ISIS are pure evil.

LorMal

unseenfootage wrote: »

Are you suggesting that he said these words, because he feared prolonged torture and humiliation before being executed.

This is somewhat more plausible than the overly emotional rant by Lormar.

I could accept this.

Well that's dandy then

DeadHand

unseenfootage wrote: »

Are you suggesting that he said these words, because he feared prolonged torture and humiliation before being executed.

This is somewhat more plausible than the overly emotional rant by Lormar.

I could accept this.

Why do you think he said those words?

unseenfootage

LorMal wrote: »

Yet you call for us to 'consider his last words' (written by ISIS). You are not convincing in the least.

What do you understand by what I say that should be considered?

comongethappy

LordNorbury wrote: »

Just watched the video of Foley being beheaded. I really hope this will wake up Obama and make him snap out of whatever it is he is smoking at the moment.

Americans are pretty tired of expecting to do this..... And then be attacked for doing so.

Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

I agree, its a global issue..... But I'd call on the Arab league to do something (but I know they won't).

whisky_galore

Ignorant etc. wrote: »

That is what created this mess in the first place. The ideal situation is that the ordinary people of Iraq rise up and defeat ISIS. Any other alternative will just create more problems.

Or arab countries to unite and wipe ISIS out, though that's pretty unlikely.

Arming of one lot against another by the West has created generations of sh*tstorms.

LorMal

unseenfootage wrote: »

What do you understand by what I say that should be considered?

Hold on 'till I get a Thesaurus, a Dictionary and a Calculator......

Kermit.de.frog

I wonder why British jihadists are so disproportionately represented in the goings on in Syria and Iraq?

TerrorFirmer

Ignorant etc. wrote: »

You then have a severe conflict situation because Iran has a relatively strong military. Not as strong as Britain's or America's, admittedly, but much stronger than the Iraqi one was or is. If we thought Iraq was a protracted situation, then imagine what a conflict with Iran would be like. You're also dealing with religious nutters in Iran, whereas Sadaam, for all his faults, was a very secular leader by Middle Eastern standards.

If, as I suspect it would, proved far more difficult for an invasion to get a foothold in Iran, then you get into a locked down battle situation, and then other players come into play. How many countries in the Middle East, other than Israel, would support America and Britain? How many would take the opportunity to assist Iran if Iran looked like having a fighting chance, particularly after the bag of willies that America and Britain has made of Iraq?

It might hold up a bit better than Iraq's military did in 2003 (but then again the vast majority of Iraq's military didn't even engage the invading force and leadership was dreadful), but Iran's military wouldn't have the faintest hope against the US military. Their spending on defense is actually pretty low to be fair. Literally probably about one percent of the US budget.

Yes in terms of a drawn out conflict zone due to insurgency and internal strife etc, it'd be no better than Iraq I'm sure. But if terms of a conventional military showdown, Iran wouldn't have a hope. They'd have as much chance of a 'locked down battle situation' or a 'fighting chance' as the Defense forces would have if the British army invaded Ireland. Not a notion!

Ignorant etc.

LorMal wrote: »

NOBODY believes these were his true words. BUT Unseenfootage would like us all to "consider" them (because they agree with his viewpoint.) But they were written by ISIS.
Unseenfootage viewpoint= ISIS viewpoint

Personally, having now seen the full video, where the beheader has another American at the end and says that American's life depends on Obama, I believe that Foley was told something like "say these words, and we will let the other American go after we've killed you". It would be a terrible thing to face, but he seemed like a very kind and warm human being and maybe he was trying to save his compatriot. Speaking of compatriots though, a part of me feels ashamed that I am a compatriot of the evil cnut doing the beheading.

unseenfootage

LorMal wrote: »

Hold on 'till I get a Thesaurus, a Dictionary and a Calculator......

catholic.org has a transcript of John Foley's words.

Shouldn't you be tackling them head on.

Don't forget to take you school bag.

Ignorant etc.

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

It might hold up a bit better than Iraq's military did in 2003 (but then again the vast majority of Iraq's military didn't even engage the invading force and leadership was dreadful), but Iran's military wouldn't have the faintest hope against the US military. Their spending on defense is actually pretty low to be fair. Literally probably about one percent of the US budget.

Yes in terms of a drawn out conflict zone due to insurgency and internal strife etc, it'd be no better than Iraq I'm sure. But if terms of a conventional military showdown, Iran wouldn't have a hope. They'd have as much chance of a 'locked down battle situation' or a 'fighting chance' as the Defense forces would have if the British army invaded Ireland. Not a notion!

Bit insulting to say I don't have a notion merely because I have a different idea to you.

Iran would have a far better chance because it is far more likely to attract support from other countries. Hussein wasn't liked by important players in the Middle East because he was extremely secular for a Middle Eastern leader. Iran is likely to attract more support.

My thoughts are also with Steven Joel Sotloff and his family. He is the journalist shown at the end of the video and next on the list.

Ignorant etc.

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I wonder why British jihadists are so disproportionately represented in the goings on in Syria and Iraq?

The pubs close earlier in Britain.

unseenfootage

DeadHand wrote: »

Why do you think he said those words?

There are many reasons why he may have said that. Now that you convinced me that he was in fact under duress, it doesn't matter any more.

LorMal

Ignorant etc. wrote: »

Personally, having now seen the full video, where the beheader has another American at the end and says that American's life depends on Obama, I believe that Foley was told something like "say these words, and we will let the other American go after we've killed you". It would be a terrible thing to face, but he seemed like a very kind and warm human being and maybe he was trying to save his compatriot. Speaking of compatriots though, a part of me feels ashamed that I am a compatriot of the evil cnut doing the beheading.

There does appear to be something about this organisation that is resonating with some young British Muslims. Reminds me of the two morons who beheaded Lee Rigby in Woolwich

LorMal

unseenfootage wrote: »

catholic.org has a transcript of John Foley's words.

Shouldn't you be tackling them head on.

Don't forget to take you school bag.

Apologist.

LordNorbury

comongethappy wrote: »

Americans are pretty tired of expecting to do this..... And then be attacked for doing so.

Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

I agree, its a global issue..... But I'd call on the Arab league to do something (but I know they won't).

I think this is now everyone's problem, in all my years alive I have never seen anything as crazy and insane as the videos that are coming out of Iraq right now. I watched a room full of men being slaughter the other day, roughly 20-30 men, young and old, in Iraqi uniforms, made kneel down in what appeared to be a police barracks and every single one of them got a bullet in the head. The people behind this have now declared their own state, there is no way on earth that this is going to be tolerated I reckon by the rest of the world.

I feel confident that there are advanced plans already in place to start inserting US and EU troops with modern artillery, as there is no point in giving a Kurdish or Iraqi military company or military unit, a US, British or German tank, they wouldn't be able to get it into gear let alone using the advanced computer systems on board that deal with acquiring targets, etc. Air strikes are grand for stopping a military unit from advancing on a town or city, but they can't push rebels out of a town they have captured, not unless you want to bomb the whole town, thereby killing more innocent people than IS insurgents.

There is no other way of dealing with this I reckon other than an invasion.

whisky_galore

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I wonder why British jihadists are so disproportionately represented in the goings on in Syria and Iraq?

At a guess: sh*t-stirring clerics, ghettoism/disillusion and a failure to integrate into wider society?

unseenfootage

LorMal wrote: »

Apologist.

So now catholic.org are apologists.

Who's next on your hit list - Obama?

Ignorant etc.

LorMal wrote: »

There does appear to be something about this organisation that is resonating with some young British Muslims. Reminds me of the two morons who beheaded Lee Rigby in Woolwich

Being from there I can speak from experience that Muslims are allowed far more of a free reign in the UK than in Ireland. The British do tend to change things to try to appease them, whereas this country has more of a "this is Ireland, get used to it" attitude. Through appeasing, there is more scope for things like the disaster with the Islamic schools in Birmingham.

Couple that with the fact that a lot of Muslims are probably angry about British involvement in Iraq and Afghanistan.

comongethappy

whisky_galore wrote: »

At a guess: sh*t-stirring clerics, ghettoism/disillusion and a failure to integrate into wider society?

Britain needs to take a serious look at itself.

Take schools for example.
This idea of independent 'academies'.
(A means to break teaching unions).

Allow a school to teach what it likes, employ or not employ whoever it wants, qualified or not.... Have any ethos it wants, just to break the back of the state system....

Now Muslim schools are a law unto themselves.

comongethappy

unseenfootage wrote: »

So now catholic.org are apologists.

Who's next on your hit list - Obama?

Still waiting for your "arguments that can't be defeated" ?

When can we expect these?

unseenfootage

comongethappy wrote: »

Britain needs to take a serious look at itself.

Take schools for example.
This idea of independent 'academies'.
(A means to break teaching unions).

Allow a school to reach what it likes, employ or not employ whoever it wants, qualified or not.... Have any ethos it wants, just to break the back of the state system....

Now Muslim schools are a law unto themselves.

To be fair the same can be said of all faith based schools, especially Jewish schools.

Ignorant etc.

comongethappy wrote: »

Britain needs to take a serious look at itself.

Take schools for example.
This idea of independent 'academies'.
(A means to break teaching unions).

Allow a school to reach what it likes, employ or not employ whoever it wants, qualified or not.... Have any ethos it wants, just to break the back of the state system....

Now Muslim schools are a law unto themselves.

Another prime example of the fockwittery of our politicians.

LorMal

comongethappy wrote: »

Still waiting for your "arguments that can't be defeated" ?

When can we expect these?

They are in his Koran

unseenfootage

Ignorant etc. wrote: »

Being from there I can speak from experience that Muslims are allowed far more of a free reign in the UK than in Ireland. The British do tend to change things to try to appease them, whereas this country has more of a "this is Ireland, get used to it" attitude. Through appeasing, there is more scope for things like the disaster with the Islamic schools in Birmingham.

Couple that with the fact that a lot of Muslims are probably angry about British involvement in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Don't you think that Britain should just strip those "angry Muslims" of their passports and let them leave the country?

youtube!

What is really scary is that so many young British Muslims who have gone out to fight for this terror group are still British citizens who presumably will return home some day...what kind of chaos are we going to see then on the streets of England and by extension very possibly here too.

This is too much..as far as I am concerned a full on Guantanamo bay situation should be waiting for these scumbags, they should be gathered up and tortured for eternity for their part in their so called freedom fighting. I really hope the British authorities are on top of this.

MadYaker

LordNorbury wrote: »

I think this is now everyone's problem, in all my years alive I have never seen anything as crazy and insane as the videos that are coming out of Iraq right now. I watched a room full of men being slaughter the other day, roughly 20-30 men, young and old, in Iraqi uniforms, made kneel down in what appeared to be a police barracks and every single one of them got a bullet in the head. The people behind this have now declared their own state, there is no way on earth that this is going to be tolerated I reckon by the rest of the world.

I feel confident that there are advanced plans already in place to start inserting US and EU troops with modern artillery, as there is no point in giving a Kurdish or Iraqi military company or military unit, a US, British or German tank, they wouldn't be able to get it into gear let alone using the advanced computer systems on board that deal with acquiring targets, etc. Air strikes are grand for stopping a military unit from advancing on a town or city, but they can't push rebels out of a town they have captured, not unless you want to bomb the whole town, thereby killing more innocent people than IS insurgents.

There is no other way of dealing with this I reckon other than an invasion.

It's getting pretty bad over there alright. But I don't think the Americans or the British will invade. The British and American voters and politicians have absolutely no appetite for another lengthy and costly overseas military campaign. There is still a bad taste in their mouths from the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. The only thing that would change this would be a 9/11 style attack by ISIS on US or British soil, and at the moment that seems unlikely as they are quite content slaughtering Iraqis alone.

The best solution would be for the Iraqi military and government to get their act together and start fighting these terrorists along with the kurds and with the support of the Americans in the form of intelligence and air strikes etc. Hopefully when the new Iraqi PM takes office this will happen but I wouldn't be too hopeful.

Ignorant etc.

unseenfootage wrote: »

To be fair the same can be said of all faith based schools, especially Jewish schools.

Not at all. I don't know of a single Jewish school in the UK that is an academy. The vast majority of UK faith schools, at least non-Islamic ones, are state-run which means they have to follow a prescribed curriculum and are subject to inspections by Ofsted, Estyn etc.

To be honest, throwing the bit in about "especially Jewish schools" without backing up your statement with evidence smells of anti-semitism.

comongethappy

Ignorant etc. wrote: »

Another prime example of the fockwittery of our politicians.

Indeed.

The tories hold out on funding for state schools unless they become 'academies'.

Instead of being educated together, communities segregate to deliver the education they want.... Not what is best for the kids.

Segregation from a very young age will be the norm for British Muslim children, with almost no oversight.

All just because the Tories want to play ideological games.