Locking strategies

eclectichoney

Hi guys
Getting a new bike shortly and wondering if it is better to go with a combination of a Kryptonite Mini Evo and Cable lock (weighing about 2kg together) or just a Kryptonite NY (weighing about 2kg on its own). I don't really want to go over 2kg in terms of extra weight to be carrying.

It should be in a decent enough area during the day (not the city centre and off the street).

Right now I am thinking the combination of the mini kryptonite and the cable locked in the 'correct' way is probably the better choice, than just a single (albeit excellent) lock?

Thanks

Colonel Panic

I personally think two types of lock is a better approach.

ashleey

I have the kryptonite Evo series 4 and a long kryptoflex cable. Together they are heavy and a bit long. The mini d lock is 7/10 rather than 8/10 for the standard size security rating but the mini and short cable would save about 0.5 kg for me but the mini is reputedly tricky to go round the back wheel, frame and street locking mount. If your locking point on the street can take it then this is the best option though as it limits the leverage access for a scum bag. In London these are a common locking combination and you get a year insurance from kryptonite. Not sure it is valid in Ireland though.

eclectichoney

Thanks guys - much appreciated. Seems the two lock approach is the way to go!

TheBlaaMan

eclectichoney wrote: »

Hi guys
Getting a new bike shortly and wondering if it is better to go with a combination of a Kryptonite Mini Evo and Cable lock (weighing about 2kg together) or just a Kryptonite NY (weighing about 2kg on its own). I don't really want to go over 2kg in terms of extra weight to be carrying.

It should be in a decent enough area during the day (not the city centre and off the street).

Right now I am thinking the combination of the mini kryptonite and the cable locked in the 'correct' way is probably the better choice, than just a single (albeit excellent) lock?

Thanks

beauf

I think you have to consider if someone really wants it no lock will stop them. But of the main objectives of the lock its to make them not bother or pick something easier.

So which looks like it would put more people off. For me that would be the two lock.

Sad Professor

OP, when you say cable lock do you mean the flex cable included with the Evo Mini? Because I wouldn’t consider that a second lock since it’s dependent on the first one. While it might act as an extra deterrent and discourage someone from taking off with your front wheel, all the thief has to do is break the u lock to get the bike. You could use a pad lock for the flex cable as shown in the video above, but that’s adding to the weight.

Since getting pitlock skewers to secure my wheels, I just use the Evo Mini on its own, locked using the Sheldon method. I never lock through the frame, even when I have space, in order to discourage thieves from using the bike as leverage to twist the lock off. I figure most bike thieves are opportunists who want to cycle off on the bike when they’re finished. Locking the bike so that they’ll have to wreck the back wheel to get the frame should make most of them think twice.

beauf

I assume you mean the modified method.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9fLtdZyX-A
http://www.802bikeguy.com/2011/07/the-modified-sheldon-brown-bike-locking-strategy/

IMO the flex cables are a visible deterrent and also to deter the opportunist. Nothing more.

I've seen people lock a bike through front wheel and frame with one u lock and a 2nd lock though the rear wheel and frame. But for that you need a railing that you can lock to at both points.

Sad Professor

It’s not really modified. It’s the same method, just with the addition of a flex cable, which is unnecessary if you have pitlocks.

beauf

Apologies, maybe I'm miss-reading it. I thought Sheldon method locks through the rear tyre only within the rear tri-ange but not using the rear triangle. I though the modified bit was including part of the rear triangle aswell. The flex cable I didn't think had anything to do with it.

Maybe I took it up wrong.

Sad Professor

Actually you are right, locking via one the chain stays is different from the original Sheldon method. Sorry, I didn’t notice that. Although I don’t really see what the advantage of doing it this way is. I guess it means less space to fit a tool into, which is good, but it seems like it could make it easier to use the frame as leverage against the lock.

beauf

TBH its not that clear from the photos.

Pro and cons I guess. With U locks I thought the tighter the better so the frame can't be moved to act as a lever.

Someone else commented about a theft attempt where they used a carbon frame as a level, destroying it as you would be expected.

I guess another issue to consider having the bike insured too.

the world wonders

Cable locks are useless, get a U-lock and a chain.

It should be in a decent enough area during the day (not the city centre and off the street).

It's probably safer on a busy street with people passing by rather than down an alley or at the back of a car park.

beauf

I wonder has any one tested that theory.

eclectichoney

Thanks for all the advice guys! Looks like pitlock skewers for the wheels and then a single u-lock (maybe the NY?) might be a good option. I am definitely getting a u lock anyway - just have to decide on what else to go with to add a bit of extra security.

Inquitus

eclectichoney wrote: »

Thanks for all the advice guys! Looks like pitlock skewers for the wheels and then a single u-lock (maybe the NY?) might be a good option. I am definitely getting a u lock anyway - just have to decide on what else to go with to add a bit of extra security.

You can always leave the locks locked in situ, do don't worry about weight and just go for maximum protection. The big abus chains made for motorbikes are a great starting point, maybe coupled with u lock for each wheel.

cdaly_

beauf wrote: »

I wonder has any one tested that theory.

I believe so (at least the public area bit)...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4yydGUB88c

tomasrojo

I currently have a Pitlock skewer on the front wheel and have a Fahgettaboudit mini lock and a Kryptolok Series 2 lock mounted on the rear rack and frame. That's about 3kg of locks, so maybe too much for the OP. This gives you a lot of options for locking the frame and rear wheel.

There is always talk of how Pitlocks can be defeated, but their track record seems to be very good.

I don't like that "modified" locking option (through the chain stays) as I try not to lock anywhere near the chain, just because of the risk of getting oil on you clothes or hands.

Zen0

My principal concern with Sheldon's method is that it doesn't look secure, so it could encourage some half wit to give it a go.

tomasrojo

Zen0 wrote: »

it could encourage some half wit to give it a go.

I think someone here once mentioned that that did happen to them. It does seem a slight risk with it (I have yet to hear of anyone in the real world sawing through the rear wheel). If I'm leaving the bike for more than a few minutes I employ a second lock to secure the frame directly anyway.

beauf

I've not seen it sawed but I've seen a wheel chopped I assume with bolt croppers.

Sad Professor

Zen0 wrote: »

My principal concern with Sheldon's method is that it doesn't look secure, so it could encourage some half wit to give it a go.

If I had a quick release back wheel I'd be concerned about this as well. But with the pitlocks they aren't going to be able to take the back wheel off, so there's not much damage they can do other than saw through the back wheel, which is probably too much work and will attract too much attention for your average opportunist who wants a bike to ride off on.

Someone recently tried to steal my bike from outside work. I have pitlocks and lock it using the Sheldon method. First they took the cap covering the skewer off, obviously thinking they could remove the wheel and take the frame. When that didn't work they had a go at the lock with what I assume where bolt cutters which left barely any impression. I've been locking my bike there for over a year and this was the first time it's been interfered with.

tomasrojo

beauf wrote: »

I've not seen it sawed but I've seen a wheel chopped I assume with bolt croppers.

And the bike itself was gone? That's intriguing, because I would assume that breaking the rear wheel would usually be done by a thief with a van, the broken wheel going with the bike for a quick getaway, to be replaced later (why waste time taking the wheel off if you don't have to cycle it?). If the broken wheel is left behind, I assume the thief cycled the bike away, which meant they stole another rear wheel from somewhere. Must have been a pretty good bike to have bothered to do all that.

But, yes, breaking the rear wheel is definitely a weakness of the method.

tomasrojo

Sad Professor wrote: »

If I had a quick release back wheel I'd be concerned about this as well. But with the pitlocks they aren't going to be able to take the back wheel off

With the Sheldon method, the thief can't get a wheel with quick release skewers off either, unless they saw or cut the rim. Using quick release doesn't make the method any weaker (though Pitlocks would put them off trying in the first place, which now I think about it is what you were saying, isn't it?).

Sad Professor

tomasrojo wrote: »

With the Sheldon method, the thief can't get a wheel with quick release skewers off either, unless they saw or cut the rim. Using quick release doesn't make the method any weaker (though Pitlocks would put them off trying in the first place, which now I think about it is what you were saying, isn't it?).

Yeah, I was responding to Zen0’s worry that a thief might see the Sheldon method and foolishly think they can just take the wheel off and nick the frame - causing a lot of damage in the process or just leaving you with a mess to fix. Without a pitlock on the back wheel I’d be inclined to use a larger u lock that would go around the frame as well for this very reason. But with the pitlock I’m reasonably confident that all but the most determined of thieves will move onto another bike.