Better Call Saul ***Spoilers***

gormdubhgorm

Hunky Monster wrote: »

Oh and just to add to that. Google the lyrics of “The winner takes it all”...

A bit in it reads like commentary on the show itself -

The judges will decide
The likes of me abide
Spectators of the show
Always staying low

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

NickNickleby wrote: »

Goodness, young 'uns nowadays. Google, pffft. I can sing it from memory :pac:.

Ah Jesus you’d wanna be 70 to have heard that first time round :pac:

thecretinhop

Hunky Monster wrote: »

Oh and just to add to that. Google the lyrics of “The winner takes it all”...In the context of jimmy and chuck this is fücking brilliant. But which one is the winner and which is the loser...

I don't wanna talk
About things we've gone through
Though it's hurting me
Now it's history
I've played all my cards
And that's what you've done too
Nothing more to say
No more ace to play

I was in your arms
Thinking I belonged there
I figured it made sense
Building me a fence
Building me a home
Thinking I'd be strong there
But I was a fool
Playing by the rules

The gods may throw the dice
Their minds as cold as ice
And someone way down here
Loses someone dear
The winner takes it all
The loser has to fall
It's simple and it's plain
Why should I complain?

The judges will decide
The likes of me abide
Spectators of the show
Always staying low
The game is on again
A lover or a friend
A big thing or a small
The winner takes it all


So the winner takes it all
And the loser has to fall
Throw a dice, cold as ice
Way down here, someone dear
Takes it all, has to fall
It seems plain to me

wow beyond amazing.

NickNickleby

Hunky Monster wrote: »

Ah Jesus you’d wanna be 70 to have heard that first time round :pac:

No, 63 will do it. (insert senile smiley here).

leggo

Hunky Monster wrote: »

Oh and just to add to that. Google the lyrics of “The winner takes it all”...In the context of jimmy and chuck this is fücking brilliant. But which one is the winner and which is the loser...

I think rather than seeing one as a winner and loser, it's more referring to how they viewed each other. They were typical rival brothers, with that scene in particular showing the inherent competition, jealousy, love and respect that all managed to co-exist within their relationship. I don't think there was a winner or loser, like all great rivals they needed each other to both thrive and struggle. You could say Jimmy was the winner because of how it ended for Chuck, but that outcome also led to him permanently looking over his shoulder in Omaha as Gene, so did he really win or did Chuck win just ejecting himself from this competition and finally being at peace?

I'm sorry lads, I respect your right to have an opinion, but I'll never understand how a show that sparks us having these kind of conversations and reflections weekly can be written off as 'boring' or having 'run its course'. Yes there may not be much plot left, but I'd watch 20-minute flashbacks of Jimmy and Chuck eating dinner together tensely.

take everything

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

A bit in it reads like commentary on the show itself -

The judges will decide
The likes of me abide
Spectators of the show
Always staying low

Abba songs are always packed with meaning

gormdubhgorm

Hunky Monster wrote: »

Oh and just to add to that. Google the lyrics of “The winner takes it all”...In the context of jimmy and chuck this is fücking brilliant. But which one is the winner and which is the loser...

That is one thing I do admire them in the show they are great for picking a tune.
Not only a tune that is relevant to the episode, but it is always good music, ranging from the obscure to the well known.

I found a site with a list of the songs in every episode.

https://www.what-song.com/Tvshow/120/Better-Call-Saul

Say Your Number

Jimmy's fake crying in front of that couple at Chuck's grave was incredible!!!!!!!

Kevin Finnerty

Say Your Number wrote: »

Jimmy's fake crying in front of that couple at Chuck's grave was incredible!!!!!!!

1001, 1002 1003.
He went well overboard on the poor the Esposito kid though, even though he was projecting.

TomOnBoard

NickNickleby wrote: »

Goodness, young 'uns nowadays. Google, pffft. I can sing it from memory :pac:.

Hope you do it better than Jimmy did.... :P

TomOnBoard

take everything wrote: »

Abba songs are always packed with meaning

Now thats not something you could have said openly back in the day...

TomOnBoard

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

That is one thing I do admire them in the show they are great for picking a tune.
Not only a tune that is relevant to the episode, but it is always good music, ranging from the obscure to the well known.

I found a site with a list of the songs in every episode.

https://www.what-song.com/Tvshow/120/Better-Call-Saul

Nice find! Thanks!

n!ghtmancometh

That scene with Mike and the German equalled and almost surpassed anything BB ever did, in my opinion. Pitch perfect, wonderfully shot and so, so sad.

The camera slowly seperating Jimmy and Kim at the end was fantastic too. Brilliant stuff.

TomOnBoard

n!ghtmancometh wrote: »

That scene with Mike and the German equalled and almost surpassed anything BB ever did, in my opinion. Pitch perfect, wonderfully shot and so, so sad.

Yeah, aaaand as Mike shoots Werner, it locks him fully into Gus and Gus into him, thus setting them both on the arc for each of them to be taken out ultimately by Walt as Heisenberg...

And what was the scientist Heisenberg's first name?

Werner!!!

Talk about Gilliganisms......

Collie D

Excellent episode. Probably the best one so far. Really well written and acted by every character.

Enjoyed the opening scene. Thought it was very sweet and showed once upon a time the brothers were close. Nice to see Ernie again. I was convinced he'd play a bigger role, purely because he looks like a young Gus to me.

Was wrong about Mike. Everyone on here predicted he'd take out one of the Germans and I just thought he'd have too many morals to kill an innocent. Great scene.

As for the ending. We know what Saul is..a sleazebag lawyer but Jimmy was an essentially decent guy who bent the rules a little but wasn't outright nasty. A likeable rogue. That scene was the first time where I watched and thought "What a horrible piece of crap you are"

TomOnBoard

Collie D wrote: »

Excellent episode. Probably the best one so far. Really well written and acted by every character.

Enjoyed the opening scene. Thought it was very sweet and showed once upon a time the brothers were close. Nice to see Ernie again. I was convinced he'd play a bigger role, purely because he looks like a young Gus to me.

Was wrong about Mike. Everyone on here predicted he'd take out one of the Germans and I just thought he'd have too many morals to kill an innocent. Great scene.

As for the ending. We know what Saul is..a sleazebag lawyer but Jimmy was an essentially decent guy who bent the rules a little but wasn't outright nasty. A likeable rogue. That scene was the first time where I watched and thought "What a horrible piece of crap you are"

I felt the exact same thing at the end about Jimmy.

I've been all over the place abt Jimmy this season- There were times when I thought he was a sad casualty of Chuck's superiority complex and constant put-downs, and other times when I felt "What a POS you are!!". And that swing in my perception happened a number of times in each episode, which says a lot for how Jimmy/Saul has been written and acted.

Like, is he really a total a**hole or just a victim whose only opportunity in life has been to carve out a niche on the dark side?

OmegaGene

I disagree about jimmy being a piece of crap etc
He took his suspension on the chin and went back to the board and was open with them, but because he didn’t mention his dead brother they benched him for another year and the way he sees it he will never make it being a good guy.
Hello Saul goodman we now have the shady character we all know from breaking bad.
I couldn’t believe the German sneaked our for a 4 day vacation considering the people he’s workinv for, how did that play out well in his head lol, just go back and say sorry or bring in a sick note from the doctor.
Good ending but now I want more ......

mloc123

Collie D wrote: »

Enjoyed the opening scene. Thought it was very sweet and showed once upon a time the brothers were close.

I dunno... I think it showed more that Jimmy once admired Chuck... but it was mostly one sided. Chuck still took the limelight and pushed Jimmy aside, ignored the chat about HHM renaming to HHMM etc..

OmegaGene

mloc123 wrote: »

I dunno... I think it showed more that Jimmy once admired Chuck... but it was mostly one sided. Chuck still took the limelight and pushed Jimmy aside, ignored the chat about HHM renaming to HHMM etc..

This 100%, no matter what jimmy did it just didn’t seem good enough, even passing the bar exam was all down tho chuck for giving him the job in the mail room, how demeaning must that have been
Come and join me at my law firm and I will set you up, btw you’re in the basement pushing a cart around while I’m at the top floor eating caviar and what not

Jakey Rolling

Did I miss something, or is Jimmy still due to get his share of the settlement from the Sandpiper case?

It's one of the few loose ends that would interest me in a final series. That and maybe how Jesse gets involved and Tuco's return. Everything else is pretty much tied up to my satisfaction, could care less what happens with Kim.

TomOnBoard

mloc123 wrote: »

I dunno... I think it showed more that Jimmy once admired Chuck... but it was mostly one sided. Chuck still took the limelight and pushed Jimmy aside, ignored the chat about HHM renaming to HHMM etc..

And I dunno.... I saw a very starch- shirted Chuck who wanted to leave and go home from the karaoke bar, which was clearly not his scene, rise to the occasion of Jimmy's celebration and join him on stage and play- act along with him... Then later, he took care of the drunken Jimmy, placing the bucket by the bed and all that, and joining him on the bed like a good mate looking after his pissed buddy, even singing along with him towards sleep... That didn't smack of a Chuck pushing Jimmy aside to me...

thecretinhop

TomOnBoard wrote: »

mloc123 wrote: »

I dunno... I think it showed more that Jimmy once admired Chuck... but it was mostly one sided. Chuck still took the limelight and pushed Jimmy aside, ignored the chat about HHM renaming to HHMM etc..

And I dunno.... I saw a very starch- shirted Chuck who wanted to leave and go home from the karaoke bar, which was clearly not his scene, rise to the occasion of Jimmy's celebration and join him on stage and play- act along with him... Then later, he took care of the drunken Jimmy, placing the bucket by the bed and all that, and joining him on the bed like a good mate looking after his pissed buddy, even singing along with him towards sleep... That didn't smack of a Chuck pushing Jimmy aside to me...

yeah it's a hard one but chuck did grab the microphone quite roughly imo

sicknotexi

Everyone to themselves but some of the guff spoke on here is ridiculously over the top. Not near good a show as Breaking Bad. If you enjoy it more then fair enough but it really is not in the same sphere imo. A few of the problems I had with season 4.

1.That Werner story line was piss poor. He is an educated guy he is never going to cross Gus for a 4 day holiday(He's German ffs)
2. Nacho completely disappeared from the show for what felt like half the season.
3. The Kim and Jimmy story is sloppy and not that interesting. Kim changes her mindset when the wind changes direction. If the pay off was that one last scene where Kim finally accepts that Jimmy will never change well it was a convoluted way of getting there(it felt like this had happened already on a few occasions anyway)

There are loads of smaller ones that I can't be arsed list but they are my main gripes.

Basically thought it was an average enough season. I know a lot of people like the little touches and nods to Breaking Bad but I am interested in plot and good story lines which I felt this season lacked. The main story line was that a German contractor gets homesick/wifesick(is that a thing)and decides to break away for a little holiday leading to Mike having to kill him. Were we supposed to feel moved by this? He's a silly f*ck, he's no loss.

Anyway, each to their own and I did enjoy some episodes but it really was not a good season imo.

StupidLikeAFox

StupidLikeAFox wrote: »

For the lads who don't like the show but are sticking it out anyway.....

That doesn't 100% fit. I thought season 1 of Westworld was somewhat painful up until the final episode that tied it all together brilliantly.

gormdubhgorm

sicknotexi wrote: »

1.That Werner story line was piss poor. He is an educated guy he is never going to cross Gus for a 4 day holiday(He's German ffs)
.

Very good point on the practicality of a German doing that.



This does not have the same ring to it:

As this did:

Collie D

I think Werner doing a runner is quite believable. No matter how educated, professional or even German he is he still missed his wife.

He has gone from work to the warehouse they're staying in and back for months on end with one night out on the beer in between. I think most people would fancy a bit of downtime or a holiday.

Lots of people have bunked off work or taken sickies under much better circumstances. If caught, we'd probably expect a bollocking or to be fired at worst. The last thing Werner expected for going AWOL was a nighttime trip to the desert. He doesn't know who Gus is or what he does.

OmegaGene

Collie D wrote: »

I think Werner doing a runner is quite believable. No matter how educated, professional or even German he is he still missed his wife.

He has gone from work to the warehouse they're staying in and back for months on end with one night out on the beer in between. I think most people would fancy a bit of downtime or a holiday.

Lots of people have bunked off work or taken sickies under much better circumstances. If caught, we'd probably expect a bollocking or to be fired at worst. The last thing Werner expected for going AWOL was a nighttime trip to the desert. He doesn't know who Gus is or what he does.

Wasn’t he brought there with a bag on his head and kept in lock down for months with a huge amount of money paid to him
It’s hardly a normal 9-5 engineering job

Collie D

OmegaGene wrote: »

Wasn’t he brought there with a bag on his head and kept in lock down for months with a huge amount of money paid to him
It’s hardly a normal 9-5 engineering job

True but I'd still guess being killed was the last thing on his mind and even if it was, the environment he was in could easily drive anyone a bit stir crazy.

Bad decision that cost him dearly but I don't think it was a completely off the wall act on his part.

FrancieBrady

Collie D wrote: »

True but I'd still guess being killed was the last thing on his mind and even if it was, the environment he was in could easily drive anyone a bit stir crazy.

Bad decision that cost him dearly but I don't think it was a completely off the wall act on his part.

Yes, it was a fatal miscalculation that people make all the time, including Germans.
He plainly believed the worst that would happen would be the bag over his head and shipped out again.

Dyr

NickNickleby wrote: »

Werner - he didn't realise he was messing with the bad guys. I think he only really realised the game was up, when Mike told him that Margarethe was going to be followed. Awful scene.

Because Mike was too nice, he never gave Werner the vibe that he was swimming with sharks

TBH I found that whole plot pretty ludicrous, like most of this season.