Better Call Saul ***Spoilers***

km79

Thought that was the poorest episode in a while .......felt like a filler

noodler

km79 wrote: »

Thought that was the poorest episode in a while .......felt like a filler

Agreed.

I still don't feel like poor is fair but relatively I see what you mean.

The Howard rant was not easy to watch. Blaming him for Chuck's death is a bitt mental. The sociopath (correct use?) In Jimmy is really coming out now.

He can be so oblivious to the harm he does.

Sad to see the end of Howard! Wonder how he figured out the bowling ball and hookers.

leggo

I don’t think he’s sociopath. A sociopath is devoid of any empathy or feeling and just does things because they suit their immediate self-interest. Lalo is a textbook sociopath, for example.

I think this entire show is a case study in how we may have once seen Saul that way, but the twist is he’s the opposite: a good guy who perhaps feels a bit too much and is entirely driven by how life dealt him a tough hand. The last scene was caused by the fact that he was trying to tell himself that he was fine after Chuck’s death but wasn’t, it’s still his brother and he still had love for him that he doesn’t know how to process in spite of everything Chuck had done to him. That’s way more interesting tbh. If this was the story of a sociopath, Lalo’s for example, it would be dramatic but boring with him just committing acts of mindless violence and manipulating/intimidating people to further his agenda.

artvanderlay

I thought it was a fantastic episode this week. Lots of stuff happened,, and it moves everything along nicely. I normally like to bingewatch shows, but i savour my weekly BCS when it is this good.

Mr. Incognito

Wow.

That was incredible.

The scene in the courtroom was watching Jimmy become Saul.

There was a powerful shot directly after where half of Jimmys face is reflected in the marble wall signifying the two face. Cant but help think of Harvey Dent in Barman. Pic attached.

Its hard to hear from BB fans who basically were adreneline junkies waiting for the next train robbery. Its a shame this show didnt come out first as its superior in every way and is much darker. Writing. Acting and Cinematography. BB was poor season 1. It only became really good when they had the budget.

Sopranos will never be touched. The wire was a cynical social commentary but this is a different type of show. Much more personal and introspective where characters are allowed breathe.

Saul took his frustration on Howard who is a link to the past.

Jimmy is gone and Saul is all that remains. Kim is the only moral compass left.

noodler

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

Wow.

That was incredible.

The scene in the courtroom was watching Jimmy become Saul.

There was a powerful shot directly after where half of Jimmys face is reflected in the marble wall signifying the two face. Cant but help think of Harvey Dent in Barman. Pic attached.

Its hard to hear from BB fans who basically were adreneline junkies waiting for the next train robbery. Its a shame this show didnt come out first as its superior in every way and is much darker. Writing. Acting and Cinematography. BB was poor season 1. It only became really good when they had the budget.

Sopranos will never be touched. The wire was a cynical social commentary but this is a different type of show. Much more personal and introspective where characters are allowed breathe.

Saul took his frustration on Howard who is a link to the past.

Jimmy is gone and Saul is all that remains. Kim is the only moral compass left.

Didn't have anywhere near the same love for sopranos as most tbh.

This is definitely better then BB. Never had a bad season.

Absolute gem.

seligehgit

leggo wrote: »

I don’t think he’s sociopath. A sociopath is devoid of any empathy or feeling and just does things because they suit their immediate self-interest. Lalo is a textbook sociopath, for example.

I think this entire show is a case study in how we may have once seen Saul that way, but the twist is he’s the opposite: a good guy who perhaps feels a bit too much and is entirely driven by how life dealt him a tough hand. The last scene was caused by the fact that he was trying to tell himself that he was fine after Chuck’s death but wasn’t, it’s still his brother and he still had love for him that he doesn’t know how to process in spite of everything Chuck had done to him. That’s way more interesting tbh. If this was the story of a sociopath, Lalo’s for example, it would be dramatic but boring with him just committing acts of mindless violence and manipulating/intimidating people to further his agenda.

Definitely not a sociopath.You could see he had some sense of guilt/shame when he looked over at the victim's family.

Hodors Appletart

rubadub wrote: »

some redditor also was trying to figure it out, and like me thinks this makes her too old, but going by music rather than the nuggets!

Radios often play older music and not just contemporary pop. Kim's mother could have been listening to Q102, which seems to have a permanent rotation of out of time shíte pop music.

noodler

seligehgit wrote: »

Definitely not a sociopath.You could see he had some sense of guilt/shame when he looked over at the victim's family.

I guess he just doesn't seem to have proper awareness in other areas.

Kim's feelings for the most recent stunt or Howard and the job offer

Penn

Kim calling out Kevin for ignoring their advice was genius, and a great scene. Howard calling out Jimmy too, knowing he was the one responsible for the bowling balls and prostitutes was so well done.

Great episode. Interesting to see how far Fring will allow himself to be pushed to keep Nacho within Lalo's ranks.

Tabnabs

I enjoyed the scene with Mike telling his daughter in law that he was better now and he had “decided to play the cards I was dealt.” The path that Mike is following, like that of Jimmy/Saul, is now one they are resolved to follow. Their journey is paralleled on an off screen.

groovie

Luftwaffle! I just got that.

Noo

groovie wrote: »

Luftwaffle! I just got that.

I laughed out loud at that

rubadub

Hodors Appletart wrote: »

Radios often play older music and not just contemporary pop. Kim's mother could have been listening to Q102, which seems to have a permanent rotation of out of time shíte pop music.

Yes of course, but it shows the max age she could have been, rather than exact time/age. I had said she looked 10-12, the junior school matched that, so I estimated she could have been ~35 or younger. I spotted the mcnuggets reference, so 81 was my minimum time, the other guy did the song.

As I said, too much time on my hands but I am always curious about characters ages.

gormdubhgorm

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

Wow.

That was incredible.

The scene in the courtroom was watching Jimmy become Saul.

There was a powerful shot directly after where half of Jimmys face is reflected in the marble wall signifying the two face. Cant but help think of Harvey Dent in Barman. Pic attached.

Its hard to hear from BB fans who basically were adreneline junkies waiting for the next train robbery. Its a shame this show didnt come out first as its superior in every way and is much darker. Writing. Acting and Cinematography. BB was poor season 1. It only became really good when they had the budget.

Sopranos will never be touched. The wire was a cynical social commentary but this is a different type of show. Much more personal and introspective where characters are allowed breathe.

Saul took his frustration on Howard who is a link to the past.

Jimmy is gone and Saul is all that remains. Kim is the only moral compass left.

When I saw that Jimmy reflection scene in the show. My first thought was - it looked like Charlie Sheen!



Also, is the resemblance between Fred Whalen (the travel wire fella Lalo killed) and Gene/Jimmy a coincidence, or a later homage to Fred?

gormdubhgorm

rubadub wrote: »

Yes of course, but it shows the max age she could have been, rather than exact time/age. I had said she looked 10-12, the junior school matched that, so I estimated she could have been ~35 or younger. I spotted the mcnuggets reference, so 81 was my minimum time, the other guy did the song.

As I said, too much time on my hands but I am always curious about characters ages.

The BB fandom wiki page has Fred's age at 26 date of death 31st March 2004.

https://breakingbad.fandom.com/wiki/Fred_Whalen.

The same site has Kim aged at 36

https://breakingbad.fandom.com/wiki/Kim_Wexler

Slydice

5.6: Hold on! Married!?

I was full on thinking this was the point they'd been leading to which would see Kim leave.

Well.. after she didn't get into an actual fight with him (the rolling up the sleeves bit?)
and after the owner of Mesa Verde didn't get into an actual fight with him. He really looked like he was gonna explode!

Mad_maxx

rubadub wrote: »

Saw this on reddit, they were talking about the address but I see the dates of birth are shown.

Jimmy 1960, Kim 1968. So Jimmy is around 44-45 now, and Kim around 36-37. Others and myself thought they were meant to be closer in age.



some redditor also was trying to figure it out, and like me thinks this makes her too old, but going by music rather than the nuggets!

jimmy looks a good fifteen years older than kim

ShineOn7

Homelander wrote: »

Mike looked like a crystallized fossil even in early breaking bad. His head in 4K is terrifying.

I'm proper laughing here

rubadub

Mad_maxx wrote: »

jimmy looks a good fifteen years older than kim

Maybe, but I wasn't going by looks at all, the actor Odenkirk playing Jimmy is obviously a lot older than Jimmy should be in the current timeline. That fandom page is now saying 36 based on the licence. Last week the same page had stated Kim was "Date of birth Late 1950’s to early 1960’s", I guess they figured this was since they were in the firm at the same time and so would be closer in age. They may have also taken into account Rhea's actual age in their estimates, she is 47

There is 10 years between the actual actors.

leggo

Another thing I like a lot is the very fact they actually bothered to address the murder that happened last season, show the victim’s family and the suffering it caused. Not only does it let us see Lalo’s true colours for anyone who’d otherwise be charmed by his charisma, but often that kind of death would just be thrown away for drama or laughs to establish how bad ass a particular character is. This show takes time to show that he was a person who’d done nothing wrong and, no matter how cool it seemed with Lalo appearing out of nowhere and the next scene leaving him laying, he left behind people who were devastated needlessly for what amounted to zero gain even on his part. Lalo is scum, not cool, and we shouldn’t forget that.

It’s that attention to detail, to not only tell you it but make you feel it, that marks it as an elite show.

ShineOn7

I do love this show, I was a big Breaking Bad fan and I'd put the latter in my all time top 3 TV shows.

But has it ever been addressed why they don't even try to de-age actors in Better Call Saul? With Fring even dying his hair in BCS would help.

Is it a budget thing or laziness? As BCS progresses it's starting to look more like a sequel than a prequel

EltonJohn69

They do look older... but it’s a very small price to pay for such a great show... it’s probably going to be a long time till we get another season unfortunately

Muahahaha

Thought that latest episode was superb. I'd almost forgotten about the whole Madrigal and Lydia thing from the Breaking Bad days and then they show up in the boardroom, absolutely loved it.

RobbingBandit

Saul has no humanity in Breaking Bad gone is the Jimmy who played/called bingo in the earlier seasons he speaks very little to Huel or his secretary even the fear when Walt and Jessie first interact with him is glassy he's a mob lawyer who has no personal connections to anyone. Long story short Kim won't dump him she's gonna die just like Marko and Chuck did she's the last human part of James McGill once Kim is gone he is Saul Goodman

alroley

RobbingBandit wrote: »

Saul has no humanity in Breaking Bad gone is the Jimmy who played/called bingo in the earlier seasons he speaks very little to Huel or his secretary even the fear when Walt and Jessie first interact with him is glassy he's a mob lawyer who has no personal connections to anyone. Long story short Kim won't dump him she's gonna die just like Marko and Chuck did she's the last human part of James McGill once Kim is gone he is Saul Goodman

I feel like Kim dying would be beyond predictable for the show.

RobbingBandit

:

alroley wrote: »

I feel like Kim dying would be beyond predictable for the show.

She has had the near miss car crash already I don't think she dumps him it has to be more than that even a couple of episodes ago when she was driving to the old guy to bargain with him I got the feeling of a fatal car crash I'm just thinking out load though she is with him till death do us part.

rubadub

ShineOn7 wrote: »

de-age actors in Better Call Saul?

People did deaging themselves for The Irishman and did a great job of it, so it should not cost much, however there was also backlash against it saying it was distracting etc. But yeah, it does not have to be CGI, just a bit more makeup, wigs with no actual CGI.

artvanderlay

I think Kim and Jimmy are both fighting against their inevitable life paths, and are clinging to each other to avoid them. She will end up a corporate lawyer with a financially rewarding but otherwise dull life, he will become the scumbag lawyer from BB. It's inevitable.

RobbingBandit

RobbingBandit wrote: »

Saul has no humanity in Breaking Bad gone is the Jimmy who played/called bingo in the earlier seasons he speaks very little to Huel or his secretary even the fear when Walt and Jessie first interact with him is glassy he's a mob lawyer who has no personal connections to anyone. Long story short Kim won't dump him she's gonna die just like Marko and Chuck did she's the last human part of James McGill once Kim is gone he is Saul Goodman

I was thinking more or less along the same lines since season 1 and figured Kim would ultimately die or be gravely hurt by her association with Jimmy / Saul. It always seemed like it would be the catalyst for him turning to the Saul persona entirely and at the end of last season it looked like their relationship was in jeopardy with Kim having seen the full depravity behind the mask. After the latest episode I think she's gone the other way - she values Saul and in some ways wants to be her own Saul. She saw how effective it was when she got the plea deal using Jimmy's ruse and they've highlighted how she still suffers from a lack of self confidence having been discarded as a child. Saul is an ideal persona for her too - and she was fully Saul when she went back into Kevin's office and read him the riot act. This mess is entirely her making but she humbled him anyway. Amazing.

She probably wants Jimmy more professionally than romantically at this point, she wants him on hand so she can benefit from his innate ability to manipulate and deceive. She has a taste for it now and she either wants to be Saul herself or live it vicariously through Jimmy. This is working really well for her and ultimately I think it's going to be her that pushes Jimmy into the higher stakes cartel world.

After the latest episode I reckon she might end up being the brains behind the whole thing. She is by all accounts a gifted lawyer, she will end up having her own breaking bad moment and we will see some of the events of Breaking Bad from her perspective - controlling and directing Saul.

Saul will get jealous of the double meaning of his slogan 'Better call Saul' coming to basically mean Kim. He will go against her wishes to get involved in some caper and that will ultimately lead to them both going on the run. Jimmy is miserable in the present as Kim never showed up to meet him, she ghosts him in the afterlife having decided she didn't need him anymore or maybe just that he was too much of a liability. The show will end with her reading about his arrest over something really petty and stupid and her decision will be vindicated!