Better Call Saul ***Spoilers***

jooksavage

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Gotta love Howard. What a guy. He's the moral compass of the show. Straight as a die.

Yep. I think he became a great character this season. Both Jimmy and Chuck thought they could manipulate him. For all his squareness, he called Jimmy out straight away last week and it was great to see him out-maneuver Chuck in the finale, even if it means risking financial ruin - how many other characters in the BB/BCS universe would go that far?

With that in mind, I'm still holding out for the Howard spin-off where he secretly spends his nights hittin' the pipe with Badger and Skinny Pete. "How much can I get for these cool lamps guys?"

thegreengoblin

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Gotta love Howard. What a guy. He's the moral compass of the show. Straight as a die.

The scene where he got the HHM staff to give Chuck his send-off was fantastic. That priceless look on Howard's face as he turned away to get back to work after he had effectively booted Chuck out of the place :pac:

Also loved that scene when Hector arrives at Nacho's dad's garage. The less Hector says the more terrifying he is but when he tells Nacho 'I don't trust him' man that was pure evil at work.

I don't think there's any doubt Chuck is gone. That last conversation between him and Jimmy was hugely enjoyable, that great line 'the truth is you never meant all that much to me' rounding off their relationship very fittingly.

Pelvis

That was a poor episode, all the worse because it's a season finale.

Richie71

Do we know what was using the electricity in Chuck's house? It wasn't something Mike / Jimmy put in a few weeks ago was it?

Royale with Cheese

Was flicking through Netflix after watching the finale and decided it would be apt to watch the BB scene where Hector blows up Gus :-)

Gus has visibily aged considerably since that was filmed unfortunately, kind of takes away from it slightly when you watch it back to back.

leggo

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Gotta love Howard. What a guy. He's the moral compass of the show. Straight as a die.

YES! He's become perhaps my favourite character the past few episodes. The acting has always been spot on, but I've actually started to root for him now (reminds me of Pete Campbell in Mad Men - a little **** at first but he grows on you). Shame I can't see how he'd continue on in the show now after all that's happened. But, hey, it's a spin-off, and what are they for if not unnecessarily prolonging the stories of characters you love for fan service purposes!

Delighted to see Jimmy do right by Irene, and nobody knows the true story but Kim (who I imagine is somewhat sheltered from the gruesome truth of it all too). Jimmy McGill is the hero Gotham didn't know it deserved.

That ending with Chuck was super dark though. As soon as he had it out with Jimmy (and that speech was ice cold - that was the moment Saul was born right there), I had a feeling a death was coming, but I was imagining him grabbing a live wire by mistake or something. I thought he'd be way too proud and stubborn to go by suicide, but they did a good job showing you how he got there. :eek:

The only thing I'm wondering now is how they get a few more seasons out of it, if they're still going by the six-season timeline originally planned. All of the characters are close to where they're going to be:

• Gus has consolidated power and is working with Mike - whose priorities are pretty much the same as they were in BB.
• Jimmy has even used the name Saul Goodman now and has nowhere left to go but downwards in terms of law.
• Hector looks to have been pushed out of top spot fully and we know how he ended up in a wheelchair now.

All that's left really is to write the characters who aren't in Breaking Bad out, so Nacho and Kim basically, and to tie Jimmy to Fring (which doesn't take much imagination with the Mike tie-in). Could we even get a season set entirely in the future?

Skullface McGubbin

What I didn't understand was why Chuck was kicking the desk (causing the lantern to fall over). Was it an involuntary action in his sleep (he looked like he was in a semi-asleep state) or just his deteriorated mental state?

el diablo wrote: »

Anyone know how many seasons of BCS there'll be?

Since Breaking Bad was 5 seasons, i reckon they're going for the same amount with Better Call Saul.

leggo

Skullface McGubbin wrote: »

What I didn't understand was why Chuck was kicking the desk (causing the lantern to fall over). Was it an involuntary action in his sleep (he looked like he was in a semi-asleep state) or just his deteriorated mental state?

I took it as he was exhausted and had given up. I think they filmed it so you'd originally think it was him involuntarily spasming (as in the big reveal that his illness was, in fact, real...which I was worried because I think that would've been cheap), but when they showed his face you could see he'd given up and didn't even have the energy or willingness left to move so could just keep kicking until the lamp fell. Really, really intense.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Collie D

Does Gus know Nacho changed Hector's pills or is he simply suspicious? Didn't expect him to be the one to save Hector, given the obvious hatred between the two in BB.

And as Nacho isn't in BB I wonder now with Hector gone and Gus effectively being top dog does Gus have Nacho killed? We are told by Mike in BB that loyalty is a trait he respects even if it's towards the wrong person.

Icemancometh

Collie D wrote: »

Does Gus know Nacho changed Hector's pills or is he simply suspicious? Didn't expect him to be the one to save Hector, given the obvious hatred between the two in BB.

And as Nacho isn't in BB I wonder now with Hector gone and Gus effectively being top dog does Gus have Nacho killed? We are told by Mike in BB that loyalty is a trait he respects even if it's towards the wrong person.

Well, it is was a pretty poor attempt at CPR. No real compression of the chest, and far too slow to have any effect whatsoever. He may have have wanted to show Hector's men he tried to save him, but secretly perform poor resuscitation to ensure maximum damage, and stop anyone else from trying to save him.

(I may be reading a bit too much into this...)

ixoy

I love the fact that, the first time we saw Salamanca in the show they worked in the bell and now, the last time he can walk, they worked in the bell again:

Nerdlingr

leggo wrote: »

YES! He's become perhaps my favourite character the past few episodes. The acting has always been spot on, but I've actually started to root for him now (reminds me of Pete Campbell in Mad Men - a little **** at first but he grows on you).

Spot on. Excellent comparison. Led to believe he's a bit of a d*ck, turns out he's an ok guy in the end.

goose2005

cullenswood wrote: »

HHM still owe Chuck about $6m do they not (Howard gave a cheque of $3m as the first of 3 instalments)? I wonder is Jimmy entitled to the rest now as Chuck is dead and this could be where he gets his start up money from?

Chuck would definitely have a will tho. Probably would leave it all to the ex-wife, or maybe a scholarship fund

SEPT 23 1989

The scene moving from the board room to the entrance was perfection

The four lights on the table

Slydice

Just before the ending, I was just thinking about how well done the episode had been. The cast really did great. The story was decent.

Then that last scene.

I was like.. what's going on? is he having a stroke or heart attack or.. oh I see the lantern. It clicked with me what they were about to do to Chuck. Then watching as it happened. It was like that "watching a car crash in slow motion" idea. As all the bits fit together. All his loss, all the bridges burned, nobody coming.


Like I know the scene was done well. It's just sad ok.

gormdubhgorm

Pelvis wrote: »

That was a poor episode, all the worse because it's a season finale.

I wouldn't say poor but it wasn't great.
There were good bits in it. Howard sending chuck off remind me of Spartacus or a Julius Cesar type thing.
But other bits seemed clunky by it's usual standards - like the idea how Jimmy revealed himself to the old folks.

gormdubhgorm

Slydice wrote: »

Just before the ending, I was just thinking about how well done the episode had been. The cast really did great. The story was decent.

Then that last scene.

I was like.. what's going on? is he having a stroke or heart attack or.. oh I see the lantern. It clicked with me what they were about to do to Chuck. Then watching as it happened. It was like that "watching a car crash in slow motion" idea. As all the bits fit together. All his loss, all the bridges burned, nobody coming.


Like I know the scene was done well. It's just sad ok.

I don't know what it says about me then.
I said good enough for ya f**k you chuck and yer 3mill.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Slydice

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I don't know what it says about me then.
I said good enough for ya f**k you chuck and yer 3mill.

I see that side too. They give us a lot of that side of Chuck in the show. Makes sense.

murpho999

Pelvis wrote: »

That was a poor episode, all the worse because it's a season finale.

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I wouldn't say poor but it wasn't great.
There were good bits in it. Howard sending chuck off remind me of Spartacus or a Julius Cesar type thing.
But other bits seemed clunky by it's usual standards - like the idea how Jimmy revealed himself to the old folks.

I don't get how people say this is a bad episode.

There was so much in it. In no particular order:

Chuck's insulting of Jimmy
Kim giving up her business
Jimmy ruining his entire reputation in the community and legal profession for the sake of an old lady.
The promotion of Fring over Salamanca.
Salamanca's demise and most likely transition to Mr Ding Ding.
Howard's total annahilation of Chuck.
Chuck's complete breakdown.
Chuck's death. I'm convnved he's dead as I called it when I saw the episode title 'Finale Lantern'

I am sure I missed other things.

How people can say it was poor is beyond me.

Always seems to happen when some scenes get drawn out or a scene doesn't make an obvious point or move the story along.

This show is not The A Team, it's a drama and that's what makes it good. Just enjoy the acting and interaction of characters.

gormdubhgorm

murpho999 wrote: »

I don't get how people say this is a bad episode.

There was so much in it. In no particular order:

Chuck's insulting of Jimmy

Although it could be argued that it was the first time that said what he thought of Jimmy.
He always seemed to worry about Jimmy in relation to him affecting his reputation.
It just felt repetitive to me.
More Chuck v Jimmy we get it.
I think it would have been far better if they edited the Chuck and Jimmy scene out of this episode altogether.

Kim giving up her business

That seemed fairly telegraphed and logical she nearly killed herself in a car crash

Jimmy ruining his entire reputation in the community and legal profession for the sake of an old lady.

The deeper premise of it is OK.
But I just did not belive the whole method of it and the result

The promotion of Fring over Salamanca.
Salamanca's demise and most likely transition to Mr Ding Ding.

For this bit I thought to myself it is about time!

They dragged enough mileage out of those pills and nacho and his father.
Nothing shocking in it as we knew he would get the stroke at some stage.

Howard's total annahilation of Chuck.

This was the best part of the episode by miles well acted and well thought out.

Chuck's complete breakdown.

Chuck's death. I'm convinced he's dead

This was done well the lead up to the madness etc
He is obviously dead or else it would be really silly!

This show is not The A Team, it's a drama and that's what makes it good. Just enjoy the acting and interaction of characters.

I realise this but I felt it just did not knit together nicely.

The second last episode was superb in contrast this was average.

bajer101

rubadub

rubadub wrote: »

Not sure if people do not read future episode names to avoid hints, if not do not read this-

episode 10 is called "Lantern".

rubadub wrote: »

If you mean the one I named in the spoiler then yes.

I was picturing the very end of the season, Chuck looking over the photo and zooming in on the date on the paper and it dawning on him, similar to Hank on the toilet reading the book. Bit too similar though. Or his house burns down

rubadub wrote: »

saw this about the whiskey on redditt

55,5% means it's quite flammable, if one were to say lash it across the room and hit a gas light, or fall asleep and let it drop.

I was talking about the lantern episode name before, but then really thought it must be a red herring as it was a bit too obvious, too much foreshadowing. In the last few days I saw lads on reddit saying the same thing. The episode names are usually a bit more cryptic.

Reading episode names in advance is one thing. I also previously mentioned IMDB who had cast members listed ages ago for "young chuck" and a "Hospital Technician". Turned out the hospital was not to do with chuck but I am still wary of reading any more predictions online, as people might be going as far as reading stuff like actors roles and coming up with ideas which are not pure guesses.

I wonder if Irene is still going to cash in early now and Jimmy still gets his money. Though he was supposedly doing the right thing he was still reminding them.

You've ruined her life because you wanted your money faster.
Boo and hoo.
Besides, it's not like she's got that much time left, anyway.
You're disgusting.
And rich.

Read more: http://www.springfieldspringfield.co.uk/view_episode_scripts.php?tv-show=better-call-saul-2015&episode=s03e10

take everything

Can anyone tell me:

How did Saul get Erin to play along.
Is it that she just gets to keep prolonging the case. And was willing to go with whatever thing he came up with if it served her.

And he doesn't get his money (yet at least). Or has he jeopardised getting the money from the case.

I wasn't following that too closely.

jooksavage

take everything wrote: »

Can anyone tell me:

How did Saul get Erin to play along.
Is it that she just gets to keep prolonging the case. And was willing to go with whatever thing he came up with if it served her.

And he doesn't get his money (yet at least). Or has he jeopardised getting the money from the case.

I wasn't following that too closely.

Some people have said that Jimmy has sacrificed his stake in the eventual payout. I can't imagine that's the case. No matter how bad Jimmy feels for Irene I can't see him turning his back on a million dollars to get her friends back. I'm presuming he's just killed his prospects in senior law and will have to wait until Davis & Main/HHM are good and ready to settle before he gets his share.

On something completely unrelated, at one point Jimmy mentions "Relax-athon 2003". I actually thought we were further along. Maybe up to 2004 at least - can't believe 3 full seasons have only taken in one year (seaon 1 is opens in 2002 as far as I remember).

leggo

jooksavage wrote: »

Some people have said that Jimmy has sacrificed his stake in the eventual payout. I can't imagine that's the case. No matter how bad Jimmy feels for Irene I can't see him turning his back on a million dollars to get her friends back. I'm presuming he's just killed his prospects in senior law and will have to wait until Davis & Main/HHM are good and ready to settle before he gets his share.

Yeah, this. He doesn't lose anything, he just doesn't get the payout when he's stuck for money, which is what inspired the con to begin with. He's let go of the office with Kim so he's letting go of this for now too.

SuperS54

leggo wrote: »

Yeah, this. He doesn't lose anything, he just doesn't get the payout when he's stuck for money, which is what inspired the con to begin with. He's let go of the office with Kim so he's letting go of this for now too.

What surprised me was that he appears at some point to have confessed to Kim what he had done to Irene and she doesn't seem that annoyed.

SuperS54

Collie D wrote: »

Does Gus know Nacho changed Hector's pills or is he simply suspicious? Didn't expect him to be the one to save Hector, given the obvious hatred between the two in BB.

I think he knew about the swap, my bet is still on the cook in the cafe having seen what Nacho did. Assume he is a spy for Gus.

Also surprised at Gus giving some sort of first aid, he does take control of the situation though, advising the guy to leave and the others to get rid of their weapons, perhaps he's trying to paint an image.

Penn

Collie D wrote: »

Does Gus know Nacho changed Hector's pills or is he simply suspicious? Didn't expect him to be the one to save Hector, given the obvious hatred between the two in BB.

To me, it makes sense that Gus would save Hector. Gus doesn't want Hector dead, he wants him to suffer. He wants to strip everything he can away from him and torment him for the rest of his life. We see that in Breaking Bad with visiting him in the home, telling Hector how he killed Don Eladio and all the rest, including another relation of Hector's, and then even pointing out that Jesse (who was partly responsible for Tuco's death) helped him do it.

Gus only went to kill Hector in the home because he thought Hector was talking to the DEA, but other than that, he wanted Hector alive. Dying after a heart attack while throwing a hissy fit wouldn't be a painful enough death for Hector in Gus' eyes, even if that meant Gus had to help save him himself. It would also help increase Gus' standing with Eladio and Bolsa by showing he's part of the team.

Overall, a great finale imo. I thought it all worked well. Only disappointment was no Mike. He obviously couldn't be part of Gus' crew yet since Hector would have recognised him, but hopefully we see more of them actually working together next season.