Extremely bad buddy sour horse

Jen Pigs Fly

My mare has gotten extremely buddy sour in only four short weeks.

She has gone from a placid, easy going and relaxed horse, to a demon if I so much as close a gate between her and her friend she goes crazy, spinning, calling, jumping around, even rearing which is brand new for her. If I put her in her stable it's constant weaving, head shaking, calling, pawing and she just will not relax.

In the arena she paces excessively to get to her friends, unfortunately her friends share a fence line with the arena

So needless to say I can't ride her, she is far too dangerous, she'll take off as soon as she sees her friend and won't listen to any riders cues. Even lunging is dangerous as she cuts right into the circle to get to her friend. I use the lunge whip to push her out but she still falls in a lot. After maybe 30 mins of this crazy galloping lunging I may finally get a trot.

She has just become a monster.

I am sectioning off somewhere for her where she can't see her friend, but I just know she will jump out and will cause off sorts of damage and not to mention stress herself out so much she'll have a heart attack.

Has anyone got any advice for me? At my wits end. It was suggested I stable her for a few days to break it out of her. I can only imagine the emotional stress and found that using this method before she just became attached to another horse just as quick.

So any tips? Can anyone help? I have her over 6 years, she's a 13 year old arabian mare.

monflat

xxxJennyxxx wrote: »

My mare has gotten extremely buddy sour in only four short weeks.

She has gone from a placid, easy going and relaxed horse, to a demon if I so much as close a gate between her and her friend she goes crazy, spinning, calling, jumping around, even rearing which is brand new for her. If I put her in her stable it's constant weaving, head shaking, calling, pawing and she just will not relax.

In the arena she paces excessively to get to her friends, unfortunately her friends share a fence line with the arena

So needless to say I can't ride her, she is far too dangerous, she'll take off as soon as she sees her friend and won't listen to any riders cues. Even lunging is dangerous as she cuts right into the circle to get to her friend. I use the lunge whip to push her out but she still falls in a lot. After maybe 30 mins of this crazy galloping lunging I may finally get a trot.

She has just become a monster.

I am sectioning off somewhere for her where she can't see her friend, but I just know she will jump out and will cause off sorts of damage and not to mention stress herself out so much she'll have a heart attack.

Has anyone got any advice for me? At my wits end. It was suggested I stable her for a few days to break it out of her. I can only imagine the emotional stress and found that using this method before she just became attached to another horse just as quick.

So any tips? Can anyone help? I have her over 6 years, she's a 13 year old arabian mare.

Is she with her companion at all in the same field
Why are they separate?
How long does she know her companion?

Rips

As soon as you put them back in together the problems will occur, often mares will pair-bond with another mare, and this sort of separation anxiety is called 'herd-bound'.

I have two mares, and I have had to get a loan of a small companion pony to keep the peace.

Over the winter, both were stabled, and when we worked up a routine, I was able to ride the younger horse/take her away without much drama, but the older horse was depressed and unhappy, generally.

Over the summer, they are turned out in the same field, but in separate electric paddocks. The companion is in with my old mare, and I can take the younger one away to ride.

The young mare has always been accustomed to this, so no problems.

The old mare has always had insecurities as she was kept alone for years before I owned her. Initially I would have had problems socialising her, over the years, she has gone the opposite way.

Jen Pigs Fly

monflat wrote: »

Is she with her companion at all in the same field
Why are they separate?
How long does she know her companion?

Companion is in the same friend with two other mares and a Shetland gelding. So 5 in the field.
They're not separate yet but I want to as I would like to be able to actually do stuff with my horse and not watch her from afar, she is currently too dangerous to ride.
She knows her companion 4 weeks were only new at a new yard

Jen Pigs Fly

Rips wrote: »

As soon as you put them back in together the problems will occur, often mares will pair-bond with another mare, and this sort of separation anxiety is called 'herd-bound'.

I have two mares, and I have had to get a loan of a small companion pony to keep the peace.

Over the winter, both were stabled, and when we worked up a routine, I was able to ride the younger horse/take her away without much drama, but the older horse was depressed and unhappy, generally.

Over the summer, they are turned out in the same field, but in separate electric paddocks. The companion is in with my old mare, and I can take the younger one away to ride.

The young mare has always been accustomed to this, so no problems.

The old mare has always had insecurities as she was kept alone for years before I owned her. Initially I would have had problems socialising her, over the years, she has gone the opposite way.

See I thought she'd be ok because there are other horses in there too, there's 5 in the field in total, 4 mares and 1 gelding. She is very attached to one mare.

I would separate them in the same field but wouldn't that defeat the point? She'll still be crazy when I try to remove her.

I want to be able to ride her and at least take her in without drama, can't even stable her as earlier she tried to jump out of the stable and badly cut her leg. I'm at my wits end with her if I'm honest.

She can't get any farrier work done nor can she get and dentist or chiropractor work done because she will not behave or stand still. Every time the farrier picked up her feet shed just scream for her friend and will keep trying it spin.

I do not own her friend so I can't dictate what I do with her friend. So I cannot just bring her friend in when I want her in, were a DIY yard and we don't interfere with each other's horses. Plus it's very hard to catch her friend.

monflat

xxxJennyxxx wrote: »

Companion is in the same friend with two other mares and a Shetland gelding. So 5 in the field.
They're not separate yet but I want to as I would like to be able to actually do stuff with my horse and not watch her from afar, she is currently too dangerous to ride.
She knows her companion 4 weeks were only new at a new yard

Oh god it's a tuff suitation

How long have you had her and what was she like in her previous yard

Do you know any of her history.
See 5 is an odd number as you know.
Is she really paired off or is she trying to poke her way in there as there's an odd number and she really has not fitted into the herd yet?


Is she the odd one out and trying to break up herd dynamics?

When you observe them which one is off grazing on their own out of the 5? Is it 4 mares one gelding?

It's v v stressful I know I had A youngster like that once.
Is she Marish at other times?

I would not separate them as yet. Is she bargy pushy and disrespectful of you as a handler

Jen Pigs Fly

monflat wrote: »

Oh god it's a tuff suitation

How long have you had her and what was she like in her previous yard

Do you know any of her history.
See 5 is an odd number as you know.
Is she really paired off or is she trying to poke her way in there as there's an odd number and she really has not fitted into the herd yet?


Is she the odd one out and trying to break up herd dynamics?

When you observe them which one is off grazing on their own out of the 5? Is it 4 mares one gelding?

It's v v stressful I know I had A youngster like that once.
Is she Marish at other times?

I would not separate them as yet. Is she bargy pushy and disrespectful of you as a handler

Have her over 6 years since 2008. In the last years she was fine now I did put her in foal in 2012 which she lost, since then she's started to get buddy sour now that I'm thinking of it.
Since she's been out of work she's been bad. Which is a good year now. Perhaps work will help her gain More respect for me but she's honestly too dangerous right now so I might try ground driving and lunging to try to reinstate some respect.

She is paired off with the other mare, the call to each other and graze together. Another mare follows my mare and the other mare. The gelding and the other mare are together mostly. My mare tends to lead, if she goes the other two follows.

She is very Bargy and pushy. In the stable she is very anxious unless I'm over petting her, she sort of relaxed. I think she has bad separation issues! Even I'm not aloud to leave her sometimes haha

Rips

Separation really works, even if its in the same field.

Are the other horses taken out?

If you separate the mare you want to bring in and ride into a paddock on her own, she'll still be able to see/touch her friend, but the other mare won't be able to exert dominance over her or herd her around, and she will likely choose another horse in the main herd to bond with.

My mares are mother and daughter, the companion I got was a strange horse.

I initially put the companion in the separate paddock for one night, so they could all talk over the fence, and the next day I switched her with the riding mare.

The old mare, who is the mother of the ridden horse, didn't give a crap.
Where the week previous, if I tried to separate them, she would have been straight through/over the fence.

Rips

Its important to set up good fencing though, electric with a strong current, so they respect it, anything else will be a waste of time. My horses will respect one single strand of electric tape (separate paddocks in enclosed area) but as soon as the battery starts to fail, they know about it!

Jen Pigs Fly

I will be separating the field they're in with electric tape so they can still see each other.

I've tried a bit of 'soft love' as I call it. I don't like to give my mare treats as she gets mouthy but today I went out, when she let me catch her she got a slice of carrot, when she walked with me and didn't look back she got a carrot. I didn't remove her from the friend just led her away from her friend. She did very good walking beside me. I took her into the adjacent field and she was ok to a point and then she started to jump around again, I got her attention on me and then got a treat. After she calmed a bit I put her back into the field with her friend. I made her turn away and look at me, got a carrot and the let her go. She then ran off to her friend.

I then tried something different. She keeps walking away from me. So using the carrot as a lure I crouched around 5 meters away from her and her buddy, she came to me after a minute. I tried this a few times each time she got closer quicker, then I went up to her and her buddy and walked away from her friend and she followed away from the friend for the carrot.

Little steps I suppose until I can set up the separate fencing.

It's quite upsetting though as she used to be the mare that galloped up to the gate when I came up and was a dream on the ground. She was so good, used to use her in pony camp while doing the points of the horses and grooming lessons. Now I just can't trust her

ems_12

Hi xxxJennyxxx I'm watching this thread with interest, the same happened a mare I am riding at the moment. She's TB, which I'm not sure is a factor or not.

The yard has had a few changes, so she is with different field buddies; 1 has remained the same and this is the one she seems to get anxious about. The other mares she previously shared with were more dominant, now she seems to be the dominant one in the field.

She does the same when caught and brought in; pulls away, won't stand still, head shakes, paws and sometimes even rocks her weight back to her hind legs and chews her teeth (I'm told this is something that can point to stomach ulcers, common in TBs, something we think she's suffered from in the past). She's actually very well behaved when ridden, even when she can hear the field buddy nearby, but I am uncomfortable that she is so anxious when taken out of the field, and it's affected her loading.

We worked hard since last winter to get a feed that suited her (stomach ulcers, and some hyper behaviour in between!) and all was going well until the summer when she started this anxiety.

The owner suggested bringing her in for a while on her own each day, I'm worried it will make her more anxious and bring back the ulcers. Let me know how you get on with your mare.

monflat

ems_12 wrote: »

Hi xxxJennyxxx I'm watching this thread with interest, the same happened a mare I am riding at the moment. She's TB, which I'm not sure is a factor or not.

The yard has had a few changes, so she is with different field buddies; 1 has remained the same and this is the one she seems to get anxious about. The other mares she previously shared with were more dominant, now she seems to be the dominant one in the field.

She does the same when caught and brought in; pulls away, won't stand still, head shakes, paws and sometimes even rocks her weight back to her hind legs and chews her teeth (I'm told this is something that can point to stomach ulcers, common in TBs, something we think she's suffered from in the past). She's actually very well behaved when ridden, even when she can hear the field buddy nearby, but I am uncomfortable that she is so anxious when taken out of the field, and it's affected her loading.

We worked hard since last winter to get a feed that suited her (stomach ulcers, and some hyper behaviour in between!) and all was going well until the summer when she started this anxiety.

The owner suggested bringing her in for a while on her own each day, I'm worried it will make her more anxious and bring back the ulcers. Let me know how you get on with your mare.

Has your mare been pushed into the dominant rolewith the changes that have happened and through this shows her inability to cope as anxious behaviours.
Some horses don't cope well with being the dominant one and I can remember a few that just loved the herd leader lookin after them.

ems_12

Hi Monflat, thanks for the reply. It might sound silly but your description matches her former (nicer!) character in that she would be happy being 'looked after' by dominant horse.

We had realised she was the 'new' dominant mare after seeing her assert her dominance over a new field buddy. Once it was noticed, the owners tried to put it back to the way it was, but 'my' mare plus the original dominant horse went at it tooth and nail.

So are we stuck? There was an older gelding who was able to put manners on all in the field but he is no longer with us; there's no other horse we would risk putting in with 'my' sour mare, so have we created a problem mare by allowing her to step into the dominant role?

Edited to add; I've read elsewhere that the dominant horse may have more separation anxiety particularly in this case as she had to 'fight' to get to the position and then gets anxious when she is taken away from the 'herd'.