Help with choosing a breed of dog

BigEejit

We recently moved close to a large park (180ha) in the UK and so the wife has finally agreed that we should get a dog (we were always in town centers/cities before with no parks nearby suitable for bringing a dog for a run).

We have a 40 meter x 10 meter garden but would expect the dog to sleep indoors. The dog would would get walked/run in the park twice a day, by myself mostly but my daughter would be a backup. Twice a week the dog would be left on its own for a few hours. We had dogs when I was growing up and I had one before before but did not replace him when he passed away because we were moving to London.

I really wanted to get a jack russell but they have a reputation for being nippy with small kids at them and we have a 3 1/2 year old son (and a 12 year old daughter) who would likely be doing just that, for a while at least. For the same reason I suppose a border collie would probably be ruled out.

So we would like a medium sized dog that is good with small kids and is a bit boisterous/will chase a ball in the park. We will look in the local shelters for a few months for one, I don't really want a puppy, a cousin of mine got a border collie that was a lovely looking puppy but by the time it grew up no-one could come in the door with it (not mistreated or anything, just really territorial)

spurious

Some lovely older dogs in shelters/pounds whose owners can't mind them any more. Settled, calm dogs, just a bit old with maybe some health issues.

Nody

I'd say your best bet is to reach out to the shelters and explain what you're after rather than tie yourself down to a single breed; you may find a dog of a "unsuitable" breed whose personality is a perfect match even if the breed would generally not be considered or vice versa.

kylith

spurious wrote: »

Some lovely older dogs in shelters/pounds whose owners can't mind them any more. Settled, calm dogs, just a bit old with maybe some health issues.

Not even that, there are thousands of dogs in shelters of all ages, from puppies to geriatrics, and most of them would have nothing medically wrong with them at all, but may have behavioural problems (barking, toilet training, that kind of thing). They are surrendered for all kinds of reasons; from the previous owners not realising the work a dog takes to them emigrating, allergies, deaths, or just plain not wanting the dog any more. Others are strays that were picked up.

Check out shelters, OP, they will help find you the perfect dog for your circumstances.

BigEejit

Thanks for the food for thought guys, I wanted to narrow down the field a little but as mentioned, I should probably be going to the shelters and looking at the the personality of the dogs rather than looking for a specific breed. Saying all that though .... my sister mentioned that a whippet can be a good family dog .... I must do some research.

VonVix

BigEejit wrote: »

Thanks for the food for thought guys, I wanted to narrow down the field a little but as mentioned, I should probably be going to the shelters and looking at the the personality of the dogs rather than looking for a specific breed. Saying all that though .... my sister mentioned that a whippet can be a good family dog .... I must do some research.

I do agree that you should look for a dog and see who clicks with you, personalities are all different, but that said I still think it's important to be aware of breed tendencies and characteristics, which is separate from a dogs personality.

Since working in a doggie daycare I have become all too aware of how certain breeds are VERY similar to one another in terms of specific behaviours they have which has really helped me figure out particular dog breeds I'd love to own and others that I don't think I could ever own, no matter how adorable looking they may be!

salmocab

Whippet is a good suggestion, the sprinter breeds like greyhounds whippets and lurchers make great pets I have a greyhound cross and he is a couch potato, gets out to stretch his legs and runs around like a head case but when he gets home crawls up onto sofa and content to lie beside you. Has a good temperament with our nephews and nieces too when they come round.

Ashbx

You should check out www.dogbreedinfo.com.....fantastic website with some great info on the breeds if you have any in mind! Maybe a Spaniel (although, they have a LOT of energy), Beagle, Korgi, Schnauzer, Collie?

DBB

Ashbx wrote: »

So as long as the dogs are trained properly, those breeds shouldn't be a problem around kids. Chip was a puppy when we got her and Phoebe was 3 when we got her.

With all due respect, saying it's all down to training is over-simplifying it, because it's nowhere near all down to training. I can give you hundreds and hundreds of examples where people socialised and trained their dogs religiously, and still they had problems with their dogs around children. Why? All sorts of reasons, but one of the major, major factors was simply their choice of breed, because some breed traits are simply not consistent with living peaceably with a small child on a full time basis... And do bear in mind that visiting children are an entirely different kettle of fish to living with children full time.
By the same token, I know many, many dogs who never met a child during puppyhood, and have had only the most elementary training, yet are bombproof with children. Why? Because they were bred for patience, calmness, and gentleness.
Whilst it's great that your experience with your dogs around children has been good, I think advising that a person with a small child choose a collie or a terrier based on this is not a good idea, because both breeds/types tend to have a sharpness and tenacity that is inconsistent with living with small kids.
Of course there are exceptions, and of course there are some breeds within the terrier group that are less "terrierish" than others, but looking at the bigger picture, a parent of a small child should tread very carefully if choosing either of these types of dog as a family pet.

DBB

Also op, do view these dog breed info sites with caution. The one linked to above describes how owners need to stem bad behaviour by being "pack leader". This is terribly outdated advice, and I'm afraid it alone would temper how I'd feel about anything else the authors have to say.
But just for interest sake, I checked out what they said about my specialist breed, a breed that I know like the back of my hand. I've rehomed so, so many of these dogs from families who bought them as pets for their kids, and despite putting a lot of effort into socialising and training them, there were still problems between the dogs and the kids, resulting in the dogs having to go.
And yet, this website describes the breed as being great with kids! I know no genuine breeder or person who is very familiar with this breed who'd recommend them as a suitable pet to have around small kids. Again, as I said above, they're often ok, even pretty good with visiting children, but they simply don't have the depth of patience a dog needs to have when living with small kids full time.
So, take what you read on these websites as a very broad guideline, and do not rely on them that what they're saying is necessarily representative.

kylith

Ashbx wrote: »

Yes I do understand completely what you are saying but to rule out all terriers and collies because one type of this breed are not great with children is not good either - I know border collies are supposed to be bad but there are many collies who are notoriously good with kids - rough collies for example. As you will see from my suggestions, I did suggest a collie (I more meant a collie mix) but of all my other suggestions, not one was another terrier or collie! So I am staying away from the "bad" breeds!!!!!

I wanted to give the OP an insight to my dogs who are perfect with kids and to let them know that not all dogs are like this! So yes, if you are going to pick a dog I would choose one that would be best suitable. But equally, I have known spaniels who have gotten aggressive with children so its not all down to the breed! I do have to disagree with what you say about training....I think training is a HUGE part of it!! You socialise your dogs with other dogs so of course you should socialise your dogs with kids, teenagers, old people....everyone!

Also, just to say, although they aren't my kids. They actually live a few doors down to me and I spend A LOT of my time with them plus if we are out for long periods or going away on holidays, my brother takes the dogs for the two weeks or whatever so the dogs are very much in the kids lives!

I just wanted to give the OP an insight to my personal situation and just to be clear, I did not once suggest they should get a border collie or a terrier.

I grew up with a terrier (so she was definitely well socialised with us) and I wouldn't recommend them as a family dog. She was never tormented and we were taught to be gentle with her; she bit me and my brother several times. I currently have terriers - one can just about deal with visiting kids, one can't handle children at all. My friend grew up with a BC and it was driven mental trying to round up any children.

Individuals of a breed may be ok, but as an overall trait those breeds are not suitable for living with children. Recommending them on the basis that yours are fine doesn't take into account the fact that 90% of the breed would not be fine.

DBB

Ashbx wrote: »

Yes I do understand completely what you are saying but to rule out all terriers and collies because one type of this breed are not great with children is not good either

In my first post, I'm not singling out a breed either.
I said that a parent should tread with care if choosing a collie or a terrier. No specific breeds mentioned.

notoriously good with kids - rough collies for example.

I don't agree... Rough collies feature regularly on behaviourists case lists of aggression towards children.

  I do have to disagree with what you say about training....I think training is a HUGE part of it!! You socialise your dogs with other dogs so of course you should socialise your dogs with kids, teenagers, old people....everyone!

I'd rather you didn't misrepresent what I said. Nobody disputes that socialisation and training are vitally important. This is well established.
But to rely on it entirely without taking genetics and inbred behavioural patterns is a huge mistake. The two are absolutely inextricable, and probably divide up 50:50 in terms of relative importance, although some might argue that genetics is more important, because without good behavioural genetics, if you have a dog from behaviourally poor genetic lines, you can socialise it til you're blue in the face... You're still going to end up with a behaviourally challenged adult dog. Again, this is well established in the literature.
But a dog from good behavioural genetics lines can turn into a very balanced adult with a minimal amount of socialisation.
I'm not just talking from personal experience here, the importance of DNA, backed up by good socialisation, is very well established.

Knine

Not meaning to offend Rough Collie owners but not a hope in hell would I be getting one as a family dog. I have young children. I also have lots of experience with Rough Collies. A very close friend of mine breeds and shows them too.

My own dogs who are extremely well socialised have also been on the receiving end of some rather unpredictable behaviour.

Ashbx

Ugh I give up...OP, I have deleted all my posts except the one where I suggested a few dogs that might be of assistance!

Best of luck to you! I hope you find one that's suitable.