Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 25/08

Claude Burgundy

Coat22 wrote: »

Only 342 hours to go before the window closes

And when Vidal signs at 10pm that night he will be presented by Elvis & Michael Jackson signing a duet !

Your Airbag

Pro. F wrote: »

Talk about selective quoting! I addressed all of those points regarding what others question about him, his attitude, etc, but you cut off my post in the middle of a sentence and then called it bizarre.

You clearly said there are F*ck all question marks over him, thats not the case. Bizarre thing to say

beno619 wrote: »

1. The original comment made about Nani was along the lines of him bieng useless on Saturday, Pro F posted a video showing how he was anything but useless.

2. You ended with

Id say you've moved the goalpost.

1. This is the second point I'm making this simple point to you, hopefully it sticks this time. I agreed the video showed hard work and proved anyone saying Nani did NOTHING wrong as Pro F said "lol at at saying Nani did nothing"

2. Yes I ended with that, which doesn't contradict anything I said. He worked hard but lacked quality in the final 3rd. We need someone who can do both. What exactly can't you understand about that?

homerjay2005

Adamocovic wrote: »

Quote from VG on MUTV after defeat


You would imagine we will bring in a player within the next 4-5 days. Would like to see Daley Blind join us, but judging by interviews he's given saying he's happy at Ajax I would think Rojo is the most likely player, if we are to sign a defender soon.

he also said that he has know for several weeks that we have needed players and what players he needed but he is not going to panic. this comes the day after saying it takes only 24 hours to sign a player.

what on earth are we waiting for then?

in my opinion, weve missed every one of our top targets this summer and now are turning to back up ones such as Rojo and then big ones like Di Maria.

essentially there was nothing being reported all summer, as there was nothing to report.

Pro. F

Your Airbag wrote: »

You clearly said there are F*ck all question marks over him, thats not the case. Bizarre thing to say

In response to your mention of there being questions over him I said:

"Fúck all question marks hang over him regarding his quality (what you brought up) and consistency (the old favourite of his critics) for me. The fact that other people question his ability and consistency is of no consequence to me. The majority of football fans think silly things.

I do question his ability to stay fit after the last few years, and I question why Fergie seemed to take such a disliking to him. Maybe he is a shít to deal with in the dressing room and in training. On the pitch I've no doubts about him.
"

You misquoted me in order to pretend that I said something bizarre.

MD1990

Fellaini should get retrospective action for his elbow. Does it quite often too when things are going against him.

The Moldy Gowl

I have 7 pages to read back on.

Anyone want to sum it up?

Or is it the usual gobobbles?

How Soon Is Now

Seen this on Skys site.

Reports coming out of Spain claim Bayern Munich are stepping up their interest in Atletico Madrid defender Diego Godin. Bayern's sporting director Michael Reschke is set to to travel to the Spanish capital to hold talks with Atletico over a possible move.

No interest in Benatia ?

How Soon Is Now

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

I have 7 pages to read back on.

Anyone want to sum it up?

Or is it the usual gobobbles?

****e talk all of it.

Your Airbag

Pro. F wrote: »

In response to your mention of there being questions over him I said:


You misquoted me in order to pretend that I said something bizarre.

Even then his qaulity has question marks. Your calling Saturdays preformance a good crossing display I presume?

It wasn't, it was shocking.

kippy

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

I have 7 pages to read back on.

Anyone want to sum it up?

Or is it the usual gobobbles?

United aren't in disaray,
United are in disaray,
United are signing someone,
United aren't signing someone,

Thepoet85

It really doesn't look great for the club when they seem to struggle to attract top talent two summers in a row. Exeter are the only club in the football league to have made fewer signings, but they had a transfer embargo up until Friday I believe. Really hope we can get a few players in before the end of the window, as it's badly needed.

redbaron_99

Pro. F wrote: »

In response to your mention of there being questions over him I said:


You misquoted me in order to pretend that I said something bizarre.

Nani is a fairly average footballer. Has good days, has bad days, but mostly he's just average.

Coat22

homerjay2005 wrote: »

he also said that he has know for several weeks that we have needed players and what players he needed but he is not going to panic. this comes the day after saying it takes only 24 hours to sign a player.

what on earth are we waiting for then?

in my opinion, weve missed every one of our top targets this summer and now are turning to back up ones such as Rojo and then big ones like Di Maria.

essentially there was nothing being reported all summer, as there was nothing to report.

The next 2 weeks are going to be excruciatingly painful aren’t they?

We might get Rojo and then nothing will happen until the panic buy this day 2 weeks. I hadn’t seen those quotes from VG on MUTV but it looks like there is nothing in the bag and the ego thinks he can turn around what he’s got rather than going after big money signings.

Pro. F

Montroseee wrote: »

Well largely you are correct, I think it's the most difficult position for a variety of reasons to consistently be world class in. But there are several who have managed to do it and these are really the only wide players worth that kind of money - Robben, Ribery, Bale when he plays there, Sanchez?

Bale hasn't done it for years on end yet. Although I'm sure he could, I still wouldn't be surprised if he was to spend his career out wide that he would go through spells, when his team were under-performing, where he would get a lot of unfair criticism.

Sanchez definitely has had good and bad times at Barca and come in for a lot of unfair criticism, like I think Di Maria does.

Robben has had poor spells, mostly to do with injuries and discipline.

Ribery I don't rate to highly as an out-and-out winger myself.

For me Di Maria is in the group along with Sanchez and a good few others as top quality out-and-out wingers, who are all behind Bale.

Personally, I don't think that clubs should spend huge money on them because I honestly think it's one of the easier positions to find quality in.

Robson99

Thought Nani‘s performance on Sat was just typical of how he has been for the last few seasons. Gets the ball and you feel like hes going to do something wonderful but ends up doing his headless chicken party piece. Head down aimless crosses and looking around for someone to blame. I would rather see anyone of the younger players get a chance ahead of him. He‘s had his and is now past his sell by date

Hank Scorpio

Another day and it doesn't look like anyone is signing, getting really mad/worried at this stage

Nani did his usual thing of doing well and beating a defender and instead of playing the right quick pass held onto the ball far too long to allow they're defense to regroup, the talent is there but his decision making is brutal

The Moldy Gowl

How Soon Is Now wrote: »

****e talk all of it.

Can i have it in gif form carol

Adamocovic

I think what has made the transfer window so much worse is the fact that Ed had talked it up so much.

I know he was trying to increase confidence and morale but to say the things he has and then not bring in any new faces since is very worrying. It was over hyped.

Really it will take something big in the next 2 weeks to please most fans.

Giggsy11

Robson99 wrote: »

Robben and Ribery come to mind

Robben lost his place in their treble season. He started playing well since the KO round against Juventus when Kroos went off injured and Robben came on to replace him. Since then he was immense. Prior to that his Bayern career was stop start and inconsistent.

Coat22

Coat22 wrote: »

The next 2 weeks are going to be excruciatingly painful aren’t they?

We might get Rojo and then nothing will happen until the panic buy this day 2 weeks. I hadn’t seen those quotes from VG on MUTV but it looks like there is nothing in the bag and the ego thinks he can turn around what he’s got rather than going after big money signings.

Scrap that - that was a quote from Adamcovic rather than VG. I live in hope.

Pro. F

Your Airbag wrote: »

Even then his qaulity has question marks. Your calling Saturdays preformance a good crossing display I presume?

It wasn't, it was shocking.

I already addressed these points, you can go back and read them again if you want. If you chose to reply please don't alter quotes of my posts in order to misrepresent what I said the next time.

redbaron_99

Coat22 wrote: »

The next 2 weeks are going to be excruciatingly painful aren’t they?

We might get Rojo and then nothing will happen until the panic buy this day 2 weeks. I hadn’t seen those quotes from VG on MUTV but it looks like there is nothing in the bag and the ego thinks he can turn around what he’s got rather than going after big money signings.

He could be gambling with his job if he wants to prove something with this current squad. And it's not very professional of him. It's about the benefit of the club, not to prove something about his managerial ability.

It's not a particularly strong squad, and we are only one or two injuries away from a full blown crisis.

Can you imagine if any of de gea, Herrera, or one of our senior centre defenders pick an injury that keeps them out for a few months...

Your Airbag

Pro. F wrote: »

Bale hasn't done it for years on end yet. Although I'm sure he could, I still wouldn't be surprised if he was to spend his career out wide that he would go through spells, when his team were under-performing, where he would get a lot of unfair criticism.

Sanchez definitely has had good and bad times at Barca and come in for a lot of unfair criticism, like I think Di Maria does.

Robben has had poor spells, mostly to do with injuries and discipline.

Ribery I don't rate to highly as an out-and-out winger myself.

For me Di Maria is in the group along with Sanchez and a good few others as top quality out-and-out wingers, who are all behind Bale.

Personally, I don't think that clubs should spend huge money on them because I honestly think it's one of the easier positions to find quality in.

How would you rate Nani compared to the names you mentioned above?

Its not easy for UTD apparently, we seem to be sturggling to find quailty in this position.

Pro. F

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Nani is a fairly average footballer. Has good days, has bad days, but mostly he's just average.

A winger doesn't score and assist that many by being average.

TheTownie

redbaron_99

Pro. F wrote: »

A winger doesn't score and assist that many by being average.

Spend more time watching football and less time reading stats, mate.

Your Airbag

Pro. F wrote: »

I already addressed these points, you can go back and read them again if you want. If you chose to reply please don't alter quotes of my posts in order to misrepresent what I said the next time.

I read them and disagreed and came back with a list of how poor his quality was in this aspect on Saturday. So i don't need to go back as I already addressed it. Your seem to be avoiding and deflecting.

My guess is you don't want to talk quality because the video and player in question didn't show much of it on Saturday.

How many marks out of ten would you give his crossing display from the Swansea game?

Maximus Alexander

TheTownie wrote: »

Lingard picture

Poor chap, he must be in the horrors. Imagine getting your chance at Manchester United and then being forced off so soon. :mad:

Pro. F

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

Can i have it in gif form carol

Pro. F

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Spend more time watching football and less time reading stats, mate.

I watch loads of football. Do you think goals aren't important?

Your Airbag

So thats Lingard out for the foreseeable.

Maximus Alexander

Pro. F wrote: »

I watch loads of football. Do you think goals aren't important?

I was to understand that they were the only factor taken into consideration when determining a winner. Have I been doing it wrong?

homerjay2005

Coat22 wrote: »

Scrap that - that was a quote from Adamcovic rather than VG. I live in hope.

eh? LVg said he needs players and has known this for many weeks, but is not panicking....which is strange as panic is exactly whats going to happen the more this mess goes on.

people are saying he is saying this to cover Woodward and take pressure off, while i doubt it is the case, it could have some element to play in all of this.

some points from Ollie Holt about Saturday.

The reality is the side Dutchman Van Gaal fielded would have been embarrassed by Manchester City or Chelsea.

BT pundit Steve McManaman rated it the worst United line-up he had seen for more than 20 years. Alongside him, Paul Scholes did not disagree.

Scholes pointed to a lack of quality in midfield. Others pounced on uncertain defensive performances from Phil Jones and Chris Smalling.

Both were right and it is ­inevitable the focus will switch back to the transfer acumen of United executive vice-chairman Ed Woodward.

Because so far this summer, rather than closing the gap on the rest of the leading clubs, United allowed it to widen.

Fifty-two days have elapsed since they last signed a player and they have let City and Chelsea, in particular, steal a march on them.

Woodward’s stated intention was to get business done early this summer, like in the old days under Sir Alex Ferguson.

Whatever the reason, that did not happen. Instead, they left it to the last minute to try to claim reinforcements.

Sure, they signed Luke Shaw and Ander Herrera earlier in the summer and both are highly promising young players. But neither is of the calibre of, say, Toni Kroos, who was ready to join but was then allowed to sign for Real Madrid.

Shaw and Herrera are not going to propel United back to the top of the table. They are not marquee signings.

United are fond of calling themselves the biggest club in the world. Yet compare their ambition with that of Real Madrid, Barcelona and Bayern Munich.

United are not even close. They are not just in danger of falling further behind in English football; they face losing touch completely with the European elite.

The reality is the current predicament is the product of years of under-investment by the Glazer Family that was camouflaged by Ferguson’s strengths. That has to be reversed if they are to become the pre-eminent power in the English game again.

No matter how fine a coach Van Gaal is, no matter how good he is at getting the maximum from his players, the gap in the raw material possessed by United and teams such as Chelsea and City is growing too wide.

Woodward must act fast and boldly. Otherwise, another season of mediocrity beckons.

There are rumours a stunning transfer coup is about to happen. Some whisper the name of Bastian Schweinsteiger. Others Arturo Vidal, or Daley Blind.

But United have been talking a good game for some time now, just as they did last summer. Gary Neville said in his newspaper column on Saturday he believed two players would be signed before the end of the month

Robson99

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Robben lost his place in their treble season. He started playing well since the KO round against Juventus when Kroos went off injured and Robben came on to replace him. Since then he was immense. Prior to that his Bayern career was stop start and inconsistent.

He wasn't half bad at Chelsea either. And hes never had a bad game again us IMO.

Your Airbag

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Spend more time watching football and less time reading stats, mate.

Pro. F wrote: »

I watch loads of football. Do you think goals aren't important?

Both of you have points here. Yes of course goals are important. Your one of Nanis biggest supporters on here and weve all seen the list of goals and assists many times.

Yet people still question Nani. Why?

Its not because they are idiots its because Nani can be mcuk for 89 mins then score a goal.

I've seen him, misplace simple passes, shoot when he should pass, scuff crosses and be very poor on many occasions. Then he will grab a goal or assist and in lots of matches the goal or assist doesn't come.

Its great when he gets a goal or assits but it doesn't all of a sudden turn 80+ mins of being piss poor into a good display and make a very good consistant player.

That list of goals and assits would have many matches on it where you'd be tearing your hair out watching him being rubbish until he finally does something.

Pro. F

Your Airbag wrote: »

How would you rate Nani compared to the names you mentioned above?

Its not easy for UTD apparently, we seem to be sturggling to find quailty in this position.

United's strategy gives very little indication towards what quality is available.

Based on his consistent quality when he's had regular football I would rate Nani up there with Di Maria and Sanchez.

Based on the fact that he has been out injured and out of favour at his club for the last few years I would expect him to be sold cheap if he goes.

Maximus Alexander

Your Airbag wrote: »

That list of goals and assits would have many matches on it where you'd be tearing your hair out watching him being rubbish until he finally does something.

See I don't get this reasoning, because if he's scoring and assisting more goals than an alternative player in his position would, and if he's not causing more goals to be conceded than would be conceded otherwise, I couldn't care how many people are tearing their hair out - I want him in the side.

Your Airbag

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

See I don't get this reasoning, because if he's scoring and assisting more goals than an alternative player in his position would, and if he's not causing more goals to be conceded than would be conceded otherwise, I couldn't care how many people are tearing their hair out - I want him in the side.

The reasoning is he hasn't being doing that at UTD for a long time now. So where is the benefit? If its what we got on Saturady then he should go. Many players considered average would have had identical displays to what Nani produced Saturday.

Even in the period when he was scoring and asssisting the reasoning is to have a player who maintains a better level of preformance week in week out where the team as a whole benefits from the upshots such as maintaining more possesion and UTD plays better because of it, not the individual. There are no stats for this possibility.

The goals conceded point is moot, where are the stats for showing a goal resulting in a move breaking down due to Nani giving it away or trying something silly?

redbaron_99

Pro. F wrote: »

I watch loads of football. Do you think goals aren't important?

I do, yeah. When's the last time he scored one?

I would also judge a wide player on his ability to cross a ball. It takes Nani about ten attempts at a corner to beat the first man!!

Robson99

Pro. F wrote: »

Personally, I don't think that clubs should spend huge money on them because I honestly think it's one of the easier positions to find quality in.

Well we could certainly do with finding one or two quality ones. You think its an easy position to find quality in yet one of your earlier posts question what consistent top quality wingers there has been over the last number of years??
You want quality its out there but you pay for it

Pro. F

Your Airbag wrote: »

I read them and disagreed and came back with a list of how poor his quality was in this aspect on Saturday. So i don't need to go back as I already addressed it. Your seem to be avoiding and deflecting.

My guess is you don't want to talk quality because the video and player in question didn't show much of it on Saturday.

How many marks out of ten would you give his crossing display from the Swansea game?

And I responded to your list of what you saw as his poor quality. So you can stop pretending that I haven't directly addressed all your criticisms of Nani's performance on Saturday.

I would give his crossing 7/10 on Saturday. A decent rate of delivering quality from the opportunities he got, but no outstanding crosses. Of course the sample (45 minutes in the first game of the season when the whole team were struggling) is tiny and flawed, so it is stupid to be analysing it this much in the first place.

homerjay2005

is there anybody reliable reporting these Van Gaal and Woodward problems or who started them?

have a feeling its coming from red issue but not sure.

Your Airbag

Pro. F wrote: »

And I responded to your list of what you saw as his poor quality. So you can stop pretending that I haven't directly addressed all your criticisms of Nani's performance on Saturday.

I would give his crossing 7/10 on Saturday. A decent rate of delivering quality from the opportunities he got, but no outstanding crosses. Of course the sample (45 minutes in the first game of the season when the whole team were struggling) is tiny and flawed, so it is stupid to be analysing it this much in the first place.

Jaysus. If thats really your score we can stop the discussion now.

Obviously your biased to the player on such high level, a proper discussion won't happen.

Pro. F

Robson99 wrote: »

Well we could certainly do with finding one or two quality ones. You think its an easy position to find quality in yet one of your earlier posts question what consistent top quality wingers there has been over the last number of years??
You want quality its out there but you pay for it

You've missed the point of that post. My point was that whoever you pay for, even the likes of Di Maria and Sanchez, there will always be questions over their form when you look long term.

The issue is that all wingers can look poor if their teams are under-performing. That doesn't mean that there aren't a lot of good wingers about, it just means that the position always comes in for undeserved criticism.

xtal191

https://twitter.com/FutbolSergi/status/501407500982181888

irishfeen

MOD's do ye want to attach this to the first post again?

Montroseee

Pro. F wrote: »

United's strategy gives very little indication towards what quality is available.

Based on his consistent quality when he's had regular football I would rate Nani up there with Di Maria and Sanchez.

Based on the fact that he has been out injured and out of favour at his club for the last few years I would expect him to be sold cheap if he goes.

You can't pick the best 12 months of a player's career and use that to compare them players that have consistently performed at the highest level ie. Sanchez and Di Maria both since they were 21. Outside of that period where Nani admittedly looked world class, he has not been anywhere near these top players. Don't forget that players like Valencia, Krasic etc. have gone through stellar periods where they have looked like top class.

Fergie took a disliking too him and judging him on the field, you'd have to wonder what his work ethic/attitude in training is like.

Edit: Just saw you gave Nani's crossing a 7/10 on Saturday - as has been said, you obviously can't have a proper discussion on Nani.

Schwiiing

Are these twitter links not working for anyone else?

Pro. F

Your Airbag wrote: »

Jaysus. If thats really your score we can stop the discussion now.

We could have stopped the discussion ages ago when it became obvious that we judge crosses in a fundamentally different way.

Your Airbag wrote: »

Obviously your biased to the player on such high level, a proper discussion won't happen.

Obviously you're biased against the player on such high level, a proper discussion won't happen.

Robson99

Pro. F wrote: »

And I responded to your list of what you saw as his poor quality. So you can stop pretending that I haven't directly addressed all your criticisms of Nani's performance on Saturday.

I would give his crossing 7/10 on Saturday. A decent rate of delivering quality from the opportunities he got, but no outstanding crosses. Of course the sample (45 minutes in the first game of the season when the whole team were struggling) is tiny and flawed, so it is stupid to be analysing it this much in the first place.

Well analyze it further so. His performances for the last 2 or 3 seasons have probably been 4 or 5/10 at best. He has nothing to offer this utd team going forward imo. There comes a time when you just have to say enough is enough.