Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 25/08

Ordinary man

It wouldn't surprise me if united went for vlaar soon if lvg wants to keep the 352 system. He's expeienced, vocal and knows how to organise a back 3. Personally i think we'll get a cm and switch to a 433 that players are more used of

The Moldy Gowl

ericzeking wrote: »

That's David Jones

*penny drops*

I wonder who would have won a game between those 2 sides

Mikeyt086

I just clicked into the "humour" thread by mistake...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUfS_2UGftg

v3ttel

Di Maria added to FPL at 9.5.

TheDoc

I would be highly disturbed if we havn't cleared 3-4 players out of the first team squad by the end of the week.

kryogen

Pro. F wrote: »

Fellaini could have played instead of Anderson, but other than that, the quick turn around and injury concern is a valid point.

But then he should have put them a formation that they were more familiar with and given them a more straight forward plan to follow.

Fellainis injured

Edit: I see that has been acknowledged now

homerjay2005

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

I just clicked into the "humour" thread by mistake...

weve been putting up with it for 12 or 13 months now, nothing new really accept LVG has replaced Moyes in the gifs and pics.

weve had our days in the sun, they will come again also.

TheTownie

v3ttel wrote: »

Di Maria added to FPL at 9.5.

Hes unlikely to start this weekend. Not even in the country at the moment.

Mitch Connor

Want Vidal deal done, so I can get my 3 new jerseys...

Home - Vidal.
White Away - Januzaj
Blue Away - Di Maria.

Come on United, stop holding things up.

advertsfox

v3ttel wrote: »

Di Maria added to FPL at 9.5.

In ya go son!

TheTownie

TheDoc wrote: »

I would be highly disturbed if we havn't cleared 3-4 players out of the first team squad by the end of the week.

Its hard to shift them with the wages their on. All reports of players leaving involves other clubs wanting players on loan rather than buying.

advertsfox

kryogen

titan18 wrote: »

Not really, and Chelsea and City have come from a much lower standard as they're only recently rich and were able to put their resources into their youth academy then



Liverpool have Sterling. I'd kill for a player of his ability to come through the United academy again.

Chelsea and City started from a much lower base than us and have only recently started investing in their academies.

Arsenal have Wilshere, Sczesney and Gibbs in their current team.

Spurs academy is crap.

Everton have had Rooney, Rodwell and Barkley come through, and they've got Ledson in their youth team atm who's meant to be very promising.

Southampton have had plenty come through over the last 10 years.

Outside of the PL, Barcelona are obviously ridiculous with the talent they're bringing through, Bayern bring through a few players, and whilst Real don't really play any of theirs, they've managed to sell the likes of Morata for big money, or before with Negredo.

We can't even do what Chelsea and City do of just buying lots of young players and making money off them when they come good. Look at the money Chelsea got for De Bruyne, Lukaku and then Courtois coming back to them

I'm going to stop your post at Liverpool/Sterling. He did not come through their youth system. I assume the rest of your post contains similar errors

advertsfox

Would love to see this a reality.

homerjay2005

Mitch Connor wrote: »

White Away - Januzaj

he was really poor last night, it showed he has a lot of learning & developing to do before he deserves the credit he is getting.

i wont go as far as saying he is overrated, but the hype around him is a bit OTT - he is not as good (yet) as people are saying though he has plenty of time to get better.

irishfeen

advertsfox wrote: »

Would love to see this a reality.

That's a great team.. We need Vidal don't we..

TheDoc

homerjay2005 wrote: »

he was really poor last night, it showed he has a lot of learning & developing to do before he deserves the credit he is getting.

i wont go as far as saying he is overrated, but the hype around him is a bit OTT - he is not as good (yet) as people are saying though he has plenty of time to get better.

Totally agree, claims he will be World Class are laughable. Has a lot of developement to do, can go either way. Was hopeless last night.

ericzeking

Here lads, my overall view is that with limited matches this year, the squad should be trimmed to fook and fellas should be earning their wages, like we shouldn't really need more than 18 or 20 players. Play more or less the same 11 on a weekly basis, get some continuity and inbed the 'system' properly.

We could build it up again when we get back in the CL
But fock me the injury list is so bad that we need all these extra lads just to field a team.

Is there anything to be said about this? Are players too precious these days? Have even more lads contracted a touch of the Louis Sahas where they will only play when absolutely 100%....or what's going on...

paulbok

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

Was Ronaldo and Saha and fletcher playing in that?

Maybe a few more?

A strong enough team with the heavy hitters coming on after an hour.

Man Utd: Howard, Brown, Pique, Silvestre, Bardsley, O'Shea, Jones, Richardson, Solskjaer (Ronaldo 59), Saha, Rossi (Rooney 58).
Subs Not Used: Steele, Eckersley, Campbell.


Even Howard Webb was the ref

kryogen

TheDoc wrote: »

I would be highly disturbed if we havn't cleared 3-4 players out of the first team squad by the end of the week.

Its getting people to take some of them that will be a problem, clubs that would be interested in the likes of Anderson won't be able to afford his wages probably, Hernandez I expect to go, Kagawa too maybe and they should be easy enough sales. I hope Danny is kept, Cleverley unless bodies are coming in to take his sqaud place, there is nobody in the reserves that provides a better option right now and contrary to some peoples thinking about last night, Powell was muck, absolutely brutal and didn't look like he cared at all. That is not something you should be seeing from a player like him, it was a chance for him to put down a marker and stake a claim for a squad place, he failed.

I think Michael Keane will get a loan, hopefully because he needs another one. I guess a lot of it is down to what system Louis plans on going with once the window is shut

4 at the back is the best option for us right now imo, a 4312 with flexibility seems like it is the best option, though I would be open to the idea of a 433 with a forward line of Di Maria, RvP and Rooney, pace is the most important thing to inject into this team, there is no tempo to the play and until that changes teams are going to find it very easy to defend against us and hit us on the counter as we commit more players forward.

Van Gaal has a job on his hands here, but no need to panic yet.

ericzeking

TheDoc wrote: »

Totally agree, claims he will be World Class are laughable. Has a lot of developement to do, can go either way. Was hopeless last night.

I get the feeling he has come back a little bit 'Big Time Charlie'... I could be completely wrong...maybe it's just the new haircut....!!

intellectual dosser

Look at the state we're in right now with injuries, will need a full squad to get us through the season.

homerjay2005

advertsfox wrote: »

Would love to see this a reality.

is there enough pace in that Diamond for it to work? apart from Di maria, the other 3 dont really have lightending pace.

Fitz*

RayCun wrote: »

Bought from QPR three years ago.

When he was 15. And stayed playing academy football for 2 years before making his 1st team debut. Not as if he was bought as a 'ready-made' youth player, if that is even possible.

RayCun wrote: »

Give you them, though Chesney was bought at 16

So is it ok to count this player as coming though the academy, because he was bought at 16, but not Sterling at 15?

RayCun wrote: »

So of the teams in the top 6 last year, Arsenal have brought through 3 players and so have Everton.
United have brought through Evans, Welbeck, Cleverley. Wilson started last season, and Blackett and Lingard have both started for the first team this season.

You're counting players like Blackett, Lingard, Wilson but fail to mention other clubs players, brought through academies and made more appearances than them players combined. very one dimensional view if you ask me :rolleyes:

I'll just mention that under Rodgers, Liverpool have fielded Kelly, Flanagan, Wisdom, Suso, Teixeira, Sterling, Ibe, Morgan, Yesil, Sinclair, Robinson, Smith in competitive 1st team games, all while coming through (or playing for) the Liverpool academy also.

8 out of those 12 have played in the league too FYI.

irishfeen

homerjay2005 wrote: »

is there enough pace in that Diamond for it to work? apart from Di maria, the other 3 dont really have lightending pace.

Shaw and Raf bombing forward could inject that pace.

twam2008

As it stands, would a 4-5-1 not suit us much better?

DDG

Rafa

---

Jones

---

Rojo

---

Shaw

Januzaj

---

Herrera

---

Vidal/AN Other

---

Mata

---

Di Maria

Rooney/RVP

adox

TheTownie wrote: »

Hes unlikely to start this weekend. Not even in the country at the moment.

What?

Spazdarn

I don't know if I wasn't paying all that much attention but I didn't think Januzaj was that bad. He was only one of two or three players that were actually running in the right direction.

homerjay2005

intellectual dosser wrote: »

Look at the state we're in right now with injuries, will need a full squad to get us through the season.

of course injuries are a problem, but had we got our business done earlier in the summer (both getting rid of players and getting them in), it may not have effected us as much.

its horrible luck, but you make you own luck sometimes and right now it appears that anything possible that could go wrong, is going wrong.

i do find it a bit strange however that 6 players played last night that the manager didnt involve in preseason.

magnumbud

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Want Vidal deal done, so I can get my 3 new jerseys...

Home - Vidal.
White Away - Januzaj
Blue Away - Di Maria.

Come on United, stop holding things up.

dont like either of the other kits but really like the blue one. think i'll pick that up with di maria on the back when im at OT at the end of september................... or vidal if hes signed :pac:

has di maria's number been confirmed by united? wonder if holding off to give vidal 7 and di maria 9 :P

Your Airbag

kryogen wrote: »

Really? Not one. Ok so

I know you don't agree with him but if you analyise it from a neutral perspective its not that crazy.

Who are our stand out candidates to get into another team? RVP, Rooney, DDG, Mata, Herrera, Januzaj, Smalling, Shaw?

Look at Chelseas defence, taking the starting line up from their first two games

• 13 Courtois
• 02 Ivanovic
• 28 Azpilicueta
• 26 Terry
• 24 Cahill

Courtois is quality, I dont think Jose would pick DDG over him, there isn't much between the two. The remaining three defenders? I'm not sure Smalling, Jones or Blackett would dislodge any of the CBs. Shaw maybe but Jose didn't go for him.


MF

• 10 Hazard
• 08 Oscar
• 21 Matic
• 14 Schürrle
• 04 Fàbregas

Wingers? no, we are beaten hands down. Then Cesc, Matic and Oscar. I don't think Fellaini, Herrera, Clev, Carrick or Fletch would get in there. We now Mata was moved on because of his lack of pace.



Diego Costa up front. He is big bulky and skillful. Rooney may have a chance here but Costa has age on his side. RVP is outpaced by Costa.



Jose is building a pacey and strong team, honestly its not crazy to think that he wouldn't prefer one of ours.


For City there are a couple more chances for UTD players, taking the starting line up against Pool

• 01 Hart
• 05 Zabaleta
• 26 Demichelis
• 22 Clichy
• 04 Kompany

Again, nothing in the keepers. Demichelis maybe but he improved a lot late last season. So Clichy at LB, Shaw and Rojo over him? Yes for Shaw imo but would Pellegrini see it that way, Clichy has more top four experince than Shaw.


The rest

• Silva
• 08 Nasri
• 42 Y Touré
• 06 Fernando
• 10 Dzeko (Agüero - 68' )
• 35 Jovetic

For MF I think City would not want any of our MFs over theirs. Rooney and RVP over Dzeko and Jovetic. Yes over Jovetic but I left in the Augero sub above because he starts if fit and that changes it, I don't RVP or Rooney would be preferred over him.


The squad depth City have is staggering though, they have like for like all over the place. We are lagging behind with the quailty of player.

Mikeyt086

homerjay2005 wrote: »

weve been putting up with it for 12 or 13 months now, nothing new really accept LVG has replaced Moyes in the gifs and pics.

weve had our days in the sun, they will come again also.

Ah I know I was just saying for a laugh.

It doesn't bother me, some of them are quite funny, others make me question if the creator was raised in a skip by chimps.

But last night I was watching the match with a few mates and one of them said "Other fans are going to have a field day with this." and my reply was "Rightly so. This is utterly hilarious."

NTMK

adox wrote: »

What?

flew back to madrid last night to finalise things over there (moving house and stuff)


i hope he comes back:pac:

Crimson King

homerjay2005 wrote: »

is there enough pace in that Diamond for it to work? apart from Di maria, the other 3 dont really have lightending pace.

I think Herrera is a fast enough player, and Vidal is fast too.

I was thinking about it this morning and that's actually the team I want, funny to see someone else come up with it.

At this stage a signal of intent is needed with the deadweights. Something big, like buying Anderson off (10 months left on his contract). It will buck others up and show Van Gaal simply won't accept half arsed attempts like last night. If he took one more limp corner I would have broken my TV.

irishfeen

I see Sky Italia are majorly taking the piss out of us over last nights result ... bringing together loads of mocking tweets by fans

DrPhilG

advertsfox wrote: »

Would love to see this a reality.

Really do hope that Rojo does well. I've not been convinced by Smalling at all so far and Evans has gone from being regarded as our best defender, to being one of the biggest culprits in our most embarrassing defeats in years.

I do hope we return to a 4 man back line. LVG keeps saying that he played 352 because he didn't have the players for 433. Well news flash Louis, you don't have the players for 352 either!

v3ttel

I was reading some replies to a tweet by Ducker on Twitter. Apparently Real Madrid lost their first game 4-0 after Di Maria signed for them too.

I haven't checked but that's hilarious if true. It didn't turn out half bad for them in the end :pac:

Liam O

Any chance people can stop putting Vidal in lineups like he's already signed?

Please and thank you.

titan18

RayCun wrote: »

Bought from QPR three years ago.



Its ten years since Chelsea won the lottery, and they were a top ten side before that, plenty of time for players to come through.



Give you them, though Chesney was bought at 16





promising :rolleyes:

So of the teams in the top 6 last year, Arsenal have brought through 3 players and so have Everton.
United have brought through Evans, Welbeck, Cleverley. Wilson started last season, and Blackett and Lingard have both started for the first team this season.

Well, Cleverley is pretty much a minus tbh. He's sh1t. Evans is decentish but then everyone else wants a new CB in so how good is he. Welbeck works hard but is very inconsistent in front of goal, which for a forward, isn't a good trait to have.

As for Chelsea, not sure I'd count them as youth players, but they're doing a very good at signings 16 or 17 year olds, and loaning them out until they can come into their side or selling them at a profit. Already mentioned Lukaku and De Bruyne, but they've got Thorgan Hazard, Traore, Piazon and Atsu out on loan atm (along with fcukloads of others), and they're going to make some decent money off of them. Kakuta, McEachran, Wallace and Omeruo will probably fetch decentish money too. Bertrand is a decent player, and will get good money for. Got money for a bunch of other players over the years (Mancienne, Huth, Van Aanholt etc) which they're then able to re-spend.

We've gotten similar money for some players (ranging 1-5m, nothing on the Lukaku scale), but really, we should be doing much more.

kryogen wrote: »

I'm going to stop your post at Liverpool/Sterling. He did not come through their youth system. I assume the rest of your post contains similar errors

Bought when he was 15, and spent a few years in their youth system. So, their scouts and youth team doing a good job there.

irishfeen

Liam O wrote: »

Any chance people can stop putting Vidal in lineups like he's already signed?

Please and thank you.

Shur there is no fun in that ... Anyway ha we don't have anyone else to fill in.

TheDoc

There is enough history with LVG to indicate slow starts, but success eventually. Not getting my knickers in a twist. He says himself takes 90 days for players to get to grips with his methods.

Pro. F

titan18 wrote: »

Well, Cleverley is pretty much a minus tbh. He's sh1t. Evans is decentish but then everyone else wants a new CB in so how good is he. Welbeck works hard but is very inconsistent in front of goal, which for a forward, isn't a good trait to have.

As for Chelsea, not sure I'd count them as youth players, but they're doing a very good at signings 16 or 17 year olds, and loaning them out until they can come into their side or selling them at a profit. Already mentioned Lukaku and De Bruyne, but they've got Thorgan Hazard, Traore, Piazon and Atsu out on loan atm (along with fcukloads of others), and they're going to make some decent money off of them. Kakuta, McEachran, Wallace and Omeruo will probably fetch decentish money too. Bertrand is a decent player, and will get good money for. Got money for a bunch of other players over the years (Mancienne, Huth, Van Aanholt etc) which they're then able to re-spend.


Bought when he was 15, and spent a few years in their youth system. So, their scouts and youth team doing a good job there.

Move the goal posts much?

homerjay2005

TheDoc wrote: »

There is enough history with LVG to indicate slow starts, but success eventually. Not getting my knickers in a twist. He says himself takes 90 days for players to get to grips with his methods.

i appreciate what you are saying, but 90 days could be too late though in the premier league. we already are 5 points behind in what should have been 2 handy games - DI Maria will help, but the team has massive problems that i dont think Rojo, Shaw and Herrera will solve

if we keep dropping points for the next 3 months, we wont finish in top 4. having spent the guts of £200million in 12 months, with a top class manager and a team who walked the league 15 months ago you'd expect us to be doing much better than just "wait and see".

MagicIRL

irishfeen wrote: »

Shur there is no fun in that ... Anyway ha we don't have anyone else to fill in.

Throw in Blind!

Mitch Connor

TheDoc wrote: »

There is enough history with LVG to indicate slow starts, but success eventually. Not getting my knickers in a twist. He says himself takes 90 days for players to get to grips with his methods.

as I said earlier, I do get this and it excuses some of the crap so far - but 4-0 to a League 1 side can't be excused by ANYTHING, imo. It just isn't acceptable or understandable for any reason at all.

Liam O

TheDoc wrote: »

There is enough history with LVG to indicate slow starts, but success eventually. Not getting my knickers in a twist. He says himself takes 90 days for players to get to grips with his methods.

The thing is, especially after that preseason and with the early fixtures, a fast start was not just needed but was made to seem likely. I know they were only preseason games but a different United has shown up in every competitive game since then and even with the injuries it doesn't make sense. After the hopes I had I've already almost reverted into last season's shell and after all the optimism over the last few months it's a sobering experience.

irishfeen

homerjay2005 wrote: »

i appreciate what you are saying, but 90 days could be too late though in the premier league. we already are 5 points behind in what should have been 2 handy games - DI Maria will help, but the team has massive problems that i dont think Rojo, Shaw and Herrera will solve

if we keep dropping points for the next 3 months, we wont finish in top 4. having spent the guts of £200million in 12 months, with a top class manager and a team who walked the league 15 months ago you'd expect us to be doing much better than just "wait and see".

We not going next or near winning the league this year anyway so no massive panic yet ... Get to Christmas 4th or 5th and things will come good I'm certain for at least 4th ir 3rd.

Pro. F

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

See if it was a scrappy 1-0 defeat I'd agree with you, but there should be enough talent, leadership and determination in any United side to avoid getting absolutely hockeyed by MK Dons. 'The system' is no excuse for some of the embarrassing errors, poor passing and lack of wherewithal that we saw last night.

The likes of Evans, Hernandez, Anderson and Welbeck should have been taking that game by the scruff of the neck and giving the younger lads an opportunity to show what they can do. Instead, they were arguably the worst performers on the pitch.

It highlights for me the complete lack of depth at the club, despite the fact that there are plenty of players available. There are too many players at the club who are not close to the standard they should be at, to the point that even the first eleven still has players in it that many would argue are barely good enough as backup options.

I think you aren't giving enough credit to how important organisation and coaching are. I think the majority of players that United put out last night would walk into the MK Dons team. And I don't agree with the claims that they are lazy either.

None of this is to say that I don't trust LVG as a manager. I think he's just trying to introduce a lot of change at the moment and performances like last night are a consequence.

TheDoc

Mitch Connor wrote: »

as I said earlier, I do get this and it excuses some of the crap so far - but 4-0 to a League 1 side can't be excused by ANYTHING, imo. It just isn't acceptable or understandable for any reason at all.

It's understandable for me.Majority of team play underage/reserve team football. Nowhere near as intense as Football League.

TheDoc

Liam O wrote: »

The thing is, especially after that preseason and with the early fixtures, a fast start was not just needed but was made to seem likely. I know they were only preseason games but a different United has shown up in every competitive game since then and even with the injuries it doesn't make sense. After the hopes I had I've already almost reverted into last season's shell and after all the optimism over the last few months it's a sobering experience.

Agree that easy fixtures meant we should be capitalising. No disaster if we get a run of wins together. Can't afford less then six points from next two games.