Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 25/08

GSPfan

I'm more excited to see players leave than arrive at the moment. Whats wrong with me.

If we cleared out Welbeck, Clev, Kagawa and Hernandez we should be able to bring in a centre half and 2 midfielders surely. I know its a lot to ask in 3 days or whatever but it has to be done.

Blind, Carvalho or Vidal, Centre Half.

Thats my ideal scenario.

The_Kew_Tour

Irishcrx wrote: »

Talk about stealing a wage...:mad:

I remember throwing up 7 or 8 links here before to wages.

Always few slight differences but none had Cleverly on less then 70k.

Now I don't know what he is on but those links could not be all wrong.

I remember Ducker mentioning it before too.

Headshot

Talib Fiasco wrote: »

Weren't ye linked to Freddy Guarin a few days ago? Had a shocking season but is a very good all round player.

No he's not!

Rubbish player. I rather keep Clever

Irishcrx

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I remember throwing up 7 or 8 links here before to wages.

Always few slight differences but none had Cleverly on less then 70k.

Now I don't know what he is on but those links could not be all wrong.

I remember Ducker mentioning it before too.

I'll get on football manager when I get home and have a look, that's usually pretty accurate...:cool:

The_Kew_Tour

Of all the players linked to go I hope Welbeck stays. I think he will, hopefully.

Pro. F

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I don't hate him, though sometimes it's fun to take the piss. But let's be honest, he's 25 now and he's never going to get close to the standard he needs to be at for United.

We've had enough of mediocrity in the middle of the field for the last five years or so. If 9 million can be gotten for him then that's a great bit of business and is the best thing for him too. He must be in a bad place with the flak he has taken and he could thrive at a smaller club.

magnumbud wrote: »

i dont hate him i just dont think he is united standard and hope he gets the move to valencia as its the best move for him.

No need to say you don't hate him lads. If you post silly bollocks about him being the worst player on the pitch / in the league / in the history of the club / a coward / narcissist or whatever, then you are participating in the scapegoating of a United player who has been trying his best and you deserve scorn. If you don't then the post didn't apply to you.

Delboy5

jaykay74 wrote: »

Id say a lot of the interest around TC23 that isn't around some others is that he never got the BIG contract so his wages will be at a more reasonable level. Could be me talking böllocks though and someone comes and points out he is on 90k a week

70k

According to this

http://www.tsmplug.com/richlist/manchester-united-players-salaries-list/

Giggsy11

Headshot wrote: »

No he's not!

Rubbish player. I rather keep Clever

Number of times he (Guarin) loses possession and makes decision that makes Nani look like Scholes is staggering.

He has a beast shot apart from that nothing.

Pro. F

KH25 wrote: »

Get where you're coming from alright. He's not the worst we've ever had but he's still just not United standard. I think the last few games have shown that easily. He looked like he was trying in his defence, but he just hasn't got it.

At this stage a move is best for him. He's not the level that's needed, he's out of the England team and he's going to be constantly hounded by united fans if he stays. For his career, a move is the smartest option.

All of the players have been below standard in the last few games. Cleverley has been far from the worst.

The_Kew_Tour

IMO Fletcher been worst player for United past 2 League games.

Pity as I had hoped to see bit of the player I enjoyed around 09/10

Maximus Alexander

Pro. F wrote: »

All of the players have been below standard in the last few games. Cleverley has been far from the worst.

Cleverley has been below standard for a couple of years, he just looked like he had potential. There comes a point where you have to decide the potential won't be delivered upon, that point has arrived in my opinion.

Giggsy11

Nani is gone.
Cleverley and Kagawa looks likely to be gone.

How will superthreads survive without the debates on these plyers.

homerjay2005

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

IMO Fletcher been worst player for United past 2 League games.

Pity as I had hoped to see bit of the player I enjoyed around 09/10

Fletcher is the classic example of why "assessing the squad" was a waste of time.

LVG shouldnt have needed to find out for himself that Zaha had an attitude problem, that Cleverly was s*ite or that Fletcher wasnt good enough to be first choice CM for the season.

he should have been told this when he was getting the job, the problems we had just didnt appear last week.

Hococop

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Nani is gone.
Cleverley and Kagawa looks likely to be gone.

How will superthreads survive without the debates on these plyers.

Oh they will one bad play in a game and people will say "if we still had nani we would have won etc"

Your Airbag

Pro. F wrote: »

No need to say you don't hate him lads. If you post silly bollocks about him being the worst player on the pitch / in the league / in the history of the club / a coward / narcissist or whatever, then you are participating in the scapegoating of a United player who has been trying his best and you deserve scorn. If you don't then the post didn't apply to you.

All of those things except the one in bold Clev has been at one time or another for UTD. Anything else is pure denial.

You deserve scorn? Who will be dishing out this scorn? You? Jaysus to your attitude. This is an internet forum, people express opinions and piss take. You don't get upsept over the Liverpool piss taking which goes far beyond the Clev criticism and have no right to over this. Its not even piss taking, its grounded in reality. Clev was a very limited, below average and poor player.

Its no suprise that Villa and Hull, two teams who battle relegation are trying to sign him for a single figure sum and the fact we are getting a single figure sum is suprising people. Its not that all these poeple are wrong on this, we know you are one of Clevs biggest defenders, you talked him up early on and have dug your heels in and wont change your way off the mark evalutaion of him. Your quite simply worng. Get off your high horse.

ericzeking

We could play a flat back four tomorrow of

Valencia Jones Evans Blackett


I don't think we will as LVG didn't sound like he was for changing just yet in the press conference yesterday.

He keeps referring to Valencia as a defender and Blackett has played left back for the 21s/reserves

RobertKK

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Nani is gone.
Cleverley and Kagawa looks likely to be gone.

How will superthreads survive without the debates on these plyers.

Ashley Young and Antonio Valencia, Beware!!!!

Pro. F

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Cleverley has been below standard for a couple of years, he just looked like he had potential. There comes a point where you have to decide the potential won't be delivered upon, that point has arrived in my opinion.

Other than last season, where once again he was no worse than the rest of the midfield who all suffered under Moyes, I don't agree that he has been below standard for the United squad.

Your Airbag

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Nani is gone.
Cleverley and Kagawa looks likely to be gone.

How will superthreads survive without the debates on these plyers.

Besides the Kag debates the threads will be a lot better place without them.

homerjay2005

ericzeking wrote: »

We could play a flat back four tomorrow of

Valencia Jones Evans Blackett


I don't think we will as LVG didn't sound like he was for changing just yet in the press conference yesterday.

He keeps referring to Valencia as a defender and Blackett has played left back for the 21s/reserves

hopefully Rojo is cleared to play, but the fact he spend a few days in Spain in an Argentinian embassy, makes me think he wont.

ideally, we line up like this tomorrow.

Rafael Jones Evans Rojo.

we start that back 4, with Rooney, Rvp, Di Maria and Mata up top, id be confident of scraping a win.

at the moment though, i think a poor performance and a draw is our lot.

Finally, some of the dead weight is being shifted.
In fairness to LVG, he's done a lot in a couple of months. Now let's hope for a result / performance tomorrow @ Burnley.

Maximus Alexander

Pro. F wrote: »

Other than last season, where once again he was no worse than the rest of the midfield who all suffered under Moyes, I don't agree that he has been below standard for the United squad.

Well then I think we will have to agree to disagree because there will be nothing gained from a back and forth on this.

GSPfan

Your Airbag wrote: »

Its no suprise that Villa and Hull, two teams who battle relegation are trying to sign him for a single figure sum and the fact we are getting a single figure sum is suprising people.

Just for the sake of accuracy, 8 million is a 7 figure sum.

RobertKK

Does Cleverley bring inspiration to the team?
Does Cleverley enhance our attackers?
Does Cleverley do enough as a defensive midfielder?
Is he a game changer?
Does he score enough goals?
Is he good enough for teams like Chelsea, Man City, Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern Munich?

What does he actually bring to the team?

Mitch Connor

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Nani is gone.
Cleverley and Kagawa looks likely to be gone.

How will superthreads survive without the debates on these plyers.

We can debate the merits of the seeming superior Young, Valencia and Anderson.

Your Airbag

GSPfan wrote: »

Just for the sake of accuracy, 8 million is a 7 figure sum.

Of course but you know what I mean. In football we count from 1m upwards.

We dont need no decimal places and lots of zeros

kstand

Regarding the 8m for Cleverly to villa deal - are we paying the 8M up front or a lump sum and then instalments?

Your Airbag

RobertKK wrote: »

Does Cleverley bring inspiration to the team?
Does Cleverley enhance our attackers?
Does Cleverley do enough as a defensive midfielder?
Is he a game changer?
Does he score enough goals?
Is he good enough for teams like Chelsea, Man City, Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern Munich?

What does he actually bring to the team?

GSPfan

kstand wrote: »

Regarding the 8m for Cleverly to villa deal - are we paying the 8M up front or a lump sum and then instalments?

Too late. That joke was done yesterday.

RasTa

Even the way Cleverly kicks a football annoys me. He will be a solid performer for Hull, Villa and the likes.

I'm going to try make this my last post about Cleverly:

Someone needs to post the replay of the Sunderland match with a red circle around him. He's just not good enough. There's is no personnel vendetta against him but again; He's just not good enough for.

Hopefully I can repeat this post for Anderson, Hernandez, Young, Fletcher....the list goes on.

*Sunderland!

Pro. F

Your Airbag wrote: »

All of those things except the one in bold Clev has been at one time or another for UTD. Anything else is pure denial.

You deserve scorn? Who will be dishing out this scorn? You? Jaysus to your attitude. This is an internet forum, people express opinions and piss take. You don't get upsept over the Liverpool piss taking which goes far beyond the Clev criticism and have no right to over this. Its not even piss taking, its grounded in reality. Clev was a very limited, below average and poor player.

Its no suprise that Villa and Hull, two teams who battle relegation are trying to sign him for a single figure sum and the fact we are getting a single figure sum is suprising people. Its not that all these poeple are wrong on this, we know you are one of Clevs biggest defenders, you talked him up early on and have dug your heels in and wont change your way off the mark evalutaion of him. Your quite simply worng. Get off your high horse.

People pour scorn on each other's opinions on internet fora all the time, there's no need for you to cry about it.

A horribly out of form player potentially going to a lower mid-table team would be of no surprise to anybody I'm sure.

I did indeed have extremely high hopes for the player. Obviously he had a torrid time last season, his confidence was shot to pieces and he needs to rebuild his career now. He is still an okay option as a squad player and the fact that there are lots of people who think he is something awful is no indication of anything. There are lots of people who think lots of stupid things about all sorts in football.

Giggsy11

Mitch Connor wrote: »

We can debate the merits of the seeming superior Young, Valencia and Anderson.

Young and Valencia only. I don't think anyone cares about Anderson, everyone knows we are trying to offload him but there are no takers.

Btw, for Nani, Kagawa, Cleverley there is a debate but for Young, Valencia there is an agreement from all posters that they are ****.

beno619

homerjay2005 wrote: »

Fletcher is the classic example of why "assessing the squad" was a waste of time.

LVG shouldnt have needed to find out for himself that Zaha had an attitude problem, that Cleverly was s*ite or that Fletcher wasnt good enough to be first choice CM for the season.

he should have been told this when he was getting the job, the problems we had just didnt appear last week.

This is rubbish of course every player should have been given a chance to impress, some have Blackett, Wilson ect.

How disgusted would you be if a manager came into the office and started handing half your team p45's.

ericzeking

homerjay2005 wrote: »

Fletcher is the classic example of why "assessing the squad" was a waste of time.

LVG shouldnt have needed to find out for himself that Zaha had an attitude problem, that Cleverly was s*ite or that Fletcher wasnt good enough to be first choice CM for the season.

he should have been told this when he was getting the job, the problems we had just didnt appear last week.

The whole decision making on players as been a strange one.

I said previously on the board that LVG had the job long before it was announced, I'd say even before Giggs stepped in based on the Herrera and Shaw deals and how he would have needed to have been monitoring them last season in order to make the calls on them but I was shot down because LVG would know all about such players just from being LVG.

Then you had the decision on Rio at the end of the season well before LVG was announced.

And yet we have the situation where he has needed to see some players on pre season tours and in training before making a decision.

If Cleverly for example is being let go. Cleverly would be of a similar profile in England to Herrera in Spain (age, gametime, fringes of international setup), if he could make a decision on Herrera, he could have made a decision on Cleverly. Odd.

Maybe we have a signing lined up that was thought previously unavailable.

Lord TSC

With Cleverly, it could simply be a case of not wanting rid of a player until some form of a replacement was found, be it DiMaria or someone else we don't know of yet, or even simply that it's only now that teams are getting interested in him after THEIR first choice targets fell through.

homerjay2005

beno619 wrote: »

This is rubbish of course every player should have been given a chance to impress, some have Blackett, Wilson ect.

How disgusted would you be if a manager came into the office and started handing half your team p45's.

if my performances were poor for many years, id expect my p45. our entire short-medium term planning in terms of squad rebuilding should not be decided on a few meaningless pre season games in the US.

that approach has backfired and leaves us playing players who are not good enough or have been told they can leave, while we struggle with 3 days left in the transfer window to replace them.

Maximus Alexander

Pro. F wrote: »

There are lots of people who think lots of stupid things about all sorts in football.

Speaking of which, I was listening to BBC Radio 5 Live yesterday and they had a United fan on shouting about how De Gea is not good enough because he doesn't come for crosses and he should be replaced by Cech, since he's second choice at Chelsea.

My eyes rolled back so far in my head that I couldn't see for an hour.

The Moldy Gowl

Are Pro F and your Airbag gonna have one last 10 page debate about cleverly posting gifs showing him being 1 foot out of position?

Kerrydude1981

Football agent Barry Silkman on SSN makes out there will be a maximum of 3 big deals before the the deadline and he expects Utd to be involved in 2 of them,

Could be full of sh1t.

PaddyCar

Did Cleverly play in MK Dons match?

Mitch Connor

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I'm going to try make this my last post about Cleverly:

Someone needs to post the replay of the MK Dons match with a red circle around him. He's just not good enough. There's is no personnel vendetta against him but again; He's just not good enough for.

Hopefully I can repeat this post for Anderson, Hernandez, Young, Fletcher....the list goes on.

What. The. Fuk.

He neither started the game nor game on as a sub.

May as well put a red circle around Di Maria and say his performance in that match shows he isn't good enough for United!

Backstreet Moyes

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I'm going to try make this my last post about Cleverly:

Someone needs to post the replay of the MK Dons match with a red circle around him. He's just not good enough. There's is no personnel vendetta against him but again; He's just not good enough for.

Hopefully I can repeat this post for Anderson, Hernandez, Young, Fletcher....the list goes on.

Of all the criticism of Cleverley this is the best your singling out his performance in a game he didn't play bravo.

Your Airbag

Pro. F wrote: »

People pour scorn on each other's opinions on internet fora all the time, there's no need for you to cry about it.

1. A horribly out of form player potentially going to a lower mid-table team would be of no surprise to anybody I'm sure.

I did indeed have extremely high hopes for the player. Obviously he had a torrid time last season, his confidence was shot to pieces and he needs to rebuild his career now. He is still an okay option as a squad player and the fact that there are lots of people who think he is something awful is no indication of anything. 2. There are lots of people who think lots of stupid things about all sorts in football.

1. Thats putting it nicely. He's been out of form for a long time now.

2. You got that right.

It looks like he is gonig so we can draw a line under it because I couldn't imagine having a more polarising opinion on a player. It will be interesting to see how he does somewhere else and whether the pressure of UTD had something to do with it.

MagicIRL

Kerrydude1981 wrote: »

Football agent Barry Silkman on SSN makes out there will be a maximum of 3 big deals before the the deadline and he expects Utd to be involved in 2 of them,

Could be full of sh1t.

That is definitely a porn star, not a football agent.

Backstreet Moyes

Selling Wellbeck would be lunacy especially when the options seem to be two direct rivals for 4th. That would piss me off more than anything if he left.

Soldie

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I'm going to try make this my last post about Cleverly:

Someone needs to post the replay of the MK Dons match with a red circle around him. He's just not good enough. There's is no personnel vendetta against him but again; He's just not good enough for.

Hopefully I can repeat this post for Anderson, Hernandez, Young, Fletcher....the list goes on.

Took me a while edit the footage but here you go:

Brendan Flowers

Irishcrx wrote: »

Talk about stealing a wage...:mad:

I hate when people say players are stealing a wage. He didnt put a gun to anyones head demanding that money. The contact and wage was offered to him. Would you expect him to say "No, thats too much. I dont deserve to earn that much. Cut the salary in half and you have a deal".

case885

Cant wait to see the back of cleverley wouldnt get into the top 8 teams in the league. Anderson should take voluntary redundancy and retire early. Hopefully carvahlo and maybe vidal brought in.

kryogen

I hear there are three offers on the table for Clev? As long as there is no huge difference in the fee's I would hope the club ask him where he would like to go, leave it up to him. He has been a solid pro for the club and though obviously not of the required standard to play for the first team he can be afforded the choice of where to play his football away from United I would hope. The same as the likes of Butt (far superior obv) Neville, O Shea (all superior imo, but he is in the same vein as getting his head down and not being a whinge bag when he is left out of the team)

He came through the youth system and I hope he makes a decent career for himself, he has to go for his own good as much as anything else. Could do well in a three man midfield with the duty of linking the play between the midfield and the forwards for someone like Villa

Edit: Tl;dr Tom was a product of the youth team, never made the step up properly. I wish him well in his career and hope he has success. It was not his fault he was picked in the team