Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 25/08

keano25

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I will say it again.

Either get a top class CM or one with potential or don't bother at all.

But it's become clear with 2 days to go that there's a distinct possibility that cannot be achieved.

For 10 million I'd quite happily take him for the season.

Or, would you suggest not buying anyone and struggling away for the season?

Adamocovic

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I will say it again.

Either get a top class CM or one with potential or don't bother at all.

Well theres nothing wrong with getting a quick fix for the moment and then looking at the possibility of bringing in a world class CM in the next windows.

This window is nearly over and it might prove difficult to get the player desired, makes more sense then to get a player we can get that will offer an improvement now rather than hoping the current crop play well until a replacement is brought in during the next window.

The_Kew_Tour

keano25 wrote: »

But it's become clear with 2 days to go that there's a distinct possibility that cannot be achieved.

For 10 million I'd quite happily take him for the season.

Or, would you suggest not buying anyone and struggling away for the season?

What I would suggest was to have done all our signings by now and by having top names in place.

But here we are signing De Jong and its happy days.

The standards have already slipped.

MisterAnarchy

keano25 wrote: »

LVG has purchased him as a defender first and foremost, has he not?

Unlikely ,his best role is CDM and he played there mostly for Ajax last season when he was Dutch player of the year.

The_Kew_Tour

Adamocovic wrote: »

Well theres nothing wrong with getting a quick fix for the moment and then looking at the possibility of bringing in a world class CM in the next windows.

This window is nearly over and it might prove difficult to get the player desired, makes more sense then to get a player we can get that will offer an improvement now rather than hoping the current crop play well until a replacement is brought in during the next window.

I know what your saying and it makes sense, but it should not have come to this.

kryogen

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Get a top class player or don't bother.

De Jong ain't going to dramatically improve the CM position.

We need someone who will.

He has his positives, he would add some steel, he knows Van Gaal and his methods and has Premier League experience so would hopefully bed in and he is vocal, he is a leader out there which is something we are lacking in the middle of the field.

Have to say, all things considered I would welcome De Jong though he would have been down my list of targets

TheTownie

RVP needs surgery apparently

United Report ‏@UtdReport 6m
Robin van Persie is in need of an operation that Van Gaal persuaded him not to get before the World Cup. [mirror]

Strange one considering LVG was saying today that RVP needed match time to increase his fitness.

Some serious underestimating of de Jong.

Class for Milan last season!

DM_7

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

What I would suggest was to have done all our signings by now and by having top names in place.

But here we are signing De Jong and its happy days.

The standards have already slipped.

Makes sense. Best not sack Van Gaal so United can do that next summer

The_Kew_Tour

DM-ICE wrote: »

Makes sense. Best not sack Van Gaal so United can do that next summer

?

kryogen

keano25 wrote: »

So Blind is the answer to midfield?

LVG has purchased him as a defender first and foremost, has he not?

Blind is not the answer to midfield, but he is a good midfielder.

I doubt LvG purchased him as a defender first and foremost, he played midfield all last season and Van Gaal has already stocked the left sided defence positions.

keano25

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

What I would suggest was to have done all our signings by now and by having top names in place.

But here we are signing De Jong and its happy days.

The standards have already slipped.

Stop. Anybody that knows anything about football know that World Cup years are the worst/hardest time to sign players.

They have a good WC, price of them sky rockets. And your not guaranteed they'll replicate WC form at club level.

Cast your mind back to when we signed Kleberson on the back of the '02 WC. Our prayers had been answered and we all know how that turned out.

kryogen

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I will say it again.

Either get a top class CM or one with potential or don't bother at all.

Thats a strange attitude though, we need to replace the squad players too like Anderson Cleverley Fletcher etc

Adamocovic

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

What I would suggest was to have done all our signings by now and by having top names in place.

But here we are signing De Jong and its happy days.

The standards have already slipped.

I don't get this whole idea of standards slipping. We finished 7th place last year. United may have the history, reputation and financial backing but we had an awful year last season.

Despite not having any European football though we managed to bring in Di Maria, a player who had the most assists out of any of the top 5 leagues in the world, for a British record fee.

It also seems we have brought in Blind, a World Cup player who won player of the year last year in Holland.

Rojo, a player who just played in the World Cup final.

Herrera a player used to playing against the likes of Real Madrid and Barcelona every season and had the chance to play Champions League football with Bilbao this season.

And now talk of De Jong, a player who also has been to a World Cup final, and has won a Premiership medal.

With those players alone I don't see how the standards have slipped compared to previous transfer windows.

The_Kew_Tour

kryogen wrote: »

Thats a strange attitude though, we need to replace the squad players too like Anderson Cleverley Fletcher etc

It looks like 2 at least are staying.

Maybe they will leave.

DM_7

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

?

We had SAF

He left.

So plans went out the window

We had Moyes and his plans

Then we didn't have him so plans could not be pursued in full

Now we have Van Gaal so hopefully next summer he is in a strong place and his plans can be pushed through early

The_Kew_Tour

DM-ICE wrote: »

We had SAF

He left.

So plans went out the window

We had Moyes and his plans

Then we didn't have him so plans could not be pursued in full

Now we have Van Gaal so hopefully next summer his plans can be pushed through early

You mentioned LVG getting sacked. Not what I want.

MisterAnarchy

kryogen wrote: »

Thats a strange attitude though, we need to replace the squad players too like Anderson Cleverley Fletcher etc

Its the attitude Ferguson had at Utd for his last 5 years though.
Constantly and stubbornly refused to buy a quality central midfielder ,saying there was no value in the market .
Its the reason the midfield and other neglected areas of the team are so poor.

The Big Easy

Deleted User wrote: »

Some serious underestimating of de Jong.

Class for Milan last season!

Where did Milan finish? Wasn't good enough for City and he's just not a good enough passer for the top sides.

Vidal is still the ultimate and would make this transfer window complete.

DM_7

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

You mentioned LVG getting sacked. Not what I want.

I said best not sack him, creating a scenario where United can plan ahead and do things early.

Getting things done early was not something that was going to happen in full this summer after Moyes was sacked and his plans had to be rethought or abandoned.

The Big Easy

The Big Easy wrote: »

Where did Milan finish? Wasn't good enough for City and he's just not a good enough passer for the top sides.

Vidal is still the ultimate and would make this transfer window complete.

Won the league with city and Milan would have finished lower without him.

The Big Easy

Deleted User wrote: »

Won the league with city and Milan would gave finished lower without him.

I get what you're saying but still think he's a bit of a hatchet man. He certainly wouldn't help with the fluidity of United's play, which is unquestionably a problem at the moment.

The Big Easy

The Big Easy wrote: »

I get what you're saying but still think he's a bit of a hatchet man. He certainly wouldn't help with the fluidity of United's play, which is unquestionably a problem at the moment.

I'd be happy with him. Something we are lacking. Have to agree to disagree

kryogen

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

It looks like 2 at least are staying.

Maybe they will leave.

I don't mean they have to go right now, but having De Jong to play instead of Fletcher or Anderson would be preferable to not having De Jong available to play instead of Fletcher or Anderson. Its a no brainer for me.

Carrick is 33, this may be his last season at the club also, it is not just the first team that needs work the squad needs to be replenished too and if we get in players like De Jong, who is at a good age for that kind of thing then it has to be seen as a positive.

We would all like to see Vidal rock up at Old Trafford before Monday but it was never happening (imo) and hopefully when we get a bit stronger, regain our Champions League place we can go and get the top class guys to help us push on for a league title with a strong bench to call on too. We have seen Van Gaal has no problem going for the finished article (something Fergie was always somewhat reluctant to do) but the team will not be fixed in one window, that was wishful thinking. This season is the most important that I will have lived through

kryogen

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

Its the attitude Ferguson had at Utd for his last 5 years though.
Constantly and stubbornly refused to buy a quality central midfielder ,saying there was no value in the market .
Its the reason the midfield and other neglected areas of the team are so poor.

Fergie was great at squad building, he left us a huge problem in midfield.

Not sure what this has to do with Van Gaal though or the reality that squad players need replacing now as well as first team players. Di Maria and Herrera have certainly been bought for the first team. Blind and De Jong could improve the first team now even if they end up as squad players in a year or two

The dream signing is still Vidal though.

Chievo put up nothing earlier though. The whole Juve side strolled through the match in terms of judgeing Vidals knee.

Maxi Lopez - Anyone remeber him at Barca?

Adamocovic

I know the whole De Jong thing is just speculation and mightn't even happen but I don't see how people could complain if we got him. £10 million is a decent price. He may be 29 years old but he would no doubt help improve our team.

I've seen so many people complain about the quality of our midfield, surely spending £10 million on a solid player like De Jong can only help it. I can't see why so many people are complaining about the idea.

Fletcher and Carrick might struggle to have a full season. We need another midfielder who can play as a CDM. De Jong can. The money isn't an issue.

This idea that it's either buy a world class player or nothing is a bit foolish in my mind. You can't always bring in the world class players you want, that shouldn't stop you from bringing in a solid player who would no doubt improve the side.

The_Kew_Tour

I ask this

If we were told in start of June that De Jong was going be the CM bought would ye have been as happy as ye are now?

And on that note its time for bed, in a day that offered a glimmer of hope but just gave misery, delusion, sadness and a degree of despair now followed by desperation.

Thank God for international break. Till next time(hopefully time drags)

kryogen

The Big Easy wrote: »

I get what you're saying but still think he's a bit of a hatchet man. He certainly wouldn't help with the fluidity of United's play, which is unquestionably a problem at the moment.

I disagree, he would provide a solid base for the team to build on. He would bee well able to sit deep and provide the out ball for the defense instead of them booting it up the field most of the time.

Adamocovic

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I ask this

If we were told in start of June that De Jong was going be the CM bought would ye have been as happy as ye are now?

And on that note its time for bed, in a day that offered a glimmer of hope but just gave misery, delusion, sadness and a degree of despair now followed by desperation.

Thank God for international break. Till next time(hopefully time drags)

Firstly if you had of said to me at the start of the summer, we will sign:

Shaw
Herrera
Daley Blind
Di Maria
Rojo
De Jong (Speculation)

I personally would be delighted with that.


And on the highlighted part, chin up, clean sheet and a point. It could have been a lot worse if that Burnley free went in. This rebuild job will take time but it seemed most people last season wanted a rebuild of the team, we're getting it but it will require patience and a lot of frustrating nights.

The_Kew_Tour

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I ask this

If we were told in start of June that De Jong was going be the CM bought would ye have been as happy as ye are now?

And on that note its time for bed, in a day that offered a glimmer of hope but just gave misery, delusion, sadness and a degree of despair now followed by desperation.

Thank God for international break. Till next time(hopefully time drags)

Ander was brought in as well though? Not like it's De Jong by himself!

DM_7

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I ask this

If we were told in start of June that De Jong was going be the CM bought would ye have been as happy as ye are now?

Herrera, Blind, Di Maria before him?

I would be as satisfied with that outcome now as I would if offered in June.

(Not that de Jong was actually signed yet)

redbaron_99

Out on the piss. What's all this De Jong talk about??

Adamocovic

redbaron_99 wrote: »

Out on the piss. What's all this De Jong talk about??

Ah just some mention of a rumour on some papers linking United with a move for De Jong, then some people complained saying they don't see him as the right fit and others argued he'd be an improvement.

Just speculation no actually concrete evidence. Not too long to wait to see if it is true or not at least.

J. Marston

The De Jong stuff is in The Star.

There's obviously nothing in it.

Hococop

Funny enough Wikipedia have him as a united player already

The Big Easy

kryogen wrote: »

I disagree, he would provide a solid base for the team to build on. He would bee well able to sit deep and provide the out ball for the defense instead of them booting it up the field most of the time.

I agree with the solid base part but no more so than what Carrick would provide. I believe Carrick to be a superior passer though, hopefully his recovery is going well and he'll be back before the end of September.

However, Carrick is still continuously accused of slowing down United's play and making it deliberate and predictable even though I would consider him a lot better on the ball than DeJong.

If the choice is DeJong or nobody, I would reluctantly choose DeJong.

The Big Easy

Scrap that, I'd rather nobody than DeJong. I would prefer Blind have the opportunity to play the holding role in Carrick's absence.

MisterAnarchy

The Big Easy wrote: »

Scrap that, I'd rather nobody than DeJong. I would prefer Blind have the opportunity to play the holding role in Carrick's absence.

I like the look of Blind as CDM ,he is very wirey ,can tackle and has a good football brain too .Has a good shot as well.

Would a midfield 3 of himself ,Herrera and Di Maria be a bit too lightweight though ?

The Big Easy

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

I like the look of Blind as CDM ,he is very wirey ,can tackle and has a good football brain too .Has a good shot as well.

Would a midfield 3 of himself ,Herrera and Di Maria be a bit too lightweight though ?

It's what I'd like to see given the options we have.

kryogen

The Big Easy wrote: »

I agree with the solid base part but no more so than what Carrick would provide. I believe Carrick to be a superior passer though, hopefully his recovery is going well and he'll be back before the end of September.

However, Carrick is still continuously accused of slowing down United's play and making it deliberate and predictable even though I would consider him a lot better on the ball than DeJong.

If the choice is DeJong or nobody, I would reluctantly choose DeJong.

No argument there, Carrick is the better passer and his reading of the game and interceptions are good but he is older now and has always been a slow starter so who knows how long it would take him to get into his groove this season, then you have to think about next season! I would be looking at Blind as the one to be taking Carricks role anyway, De Jong would be filling the physical presence we have been lacking for so long.

As I said, he would not have been high up on my list of taargets but right now I would take him happily*

*He represents an improvement on most of what is there and he gives options formation wise

DrPhilG

I've made the point before that it's not just about improving our starting 11, our squad players are poor too.

I don't necessarily see De Jong as a starter. But at £10M he's a damn sight better to have in the squad than Anderson or even Fellaini.

And to sell Cleverley for £8M and replace him with De Jong for only £2M more, it's a no lose situation.

Irish94

Just in from work. I don't want to read the 250+ posts I have missed, could anyone tell me how Vidal played tonight? How did he look fitness wise etc.

john why

Irish94 wrote: »

Just in from work. I don't want to read the 250+ posts I have missed, could anyone tell me how Vidal played tonight? How did he look fitness wise etc.

Doesn't matter you won't be signing him anyway

Irish94

john why wrote: »

Doesn't matter you won't be signing him anyway

Can I not be concerned about the fitness of one the best CM's in the world after a knee injury, no?

kryogen

john why wrote: »

Doesn't matter you won't be signing him anyway

Ah John, Why?

Hidalgo

Whilst De Jong would be an upgrade squadwise on some of the current dross in Utds midfield he could get easily overran for pace imo. He'd be ok in congested areas but in more open space I could see him chasing as opposition players get by him without any major trouble.

KH25

Don't get the hate for De Jong (kicking Alonso in the WC aside). I always thought he was a good solid player for City and I was surprised to see them let him go.

keano25

Hidalgo wrote: »

Whilst De Jong would be an upgrade squadwise on some of the current dross in Utds midfield he could get easily overran for pace imo. He'd be ok in congested areas but in more open space I could see him chasing as opposition players get by him without any major trouble.

Ya he really struggled against Spain in the World Cup...

adox

Having a proper ball winner and a presence in midfield like De Jong would help the team with possession of the ball. Utd would win the ball back earlier for a start and end up with more possession of the ball. The back four would be helped immensely. The whole team would spend as long in too deep a position and also be more confident of the ball coming back to them quicker.

While he's not the marquee signing, I'd be happy enough signing him and having him in the starting eleven. He is the sort of player that is vital to give a platform for the team to get used to the new formation and Van Gaals tactics.