Nz v Oz, Sat Aug 23, 8.35am

randomname2005

FR2 wrote: »

Glad I got up for that! NZ were quite simply awesome. Just one to debate….. was Cruden a lucky boy just before McCaw yellow? Seemed a bit reckless lifting Hooper and literally throwing him to ground. Anyone else see it… sky didn't ! I've seen cards for a lot less!!!

Yup, was surprised more wasn't made of it

Swiwi.

FR2 wrote: »

Glad I got up for that! NZ were quite simply awesome. Just one to debate….. was Cruden a lucky boy just before McCaw yellow? Seemed a bit reckless lifting Hooper and literally throwing him to ground. Anyone else see it… sky didn't ! I've seen cards for a lot less!!!

Not tiddlywinks comes to mind. He didn't lift him above 90, I've no problem with it. I for one don't want rugby completely sanitised where there are no big hits or rock-solid defence. If you use your argument, Ferris could have got a yellow card for lifting Genia (although I can't remember if he dumped him to the ground or not).

P_1

Enjoyable match to watch over the morning coffee I have to say.

I wonder if you had have offered New Zealand 7 points before the double header with Australia would they have taken it?

randomname2005

Swiwi. wrote: »

Not tiddlywinks comes to mind. He didn't lift him above 90, I've no problem with it. I for one don't want rugby completely sanitised where there are no big hits or rock-solid defence. If you use your argument, Ferris could have got a yellow card for lifting Genia (although I can't remember if he dumped him to the ground or not).

Maybe I should have rephrased my original comment before posting. I don't think the tackle was dangerous, but given what has been happening in that area of the game I am happily surprised more wasn't made of it.

On a related note, is the rule for ensuring that a player is brought to ground safely, only applicable when the player is brought through 90?

P_1

I'd have thought so. If a player hasn't been brought through the 90 then they can influence how they land, something they can't do it they have been.

Journeyman_1

Very enjoyable game, ABs were awesome. In particular Retallick, A Smith, Cruden, crotty. Also coles, read, savea and b Smith stood out to me.

As an aside, I love the excitement Perenara shows during anthem, haka and all through the game, he's great.

Swiwi.

randomname2005 wrote: »

Maybe I should have rephrased my original comment before posting. I don't think the tackle was dangerous, but given what has been happening in that area of the game I am happily surprised more wasn't made of it.

On a related note, is the rule for ensuring that a player is brought to ground safely, only applicable when the player is brought through 90?

No, but I don't think it was dangerous. If you asked the players themselves, I doubt they want every person carded who lifts someone off the ground. It was just a good tackle. Jane's tackle on Folau was high though, and that was missed.

FR2

Swiwi. wrote: »

No, but I don't think it was dangerous. If you asked the players themselves, I doubt they want every person carded who lifts someone off the ground. It was just a good tackle. Jane's tackle on Folau was high though, and that was missed.

Looked at it again and still think it was reckless. Once Hooper is off the ground, whether at 90o or not, he is not in control! He clearly wasn't brought down safely and this is a more obvious issue. Not suggesting at all that the game is akin to tiddlywinks, but I'm just surprised that the incident was seemingly totally ignored by all involved.

Jello

Just wondering can anyone tell me why New Zealand retained the Bledisloe Cup seeing as it's a three match series and the first game was a draw? I know Australia would have to thump NZ in the last match by a bigger score than NZ won today, but would that not make them winners? Or is it because NZ won it last year meaning Oz would need two wins out of the three to win it?

Swiwi.

Jello wrote: »

Just wondering can anyone tell me why New Zealand retained the Bledisloe Cup seeing as it's a three match series and the first game was a draw? I know Australia would have to thump NZ in the last match by a bigger score than NZ won today, but would that not make them winners? Or is it because NZ won it last year meaning Oz would need two wins out of the three to win it?

Jello, if the wins are tied the Bledisloe remains with the current holder. That's why they brought back the 3rd match because for a while there when it was 3N there was just 2 games a season and once the holder won the first game the second become a dead rubber.

That was just an unreal performance from NZ, would have destroyed anyone today. So far ahead of the rest.

Swiwi.

Kind of hate these things, but here's how NZ's version of Stephen Jones saw the test. It goes without saying that he couldn't exactly lay into his own team this week, which makes a change.

Yeah_Right

Swiwi. wrote: »

Kind of hate these things, but here's how NZ's version of Stephen Jones saw the test. It goes without saying that he couldn't exactly lay into his own team this week, which makes a change.

I don't ever think I have seen Rattue so full of praise for the ABs. He is such a tabloid journalist. Brutal on the Wallabies (deservedly so). You have to feel sorry for Kieran Read. It would be nearly impossible to live up to last season's standards and when he doesn't even points it out.

Swiwi.

Yeah_Right wrote: »

I don't ever think I have seen Rattue so full of praise for the ABs. He is such a tabloid journalist. Brutal on the Wallabies (deservedly so). You have to feel sorry for Kieran Read. It would be nearly impossible to live up to last season's standards and when he doesn't even points it out.

We may as well talk to ourselves Y_R. What are your thoughts on SBW and the midfield? I've been disappointed with Fekitoa in black so far, seems a bit clueless as to when to run and when to pass. If the RWC squad was picked tomorrow, I'd go with Nonu, SBW, Crotty and Smith. I reckon that Crotty's 40 minutes on Saturday were some of the best by a NZ 12 in a while. And then Kahui might be back next year, although he's made of glass of course.

Otherwise, I hope Jane is given a spell. I'd be inclined to move Smith to 14 and restore Dagg to 15, but I'd also like to see Piutau get a shot. I'd also like Barrett to get at least 1 test starting at 10, although I suspect he will remain on the bench, with Cruden making way for Carter when he's back.

In the forwards, Messam deserves another shot, but a bit last chance saloon, he was poor on Saturday. Wouldn't mind Luatua getting a go if Kaino ain't back. And I hope Vito stays for at least 1 more year, his injury couldn't have come at a worse time, and the Stade Francais vultures are apparently circling.

Otherwise, would be nice to see Tuipolotu get another go when he's back from injury, and finally I hope some other hookers make the end of year tour, I'm really beginning to doubt that Mealamu lasts much longer, he's a shadow of his former self.

Your thoughts...?

CatFromHue

I always thought Crotty was alot older, I'm surprised to see he's only 25.

English Lurker

Swiwi, what did you make of Cruden?

.ak

CatFromHue wrote: »

I always thought Crotty was alot older, I'm surprised to see he's only 25.

I actually thought he was younger.

Yeah_Right

Swiwi. wrote: »

We may as well talk to ourselves Y_R. What are your thoughts on SBW and the midfield? I've been disappointed with Fekitoa in black so far, seems a bit clueless as to when to run and when to pass. If the RWC squad was picked tomorrow, I'd go with Nonu, SBW, Crotty and Smith. I reckon that Crotty's 40 minutes on Saturday were some of the best by a NZ 12 in a while. And then Kahui might be back next year, although he's made of glass of course.

Otherwise, I hope Jane is given a spell. I'd be inclined to move Smith to 14 and restore Dagg to 15, but I'd also like to see Piutau get a shot. I'd also like Barrett to get at least 1 test starting at 10, although I suspect he will remain on the bench, with Cruden making way for Carter when he's back.

In the forwards, Messam deserves another shot, but a bit last chance saloon, he was poor on Saturday. Wouldn't mind Luatua getting a go if Kaino ain't back. And I hope Vito stays for at least 1 more year, his injury couldn't have come at a worse time, and the Stade Francais vultures are apparently circling.

Otherwise, would be nice to see Tuipolotu get another go when he's back from injury, and finally I hope some other hookers make the end of year tour, I'm really beginning to doubt that Mealamu lasts much longer, he's a shadow of his former self.

Your thoughts...?

Agree with you about Fekitoa. But I think he is worth persevering withas he has a lot of talent and just needs experience. Reminds me a bit of Toeava in that way. It took a while but he came good. I always loved Kahui but he was so fragile. Crotty just gets better and better every time I see him. He has to be a certainty for the squad every time now. Love this article after last Saturday http://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/the-rugby-championship/wallabies-to-target-rookie-all-blacks-centre-ryan-crotty-in-bledisloe-cup-clash-at-eden-park/story-e6frf4qc-1227033678974

Test novice Crotty is the glass jaw to rugby’s world champions and he can expect to be worked over by a flood of attackers trying to expose him as the soft spot in the vaunted Kiwi defence.

I'd go with Piatau over Jane and leave Smith at FB. Unless Dagg recptures his form of a couple of years ago.

Yeah Messam was poor on Saturday. Kaino is first choice but I would like to see Luatua get more game time. He is obviously a great bench option as he covers lock and it means that Sam Cane is there as a specialist openside. Vito has constantly disappointed me. So much talent and fantastic in Super rugby and NPC but never seems to step up in test matches. Bit of a Ron Cribb.

Haven't seen enough of Tuipolotu but from what I have seen I rate him better than Thrush. Whats happened to Romano? Always liked him. Also I would like to see more of Bird. That guy is massive!!

Its almost sad seeing Mealamu these days. Such a great player (only behind Fitzy for best best ever AB hooker IMO) but he is not the player he was. However who else is there? The young Chiefs hooker looked alright. Whats his name? Also Ged Robinson looked impressive the few times I've seen him. I wonder what Corey Flynn has done keep himself out of a black jersey. I wonder if he did an Angus MacDonald and shagged McCaw's missus.

Swiwi.

English Lurker wrote: »

Swiwi, what did you make of Cruden?

He was very good...but given armchair ride by pack and scrum half. He's always good in such matches but I have my doubts in the wet with a struggling pack. It takes a great fly half to succeed in such conditions.

English Lurker

Swiwi. wrote: »

He was very good...but given armchair ride by pack and scrum half. He's always good in such matches but I have my doubts in the wet with a struggling pack. It takes a great fly half to succeed in such conditions.

Can't really argue with that!

And I have to agree about Fekitoa. A lot of potential, but he'll never seal the jersey unless he learns when to give. Plenty of time though, and plenty of options for you guys until he does.

Yeah_Right

English Lurker wrote: »

Can't really argue with that!

And I have to agree about Fekitoa. A lot of potential, but he'll never seal the jersey unless he learns when to give. Plenty of time though, and plenty of options for you guys until he does.

You sir, are spot on. There have been several times when I have been screaming at him to pass it but he tucks the ball and smashes forward. He has to learn to carry in both hands and look to pass. At the moment it feels like when he gets the ball, the defense can ignore his support runners and just focus on him.

Swiwi.

Yeah_Right wrote: »

Agree with you about Fekitoa. But I think he is worth persevering withas he has a lot of talent and just needs experience. Reminds me a bit of Toeava in that way. It took a while but he came good. I always loved Kahui but he was so fragile. Crotty just gets better and better every time I see him. He has to be a certainty for the squad every time now. Love this article after last Saturday http://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/the-rugby-championship/wallabies-to-target-rookie-all-blacks-centre-ryan-crotty-in-bledisloe-cup-clash-at-eden-park/story-e6frf4qc-1227033678974



I'd go with Piatau over Jane and leave Smith at FB. Unless Dagg recptures his form of a couple of years ago.

Yeah Messam was poor on Saturday. Kaino is first choice but I would like to see Luatua get more game time. He is obviously a great bench option as he covers lock and it means that Sam Cane is there as a specialist openside. Vito has constantly disappointed me. So much talent and fantastic in Super rugby and NPC but never seems to step up in test matches. Bit of a Ron Cribb.

Haven't seen enough of Tuipolotu but from what I have seen I rate him better than Thrush. Whats happened to Romano? Always liked him. Also I would like to see more of Bird. That guy is massive!!

Its almost sad seeing Mealamu these days. Such a great player (only behind Fitzy for best best ever AB hooker IMO) but he is not the player he was. However who else is there? The young Chiefs hooker looked alright. Whats his name? Also Ged Robinson looked impressive the few times I've seen him. I wonder what Corey Flynn has done keep himself out of a black jersey. I wonder if he did an Angus MacDonald and shagged McCaw's missus.

Please don't mention Toeava. The possum-in-the-headlights look of the 2007 1/4 final is imprinted on my memory for ever. Fekitoa is better, but still raw. I'll just be annoyed if Crotty gets shafted for Feitoa and SBW if he keeps up this form. Romano is injured. Last 12 to 18 months have been almost a complete write-off for him. I have no idea which hooker to take as backup to Coles (who is getting better and better), but Mealamu is getting ancient!