Murder hate crime (blacks kill whites)

creolebelle

Help!!!! wrote: »

I lived in the U.K. for many years & have found that when things don't go their way they like to use the race card a lot more than other races

So black Americans are the same as black Britons ?

Arbiter of Good Taste

bb1234567 wrote: »

I'm sorry but Michael Brown was shot at 6 times from behind, 35 feet away from the police car. He was fleeing and unarmed. He was not a fugitive. The officer had no right to kill him. It was murder.

No he was not. The autopsy showed that all the bullets were shot from his front. But we don't hear that correction from the mainstream media. What we also don't hear about is the police officer's broken eye socket. I wonder how he got that?

I'm not saying anyone deserved to die, but why is the media afraid to print the facts?

jank

creolebelle wrote: »

Strong community and no institutional racism or in this case institutional anti semitism. The american class/racial structure wasn't designed to specifically oppress them. The Jewish community is VERY vocal in silencing any form of anti semitism(as they should be).
Our politicians can't even mention the numerous human rights violations that occur in Israel without being labeled an anti Semite

Much of that is correct, whereby proves my point that the simplistic nonsense that some people argue (racism = poverty = crime ) still holds sway to the more naive and usually have an agenda. There are many factors at play, including one which you allude to, community or in other words culture. Jews have always been fiercely community oriented people, have a deep value for education and a very strong work ethic.

Polices pursued by the state even now have also damaged the black community a great deal even when a lot of these polices were designed to help them. These policies well meaning and sincere at the times have actually contributed to damage their incomes, wealth and educational levels.

Ush1

Nodin wrote: »

It can do, depending on the circumstances, as can sectarianism.


I am white, and have known a few "black people" over the years.

You are arguing against yourself.

You were saying previously it was all so very simple, now you are mitigating that.

Reformed Character

Help!!!! wrote: »

I lived in the U.K. for many years & have found that when things don't go their way they like to use the race card a lot more than other races

You mean when discriminated against, they have the temerity to complain?:eek:

Nodin

Ush1 wrote: »

You are arguing against yourself.

You were saying previously it was all so very simple, now you are mitigating that.

In reference to the condition of the African Americans, it is fairly straightforward. Of course when you don't suddenly want to converse about them, and perhaps bring up caste in India as a comparison, things become either more complicated or completely ridiculous.

Help!!!!

Reformed Character wrote: »

You mean when discriminated against, they have the temerity to complain?:eek:

Nope I'll give you an example:

I was walking home with a bag of beers when a man came up to me & asked me to give him one ( he already stank of beer & his eyes were glazed over )
I said NO & his reply was " Is it because you don't like the black man "
Now I didn't care what colour he was I wasn't giving away a beer that I had worked all week for & looking forward to enjoying & his reply really pissed me off

I've seen it happen in shops/fast food restaurants etc

Help!!!!

creolebelle wrote: »

So black Americans are the same as black Britons ?

No of course not, the same as black/Irish are not the same as black Americans or British

Ush1

Nodin wrote: »

In reference to the condition of the African Americans, it is fairly straightforward. Of course when you don't suddenly want to converse about them, and perhaps bring up caste in India as a comparison, things become either more complicated or completely ridiculous.

Yes and this case is very simply a case of racism against white people.

Ush1

Nodin wrote: »

O dear jesus. Did you read the thread?

Yes.

Nodin

Ush1 wrote: »

Yes.

You realise it wasn't a mob of 400 who killed the lad etc?

Ush1

Nodin wrote: »

You realise it wasn't a mob of 400 who killed the lad etc?

What are you suggesting?

Nodin

Ush1 wrote: »

What are you suggesting?

I'm wondering if you're familiar with what happened as opposed to the nonsense in the OP.

Ush1

Nodin wrote: »

I'm wondering if you're familiar with what happened as opposed to the nonsense in the OP.

I'd imagine I'm as familiar as you, since I'm guessing neither one of us was there and have just read reports.

Now, are we going anywhere with this?

Nodin

Ush1 wrote: »

I'd imagine I'm as familiar as you, since I'm guessing neither one of us was there and have just read reports.

Now, are we going anywhere with this?

Only one person was killed. The only sources appearing to offer a racist motive as opposed to drunken thuggery are far right.

Herb Powell

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUi2A6tUYQk

This is worth watching in it's entirety.

Ush1

Nodin wrote: »

Only one person was killed. The only sources appearing to offer a racist motive as opposed to drunken thuggery are far right.

Ah just the one so. Predictable. Would you say it was racist if four hundred white people were there and one of four black people was killed by members of the white group?

I mean, clearly the guys who dragged James Byrd Junior were just thugs, not racists, the only evidence of racism is the liberal media.

Nodin

Ush1 wrote: »

Ah just the one so. Predictable. Would you say it was racist if four hundred white people were there and one of four black people was killed by members of the white group?
..........

You know that not all 400 attacked? That they were helped by some black people?

Ush1

Nodin wrote: »

You know that not all 400 attacked? That they were helped by some black people?

Yes I do. Again, what does that have to do with the price of fish? Not all black people are racist, his attackers likely were however.

Nodin

Ush1 wrote: »

Yes I do. Again, what does that have to do with the price of fish? Not all black people are racist, his attackers likely were however.

Is there any evidence of that outside of the right wing/racist internet news sites though?

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Isn't that what American liberals say about every conservative publication.

I'm sure it is, I'm from Roscommon though.

Sand

Nodin wrote: »

Is there any evidence of that outside of the right wing/racist internet news sites though?

What evidence is there that Wilson is a racist or was racially motivated in shooting Brown...and yet there is reams and reams and ream of media either opening stating it or strongly implying it.

woodoo

If you were to go by some posters here you would think anti white racism doesn't exist.

Nodin

Sand wrote: »

What evidence is there that Wilson is a racist or was racially motivated in shooting Brown...and yet there is reams and reams and ream of media either opening stating it or strongly implying it.

Why are you asking me this on a thread that has nothing to do with the subject?

Nodin

woodoo wrote: »

If you were to go by some posters here you would think anti white racism doesn't exist.

Of course it does, human nature being as it is. That doesn't mean this incident is nessecarily related to it, however.

Sand

Nodin wrote: »

Why are you asking me this on a thread that has nothing to do with the subject?

Same standard of evidence should apply to avoid bias, right?

jank

Nodin wrote: »

In reference to the condition of the African Americans, it is fairly straightforward.

Ah, so "Racism = Poverty = Crime" is only relevant to one race of people, but for other races not so much... ironically that could be view as itself a racist view.

jank

Nodin wrote: »

I'm saying that Jewish history is markedly different and I'm not going down a pointless Rabbit hole.

Yes, avoid any discussing that may sway you to actually think outside the comfort zone of your own opinions.

kowloon

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: »

FPM is a conservative, xenophobic and racist publication. Wouldn't pay too much attention to it.

Had never heard of it before, I'll add it to the list of things I won't bother reading.

creolebelle

Sand wrote: »

What evidence is there that Wilson is a racist or was racially motivated in shooting Brown...and yet there is reams and reams and ream of media either opening stating it or strongly implying it.

look at the case

Nodin wrote: »

Why are you asking me this on a thread that has nothing to do with the subject?

According to their logic black americans have no right to question brutal police tactics used in their communities because a racist black man might have attacked a white man

jank wrote: »

Ah, so "Racism = Poverty = Crime" is only relevant to one race of people, but for other races not so much... ironically that could be view as itself a racist view.

Have you ever taken a sociology class or read any sociological texts?Its quite obvious that there is link between poverty and crime that is present in every country.

Nodin

jank wrote: »

Ah, so "Racism = Poverty = Crime" is only relevant to one race of people, but for other races not so much... ironically that could be view as itself a racist view.

If you don't want to discuss the issue of racism in America against the African American population, nobody is forcing you to post.

creolebelle

Help!!!! wrote: »

No of course not, the same as black/Irish are not the same as black Americans or British

Oh ok. It seemed like you were judging black americans based on your experience with black britons

jank wrote: »

Much of that is correct, whereby proves my point that the simplistic nonsense that some people argue (racism = poverty = crime ) still holds sway to the more naive and usually have an agenda. There are many factors at play, including one which you allude to, community or in other words culture. Jews have always been fiercely community oriented people, have a deep value for education and a very strong work ethic. Polices pursued by the state even now have also damaged the black community a great deal even when a lot of these polices were designed to help them. These policies well meaning and sincere at the times have actually contributed to damage their incomes, wealth and educational levels.

You totally ignored my points about systematic racism. Its slightly arrogant of you to lecture me about the problems of my own community.It seems like youre suggesting that black americans aren't as successful as jewish americans because we don't value education and have a poor work ethic. Thats incredibly insulting if thats what your are suggesting. Black americans have been hard working since we arrived here 400 years ago. The US wouldnt have survived without us. We have also valued education. Many of us died trying to educate ourselves and our children. It was grilled into me that I have to be twice as good in order to be successful in the country because of the color my skin. As I have gotten older Ive seen how true it is.

jank

Nodin wrote: »

If you don't want to discuss the issue of racism in America against the African American population, nobody is forcing you to post.

Its OK to admit that your wrong sometimes Nodin.

Anyway, this topic is about racism against white people in america until people change the topic. Maybe you can start your own thread on black racism.

jank

creolebelle wrote: »

l
Have you ever taken a sociology class or read any sociological texts?Its quite obvious that there is link between poverty and crime that is present in every country.

It is interesting you omitted the 'Racism' bit there, which was in the original claim that has been successfully debunked now. Of course there are socio-economic issues at hand when it comes to crime levels, I never denied that. What I did deny and dispute was the claim that high levels of black crime in the US can be attributed to Racism.

catallus

More Churches, Less Guns

/Thread.

Carlos Orange

creolebelle wrote: »

look at the case

And what would one see? After excluding the demographic data of the people involved what evidence is there?

jank

creolebelle wrote: »

You totally ignored my points about systematic racism. Its slightly arrogant of you to lecture me about the problems of my own community.It seems like youre suggesting that black americans aren't as successful as jewish americans because we don't value education and have a poor work ethic. Thats incredibly insulting if thats what your are suggesting. Black americans have been hard working since we arrived here 400 years ago. The US wouldnt have survived without us. We have also valued education. Many of us died trying to educate ourselves and our children. It was grilled into me that I have to be twice as good in order to be successful in the country because of the color my skin. As I have gotten older Ive seen how true it is.

If what you are saying is true and I don't doubt your personal sincerity or work ethic here but how do you explain the differences in incomes between African Americans and other minorities like Asians and Jews? Asian Americans have more than twice the average income of African Americans. Many of them (Japanese) were locked up/interned for years in the 1940's. There is more to the picture than just 'blame it all on racism'. I am just wondering what that could be?

We often hear the 'blame' narrative from certain sections of society. There has been many laws like affirmative action (more like positive discrimination) passed in the US to try and give minorities help. However, laws like these have done more damage than good. Yet, these are sacred cows and nobody dared touch them or voice an opinion against them.

Lastly, education. Of course there are African American families who value education. I continuously mention that blacks living in the US are the most successful, most education and most prosperous black population in the world. There is a huge middle class section of African Americans who do very very well for themselves. The problem is that there are less of them proportionally then other minorities. Why is this?

Nodin

jank wrote: »

Its OK to admit that your wrong sometimes Nodin.

Anyway, this topic is about racism against white people in america until people change the topic. Maybe you can start your own thread on black racism.

Theres no evidence that's the case here.

jank wrote: »

If what you are saying is true and I don't(................)other minorities. Why is this? .

And there you were telling me the thread was about racism against white people. Dear me.

Why do you think it is?

creolebelle

jank wrote: »

It is interesting you omitted the 'Racism' bit there, which was in the original claim that has been successfully debunked now. Of course there are socio-economic issues at hand when it comes to crime levels, I never denied that. What I did deny and dispute was the claim that high levels of black crime in the US can be attributed to Racism.

You haven't debunked anything. You didn't answer my first 2 questions. You can't take a one size fits all when examining different groups. Systematic racism and poverty are the causes of the high crime rate within the black community

R P McMurphy

jank wrote: »

It is interesting you omitted the 'Racism' bit there, which was in the original claim that has been successfully debunked now. Of course there are socio-economic issues at hand when it comes to crime levels, I never denied that. What I did deny and dispute was the claim that high levels of black crime in the US can be attributed to Racism.

Is it not evident that racism against a minority can have an impact on the economic, social and environmental resources open to them. This can lead to increased poverty levels which in turn leads to higher crime.

jank

Nodin wrote: »

Theres no evidence that's the case here.

Well apart from comments that 'could' be deemed racially motivated and the fact they were set upon by a gang of a different race, yes there is no evidence. Now will you be so forthcoming in the Michael Brown case? Doubt it.

Nodin

jank wrote: »

Well apart from comments that 'could' be deemed racially motivated and the fact they were set upon by a gang of a different race, yes there is no evidence..

....and the fact that this implication seems confined to far right sources. Well done. Bit pointless to use this case to talk about black on white racism then, isn't it?

"There is a huge middle class section of African Americans who do very very well for themselves. The problem is that there are less of them proportionally then other minorities. Why is this?"

Why do you think this is?

creolebelle

jank wrote: »

If what you are saying is true and I don't doubt your personal sincerity or work ethic here but how do you explain the differences in incomes between African Americans and other minorities like Asians and Jews? Asian Americans have more than twice the average income of African Americans. Many of them (Japanese) were locked up/interned for years in the 1940's. There is more to the picture than just 'blame it all on racism'. I am just wondering what that could be?

We often hear the 'blame' narrative from certain sections of society. There has been many laws like affirmative action (more like positive discrimination) passed in the US to try and give minorities help. However, laws like these have done more damage than good. Yet, these are sacred cows and nobody dared touch them or voice an opinion against them.

Lastly, education. Of course there are African American families who value education. I continuously mention that blacks living in the US are the most successful, most education and most prosperous black population in the world. There is a huge middle class section of African Americans who do very very well for themselves. The problem is that there are less of them proportionally then other minorities. Why is this?

It's quite laughable that you think you can actually lecture me about the problems and causes of said problems of the black american community. The answer to your query is a long standing system of systematic racism.
The main benefactors of affirmative action were white women. You can't compare the interment of japanese citizens to slavery and Jim Crow.
A recent study examining the job placement rates of recent college grads found it took black Americans twice as long to find work. Another study that used fake names and addresses found those with "black" names and addresses in black neighborhoods were least likely to be called for an interview compared to those with "white" names and addresses in white neighborhoods.
There was yet another study that found that white dropout with a high school diploma has better chance of finding work compare to a black college graduate with no criminal record.

Im going to mention another study that found it takes Asians twice as long to find work when compared to their white counterparts.

Are you an american? You seem really determined to prove that america is some kind of panacea

jank

creolebelle wrote: »

You haven't debunked anything. You didn't answer my first 2 questions. You can't take a one size fits all when examining different groups. Systematic racism and poverty are the causes of the high crime rate within the black community

I don't know what questions you are referring to. I agree you cannot take a one size fits all, that was precisely my point. People are different, groups are different. Groups have different values and culture that separates them, yet when I say that group A have a good work ethic it somehow means that group B don't have a good work ethic and everyone gets all offended with this.

Are you saying that systematic racism in 2014 is to blame for 50% of murder victims being black, 91% of them murdered by other black people? Where is the empirical evidence for this level of crime and murder. There is more to this than just racism.

creolebelle

psinno wrote: »

And what would one see? After excluding the demographic data of the people involved what evidence is there?

That officers are more likely to use to deadly force when handling black ppl.

Sonderkommando

David Duke's My Awakening is a must read for anyone interested in this subject.

jank

creolebelle wrote: »

Im going to mention another study that found Asians it takes Asians twice as long to find work when compared to their white counterparts.

Are you an american? You seem really determined to prove that america is some kind of panacea

a) Then why do Asian earn more than white americans on average? I am genuinely curious here. Why do some minorities do so well and others terribly?

b) A panacea, god no. There is no utopia in the world. I just reject the narrative that often follows a discussion on race in the US. As I mentioned before, similar studies in Australia have found similar incidents of resume discrimination against non anglo names. Yet, we don't have Asians/middle-easterns and pacific islanders trying to outdo each other in the murder rate. Correlation does not equal correlation unless there is a direct link or study between the resume studies and the homicide rate.

jank

Nodin wrote: »

"There is a huge middle class section of African Americans who do very very well for themselves. The problem is that there are less of them proportionally then other minorities. Why is this?"

Why do you think this is?

I already made my points clear, care to answer rather than add one liners?
Want to wander away from your simple 'racism=poverty=crime' sum that has been debunked?

creolebelle

jank wrote: »

I don't know what questions you are referring to. I agree you cannot take a one size fits all, that was precisely my point. People are different, groups are different. Groups have different values and culture that separates them, yet when I say that group A have a good work ethic it somehow means that group B don't have a good work ethic and everyone gets all offended with this.

Are you saying that systematic racism in 2014 is to blame for 50% of murder victims being black, 91% of them murdered by other black people? Where is the empirical evidence for this level of crime and murder. There is more to this than just racism.

Yes I am. It's a lot more complicated than just group a has better values than group b.
Poverty+racism=violent crime.
Lack of jobs causes people to turn to unsavory illegal activity

creolebelle

Sonderkommando wrote: »

David Duke's My Awakening is a must read for anyone interested in this subject.

Seriously?
I think I'm going to take my exit