Saab 93 TiD 150 or Honda Accord CDTI?

bear1

Here I am again looking for advice
I seem to change my mind every week.
With only 2 months to go I've more than likely narrowed it down to these 2 cars.
Both around the 04/05 mark and for more or less 3k.
I've scoured the net looking for reviews of the cars and they both seem to perform ok-ish.
Does anyone have an analysis on living with either car?
I've read that the Accord has an electronic boot, is this true? The one thing that scares me about the Accord is the manifold problem, drinks a lot of oil and that there is no oil level low warning light. Another issue I've read about the Accord is that to replace the clutch the subframe and steering rack has to be removed.
The Saab on the other hand seems to suffer from EGR issues and the boot space seems quite limited.

bear1

No one?

26000 Elephants

i can only comment on the engine of the saab - egr issues arent a big deal. Simply blank it off and it wont cause problems. just ensure the blanking plate has a few small holes, otherwise you get an ecu error.
Also, confirm that the dpf is in good condition. A fiatecuscan tool will give you the details. Replacement is 630 euros, so not the end of the world.
Engine/gearbox is Fiat, most other running gear is vectra C. (brakes, springs, wishbones, etc.) So parts plentiful and cheap.

The honda may be slightly sharper looking, but has the whiff of an auld one about it.

bear1

Doesn't the EGR then have to be turned off via the ECU?
I get the impression the Honda is more a load lugger than the Saab.

26000 Elephants

No. ecu opens and closes egr all it likes, has no real effect

Ive done it on 300TDI and TD5's ive had in the past - made tremendous difference - but someone had already done it on the croma mjet. Took it off recently to check, and it, and the intake were spotless. Well worth it.

patrickc

i've currently an 06 accord 2.2 icdti tourer lovely car and loads of extras

the oil issue you've mentioned hasn't affected me I've changed oil every 10k and done full service every 20k.

the boot is the electronic one no issue with that

the issues I have had are the sat nav new screen needed second hand cost me 150 and now needs disc drive repaired not getting it done though.
also rear brake pads have been done twice and rear callipers seized a few times

other than this has been a great car.

I would recommend remapping though haven't had it done but the car is so slow to respond from idle or even overtaking unless your at speed mine is the 5speed not the 6

christy02

I have 06 accord 2.2 ctdi. 6 speed exec model. Tbh buying one of that year the manifold issue would have emerged by now and been sorted if it was gonna be a problem.

I had narrowed my search down to same 2 cars when I bought accord. Ruled out Saab in end as are less reliable IMO
Alpha 159 has same engine as Saab and also worth a look. Great looking car.

No issues so far with accord. 257000km on it at moment. If you could stretch to the 06 facelift model I would reccomend it. Pick one up for 4-5k. Exec models have great spec.

bear1

patrickc wrote: »

i've currently an 06 accord 2.2 icdti tourer lovely car and loads of extras

the oil issue you've mentioned hasn't affected me I've changed oil every 10k and done full service every 20k.

the boot is the electronic one no issue with that

the issues I have had are the sat nav new screen needed second hand cost me 150 and now needs disc drive repaired not getting it done though.
also rear brake pads have been done twice and rear callipers seized a few times

other than this has been a great car.

I would recommend remapping though haven't had it done but the car is so slow to respond from idle or even overtaking unless your at speed mine is the 5speed not the 6

Cheers for that write up.
Is the electronic boot basically a button inside the car that you just push and it opens up fully itself?
I hadn't thought about remapping as I would have thought 140bhp would be enough but it could be no harm to inquire about it.
@Christy - What sort of reliability issues were pushing you away from the Saab if I can ask?
Unfortunately I won't be able to stretch much further than a 05 as my budget won't allow it. You make a good point regarding the manifold.

christy02

bear1 wrote: »

Cheers for that write up.
Is the electronic boot basically a button inside the car that you just push and it opens up fully itself?
I hadn't thought about remapping as I would have thought 140bhp would be enough but it could be no harm to inquire about it.
@Christy - What sort of reliability issues were pushing you away from the Saab if I can ask?
Unfortunately I won't be able to stretch much further than a 05 as my budget won't allow it. You make a good point regarding the manifold.

Electronic boot is a button on the fob that pops the boot open. You can open normally if you want.
I researched on here about Saab's and was put off them in the end. Was going to buy one off a boardsie at one point but he had sold before I was ready to buy

Clutch and flywheel usually need replacing around 100k miles. My accord is on 150k miles and still on first clutch/flywheel.

Listen for timing chain rattle on accord as this can be costly. Apart from that nothing major of note.

bear1

What about MPG?
Thanks for all the advice btw

26000 Elephants

"your mileage may vary...." :-)

Have a look at fuelly, usually has some insights into real world MPG figures. For example, saab 9-3 2005 Tid comes in at about 44mpg.

(cant post links, but www dot fuelly dot com and filter by you car, fuel and year. ensure you look at UK mpg figures, as US ones are different.

Most 2.0 litre diesels of the same era do about the same, in the 42 to 48 range.


Its more reliable than the usual mad claims made by the fans of different diesel cars.

christy02

I do between 45 and 50 MPG on the accord consistently. Work is a 25 mile each way on 100 and 120 kph roads. I would imagine Saab would be similar.
That is worked out fill to fill not on trip computer.

bear1

So the Honda seems to have the upper edge against the Saab.
Anyone have positives for the Saab?

ba_barabus

bear1 wrote: »

Anyone have positives for the Saab?

They have nice seats and a fancy cup holder.

bear1

ba_barabus wrote: »

They have nice seats and a fancy cup holder.

Saab it is then!

bazz26

Why not look at the Alfa Romeo 159? Uses the same Fiat engine as the 9-3 except the 159 is better built, nicer to drive and more modern.

bear1

To find a 159 in good condition would be a task in itself and the other reason is because you can't get a 159 on a 3k budget.

toastedpickles

Can i interest you in one of these?
http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/saab-9-5-2-2-tid-2004/6204636

Can't really comment on the diesel but I've the petrol 2.3 version and its stupidly comfy, fast, oddly economical plus it has an even cooler cup holder :pac: Plus they're better built than the 9-3, no rattley dashes or anything of the sort, a good few extras in them too

bear1

Yes, you would interest me in one of those
The thing is that I've heard the 2.2 isn't a particularly good engine and not so powerful for a heavy car.

toastedpickles

bear1 wrote: »

Yes, you would interest me in one of those
The thing is that I've heard the 2.2 isn't a particularly good engine and not so powerful for a heavy car.

Just done a read of a few reviews, yeah it's shyte :pac: If you can, pick up a 2.0 apparently that's the one to get, they don't suffer from all the sludge horror stories you'l probably get

bear1

Petrols are out of the question unfortunately I do approx 40k per year which keeps me firmly in daysul territory.

toastedpickles

bear1 wrote: »

Petrols are out of the question unfortunately I do approx 40k per year which keeps me firmly in daysul territory.

Well if you can get a 2.0 9-5 your laughing, besto luck! You're probably better off with a diesel one

bear1

I'd be laughing alright... till I see my annual fuel bill
I am yeah, the missus also wants me to look at SWs... women.. I mean wtf

toastedpickles

bear1 wrote: »

I'd be laughing alright... till I see my annual fuel bill
I am yeah, the missus also wants me to look at SWs... women.. I mean wtf

Ah heyor :pac:

bear1

Ah guys I have one question about the Honda.
Does it have an MPG display? or a Km/Ml to 0 readout?

christy02

bear1 wrote: »

Ah guys I have one question about the Honda.
Does it have an MPG display? or a Km/Ml to 0 readout?

Mine is 06 and has l/100km

bear1

Does the 04 have one?
I get the feeling it doesn't.

toastedpickles

Last plug for the saab, honest! :pac:

It has mpg in mpg and l/100
it has a distance till empty thing which can be changed to miles or km too basically the whole on board computer can be switched between imperial and metric or a mix of both

bear1

From reading some reviews and honestjohn it seems the Honda doesn't have a trip computer, so the Saab is back in the game

toastedpickles

It does indeed! on the lovely computer it has,

an alarm
average speed
average distance traveled
mpg
distance till empty
outside/inside temp
time/ date all that craic
then you have ones that you can tailor yourself, like average time taken on a certain journey, with the speed and stuff tied in

So there you go! Take it from someone who actually owns one, not from people who heard this off tony down in the pub who heard if from his mothers uncles godchild.....or something like that

bear1

You see the computer I'd kinda need, even if they aren't very reliable.
I'm quite sure that these are the 2 final contenders, I mentioned an Avensis on another thread and a poster kindly said not to

toastedpickles

Ah yeah, well the 9-3 computer is different to the 9-5 so im just going from the 9-5's one, but it's got more in it i think, they're fairly bang on too, sometimes the pixles go missing on them, but you can either replace the whole thing or diy fix it with double sided tape, if you do consider a 9-5, go onto a few saab forums and ask how they are there, most review sites are just bland oul it does this well or that not so well, I prefer to hear actual peoples experiences of them not some guy who drives it for a day and gets paid to write something up

That's just me though

bear1

If I could get a 3.0 tid under 3k and with an NCT I'd be fairly happy but they are a rare beasht in Ireland.

toastedpickles

They are fairly rare!

christy02

Honda has a trip computer. Can't speak for older ones though. Agreed the Saab is a lovely looking car. For me accord just shades it which is why I went for it in the end.

Thinking of getting it remapped though as can be a bit wanting at higher revs. Not sure about the Saab in this regard.

toastedpickles

christy02 wrote: »

Honda has a trip computer. Can't speak for older ones though. Agreed the Saab is a lovely looking car. For me accord just shades it which is why I went for it in the end.

Thinking of getting it remapped though as can be a bit wanting at higher revs. Not sure about the Saab in this regard.

The saab diesels can be remapped fairly well from what i remember anyways as can the petrols, petrols more sothough, with mine I'm trying to get a bigger turbo and ecu from the next model up, instantly bring me up to 250/60bhp

bear1

christy02 wrote: »

Honda has a trip computer. Can't speak for older ones though. Agreed the Saab is a lovely looking car. For me accord just shades it which is why I went for it in the end.

Thinking of getting it remapped though as can be a bit wanting at higher revs. Not sure about the Saab in this regard.

The 06 onwards has the trip comp but the 04/05 models don't which makes me wonder why they didn't bother adding this feature.
The Accord is a bigger car which is a plus for me but the Saab has bigger bhp engine with lower tax costs and possibly lower insurance costs.
Argghhhhhh decisions decisions!!
What I do like about the Accords is that it is very easy to find one with heated seats whereas it's a bit harder with the Saabs but the Saabs seem to have a nicer looking cabin.
I believe the Saab also has more airbags.

toastedpickles

First car ever to get a 5 star ncap, my one has 7 airbags apparently, I've only found 4

All you can do really is test drive the two/three and see which you prefer, press all the buttons!

bear1

toastedpickles wrote: »

First car ever to get a 5 star ncap, my one has 7 airbags apparently, I've only found 4

All you can do really is test drive the two/three and see which you prefer, press all the buttons!

You mean nightmode don't you

toastedpickles

Heh yeah :pac: Great yoke that is

26000 Elephants

bear1 wrote: »

What I do like about the Accords is that it is very easy to find one with heated seats whereas it's a bit harder with the Saabs but the Saabs seem to have a nicer looking cabin.

Heated seats you say? Buy a hot water bottle!!

Fill it up when your making the tay in the morning, stick it under your arse, fire her up, and away you go.... :-)

All the bum warming of a honda, with the class of a saab.

bear1

You sir are a genius and sure feck the AC - cut a hole in the side pillars and bobs your uncle AC!

bear1

What do you guys think of these?

http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/saab-93-saab-93-tid-sport-6sped/7456767

Now, I know he says it's a 150bhp model but I think that it is actually a 120bhp.

Not very easy to find a proper 150 model.

Here are the Hondas I'm contemplating:

http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/04-accord-diesel-taxedservicednctd/7398256

This one is probably my favourite but it is also the most expensive, has the highest mileage and shortest NCT.

http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/honda-accord/7448704

****e pics but if the spec is to believed then it's quite nice.

http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/honda-accord-cdti/7529958

Longest NCT and reasonable mileage and I do like the cream leather interior.

bear1

Or maybe one of these but I'm kinda meh about them

http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/02-audi-a4-1-9tdi/7519427

Now this I like!

http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/2005-saab-93-vector-1-9tid-150bhp/7460452

I have noticed though that the buttons on the Saab rub off very easily, is there a cure for this?

toastedpickles

Nope theres nothign you can do about button peel, doesn't happen in the 9-5 but its due to the rubber on the other ones that make them go bad and peel away

bear1

toastedpickles wrote: »

Nope theres nothign you can do about button peel, doesn't happen in the 9-5 but its due to the rubber on the other ones that make them go bad and peel away

I could tippex them black

toastedpickles

You can get black tippex??

bear1

toastedpickles wrote: »

You can get black tippex??

Err emm yeah... yeah sure you can - all you have to do is buy ordinary tippex right. Then you buy some black paint.
Mixed them together and hey presto black tippex!

toastedpickles

look at the brains on this lad! :pac:

bear1

They don't call me the fcuktard for nothing!

christy02

bear1 wrote: »

Or maybe one of these but I'm kinda meh about them

http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/02-audi-a4-1-9tdi/7519427

Now this I like!

http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/2005-saab-93-vector-1-9tid-150bhp/7460452

I have noticed though that the buttons on the Saab rub off very easily, is there a cure for this?

My accord is black but with cream leather. Goes nice imo.

That Saab is 120bhp. Easy to know the 150bhp has oil filler cap on the right of block as you look at it. 120bhp on left.

I found that as well, a lot are advertised as 150 but actually 120. I had no interest in the 120 I imagine its underpowered.