Beef in Crisis

rangler1

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

I am not resorting to lies however it is shamefull the way you resort to the question the integrity of other posters and then get on your high horse when someone throws a curve ball at you.

The reality is that five the last six leaders all tryed to become involved in politics straight after there term in office. This leaves a level of distrust among some members.

Nobody wants toe QA gone howeven at present it is used as a penelty system on farmers and nees to be reoriented. The biggest issue with it is that it is being used at present to give an impression that we have a good average price for cattle when we have not. The grid as it is composed needs to be completely redone.

This may involve a tempory exit by farmers from the scheme until this is sorted. In reality all the IFA need do is get farmers to write a letter to Board Bia instructing them not to share any data withother bodies mainly the processors. This means that no farmer is out of QA but that the factory have to access the data through the farmer. It a pain for processors and put farmers in the driving seat while it is being restructured.. It is unliky that the processors would let this get that farm.

However the IFA is dead set against this as it will upset the minster, BB and the processors. Of course the CA will declare no cartel because it takes an effort to investigate. That is no reason not to put pressure over feedlots controlled by processors. If as one poster in another thread suggested that beef from these feedlots are way more expensive to produce that processor pay it suggest market manipulation.

As far as many I see and I am unsure of how other feel the IFA is against anything that will upset the status quo.

You wrote that in the present tense, too many leaders HAVE POLITICAL AMBITION
Our leaders are mainly President Deputy Pres, Executive Board and if you like even us, Nat Exec.

One of our commodity chairmen stated last week that we can only deal with proposals that come up from the counties, you think we should go after the feedlots and I don't, that's the way it'll stay until a resolution comes to the livestock committee, That's the way the organisation works
No matter how good the ideas are here there has to be stronger support for them

Farmer Pudsey

rangler1 wrote: »

You wrote that in the present tense, too many leaders HAVE POLITICAL AMBITION
Our leaders are mainly President Deputy Pres, Executive Board and if you like even us, Nat Exec.

One of our commodity chairmen stated last week that we can only deal with proposals that come up from the counties, you think we should go after the feedlots and I don't, that's the way it'll stay until a resolution comes to the livestock committee, That's the way the organisation works

You are splitting hairs over grammer we are not all as well educated as you. In any organisation there is only one leader, in gaelic it is toiseach and plural is taoisigh. The toiseach of the IFA is its presidant and the plural for leaders is taoisigh or faromers presidants.

As well will Eddie follow the previous four trying to getting involved, will the lad that follows him continue along the same route. So we can use it in the presence tence as well.

Did a resolution have to come from so called county branches to chain up trollys. Did a county resolution have to be send on to Henry and Eddie to make sure it was there pictures were taken chaining trollys. The reasons you have leaders is to lead not to be lead by the nose to do what is necessary. The reality is the IFA will never do anything that will directly effect the big boys usless it is dragged screaming to do same.

PatrickJoseph

Heard on radio this morning that ICSA have a protest outside ABP in Bandon this morning. Important that we support all efforts by all farmers

Nettleman

Hello, have been following beef threads for past few weeks, and decided to join and contribute to the debate. I am beef farmer, agri cert.

On IFA, I was a member until 2013, and stopped as I have lost all confidence in them. I also never seen a set of accounts...Ranger, can you advise why IFA don't publish their annual accounts for entire organisation?. Branch accounts are of no value, accounts for the national organisation? Whats their cash balance, and why would they not consider automatic refunds of EIF levy to all farmers who killed cattle since the crisis began, or start a moratorium on deductions until crisis ends, that way, they have a financial incentive to get things sorted.
I am QA assured, and am in support of QA withdrawl, and have informed BB of my intentions to withdraw, if they do not take farmer concerns seriously. They got 500m from roundtable, and I cant see that this money is doing anything for the crisis. I read the presentatiins given at the last roundtable, and if these were prepared by the best brains in the business, well, enough said. So with my bug bears outa the way, here is my idea. Cant post urls so google this "NORGES SILDESALGSLAG". click map on top left of home page.

Basically this is a fisherman auction website, supported by Norweigan law, Fishermen upload details of their catch, tonnage, species etc, and processors from various countries bid for the fish. Can Irish Beef farmers route all their finished cattle through a similiar channell, and re-unite in numbers. Factories have broken the strength of farmer organisations over the year, and we need to regain some degree of control.
Factories only get cattle by bidding. No more agents snooping around your farm collecting intel on your business.
Farmer uploads a pic of side and rear of best, approx. weight, age, sex, breed, QA status etc. Very strict safeguards would be needed obviously. So what you think?

I said

whelan2 wrote: »

joe Healy in todays farming indo " last weeks estimated kill of over 34,000 was not only 3140 head up on last year but also one of the largest kils since 2011"

I'm driving the country every other day where are these cattle?

Farmer Pudsey

I said wrote: »

I'm driving the country every other day where are these cattle?

It is called organised panic. Lots of lads killing cattle because of date of birth.

I said

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

It is called organised panic. Lots of lads killing cattle because of date of birth.

I doubt that cattle are scarce this year all I'm hearing is there is no cattle in the country

RightTurnClyde

There's bound to be a scarcity of beef looming, remember all those dead calves stockpiled in the knackerys yards in spring 2012, gone, and then there's a bunch of bullocks missing, already killed as bull beef, gone. Cull dairy cows are going to be scarce compared with the last 2 or 3 years. Remember it only takes a few % either way to turn a feast into a famine.
Now weither there is a scarcity of markets for the beef...that's another matter..

whelan2

I said wrote: »

I'm driving the country every other day where are these cattle?

they're hiding in the ditches:) no seriously my parents went down the country last week and the one thing my dad said when they came back was there's alot less cattle around than there used to be.

sandydan

rangler1 wrote: »

All those names aren't running the show now, even if Eddie has any ambition that way he's not going to sway a committee of circa 50,
Of the 30 county chairmen, how many are going to be bothered politically

whether he has or not, is irrelevant imo and he is not going to tell me about it is he, and as i said its irrelevant imo. the names i used are in past,fair enough but it was pattern that was followed and will be.
past patterns is all we have to go by and is usually an indication of what may happen in future provided opportunity presents itself to a person who is capable of availing of it.
anyway no matter what organisation you refer to members will criticize those at top, unions ,GAA, FAI,and a multitude of others including political parties. those at top just stand back and let those down the line take flak and appear when publicity shines on them in a opportunistic fashion regardless of whether their actions impacted well or badly on those entrusting them in position.

as an opener i asked where were lies in Farmer Pudsey's remarks in post he submitted.
my own opinion on IFA is its now top heavy as opposed to old NFA and in danger of becoming irrelevant in farming circles as its constantly seen fighting rearguard actions instead of being in fighting farmers cause from beginning.

sandydan

rangler1 wrote: »

All those names aren't running the show now, even if Eddie has any ambition that way he's not going to sway a committee of circa 50,
Of the 30 county chairmen, how many are going to be bothered politically

that issue aside what about my "copy of Erin Foods" ( think it was Beet and Vegetable Growers a section of some organisation supervised- maybe wrong -) type of payment(or partly) of dedicated staff checking carcass grading equipment suggestion.

rangler1

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

You are splitting hairs over grammer we are not all as well educated as you. In any organisation there is only one leader, in gaelic it is toiseach and plural is taoisigh. The toiseach of the IFA is its presidant and the plural for leaders is taoisigh or faromers presidants.

As well will Eddie follow the previous four trying to getting involved, will the lad that follows him continue along the same route. So we can use it in the presence tence as well.

Did a resolution have to come from so called county branches to chain up trollys. Did a county resolution have to be send on to Henry and Eddie to make sure it was there pictures were taken chaining trollys. The reasons you have leaders is to lead not to be lead by the nose to do what is necessary. The reality is the IFA will never do anything that will directly effect the big boys usless it is dragged screaming to do same.

Protests wouldn't be anything to do with policy, they would be as a result of farmers complaining we're not ''doing anything''.
Just stressing that if you don't want to get involved don't expect me to do messenger
Some of us are pushed into positions, and then there's people that think they can abuse and ridicule us and then have the cheek to wonder why we can't be bothered.....
Ah well back to my sheep, at least they're worth the bother

rangler1

sandydan wrote: »

that issue aside what about my "copy of Erin Foods" ( think it was Beet and Vegetable Growers a section of some organisation supervised- maybe wrong -) type of payment(or partly) of dedicated staff checking carcass grading equipment suggestion.

No matter who we'd put in there they'd be in the factories pocket,
The department are there, and I'm sure theres some check done on the scales and grading daily, you need to ask our livestock guys to get information

coolshannagh28

Abfg makes a lot of very relevant points amid the bluster of his posts and Rangler while an able advocate does have a default position while under pressure that is unsettling and detrimental to his general argument

Nettleman

coolshannagh28 wrote: »

Abfg makes a lot of very relevant points amid the bluster of his posts and Rangler while an able advocate does have a default position while under pressure that is unsettling and detrimental to his general argument

HE hasn't yet come back on my question about how much cash the IFA are sitting on though.....they should publish full accounts and show that financial transparency is something only the factories and retailers choose to conceal

Username John

I see the ICSA are protesting outside AIBP in Bandon today.

http://www.agriland.ie/news/key-issues-must-resolved-talks-farmers-meat-industry/#

What do people think?
A lot of posters on here have said this is the route they would be in favour of I think.
Anyone know anything about it?

rangler1

Nettleman wrote: »

HE hasn't yet come back on my question about how much cash the IFA are sitting on though.....they should publish full accounts and show that financial transparency is something only the factories and retailers choose to conceal

I don't think I'm in that position to answer that, but money is invested wisely, I wish mine was as well invested, I think but for other incomes, IFA wouldn't be breaking even, there's an internal audit committee as well as real auditors.
It'll cost the same to run the organisation when there's 40000 members( no of farmers reducing all the time) as it does now at 90000, so it was decided to put money aside annually since Tom parlon was national treasurer ,

sandydan

rangler1 wrote: »

No matter who we'd put in there they'd be in the factories pocket,
The department are there, and I'm sure theres some check done on the scales and grading daily, you need to ask our livestock guys to get information

im surprised to read you printing that existing people are in factories pockets. if set up properly imo to set standard somewhat similar to milk testing equipment in laboratories and contract for testing on rotational basis with different contractors in each factory, id say room for that type shinanigans would be strictly limited if dismissal from contract and compensating carcasses owners was penalty for incorrect scrutiny if following complaint from producer an unprofessional scrutiny was discovered. the carcass weight penalty is different story and needs to be set by Dept or Eu order in my opinion anyway,not arbitrarily where carcass providing prime steak cuts is subject to penalty at not less than 6 weeks notice (just for example) with upper limits being notified by min 6 month period.

rangler1

sandydan wrote: »

im surprised to read you printing that existing people are in factories pockets. if set up properly imo to set standard somewhat similar to milk testing equipment in laboratories and contract for testing on rotational basis with different contractors in each factory, id say room for that type shinanigans would be strictly limited if dismissal from contract and compensating carcasses owners was penalty for incorrect scrutiny if following complaint from producer an unprofessional scrutiny was discovered. the carcass weight penalty is different story and needs to be set by Dept or Eu order in my opinion anyway,not arbitrarily where carcass providing prime steak cuts is subject to penalty at not less than 6 weeks notice (just for example) with upper limits being notified by min 6 month period.

sure I might as well let on I agree with those that know it all, dept ag is supposed to be looking after grading, trim, etc, obviously you don't trust them......imagine if IFA put in someone....can't see it happening

sandydan

rangler1 wrote: »

sure I might as well let on I agree with those that know it all, dept ag is supposed to be looking after grading, trim, etc, obviously you don't trust them......imagine if IFA put in someone....can't see it happening

well if they pushed for it a sharp decline in complaints should ensue imo. factories and Dept don't want their abilities questioned but imo it should be done to EU standards. was often present in processing plants not meat factories when EU based supermarkets inspected plant and they knew their stuff to last detail , inspections in 2 cases were unannounced as was normal practice, i was delivering to plant on both occasions and they knew what i was checking in and condition of truck was noted as well.they checked all details as their jobs depended on being thorough.i also worked in plant where Sainsbury were main buyer and as normal practice when plant was working everything was inspected, hygiene and quality and adhering to guidelines were paramount. you are right i don't trust dept of anything in high profile industries.

Farmer Pudsey

Was reading Farming Indo today, John Henry had a good article regarding grading well worth a read. It was with a little suprise when I was reading Joe Healy article the latest is that Factory's are now imposing bases depending on cattle breeds I hope he expand's on this. Finally in the Editorial Darragh McCullough has written an interesting article regarding present beef situtation

Muckit

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

Was reading Farming Indo today, John Heney had a good article regarding grading, well worth a read....

Ye must have very similar setups, yet ye both seem to have a different story to tell.

... come on puds, tell the truth and shame the devil, are you not getting a roasting this year???

I'd agree with him on grading. Sent a heifer earlier in summer that was def a u- and instead graded r+.

mf240

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

Was reading Farming Indo today, John Henry had a good article regarding grading well worth a read. It was with a little suprise when I was reading Joe Healy article the latest is that Factory's are now imposing bases depending on cattle breeds I hope he expand's on this. Finally in the Editorial Darragh McCullough has written an interesting article regarding present beef situtation

Thought those bullocks picture would have made os. Would a bit of meal have pushed them over the line.

I like you was disgrunteled to hear they are paying a lower base for friesans.

Farmer Pudsey

Muckit wrote: »

Ye must have very similar setups, yet ye both seem to have a different story to tell.

... come on puds, tell the truth and shame the devil, are you not getting a roasting this year???

I'd agree with him on grading. Sent a heifer earlier in summer that was def a u- and instead graded r+.

Have not sold so have not being roasted.........yet, old dog for the hard road, Pudsey for the path. I am holding my friesian and a few Jex crosses for a flat price somewhere between now and Christmas. It will hardly be next week.

Grading look ominious, dodgy suspect even.

Ps, will be able to go out then and give the store producer a little more full of the milk of human kindness is old puds

mf240

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

Have not sold so have not being roasted.........yet, old dog for the hard road, Pudsey for the path. I am holding my friesian and a few Jex crosses for a flat price somewhere between now and Christmas. It will hardly be next week.

Grading look ominious, dodgy suspect even.

Mine fellas are staying put for the moment too. Can keep till jan if needs be. If only there was more fight in our fellow farmers.

Abfg

Kevin the sheep wrote: »

If everyone sold true mart send no cattle to factory would it force them to up price if they have to bid against each other for the stock you can always bring them home if not getting anofe hard to bring them back from factory

I think Kevin could be onto somthing here. At the moment very few farmers are bringing their stock to ordinary sales they all wait for the special sales.
What about setting up a farming group that would organise sales where export buyers would attend that have been financially checked before hand. Pay for their flights and subsidies the transport. I would far sooner pay a levy that was put to some use like this than waisted giving it to useless organisation that care more about Larry than the people they represent.
At the moment most shippers are doing exactly this for personal gain and I think it can be improved upon if we had a group responsible for coordinating it that farmers could trust and benifit both the exporter and the farmer.
Maybe have cattle photographed and advertised on the internet beforehand with a reserve price(x amount per kilo).
Get the cattle out from under Larry and then you'll force him to pay for stock!

FarmerDougal

Muckit wrote: »

I'd agree with him on grading. Sent a heifer earlier in summer that was def a u- and instead graded r+.

Did she have it on the shoulder? Had a few like that this yr but had more that were a grade higher than expected. Very happy with grading and far scores in factory, the few 2= that were cut were marked as lean on notes. Always write a description of every beast to cross reference and study with kill sheet.

sandydan

maybe our troubles are over, some one said Hogan to be new Agri Commisioner

mf240

sandydan wrote: »

maybe our troubles are over, some one said Hogan to be new Agri Commisioner

Mister personality himself.

Willfarman

mf240 wrote: »

Thought those bullocks picture would have made os. Would a bit of meal have pushed them over the line.

I like you was disgrunteled to hear they are paying a lower base for friesans.

I love his articles and general approach. The cattle were a under fleshed. You need friesians to have a pillow over the tail to grade decently. Whether that would of payed him any better I don't know.

Muckit

He doesn't seem to meal or if he does l'd say very little. I'd say he has it went well worked out. He's one of the few l like reading about. Even the bit about the gate, another lad wouldn't even mention it.

Charliebull

sandydan wrote: »

maybe our troubles are over, some one said Hogan to be new Agri Commisioner

Yea he made a great job of his last post

Muckit

FarmerDougal wrote: »

Did she have it on the shoulder?

Yes l would have thought she had.

Farmer Pudsey

Willfarman wrote: »

I love his articles and general approach. The cattle were a under fleshed. You need friesians to have a pillow over the tail to grade decently. Whether that would of payed him any better I don't know.

One was a 3+ two were 3= and one was 3-. I am reluctant to send fresians unless they are 3+ or better unless the price is strong. I find that the KO is poor and grading is poor.

However you have to remember that John Heney said that he bought a better type of store. He was comparing them with Fresians that he killed 8+ years ago pre grading and commented that he had 30% P's them as opposed to 60% now. As far as I know he has not change his system and I am not sure if he feeds them.

I be in agreement with him grading has disimproved over last 3 years especially. Back pre mechanical grading the majority of AA cattles off dairy stock graded 'R', herefords were a littless than 50/50 and most Continental crosses were R as well. When you consider that BSE was a factor and 30 months was an issue it is a good indication as virtually no herefords and AA grade nowadays

sandydan

Charliebull wrote: »

Yea he made a great job of his last post

we will know more of that when water bills come in after daddy xmas has gone..
one thing i note is UK have set up food fraud investigation unit due to report on horsemeat scandal basically saying supervision and inspections were basically inadequate with too many responsible whereas now one body will carry out all duties with power to prosecute.wonder will something like that get go ahead here.

grange mac

Saw protest outside gates of aibp in bandon this am. Very few farners protesting 10-15 people Max I d say. Don't think it got any media coverage.

Base price

Charliebull wrote: »

I think somebody mentioned it before but maybe we should have an IFA thread, this started as a beef general thread and was going well as that, then it got side tracked to beef in crisis and now it's morphed into a fcuking IFA thread, with people slagging each other and not discussing fcuk all constructive to beef,
Bin this thread and go back to beef general

Sorry Charlie but for once I have to disagree with you.
In my opinion, the IFA -being the largest organisation to represent farmers interests in Ireland, who receive 35% of their direct funding from the EIF levy (member and non members) have professional paid staff in Ireland and Brussels are directly linked to the crisis in the beef industry. The IFA are the organisation who decide for us http://www.ifa.ie/ifa-40-years-of-delivering-in-europe/#.VA9zGaMUOjY
I will say it again (ad nausium) why did they not respond sooner to the drop in factory prices. Prices for FR bulls started to slip September 2013, by late November it was becoming a real issue, by Dec/Jan you had to beg to get them killed at ridiculously low prices and a loss for producers.
So as far as I am concerned their lack of action (and Pudsey's comment re them having to get a mandate) links them directly to the problem.
Agriland did a online survey last week asking peoples opinions as to whether there was a clash of interest re the EIF levy and our representative farm organisations.
85% agreed that there was. http://www.agriland.ie/news/levy-collection-poll-confirms-perceived-clash-interest/

rangler1

Base price wrote: »

Sorry Charlie but for once I have to disagree with you.
In my opinion, the IFA -being the largest organisation to represent farmers interests in Ireland, who receive 35% of their direct funding from the EIF levy (member and non members) have professional paid staff in Ireland and Brussels are directly linked to the crisis in the beef industry. The IFA are the organisation who decide for us http://www.ifa.ie/ifa-40-years-of-delivering-in-europe/#.VA9zGaMUOjY
I will say it again (ad nausium) why did they not respond sooner to the drop in factory prices. Prices for FR bulls started to slip September 2013, by late November it was becoming a real issue, by Dec/Jan you had to beg to get them killed at ridiculously low prices and a loss for producers.
So as far as I am concerned their lack of action (and Pudsey's comment re them having to get a mandate) links them directly to the problem.
Agriland did a online survey last week asking peoples opinions as to whether there was a clash of interest re the EIF levy and our representative farm organisations.
85% agreed that there was. http://www.agriland.ie/news/levy-collection-poll-confirms-perceived-clash-interest/

I think perceived is an important word there, I'm sorry but perception has nothing to do with fact

Base price

rangler1 wrote: »

I think perceived is an important word there, I'm sorry but perception has nothing to do with fact

Aaaa rangler is that the best you can come up with. I presume that Agriland use the verb "perceived" in their headline to exonerate them from any possible liable action!
I however wonder how many people responded to the survey. I presume that it is fairly representative of opinion on the ground.

paddysdream

rangler1 wrote: »

I think perceived is an important word there, I'm sorry but perception has nothing to do with fact

Perception may have nothing to do with fact but its quiet hard to expect support when there is "perceived" to be a clash of interest.

Perception can be very important.Wouldn't you agree that the Bord Bia image of Irish meat/dairy etc is a quiet important perception which in my opinion has very little basis in fact.

Still cannot understand why the IFA and the factories/grain merchants/creameries/marts etc cannot have an opt in rather than an opt out system.
This would ensure that those willing to pay the EIF(or whatever its called in its other guises) would pay and those that decide not to pay are allowed the common courtesy of not having to either contact the processor in question or continue to have the levy removed by stealth.
And before you quiet rightly point out that its clearly marked on all factory returns etc,answer me this.How many farmers were or are ,even now,aware that this is a voluntary deduction unlike say Sheep Ireland(which is voluntary for the factory but not the farmer supplier if the factory in question decide to support the scheme?

Anyways less of the IFA bashing (lets open an "How the IFA done me wrong" thread) and back to the beef.
Still after all the talk,no ideas,only people complaining.I believe thats its a bit of over supply,a bit of processors trying it on and a bit of poor market conditions for beef sales.
Only fault I have here is the old chestnut trotted out by farmers ie the"well it costs me x to produce y so therefore the market etc should return x plus margin or its all the ministers fault".
Believe that this is the wrong approach.
Coveney,whilst one of the poorest AG. ministers for a while,realistically really can do what ?
Don't forget that any intervention by him must pass muster with the EU as well as in Dublin.Never met a farmer yet who didn't believe some "conspiracy" bits in part or full.
How this one or that one has the famous inside track(looking at you IFA boys and your big SFP!!)
Or how this lad has great pull with this or that or how that lad has an inside line re. price falls or rises etc etc.Haven't we all heard about the "pull" this one or that one has and shur hasn't Paddy down the road a cousin who's brother in law's sister's husband works for a fella who drinks in the same pub as the ministers PA and didn't the barman tell him that****** ***** ********** *** etc etc
Load of sh**e really as men who go in to know it all seem to believe the wildest fairy stories going,the madder and more unlikely the better.
Been around a little bit and the sad truth of it is that,in general(with an odd interesting exception and those are not stories for a public forum I'm afraid) life is a lot duller,blander,honest and plain boring than people might think.

And its goodnight from me as straw beckons again tomorrow.1k big squares is rather boring when you look after a days drawing and stacking and see very little impression on the field!!!!

rangler1

Base price wrote: »

Aaaa rangler is that the best you can come up with. I presume that Agriland use the verb "perceived" in their headline to exonerate them from any possible liable action!
I however wonder how many people responded to the survey. I presume that it is fairly representative of opinion on the ground.

Those ''on the ground'' are very stupid to elect us if they don't trust us, and if they don't trust us, they know what to do........... I've told you that the county officers don't give a s...e where the funding comes from and yet you're so original, that's the best you can come up with.

Does it not occur to you that farmers are liabling us too with that statement, sad attitude, pathetic accusations where there's no proof, Is it any wonder that I got pissed off on beef price many years ago

rangler1

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

Was reading Farming Indo today, John Henry had a good article regarding grading well worth a read. It was with a little suprise when I was reading Joe Healy article the latest is that Factory's are now imposing bases depending on cattle breeds I hope he expand's on this. Finally in the Editorial Darragh McCullough has written an interesting article regarding present beef situtation

I've had farmers complaining that they're getting a lower quote for friesians alright.
seems to be no end to the crisis

Abfg

rangler1 wrote: »

I think perceived is an important word there, I'm sorry but perception has nothing to do with fact

Fairly grasping at staws now with a reply like that. Maybe give Larry a ring????

Nettleman

Agreed, theres an interesting thing called Independence, and IFA should be independent of processors and retailers and marts, independent of all vested interest (including own personal (SFP) interests, personal ambitions to run a feedlot), independent of all interests except the interest of Irish farmers. If independence is threatened or perceived to be threatened, then people loose confidence in it...I thought Eddie said he was gona look into the EIF as He already acknowledged it was problematic after he was elected...Has he looked into it now, and decided to keep stum????

rangler1

Nettleman wrote: »

Agreed, theres an interesting thing called Independence, and IFA should be independent of processors and retailers and marts, independent of all vested interest (including own personal (SFP) interests, personal ambitions to run a feedlot), independent of all interests except the interest of Irish farmers. If independence is threatened or perceived to be threatened, then people loose confidence in it...I thought Eddie said he was gona look into the EIF as He already acknowledged it was problematic after he was elected...Has he looked into it now, and decided to keep stum????

Well I left him in no doubt that to do anything with it would be admitting that this pub talk was true, The insinuations are a slur on every voluntary officer that works for IFA.......but then I'm only one, he can do as he likes.
It would be interesting for a county to send a resolution to that effect, I might be the only one, but then I mightn't

Abfg

Base price you are only banging your head off a brick wall the IFA dont give a **** about really solving the beef crisis they're Larry's boys, it wouldn't matter if the survey came back 100 percent you'd have clowns on here defending them!!!!
Spoke to a farmer yesterday that sold 11 cracking bullocks in Balla last week (550kg avg 1145) when he got the cheque and I qoute "those basta&ds had 44 euro deducted.
When I explained that he could have stopped this deduction by just telling the clerk in the office he got even more infuriated!
This shows that you are right in what you are saying farmers out there think they have no option with regards this levy that is being deducted. (Stolen)
I wonder is this legal under consumer rights/fair trade etc might be worth looking into????
I have no problem deducting the levy from members(any beef farmer in the west of Ireland that's a member deserves what he gets) but from non members some of whom despise what they are up to and what they stand for is disgracefull. It has to be a criminal act!!!!

freedominacup

Nettleman wrote: »

Agreed, theres an interesting thing called Independence, and IFA should be independent of processors and retailers and marts, independent of all vested interest (including own personal (SFP) interests, personal ambitions to run a feedlot), independent of all interests except the interest of Irish farmers. If independence is threatened or perceived to be threatened, then people loose confidence in it...I thought Eddie said he was gona look into the EIF as He already acknowledged it was problematic after he was elected...Has he looked into it now, and decided to keep stum????

Whatever about independence from processors, retailers etc if you believe exec members motives are questionable then farmers have only themselves to blame. I don't go to many co exec meetings but I went to one last week as it was being held locally and we had to fly the flag for our local branch. It's more or less the same faces for the past twenty years ,apart from the ones who have passed on, with the same pov and same agendas. Farmers elect/press gang officers, delegates etc no one else. The ifa is not some disconnected entity if you didn't vote for the people making decisions and policy some of your neighbours did so next time you're talking to a neighbour who is an ifa member tell him what sort of a bo11ox you think he is and ask him how he dares show his face in public considering all the harm he's doing to you and all other farmers. The stupid cnut going around paying subs and voting on things. I dunno what the world is coming to when fools like that can have a say. I mean jesus, right?

Nettleman

No slurs intended Rangler, but take example of judges pay contraversory , and attempts by Government to reduce it, the judges kicked up, saying that they were meant to be independent of State, as the constitution demands it, and if someone can, in theory, manipulate thier income, how can you be independent of them??? Hand that feeds and all that. Samiliar scenario between factories and IFA income stream, IMO, ,maybe fresh faces are whats needed, a Joan Bruton type changing of the old guard

rangler1

freedominacup wrote: »

Whatever about independence from processors, retailers etc if you believe exec members motives are questionable then farmers have only themselves to blame. I don't go to many co exec meetings but I went to one last week as it was being held locally and we had to fly the flag for our local branch. It's more or less the same faces for the past twenty years ,apart from the ones who have passed on, with the same pov and same agendas. Farmers elect/press gang officers, delegates etc no one else. The ifa is not some disconnected entity if you didn't vote for the people making decisions and policy some of your neighbours did so next time you're talking to a neighbour who is an ifa member tell him what sort of a bo11ox you think he is and ask him how he dares show his face in public considering all the harm he's doing to you and all other farmers. The stupid cnut going around paying subs and voting on things. I dunno what the world is coming to when fools like that can have a say. I mean jesus, right?

Agreed , I'm 62, I was winding down to take it easy, I didn't want the job.
Made it clear that I didn't want it but it was either myself or no one, so it was no honour, It's a pity farmers that don't want IFA don't do the honourable thing, but paying subs and abusing fellow farmers is pathetic/childish/whatever. Saw it in Castlerea, farmers getting off on the buzz of being cheered for having a go.
Being a sheep farmer, I didn't get involved but I should've

rangler1

Nettleman wrote: »

No slurs intended Rangler, but take example of judges pay contraversory , and attempts by Government to reduce it, the judges kicked up, saying that they were meant to be independent of State, as the constitution demands it, and if someone can, in theory, manipulate thier income, how can you be independent of them??? Hand that feeds and all that. Samiliar scenario between factories and IFA income stream, IMO, ,maybe fresh faces are whats needed, a Joan Bruton type changing of the old guard

No one wants the work, would be all for it, but a quarter of the the officers are up for election every year, it's nearly impossible to fill those positions, some take the positions and don't bother and the county execs aren't informed then on what's going on in that commodity...areal farce