Beef in Crisis

rangler1

Willfarman wrote: »

Are you not seeing that consumers are interpreting these protests as protests against them? I appreciate the effort now that guys like yourself are making in fairness and that is a positive development.

This isn't just Ireland, prices are not covering costs every where, would be great now if farmers started chaining up trolleys all over Europe,
Was delighted with the protest tonight, mostly ordinary farmers from Galway Roscommon, w.meath,.... bit disappointed at the national officers pushing into the photograph, especially after Damien O,reilly commenting on the back page of the journal about naas

Reggie.

Damo810 wrote: »

Customers don't give a rats arse about us though. We'll never be anything but greedy farmers. How many would even read fliers given out to them when they don't even care about where their food comes from.

+1

Willfarman

Damo810 wrote: »

Customers don't give a rats arse about us though. We'll never be anything but greedy farmers. How many would even read fliers given out to them when they don't even care about where their food comes from.

People like to feel good about their shopping. Branding and image are every bit as important as price. We need the consumer on our side if we are to have any chance.

rangler1

Damo810 wrote: »

If it works then fire away, I just think these isolated incidents are too minor to get real notice. Had all these 'hits' happened on the same day then they would have more impact, imv. Even if Lidl was closed for 3 hours, your talking about a loss of less than 2K profit, nothing for a chain like that.

You have to keep at it, I bet you their meat supplier has been told about it by now

Reggie.

Willfarman wrote: »

People like to feel good about their shopping. Branding and image are every bit as important as price. We need the consumer on our side if we are to have any chance.

That would be an uphill battle there

Username John

Willfarman wrote: »

People like to feel good about their shopping. Branding and image are every bit as important as price. We need the consumer on our side if we are to have any chance.

+1

I think a lot more could be done to put our point of view across a lot better.

Willfarman

Reggie. wrote: »

That would be an uphill battle there

It is the battle that will win the war. When the processors and retailer rob a beef farmer that has a domino effect for the entire rural community. This is a message that needs to be got across.

Farmer Pudsey

Damo810 wrote: »

Customers don't give a rats arse about us though. We'll never be anything but greedy farmers. How many would even read fliers given out to them when they don't even care about where their food comes from.

I would not totally agree lots of consumers and people have a deep respect for us. Remember that the majority of the population are only gone from land and rural Ireland in the last 40 years. Look at the after hours thread we got a fair bit of support there. You really had only a half dozen head the ball mouth pieces.

If you dropped Tesco take by even 20% in a weekend across the country they be p!ssing in themselves. Not only that the head office in the UK would be p!ssing in there pants as well.

A protest like that would really put fear in them as it could lead to a longterm drop in sales that might never recover. Consumers are a creature of habit they pick up a jar of this a tub of that. If they go elsewhere for a few weekend some will not return.

Miname

Damo810 wrote: »

Customers don't give a rats arse about us though. We'll never be anything but greedy farmers. How many would even read fliers given out to them when they don't even care about where their food comes from.

The thing is i think your wrong. people do care but may not show it.I have relations who are hauliers who have a serious despise towards tesco aswell. we need to get enough involved, people may be after the cheapest but they also want the easiest option in general. if enough people rolled in behind this rather than the negativity i believe we would stand a good chance. its not jusst the beef trade here its a constant battle seeing how capitalisation has gone maybe a step too far. big versus small in all regard from beef, poultry to nearly everything out there. this is where the ifa should step up and kill 2 birds with one stone. These protests should have invites worded appropriately so that the small man feels wanted and needed not just the in crowd. get everyone in every locality whether that be 2 members or 200 members to try a picket and at least it may sink through to a percentage of the population. people in general i think do want to do the right thing and if it makes even some see tesco or the likes in a bad light it may help.

rangler1

Damo810 wrote: »

If it works then fire away, I just think these isolated incidents are too minor to get real notice. Had all these 'hits' happened on the same day then they would have more impact, imv. Even if Lidl was closed for 3 hours, your talking about a loss of less than 2K profit, nothing for a chain like that.

If we can get the members help now, this campaign will be ratcheted up, Henry said tonight that they're looking for new ideas.
Locking the trolleys will be ongoing, so we'll be
''coming to a town near you'

Muckit

rangler1 wrote: »

Factories hate us annoying their customers, lidls supplier isn't far from ballinasloe

Why was lidl selected and not Tesco? Not having a go, just curious

rangler1

Muckit wrote: »

Why was lidl selected and not Tesco? Not having a go, just curious

We're trying to upset every factory, so we're spreading it around.
They might have saved themselves, by looking for a meeting.
I saw Tesco there beside us, a lot of the customers probably went up there

Damo810

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

I would not totally agree lots of consumers and people have a deep respect for us. Remember that the majority of the population are only gone from land and rural Ireland in the last 40 years. Look at the after hours thread we got a fair bit of support there. You really had only a half dozen head the ball mouth pieces.

If you dropped Tesco take by even 20% in a weekend across the country they be p!ssing in themselves. Not only that the head office in the UK would be p!ssing in there pants as well.

A protest like that would really put fear in them as it could lead to a longterm drop in sales that might never recover. Consumers are a creature of habit they pick up a jar of this a tub of that. If they go elsewhere for a few weekend some will not return.

They had some respect when all the supermarkets were selling veg and fruit at 6c a piece. I never seen them move as much stuff. How respectful of them. Theres a huge amount of people that will shop around to save 20c on a carton of milk nowadays Puds, sad, but thats the way it is, they're not tight, the moneys just not there. They're the same people who, while they may have respect for us, won't shoulder taking the extra cost on.


They might respect us, but I can't see them siding with us if it means an increase in price for them or a disruption for them in their daily lives. Getting 20% of Tesco's shoppers out of there is unrealistic, imv and a drop in price would soon alleviate any boy cotters.

The mention that consumers are a creature of habbit, well, why on earth would they change because a few farmers told them too? We're not always viewed in a great light Puds..


After hours thread, while I have mentioned it a few times is hardly represents a fair view of the Irish people either. Not only that, but who in their right mind would want to keep up with a thread where there was always about 10 farmers there to shout them down anyways (which of course they were right to do so, and I was in it too.)

Muckit

A Thursday evening. Was there even 5 cars in that car park when ye rolled in? The first l heard about it was on the 9 oclock news and l living and working in the town.

A friday or a Saturday are the main big shopping days and the ones to cause maximum diruption Or what were ye trying to achieve?

And I think Tesco should be the main target.

TUBBY

rangler1 wrote: »

We're trying to upset every factory, so we're spreading it around.
They might have saved themselves, by looking for a meeting.
I saw Tesco there beside us, a lot of the customers probably went up there

Ranger, out of interestate, what factories supply what chains

E.g tesco = kepak or Abp or who....

Username John

Damo810 wrote: »

They had some respect when all the supermarkets were selling veg and fruit at 6c a piece. I never seen them move as much stuff. How respectful of them. Theres a huge amount of people that will shop around to save 20c on a carton of milk nowadays Puds, sad, but thats the way it is, they're not tight, the moneys just not there. They're the same people who, while they may have respect for us, won't shoulder taking the extra cost on.


They might respect us, but I can't see them siding with us if it means an increase in price for them or a disruption for them in their daily lives. Getting 20% of Tesco's shoppers out of there is unrealistic, imv and a drop in price would soon alleviate any boy cotters.

The mention that consumers are a creature of habbit, well, why on earth would they change because a few farmers told them too? We're not always viewed in a great light Puds..


After hours thread, while I have mentioned it a few times is hardly represents a fair view of the Irish people either. Not only that, but who in their right mind would want to keep up with a thread where there was always about 10 farmers there to shout them down anyways (which of course they were right to do so, and I was in it too.)

I dunno damo, you seem to be totally against the idea that the consumer, who eventually buys the product you produce has any other movtivating factor other than price.
If this is the case, then how come every butcher in Ireland hasn't closed (I know a lot have, but there are still a few about)

People may not see things the same way, until you provide that extra point of view. Do you expect all people to know the breakdown of what the farmers gets, vs what the other parties in the chain get?

Outside of food purchases, does price govern every purchasing decision you make?

rangler1

Muckit wrote: »

A Thursday evening. Was there even 5 cars in that car park when ye rolled in? The first l heard about it was on the 9 oclock news and l living and working in the town.

A friday or a Saturday are the main big shopping days and the ones to cause maximum diruption Or what were ye trying to achieve?

And I think Tesco should be the main target.

We're doing it to get every factory, not just the one that supplies Tesco, that's the plan any way,
It was the farmers of Galway looked for the protest, and it was asked for at the national exec on Tuesday and here you are ridiculing it. I could ask you what are you trying to achieve.
I had to try and pull out some support from W,Meath and there's another one tomorrow.
If you're not supporting Galway farmers, you're against them I suppose. who do you work for in Ballinasloe. hope not mart or agrimerchant
You thought you were going to berate IFA

rangler1

TUBBY wrote: »

Ranger, out of interestate, what factories supply what chains

E.g tesco = kepak or Abp or who....

I wouldn't know, but they said the meat didn't come too far today,

Muckit

I seem to have got your back up. It's nothing personal lad. Just at nothing imo with that 'protest.' Thank God the tv camera was there or l or the rest of bsloe would never have known about it.

Were ye afraid Tesco would call the guards?

This thing of 'spreading it around' .... l don't get it. If you are to have any impact you have to punch hard and play dirty. Let one of them have it and make an example.

It's only tokenism 'protesting' if it has no impact.

Limofarmer

If the details of the protests was more widely available I bet there would be a much larger turn out of support . Dare I say it but even non ifa members would stand together to create some real strength in numbers .....

rangler1

Muckit wrote: »

I seem to have got your back up. It's nothing personal lad. Just at nothing imo with that 'protest.' Thank God the tv camera was there or l or the rest of bsloe would never have known about it.

Were ye afraid Tesco would call the guards?

This thing of 'spreading it around' .... l don't get it. If you are to have any impact you have to punch hard and play dirty. Let one of them have it and make an example.

It's only tokenism 'protesting' if it has no impact.

We only want the factories to know about it.
Surely the people doing the work should decide how to run it, Can't get my head around people who do nothing telling us what to do, we have one opinion of punch hard and play dirty and another of have to think of the public. You can see how taking opinions from the internet doesn't work,
Real farmers make the decisions on protests, we drive them on, nothing would ever be done if that wasn't the way.
On the guards , we have no problem with the guards but its important to get in before them,

I said

rangler1 wrote: »

We only want the factories to know about it.
Surely the people doing the work should decide how to run it, Can't get my head around people who do nothing telling us what to do, we have one opinion of punch hard and play dirty and another of have to think of the public. You can see how taking opinions from the internet doesn't work,
Real farmers make the decisions on protests, we drive them on, nothing would ever be done if that wasn't the way.

I think it's right to raise the question about beef at the moment to the public.tesco and their clever ad campaign to joe public give the impression that they care about them so they provide the consumer with low prices on products.The reality is to do this someone gets screwed that's the bit they forget to mention in their lovely feel good ads namely it's the beef farmer in this case.

rangler1

Limofarmer wrote: »

If the details of the protests was more widely available I bet there would be a much larger turn out of support . Dare I say it but even non ifa members would stand together to create some real strength in numbers .....

Hard to do without tipping off the guards, its only a picket if we can't get the trollieys

whelan2

I said wrote: »

I think it's right to raise the question about beef at the moment to the public.tesco and their clever ad campaign to joe public give the impression that they care about them so they provide the consumer with low prices on products.The reality is to do this someone gets screwed that's the bit they forget to mention in their lovely feel good ads namely it's the beef farmer in this case.

I did a little poll today on a mamsy site i am on , this is a nationwide site-as in there are posters from all over Ireland.
Q. Where do you do your main shopping each week?
Tesco 16%
Dunnes 6%
Lidl 14%
Aldi 47%
Super Valu 16%
M&S 0%
Centra 0%
Spar 0%
Other 1%
77 people voted, most commented that tesco is too expensive , Dunnes stores figure really surprised me.

Reggie.

whelan2 wrote: »

I did a little poll today on a mamsy site i am on , this is a nationwide site-as in there are posters from all over Ireland.
Q. Where do you do your main shopping each week?
Tesco 16%
Dunnes 6%
Lidl 14%
Aldi 47%
Super Valu 16%
M&S 0%
Centra 0%
Spar 0%
Other 1%
77 people voted, most commented that tesco is too expensive , Dunnes stores figure really surprised me.

Good info there whelan. Good idea

I said

whelan2 wrote: »

I did a little poll today on a mamsy site i am on , this is a nationwide site-as in there are posters from all over Ireland.
Q. Where do you do your main shopping each week?
Tesco 16%
Dunnes 6%
Lidl 14%
Aldi 47%
Super Valu 16%
M&S 0%
Centra 0%
Spar 0%
Other 1%
77 people voted, most commented that tesco is too expensive , Dunnes stores figure really surprised me.

Not surprised at the aldi figure.

Reggie.

I said wrote: »

Not surprised at the aldi figure.

Not from the car parks in westmeath anyways

Damo810

I said wrote: »

Not surprised at the aldi figure.

They won't be happy tonight anyways. Aldi in Mitchelstown was protested.

whelan2

Damo810 wrote: »

They won't be happy tonight anyways. Aldi in Mitchelstown was protested.

that is totally laughable, the one supermarket who continuously advertises and promotes irish beef , thats a total joke

rangler1

Damo810 wrote: »

They won't be happy tonight anyways. Aldi in Mitchelstown was protested.

I'd say they got a crowd there, cork always supports Dublin protests well

rangler1

whelan2 wrote: »

that is totally laughable, the one supermarket who continuously advertises and promotes irish beef , thats a total joke

No point selling it if it doesn't give an income to the producer,
4litres milk in England is a ridiculously low price, is that any good to dairy farmer just cos they're selling lots of it

whelan2

rangler1 wrote: »

No point selling it if it doesn't give an income to the producer,

so turn the people away who do buy it , fantastic logic there

rangler1

whelan2 wrote: »

so turn the people away who do buy it , fantastic logic there

when your milk is being ripped off next year you'll see the logic

Damo810

Username John wrote: »

I dunno damo, you seem to be totally against the idea that the consumer, who eventually buys the product you produce has any other movtivating factor other than price.
If this is the case, then how come every butcher in Ireland hasn't closed (I know a lot have, but there are still a few about)

People may not see things the same way, until you provide that extra point of view. Do you expect all people to know the breakdown of what the farmers gets, vs what the other parties in the chain get?

Outside of food purchases, does price govern every purchasing decision you make?

Price isn't the only factor, but it is a massive massive one, look at Whelan's figures, Aldi having nearly a 50% stake, I wonder why? Most people would say they offer good value. If you ask every shopper to move away from Tesco and the likes they have enough power to drop prices over a set period which will only backfire on us.

Now, I agree, people need information, and theres a lack of it out there, one thing I noticed from todays protest pictures was it looked like a great show for the papers with Downey locking up the shopping trollies, but no information on show. A few placards in behind him and a few Cork Ifa flags, thats not much use either. Maybe there was more information on show there, I only saw one picture, maybe Rangler can add more information...

But I'm behind the Ifa's approach here, all too often it would seem they can do no good on here but no other solutions are put forward. Information alone won't change the tide, imv, a more drastic approach is needed and this is a start.


A bigger effort from our friends at the farmers journal wouldn't go amiss either if they showed actual profits from the nations beef herds for everyone to see.

whelan2

rangler1 wrote: »

when your milk is being ripped off next year you'll see the logic

Supermarket is not the place to protest.

rangler1

whelan2 wrote: »

Supermarket is not the place to protest.

Get used to it, this is going to ratchet up

whelan2

rangler1 wrote: »

No point selling it if it doesn't give an income to the producer,
4litres milk in England is a ridiculously low price, is that any good to dairy farmer just cos they're selling lots of it

i am now bowing out of this thread . I think hassling people - housewives/shoppers - is not the way to go

Damo810

whelan2 wrote: »

so turn the people away who do buy it , fantastic logic there

You make it sound like they're our best friends. At the end of the day, they're promoting Irish beef so they can sell as much of it as possible maximising their profits, not ours. They'd screw us for every penny given the chance. I don't see them complaining about factories giving us pittance for our produce.

whelan2

last comment . mf240 had a brilliant idea here last week, to have free beef outside supermarkets, get talking to the customer, let them taste it and tell them what the story is . This would work very well rather than "hard man" antics

rangler1

whelan2 wrote: »

last comment . mf240 had a brilliant idea here last week, to have free beef outside supermarkets, get talking to the customer, let them taste it and tell them what the story is . This would work very well rather than "hard man" antics

There's enough beef farmers in the country to do that if they want to, they're certainly not all protesting

TITANIUM.

whelan2 wrote: »

last comment . mf240 had a brilliant idea here last week, to have free beef outside supermarkets, get talking to the customer, let them taste it and tell them what the story is . This would work very well rather than "hard man" antics

There's a place for both methods I think whelan. I'd love to see more stores around the country blockaded for the day.
And farmers handing out some quality produce to the locals attempting to enter and informing them of our plight can't hurt our cause.

There needs to be some shock tactics involved here. It's all well and good holding up placards but we need twenty foot high signs quickly detailing the profits that each part of the chain get at present.

Up the profile by getting some big names in to support us, even politicians, if there's a big enough crowd they'll be there. Celeb chef's cooking our beef outside stores and feed disappointed shoppers. The likes of Richard Corrigan has been an out spoken supporter of the irish farmer.

Glad to here things are ratcheting up Rangler. And not before time.

Whelan we need the support of all farmers. Were far stronger together. It might be Dairy men and women at some stage (I hope not) and when you livelihood is threatened you might think twice about hassling people going about there daily lives oblivious to the suffering of there countrymen.

I said

Lidl I think doing €3 for 600gs stewing beef and 600gs of mince loss leaders me thinks

Farmer Pudsey

whelan2 wrote: »

I did a little poll today on a mamsy site i am on , this is a nationwide site-as in there are posters from all over Ireland.
Q. Where do you do your main shopping each week?
Tesco 16%
Dunnes 6%
Lidl 14%
Aldi 47%
Super Valu 16%
M&S 0%
Centra 0%
Spar 0%
Other 1%
77 people voted, most commented that tesco is too expensive , Dunnes stores figure really surprised me.

You surveyed middle income shoppers in general. Why do I say that, I know that it was a random sample. However I have picked up a few bits and pieces in them all. Aldi is where the action is there value and product is superb. Dunnes has lost the plot what is keeping them in business is there store positioning and brand. Lidl is stupid mans Aldi. Supervalu has rural shops and if you have a few bob has really targeted people that work with branded products and there oven ready fresh products are quite good.

Finally I get to Tesco it is getting to be stupid rich mans Aldi. It is depending on there own brand as in there name Tesco, to fool shoppers to buy there own branded products. Centra etc are impulse shops and if you are short of milk, or need a cup of tAE on the road

tanko

In Cavan town today Dunnes and Aldi were jammed as usual and tesco was quiet as usual. Supervalu and lidl would be doing ok.

Sam Kade

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

You surveyed middle income shoppers in general. Why do I say that, I know that it was a random sample. However I have picked up a few bits and pieces in them all. Aldi is where the action is there value and product is superb. Dunnes has lost the plot what is keeping them in business is there store positioning and brand. Lidl is stupid mans Aldi. Supervalu has rural shops and if you have a few bob has really targeted people that work with branded products and there oven ready fresh products are quite good.

Finally I get to Tesco it is getting to be stupid rich mans Aldi. It is depending on there own brand as in there name Tesco, to fool shoppers to buy there own branded products. Centra etc are impulse shops and if you are short of milk, or need a cup of tAE on the road

Aldi is great except don't buy veg there it goes off very quickly.

I know of aldi snobs they wouldn't be seen dead in there in case someone might think they were broke :rolleyes:

Sam Kade

tanko wrote: »

In Cavan town today Dunnes and Aldi were jammed as usual and tesco was quiet as usual. Supervalu and lidl would be doing ok.

Dunnes have a great offer this week and next buy €60 get €15 back with voucher and buy €40 get €8 back with voucher

whelan2

Sam Kade wrote: »

Dunnes have a great offer this week and next buy €60 get €15 back with voucher and buy €40 get €8 back with voucher

atm i have vouchers for super valu-10 euro off if you spend 60, have a book of vouchers for dunnes best of which is 25 euro off if you spend 100. aldi 10 euro off if you spend 60 and some crappy ones for tesco. Latest results on poll are 133 people voted
Tesco 16%
Dunnes 14%
Lidl 11%
Aldi 42%
Super Valu 15%
Marks and Spencers 1%
other 2%

I said

Tesco will take all vouchers from the other shops they are even advertising that on the radio

Cavanjack

Any protests planned for McDonald's?

_Brian

tanko wrote: »

In Cavan town today Dunnes and Aldi were jammed as usual and tesco was quiet as usual. Supervalu and lidl would be doing ok.

The only problem in Cavan is you'd need a helicopter to get into Tesco to do your shopping.

But I agree. Our local Tesco in Bailieborough seems a white elephant it's so quiet.