Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014 - Mod Note in OP, 1/09

OwaynOTT

Mignolet
Manquillo Skrtel Lovern Moreno
Lucas Henderson Lallana
sterling Borin Balotelli

That's what I would like to see at the weekend.

The much maligned Borini hasn't really done it for us and at this stage I doubt he will ever come good but he can still offer movement, energy and is very decent in fast interplay which is where the team hurt everyone last year and it's missing this year. I also think he can help Mario out.

Lallana I like and he looks better and better. Very good on the ball and is playing better than Couthinho this season.

Gerrard needs to be 'rested'. Lucas isn't ideal but it should at least be tried. Lucas might give away stupid frees but Gerrad isn't even getting close enough to do that.

Skrtel and Lovern are the best CB pairing now that Sakho is injured and in fairness they didn't give away too much last night or against Everton. The team in front of them just can't score at the moment.

Last year the defence was a shambles at times but it's actually better this year in the few opening games. Not giving away as much shots on goal and not conceding as many. The problem is the team isn't scoring and more worrying is that, woodwork isn't playing a part.
They just aren't creating chances.
Mario on his own is making enough runs but to add to that, there isn't enough movement do ing from behind him either.
Henderson has to sit deeper to provide cover and help.
Markovic doesn't stay wide enough and when he cuts in, he isn't being founds whether he is hiding or his teammates have no faith in him, I don't know. He was better last night.
Lallana can get beyond the strikers and offer that little bit of closing down.
Borini has movement, and it will create space for the others to exploit and who knows maybe Borini might even score an odd goal or two.
Sterling needs to be relieved of the onus to provide that bit of magic.

Allen and Can can't come back quick enough. Big mistake not signing another midfielder in the summer that offers some discipline, steel and aggression.
The team is missing aggression, the desire to bust a lung and throw their body in the line. To get the crowd going and lift theirs teammates.

I hate to say this but I think the game at the weekend is a must win. A loss and the pressure will really mount.

Gerrard won't be dropped.

If fit he'll play every game this season. Possibly next season too.

benny79

I agree Gerrard should be dropped cause he's not playing well as should any player!(but will never happen cause he's stevie G!) but he's not to blame at the end of the day buck stops with manager! we can't defend set pieces which should be a given in the standard they place at! ie PL, and we bought too many players just like spurs last season and what I feared would happen.
We had a poor defense last season which cost us the league IMO, and this season its worse to me that's unacceptable!

It should be Quality over Quantity..

BenEadir

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Is it Gerrard's fault that the team as a collective seems to have forgotten how to press effectively?

Partly. He's the captain and sets the tone. If he's not pressing it sets the standard for others.

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Is it Gerrard's fault that the team as a collective seems unable to defend set pieces confidently and competently?

No, that's down to poor defensive coaching, BR's big weakness. He needs to get someone in who knows how to organise a defence, Steve Clarke has been mentioned.

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Is it all Gerrard's fault that the back four and goalkeeper seem to be lacking cohesiveness and positional awareness?

See comment above, same issue.

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Is it Gerrard's fault that we look utterly limp going forward in the absence of Suarez and Sturridge?

No but his lack of tempo is contributing to that problem.

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Is it Gerrard's fault that we look mentally deflated at present?

Partly because the rest of the team are having to cover for his lack of movement and I'd say they are all getting pissed off with it but no one can say anything because of who he is.

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Is it Gerrard's fault that we had a supposedly important center back of the future storm out of Anfield on derby day?

No but what's that got to do with anything?

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Is it Gerrard's fault that the club spent ~£20 on Lazar Markovic leaving us short on necessary quality in his own position?

No and I don't think anyone suggested it is.

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Finally, is it Gerrard's fault he keeps getting selected whether he looks in form / out of form / tired / tactically unable?

Yes, partially. He's captain of the club and is experienced enough to know that dropping him is a difficult thing for BR to do. What a gesture it would be if Stevie dropped a few comments that he was feeling a bit leggy after playing every game last season and the World Cup etc. That would open the door for BR to rotate him. I firmly believe we can get another year or two out of Stevie if he only plays home CL and PL games and very few away games. At Anfield, in general, teams will give us a lot more space and time on the ball which will enable Stevie to continue to be effective but away from home, in general, it's a very different story and he doesn't have the legs any more.

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

There is an elephant in the room alright on the basis of the last few months, and Gerrard it ain't.

Your love for the man is admirable but ultimately blinding your objectivity.

Harry Palmr

The love in between Rodgers and Gerrard is going to be the formers downfall if it continues, the latters position I understand (except on the pitch!) as he is desperate to eke out yet another year and another contract extension. Why Rodgers wants to keep him playing is far less explicable. The manager is being taken for a ride.

murpho999

I don't get the Gerrard bashing (That has been going on for a number of years now).

He's our best person to deliver crosses from set pieces, best free kick and penalty taker and I feel he's adapted to his more defensive role quite well.

There's a lot more wrong with this team than Gerrard and I don't know why people keep harping on about it.

Team confidence is shot and morale is low.

In a way, I'm fascinated by it as it's a true test for Rodgers and at the end of this we will know what sort of manager we have.

SlickRic

Gerrard is no different to what he was last year, and you're fooling yourself if you think differently.

last season the coaching staff and player obviously identified a role for him, and a system where we could get the best out of his major attributes. that role has remained the same. he is still the "quarterback", and he's playing the role pretty similarly to last season.

the difference is we don't have the forward play of Sturridge and Suarez, every goal we concede this season takes on greater significance than last season as a result, and you're getting the performances and results you're seeing now.

Neville put it decently last night. we don't have an identity right now. last year we were a pressing, counter-attacking machine. we're neither of those things this season yet, and we're not a possession team either.

it's a mess.

taking Gerrard out will solve nothing. more intensity, Henderson further up the pitch more often, Sturridge back, and an ability to defend balls into the box, and you'll be getting somewhere.

Tipsy McSwagger

If its true Coutinho refused to shake Rodgers hand last night I wouldn't blame him one bit. He gets subbed in every game he plays after an hour or so while certain other players who are playing shyte are untouchable.

Harry Palmr

murpho999 wrote: »

I don't get the Gerrard bashing (That has been going on for a number of years now).

He's our best person to deliver crosses from set pieces, best free kick and penalty taker and I feel he's adapted to his more defensive role quite well.

There's a lot more wrong with this team than Gerrard and I don't know why people keep harping on about it.

Team confidence is shot and morale is low.

In a way, I'm fascinated by it as it's a true test for Rodgers and at the end of this we will know what sort of manager we have.

It not so much Gerrard bashing as Rodgers being in thrall to one player who is visibly ageing and slowing who has a critical role within the side. If anyone else in the middle was so ineffective, more people would be asking questions but as its Gerrard and he can still take a dead ball (though they were rubbish last night) and spray the odd pass he gets a free pass.

Yes Rodgers is coming up well short right now and the weakness in that midfield position is a large contributory factor. Imagine having a good player for that role there rather than what we have.

SlickRic

BenEadir wrote: »

Partly. He's the captain and sets the tone. If he's not pressing it sets the standard for others.

this is part of people's misunderstanding of Gerrard's role.

his role is not to set the tone in terms of pressing. rightly or wrongly, his role is to be our playmaker in front of the back 4. he's not there to press. he's there to sweep and start attacks.

also, making him press relentlessly would be highlighting one of his current weaknesses - his mobility.

if you're expecting Gerrard to press like Henderson, you're going to be disappointed for a long time.

Charlie19

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

If its true Coutinho refused to shake Rodgers hand last night I wouldn't blame him one bit. He gets subbed in every game he plays after an hour or so while certain other players who are playing shyte are untouchable.

He didn't shake hands but its not like he left Rodgers hanging, like a lot of players last night, Couthinio was poor and rightly subbed.

Harry Palmr

SlickRic wrote: »

taking Gerrard out will solve nothing. more intensity, Henderson further up the pitch more often, Sturridge back, and an ability to defend balls into the box, and you'll be getting somewhere.

Why do think Hendo is stuck where he is? To protect Gerrard, what a waste!
Get Gerrard off the pitch, except that won't happen will it? Last night without any prompting Rodgers was singing his praises.

NEDDURC

Anyone who thinks Gerrard is playing well is just being ridiculous now.

He's making a number of obvious mistakes in every game now that are leading to clear chances for the opposition.

His free and corner taking was poor last night.

His work rate is terrible. Keep your eye on him when he doesn't have the ball. He's walking back and letting attackers run by him in defence.

Watch the first 10 minutes of last night. He came looking for the ball off the centre backs like he's supposed to but every time just played it back to them!! Then he just stopped coming looking for it after that.

In summary, he is not controlling the play and he's poor defensively. I'd like to see Allen / Lucas / Can given a chance in there soon and rest him. Not likely to happen but badly needed.

If people think our main problem is the sweeper role then they have an agenda.

Our whole defensive issue is the problem and has been since Rodgers took over.

He was blessed with incredible goalscorers last season and it somewhat masked the mess in defence.

This season if left as is will see us concededing another 50 or so goals whilst scoring substantially less.

Failure to address the defensive unit as a whole will ultimately see Rodgers getting the sack

Gbear

Sir Gallagher wrote: »

and Can, which was one of the more baffling purchases of the summer.

A very highly rated and extremely versatile young midfielder is a baffling signing?

daithijjj wrote: »

People who think Gerrard is the issue need to ask other questions imo.

If the club had purchased players that could start over Gerrard in the last 2 years we wouldnt have to play Gerrard as much. We seem to have an obsession with buying mids that dont operate in the defensive side of the game. People will say we can play others there but they arent any good at it either.

Players needed to be brought in that both removed some responsibility from Gerrard and that would or should have been coupled with the older player being phased out. Neither has happened. We HAVE to play Gerrard and thats an indictment on recruitment policy.

We saw with Sahin that the club wasn't willing to bring players in to compete for Gerrard's spot (what an absolute godsend he'd be to this team).
That's the clubs fault, even if Gerrard put pressure on them to do it.

Maybe Gerrard simply has too much power and clout at the club and now there's not much we can do to stop that without causing a giant ****storm.

It's possibly a bit unfair to criticise the club for not showing any balls in this matter, but that's certainly what it looks like from the outside.

Phasing out Gerrard was always going to be the club and Brendan Rodgers' biggest task from last season onwards. So far they're failing in that task. Badly.
It's not like having a winger or a left back who aren't quite up to snuff. It's a large component of the spine of the team and it's massively influential in the way we play.

rarnes1 wrote: »

If people think our main problem is the sweeper role then they have an agenda.

Our whole defensive issue is the problem and has been since Rodgers took over.

He was blessed with incredible goalscorers last season and it somewhat masked the mess in defence.

But part of what that attack (and it wasn't just 2 players playing well, but 5) masked was Gerrard.

When a team loses the ball in midfield, can't press properly, leaves huge gaps all over the shop, those are all defensive problems that have nothing to do with the back 5.

Nerdlingr

murpho999 wrote: »

He's our best person to deliver crosses from set pieces

His set piece delivery has been shocking this season. And again last night was no better. Coutinho had to take over from him after about the third free kick he over/under hit.

Markovic shouldnt be in the starting 11 for a game like that - dont know why lallana wasnt playing. Put out your best 11, win the game and then makes changes if you want. Markovic has done nothing to warrant a place in the team.

The whole team was very poor last night. Nobody was grabbing hold of the game and driving us on. Basel were very ordinary and were there for the taking. Its one step forwards two steps back at the moment.

I said it last year but if a manager can't make big decisions like dropping ANY player then what the hell are they managing?

Wouldn't bother most top managers in the world.

Harry Palmr

rarnes1 wrote: »

If people think our main problem is the sweeper role then they have an agenda.

Our whole defensive issue is the problem and has been since Rodgers took over.

He was blessed with incredible goalscorers last season and it somewhat masked the mess in defence.

This season if left as is will see us concededing another 50 or so goals whilst scoring substantially less.

Failure to address the defensive unit as a whole will ultimately see Rodgers getting the sack

The guy at the base of the midfield is part of the defence as is everyone ahead of him! That is a general failing this season as you or someone mentioned above - lack of pressing high up. The lack of pressing in the centre is down to the player who occupies the centre and that player every week is Gerrard who is just not up to it, he cannot cover the miles required to be effective.

Gbear wrote: »

A very highly rated and extremely versatile young midfielder is a baffling signing?

We saw with Sahin that the club wasn't willing to bring players in to compete for Gerrard's spot (what an absolute godsend he'd be to this team).
That's the clubs fault, even if Gerrard put pressure on them to do it.

Maybe Gerrard simply has too much power and clout at the club and now there's not much we can do to stop that without causing a giant ****storm.

It's possibly a bit unfair to criticise the club for not showing any balls in this matter, but that's certainly what it looks like from the outside.

Phasing out Gerrard was always going to be the club and Brendan Rodgers' biggest task from last season onwards. So far they're failing in that task. Badly.

It's not like having a winger or a left back who aren't quite up to snuff. It's a large component of the spine of the team and it's massively influential in the way we play.

But part of what that attack (and it wasn't just 2 players playing well, but 5) masked was Gerrard.

When a team loses the ball in midfield, can't press properly, leaves huge gaps all over the shop, those are all defensive problems that have nothing to do with the back 5.

If the manager is scared of making a big decision he might as well leave. Either he is scared of making the change or he really doesn't think one needs making - either way its not good news.

NukaCola

Its fairly obvious we have a problem in defence. How it hasn't been addressed is worrying not because we wont be able to outscore everyone like last season, but because it was left this long without being properly addressed.

SG deep lying role isn't really a traditional DM role. He hasn't the mobility to cover that ground anyway. We dont really play with a DM and maybe that should have been addressed.

If people can remember when BR first took over, Joe Allen was played as a DM and done very well there. Many people may disagree but I think the role SG is in as a bit of a luxury to fit him in. Teams boss the middle against us too easy.

A formation change and few role changes need to be made and hopefully BR does this sooner rather than later.

Alonso77

NEDDURC wrote: »

Anyone who thinks Gerrard is playing well is just being ridiculous now.

He's making a number of obvious mistakes in every game now that are leading to clear chances for the opposition.

His free and corner taking was poor last night.

His work rate is terrible. Keep your eye on him when he doesn't have the ball. He's walking back and letting attackers run by him in defence.

Watch the first 10 minutes of last night. He came looking for the ball off the centre backs like he's supposed to but every time just played it back to them!! Then he just stopped coming looking for it after that.

In summary, he is not controlling the play and he's poor defensively. I'd like to see Allen / Lucas / Can given a chance in there soon and rest him. Not likely to happen but badly needed.

This has become really glaring in recent games and its painful to see. Gerrard never had the discipline to be a defensive midfielder even in his prime so I cant understand how he is expected to have suddenly developed a mastery of this position in his twilight years. This coupled with the fact his legs have gone only reinforces how unsuitable he is for the role.

Nerdlingr

NEDDURC wrote: »

Watch the first 10 minutes of last night. He came looking for the ball off the centre backs like he's supposed to but every time just played it back to them!! Then he just stopped coming looking for it after that.

I've said this a good few times in here before but thats the centre backs fault. They're playing the ball to gerrard whilst he facing his own goal and with a man on his back. The only way he can go is back to where the ball came from in that circumstance.
Skrtel and Henderson had their own little game in the first half as well where skrtel wouldnt take responsibility with the ball at his feet. "You have it, no you have it, no no you have it".
For all of Sakho's defensively frailiities he will at least some times try to bypass the easy option to a marked gerrard and will try and pass a ball through midfield.

I don't buy that Gerrard has more power than the manager.

Tinfoil hat stuff

klose

Sir Gallagher wrote: »

The thing is, if Gerrard is dropped who plays? Lucas? He'd be no better. Our CM is a shambles at the moment. Not counting Henderson who i'd class as a more attacking mid we have

Gerrard: 34
Allen: sicknote
Lucas: not good enough

and Can, which was one of the more baffling purchases of the summer.

Lucas and Allen need to be sold imo, Lucas in Jan and maybe Allen next summer. The hunt for a couple of serious CM's should start now.

Im a big fan of Rodgers, but i think his naivety has him in trouble here. If he makes it through this patch hopefully he will have learned a thing or two, it could be good experience for the man, after all he's still a young manager I believe that he has the mentality to get us through this.

Eh...why?
Came off the back of a good season with leverkusen, hightly rated and young which fits fsgs policy thus far by and large. He also plays a number of positions aswell as being a bit of a unit, something weve missed in a midfielder in ages. Was personally looking forward to seeing him play but has been unlucky with injuries, id like to see a midfield of can-allen-henderson eventually myself.

NEDDURC

Nerdlingr wrote: »

I've said this a good few times in here before but thats the centre backs fault. They're playing the ball to gerrard whilst he facing his own goal and with a man on his back. The only way he can go is back to where the ball came from in that circumstance.
Skrtel and Henderson had their own little game in the first half as well where skrtel wouldnt take responsibility with the ball at his feet. "You have it, no you have it, no no you have it".
For all of Sakho's defensively frailiities he will at least some times try to bypass the easy option to a marked gerrard and will try and pass a ball through midfield.

Don't agree, centre backs shouldn't be taking big risks. Gerrard as most people point out is now our quarterback. He should come looking for the ball, turn with it and get play moving forward.

Gerrard is good when he has the ball facing forward but dropping deep facing our own goal he is terrible. Very rarely does he turn on the ball ala Scholes / Pirlo. Johnny Giles has said it a long time ago, Gerrard is not a playmaker in the way Scholes was. He can do amazing things at times but doesn't know how to control the flow of the play.

We either need a real playermaker in that position (maybe Joe Allen can have a go at it) or we need a proper defensive mid in there (like a Makellele type player). Gerrard is neither and it is being shown up this year quite badly.

rob316

NukaCola wrote: »

Its fairly obvious we have a problem in defence. How it hasn't been addressed is worrying not because we wont be able to outscore everyone like last season, but because it was left this long without being properly addressed.

SG deep lying role isn't really a traditional DM role. He hasn't the mobility to cover that ground anyway. We dont really play with a DM and maybe that should have been addressed.

If people can remember when BR first took over, Joe Allen was played as a DM and done very well there. Many people may disagree but I think the role SG is in as a bit of a luxury to fit him in. Teams boss the middle against us too easy.

A formation change and few role changes need to be made and hopefully BR does this sooner rather than later.

This is the crux of the problem, the side is suffering to accommodate him in a formation that doesn't work. Our defence is dodge and we have Gerrard playing DM when he really can't.

As someone said everything from the centre backs seems to go through gerrard which slows the whole side down.

IMO you can only play Gerrard in this role if you play 2 of Henderson/Allen/Can ahead of him in the midfield diamond but then where does that leave Lallana, as Sterling has to start. Lallana should be starting he has shown the most so far in a broken team.

When Gerrard's long balls and set pieces aren't coming off he offers nothing and is just a passenger.

When Allen/Can are fit he has to seriously look at limiting his game time, or I'm afraid this will be the downfall of Rodgers.

Sturridge might come back, score goals and win games and it will look rosey again but the fact will remain, that sadly Steven Gerrard is utterly past it.

BenEadir

SlickRic wrote: »

his role is not to set the tone in terms of pressing. rightly or wrongly, his role is to be our playmaker in front of the back 4. he's not there to press. he's there to sweep and start attacks.

If someone in the DM role doesn't press he might as well hold the door open for the opposition to come storming through our defence. Are you seriously suggesting Stevie is absolved from pressing given his location on the pitch is in sitting in front of the back four?

The first priority of a player sitting in front of the back four (whether you call him a DM or not) is to press the opposition to break up attacks and protect the defence. If you have a player who can do that and is also capable of a world class long range defence splitting pass you have a bonus on top but if having someone in that position who can't press but can deliver a nice long pass you're giving the opposition a serious advantage which teams are increasingly taking advantage of.

klose

On gerrard, whatever about being dropped people can debate over but he needs to be rotated at least and not just league cup games which are once every month or so. He will look like hes running through treacle on saturday i imagine, a 34 y/o player in such a physical role cant play every game.



Suso out for 2 months, yay.

Agent Coulson

This is the team I would like to see when everyone is fit to play.

Play a defensive high line with a high pressing high tempo midfield.

---

Mignolet

---

---

Lovren

---

Sakho

---

Manquillo

---

Moreno

---

Allen

---

---

Henderson

---

Lallana

---

---

Sterling

---

---

Balotelli

---

---

Sturridge

---

.

rob316

BenEadir wrote: »

If someone in the DM role doesn't press he might as well hold the door open for the opposition to come storming through our defence. Are you seriously suggesting Stevie is absolved from pressing given his location on the pitch is in sitting in front of the back four?

The first priority of a player sitting in front of the back four (whether you call him a DM or not) is to press the opposition to break up attacks and protect the defence. If you have a player who can do that and is also capable of a world class long range defence splitting pass you have a bonus on top but if having someone in that position who can't press but can deliver a nice long pass you're giving the opposition a serious advantage.

But he's not playing the DM role, he's playing this "quarter-back" role. We aren't playing with a DM, and without atleast 1 on the pitch we are going to continue to concede in open play and let the opposition walk through us.

There was times last night where they strolled past Gerrard, its ridiculous.

klose

klose wrote: »

On gerrard, whatever about being dropped people can debate over but he needs to be rotated at least and not just league cup games which are once every month or so. He will look like hes running through treacle on saturday i imagine, a 34 y/o player in such a physical role cant play every game.
.

That's it.

Manage him properly for a start!

Francie Barrett

For all the whinging about Sterling, here's his heat map.

http://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/season=2015/matches/live/day=2/session=2/match=2014325/index.html

Now here's Markovic's

http://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/season=2015/matches/live/day=2/session=2/match=2014325/index.html

Also what's telling from last night is our lack of passes and lack of possession. I think that plays into what we're seeing, a lot of our build up play is breaking down quite badly and we are not retaining the ball like we should be.

BenEadir

NEDDURC wrote: »

We either need a real playermaker in that position (maybe Joe Allen can have a go at it) or we need a proper defensive mid in there (like a Makellele type player). Gerrard is neither and it is being shown up this year quite badly.

^^^ This 100%

Francie Barrett

Another thing that's wrong that I haven't seen anyone touch on yet is the complete lack of support from the full back's. Last season, you could have relied on them to provide overlapping support and to drag players out of position. I think now because they feel the defense is so frail, they are not really getting past the half way line. I think in the 4-3-3 system, you can only make it work if you're giving the front 3 support when you're looking to break. Other than Moreno showing a few times - how often have we seen some truly incisive and decent support from the full backs? Again, I don't think it's their fault. They're obviously terrified to go too far forward because we lose the ball so often, we ourselves are wide open.

Again, like I said yesterday, the whole team is playing like it's broken.

Cartman78

Utterly depressing stuff again last night...Sturridge is indeed a huge loss but there seems to be far more fundamental factors at play as well.

We looked flaky,lethargic,sloppy,flat all over the pitch....can't think of one positive sign from the game tbh.

Hard to tell if Mignolet is playing nervously because the defence is crap, or are the defence acting skittishly because Mignolet is crap?

Markovic was utterly atrocious last night....should have been subbed after half and hour. Worst performance I've seen since Downing at his peak of crapness. He may yet have a Hendersonesque career turnaround but the early signs are pretty much abysmal.

Balotelli's performance was like some pyschedelic mash up of the very worst of Heskey and Andy Carroll....again things may turn around for him but not looking good.

Gerrard? Hard to know what to say....I'm two years older than him but he looked like an old man last night huffing and puffing around the place.

Have zero confidence going into the West Brom game. Any team with a bit of balls and zest would comfortably turn us over at the moment

Harry Palmr

If Gerrard is the man covering for one rampaging full back its hardly a surprise they aren't constantly looking to overlap in attack. The space can't be left empty for too long so they get back quickly or hesitate to go forward too far. Again lack of mobility and discipline from the deepest midfield position is a factor.

MD1990

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Another thing that's wrong that I haven't seen anyone touch on yet is the complete lack of support from the full back's. Last season, you could have relied on them to provide overlapping support and to drag players out of position. I think now because they feel the defense is so frail, they are not really getting past the half way line. I think in the 4-3-3 system, you can only make it work if you're giving the front 3 support when you're looking to break. Other than Moreno showing a few times - how often have we seen some truly incisive and decent support from the full backs? Again, I don't think it's their fault. They're obviously terrified to go too far forward because we lose the ball so often, we ourselves are wide open.

Again, like I said yesterday, the whole team is playing like it's broken.

I think Moreno & Manquillo have been getting forward alot tbh.

joe123

Its actually laughable how quick some are to turn on Rodgers. The man that brought us to the cusp of a Premier League for the first time in years.

Absolutely laughable. I was at Anfield for the Everton game and the good news is that support is very much behind Rodgers which is a good thing. Reading some of the absolute tripe from the usual critics on here you'd swear hes about to get the sack.

We are badly missing Sturridge and I am convinced that once he is back, Balotelli will come into his own. It is clear Balotelli needs a strike partner.

Allen is a big miss for setting the tempo which allows Henderson push further forward. Cannot understand the post calling Can one of the most baffling transfers of the summer either. He has the potential to be one of those powerful midfielders that we so badly lack.

If Rodgers deserves anything after last season its time. We are only 3 points off Arsenal.

Francie Barrett

MD1990 wrote: »

I think Moreno & Manquillo have been getting forward alot tbh.

Moreno yes, Manquillo not so much, I feel.

Francie Barrett

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Another thing that's wrong that I haven't seen anyone touch on yet is the complete lack of support from the full back's. Last season, you could have relied on them to provide overlapping support and to drag players out of position. I think now because they feel the defense is so frail, they are not really getting past the half way line. I think in the 4-3-3 system, you can only make it work if you're giving the front 3 support when you're looking to break. Other than Moreno showing a few times - how often have we seen some truly incisive and decent support from the full backs? Again, I don't think it's their fault. They're obviously terrified to go too far forward because we lose the ball so often, we ourselves are wide open.

Again, like I said yesterday, the whole team is playing like it's broken.

The fullbacks thing has been brought up a few times but because of a different reason to yours.

Being caught out of position and too far forward leaving our CB's exposed

brevity

The Gerrard situation reminds me of what Scholes said about the Utd midfield. That he should have noticed at the lack of quality coming in considering that both him and Giggs were midfield regulars even though they were well into their 30's. Seems the same thing is happening with Gerrard.

NEDDURC

joe123 wrote: »

Its actually laughable how quick some are to turn on Rodgers. The man that brought us to the cusp of a Premier League for the first time in years.

Absolutely laughable. I was at Anfield for the Everton game and the good news is that support is very much behind Rodgers which is a good thing. Reading some of the absolute tripe from the usual critics on here you'd swear hes about to get the sack.

We are badly missing Sturridge and I am convinced that once he is back, Balotelli will come into his own. It is clear Balotelli needs a strike partner.

Allen is a big miss for setting the tempo which allows Henderson push further forward. Cannot understand the post calling Can one of the most baffling transfers of the summer either. He has the potential to be one of those powerful midfielders that we so badly lack.

If Rodgers deserves anything after last season its time. We are only 3 points off Arsenal.

Agree! It took quite abit of tweaking last year to get a formation that worked well. With injuries and so many new players, Rodgers is struggling to get the right balance at the moment.

I've full confidence that he will but he has some tough calls to make now.

NEDDURC

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Moreno yes, Manquillo not so much, I feel.

Manquillo was much better than Enrique last night and probably should have resulted in an early goal or two if players were watching the off-side.

Nerdlingr

NEDDURC wrote: »

Don't agree, centre backs shouldn't be taking big risks. Gerrard as most people point out is now our quarterback. He should come looking for the ball, turn with it and get play moving forward.

Gerrard is good when he has the ball facing forward but dropping deep facing our own goal he is terrible. Very rarely does he turn on the ball ala Scholes / Pirlo. Johnny Giles has said it a long time ago, Gerrard is not a playmaker in the way Scholes was. He can do amazing things at times but doesn't know how to control the flow of the play.

We either need a real playermaker in that position (maybe Joe Allen can have a go at it) or we need a proper defensive mid in there (like a Makellele type player). Gerrard is neither and it is being shown up this year quite badly.

No one said take big risks but if a player is marked dont give him the ball. Its simple really.
Case in point being Mignolet passing the ball to gerrard just outisde our box last night when he'd a man on. He got caught in possession and they nearly scored. F*ck sake, he's being marked! at best he's gonna pass it back to one of our defenders, at worst he's gonna f&ck up and they'll get a chance out of it (what happened!!). Mignolet, like the team in general, needs to choose a better option.
Countless times Gerrard will pick up the ball facing the play and the defenders will split either side, this is where he's meant to excel and dictate the game.
Receiving the ball with someone on your back makes it difficult to turn and play, even the likes of pirlo doesnt take chances when he facing his own goal and there's a man marking him. He'll go back to his defenders if needs be.
I just feel, and I've said it here before, that the centre backs seem to think EVERYTHING has to go through gerrard before it leaves our half. Doesnt matter if he's marked or not they will still give him the ball. For me they need to be more confident in their own ability, step up into midfield with the ball if the situation (and space) arises and take more responsibilty with their passing.

Scholes was a playmaker from an attacking midfield position, he never had to play as a defensive midfielder and track people runs in behind him, he had keane and butt for that. Dont think its fair to compare two totally different positions on the pitch.

Harry Palmr

Where did this go?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bXJWSLcd4M

Fescue

joe123 wrote: »

Its actually laughable how quick some are to turn on Rodgers. The man that brought us to the cusp of a Premier League for the first time in years.

Absolutely laughable. I was at Anfield for the Everton game and the good news is that support is very much behind Rodgers which is a good thing. Reading some of the absolute tripe from the usual critics on here you'd swear hes about to get the sack.

We are badly missing Sturridge and I am convinced that once he is back, Balotelli will come into his own. It is clear Balotelli needs a strike partner.

Allen is a big miss for setting the tempo which allows Henderson push further forward. Cannot understand the post calling Can one of the most baffling transfers of the summer either. He has the potential to be one of those powerful midfielders that we so badly lack.

If Rodgers deserves anything after last season its time. We are only 3 points off Arsenal.

I don't think you should mistake criticism for wanting him sacked.

I think he deserves a certain amount of criticism for failing to address some of the problems in the team.

I don't think he should be sacked.

joe123

joe123 wrote: »

Its actually laughable how quick some are to turn on Rodgers. The man that brought us to the cusp of a Premier League for the first time in years.

Absolutely laughable. I was at Anfield for the Everton game and the good news is that support is very much behind Rodgers which is a good thing. Reading some of the absolute tripe from the usual critics on here you'd swear hes about to get the sack.

We are badly missing Sturridge and I am convinced that once he is back, Balotelli will come into his own. It is clear Balotelli needs a strike partner.

Allen is a big miss for setting the tempo which allows Henderson push further forward. Cannot understand the post calling Can one of the most baffling transfers of the summer either. He has the potential to be one of those powerful midfielders that we so badly lack.

If Rodgers deserves anything after last season its time. We are only 3 points off Arsenal.

Nobody is turning against Rodgers. It's normal to question the manager after a run of poor games. 1 good performance in 10 isn't good enough.

Sticking the head in the sand and blindly hoping things will get better is ridiculous.

Why mention Arsenal? We are 9 points off Chelsea after 6 games! 7 off Southampton.

Agree with you on Can, calling him a baffling transfer when's he's out injured having not played for us is hilarious.

Don't agree on Balotelli.

Fescue

Fescue wrote: »

I don't think you should mistake criticism for wanting him sacked.

I think he deserves a certain amount of criticism for failing to address some of the problems in the team.

I don't think he should be sacked.

Nobody thinks he should be sacked.

Almost Everyone thinks he has to improve the performances. Big difference.

Fescue

rarnes1 wrote: »

Nobody is turning against Rodgers. It's normal to question the manager after a run of poor games. 1 good performance in 10 isn't good enough.

Sticking the head in the sand and blindly hoping things will get better is ridiculous.

Why mention Arsenal? We are 9 points off Chelsea after 6 games! 7 off Southampton.

Agree with you on Can, calling him a baffling transfer when's he's out injured having not played for us is hilarious.

Don't agree on Balotelli.

Is Balotelli unfortunate that he has arrived into an attack that is not functioning well or is Balotelli the main reason the attack has lost its threat?

That's the big question for me.

Fescue

Fescue wrote: »

Is Balotelli unfortunate that he has arrived into an attack that is not functioning well or is Balotelli the main reason the attack has lost its threat?

That's the big question for me.

Is Ballotelli suited to quick interchangeable football, ie the way Rodgers wants his forwards to play? Absolutely not

Fescue

rarnes1 wrote: »

Is Ballotelli suited to quick interchangeable football, ie the way Rodgers wants his forwards to play? Absolutely not

Well then is it worthwhile adjusting the team to get the most from him?

For instance returning to the diamond despite the defensive frailty of it.