Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014 - Mod Note in OP, 1/09

NukaCola

benny79 wrote: »

Even United have bought good quality players, you always want quality over quantity!

Ya......how many points are we behind Utd with their quality buys?

brevity

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Any thoughts on what we're going to do about Balotelli, lads? Sturridge is still crocked for the next two weeks at least, so my thoughts are at least to persist with him until then. Our next three games are against Hull, Swansea and Newcastle, teams who we should be getting chances against. I think if he can break his duck in the league, the goals might just come more easier for him then.

I guess we've no choice but to persist with him. I do wish Rodgers would play him with another striker but he seems to have no time for Borini and Lambert isn't suitable as first choice.

rob316

I'd drop Balotelli until Sturridge comes back, then give him a chance to see if they can strike up a partnership, if he can't then we might as well cut our losses in January.
I would like to see us start against Hull with the False 9 formation like we saw last night in the 2nd half. It looked a lot more fluid and if you can get Coutinho, Sterling and Lallana around the box it will cause there defenders problems.
I would rest Henderson against Hull and start Can - its time to see what he is all about, Henderson has been poor the last 2 games.

I didn't think Johnson was too bad last night but I would prefer Manquillo to come back in, he will give it his all atleast.

Coutinho I think can be the difference, he looks sharp again and his through balls are improving game by game.

Nerdlingr

zerks wrote: »

Falcao's loan deal didn't involve a £16 million fee but that's moot.

Rodgers' transfer policy was discussed on Newstalk last night,he inherited Suarez who was Liverpool's best player by a mile & simply became too good to stay.Rodgers almost didn't take the job as he wanted full control & not to work under a DOF.Whatever about him being a decent coach,his transfer nous & dealings are questionable at best.
One point was raised,how relevant are Liverpool to players that weren't even born or only kids when they last won the league,that coupled with the draw of box office managers such as Jose,Wenger & LVG meant that it may have been harder than simply waving cash around for Liverpool.
Balotelli smacks of a panic buy & if I was a Liverpool fan,I'd be worried while looking at who United,Chelsea & now even Arsenal are buying in comparison.

Just had a look, yeah...its about 6m according to Wiki. The point still stands though. We cannot compete financially with them.
I'd agree with the notion that United, City, Chelsea and Arsenal are a massive draw for players around the world, as you say their recent success (last 15 - 20years) has seen them become the teams to follow, as we were in the 80's.
Its all well and good saying we should be buying quality like United, Chelsea etc but the reality is we're still shopping at a level below those teams.

Chardee MacDennis

jesus we're a mess this season.

I still have faith something good can come from Balotelli when Sturridge is back but it's madness persisting with him up top by himself.

Gerrard is useless in his current role. Johnson should be taken out and shot.

Lallana, Sterling, and Henderson are the only bright spots so far this season for me. Maybe Manquillo and Moreno but the defending as a whole is shocking.

Boom_Bap

For all the negativity that is being thrown around from last nights game, there is a whole load of positives to take from it.
At times, and I mean for decent spells, we played some excellent football against the best team in Europe. We had them chasing us around, Real are being applauded for thier movement and quick passing, but any of our simialr play is being ignored for some reason.
There were a few moments in the game that lost it for us.
Skrytl - On the first goal, he needed to get f*cking stuck in, instead he was more worried about giving away a peno. On the third goal, he was too busy trying to shield the ball so Mignolet would come to collect it, just f*cking hoof the thing.
Mignolet - Was not expecting Ronaldo to shoot with his first touch. Naive. For the header, nothing he could do. For the scramble, commit to getting the ball is you are coming for it.
Johnson - A big bag of d*cks could have done a better job than him last night.
Mario - He's getting a rough ride - he needs to start passing the ball. When he did start this and getting involved in link up play towards the end of the first half, we looked better. If we are to continue with him, I would throw Lambert up top with him.
Can - looked great, worked his socks off
Coutinho - his close control is ridiculous.

If we had of put away either the Coutinho chance, or the Allen chance near the end of the first half, I think that we would have seen a different game.

gafferino

I thought Can was decent when he came on. Didnt see him at the weekend but I hope thats a sign of good things from him.

Struggling to find any other positives.

LuckyLloyd

Boom_Bap wrote: »

For all the negativity that is being thrown around from last nights game, there is a whole load of positives to take from it.
At times, and I mean for decent spells, we played some excellent football against the best team in Europe. We had them chasing us around, Real are being applauded for thier movement and quick passing, but any of our simialr play is being ignored for some reason.

How I despise posts like this. Look at the scoreboard.

galwaylad14

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Just had a look, yeah...its about 6m according to Wiki. The point still stands though. We cannot compete financially with them.
I'd agree with the notion that United, City, Chelsea and Arsenal are a massive draw for players around the world, as you say their recent success (last 15 - 20years) has seen them become the teams to follow, as we were in the 80's.
Its all well and good saying we should be buying quality like United, Chelsea etc but the reality is we're still shopping at a level below those teams.

Ya but look at all the players Liverpool bought and what it cost them, they're paying big money for a few decent players instead of paying huge money for 1 or 2 world class players.

I haven't looked up the figures so I may be wrong but I'd guess if you added up what say balotelli, lallana, markovic, lovren, can, lambert and Moreno cost (any other summer signings?) in terns of transfer fees and wages I'd be fairly sure you could afford di Maria and falcao. Would you be better off with those 2 world class players instead of those 6 or 7 decent players? That's the question being posed.

And don't say that pool couldn't have got them, if you're willing to pay enough then you can get anyone and especially if you're from an attractive league like the premiership and have champions league football to offer ( united didn't even have this)

googled eyes

Talkin bout Ballotelli
I feel bad for you son.
We got 99 defensive problems
Ballotelli ain't one.

The lads a scapegoat. Play someone up beside him and at least try to get the best out of his style of play.

The team has regressed so much from last season. What has happened to our pressing and the magical diamond that worked so well?
It can't all be because we've lost a player?
If it is then the majority of the players need a long hard look at themselves.

We need a defense coach. How this isn't obvious is beyond me.

LuckyLloyd

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

How I despise posts like this. Look at the scoreboard.

And add the fact that Madrid went from 4th gear to 2nd after the break.

If they really wanted to they could have really went for the jugular

Mr Alan

One of many reasons it's imperative that we start to improve quickley is that our squad, which is already relatively devoid of genuine top class players runs the risk of losing the few we do have (particularly Sterling) if this season pans out the way it looks like it's going to.

LuckyLloyd

Mr Alan wrote: »

One of many reasons it's imperative that we start to improve quickley is that our squad, which is already relatively devoid of genuine top class players runs the risk of losing the few we do have (particularly Sterling).

Arrah, I think we'd hang onto Sterling for another year no matter how shambolic this season was to become. And we may inevitably lose him towards his mid twenties no matter what happens.

NEDDURC

We were better in the second half but Sterlng up front is not really an option (Carra was wrong). He doesn't know when / how to hold the ball up and just ends up giving it away too often.

We are also playing far too narrow. Trying to force the ball through the middle way too much.

Team for weekend for me would be - 4231:

............... Mignolet
Manquillo.....Toure....Lovren....Moreno
...........Henderson....Allen
Sterling.....Coutinho.......Lallana
...............Borini

A more solid centre of Henderson and Allen would allow the full backs and front 4 to get further forward. Skrtel needs a break (just too many mistakes) and with Sakho out, I'd give Toure a go for some leadership.

Gerrard is playing so poorly. I'm amazed more people aren't picking up on it. He is essentially part of the defence in that deep lying mid role and our defence is shocking. Rodgers has rotated all others at this stage but stubborny refuses to change him and its costing us.

Nerdlingr

Fair enough we played well for the first 15mins.
But in that time Real were strutting their stuff too. Its not like we had them penned in. They had us at arm's length for the most of it. Then they get the first goal and the flood gates open. Could have been a whole lot worse if they hadnt taken their foot off the gas second half.
So yes it was good to see us harry and press and get in amongst them the first 15mins but lets not kid ourselves, we got schooled.

Cjs21

galwaylad14 wrote: »

Ya but look at all the players Liverpool bought and what it cost them, they're paying big money for a few decent players instead of paying huge money for 1 or 2 world class players.

I haven't looked up the figures so I may be wrong but I'd guess if you added up what say balotelli, lallana, markovic, lovren, can, lambert and Moreno cost (any other summer signings?) in terns of transfer fees and wages I'd be fairly sure you could afford di Maria and falcao. Would you be better off with those 2 world class players instead of those 6 or 7 decent players? That's the question being posed.

And don't say that pool couldn't have got them, if you're willing to pay enough then you can get anyone and especially if you're from an attractive league like the premiership and have champions league football to offer ( united didn't even have this)

Clearly not according to the league table. If we had Di Maria or Falcao we'd still be stuck with an average team that has potential but that's it.

The players that Rodgers has brought in during the summer seem to still be blooming, Sterling still hasn't got near how good he will be. Sturridge still needs to come back, Allen also isn't fully fit. Have Hope.

Harry Palmr

Nerdlingr wrote: »

Fair enough we played well for the first 15mins.
But in that time Real were strutting their stuff too. Its not like we had them penned in. They had us at arm's length for the most of it. Then they get the first goal and the flood gates open. Could have been a whole lot worse if they hadnt taken their foot off the gas second half.
So yes it was good to see us harry and press and get in amongst them the first 15mins but lets not kid ourselves, we got schooled.

Context!? Real Madrid are one of the top three clubs in the world Liverpool are well short of that, so in the context of the match that Liverpool did re-discover some of the qualities that served so well last season is important when facing Hull, Newcastle and Swansea back in the real world (I'm assuming no one is deluded enough to think LFC will get past the first knockout stage even if they qualify).

poolboy

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Context!? Real Madrid are one of the top three clubs in the world Liverpool are well short of that, so in the context of the match that Liverpool did re-discover some of the qualities that served so well last season is important when facing Hull, Newcastle and Swansea back in the real world (I'm assuming no one is deluded enough to think LFC will get past the first knockout stage even if they qualify).

Well...... You never know:)

Nerdlingr

galwaylad14 wrote: »

Ya but look at all the players Liverpool bought and what it cost them, they're paying big money for a few decent players instead of paying huge money for 1 or 2 world class players.

I haven't looked up the figures so I may be wrong but I'd guess if you added up what say balotelli, lallana, markovic, lovren, can, lambert and Moreno cost (any other summer signings?) in terns of transfer fees and wages I'd be fairly sure you could afford di Maria and falcao. Would you be better off with those 2 world class players instead of those 6 or 7 decent players? That's the question being posed.

And don't say that pool couldn't have got them, if you're willing to pay enough then you can get anyone and especially if you're from an attractive league like the premiership and have champions league football to offer ( united didn't even have this)

The thing is we spent maybe about 20m net on transfers. United spent about 140m net. BIG difference whene the chairman says go spend what you like there's an open chequebook policy this summer.
Plus we needed to fill out the squad. Buying two players to replace two players was never gonna work for us.

I dont agree with the argument that you can get anyone if you throw enough money at them. United werent in the CL like you said but still manged to draw the likes of DiMaria, Falcao etc because their name is huge all over the world , CL or not.
We were probably looking at the likes of Sanchez, Falcao and a few others to fill suarez boots but got neither. Why is that? As you say we had money to spend yet they choose to go elsewhere.

MD1990

What really struck me was how we have no one anyway near being world class. Real were so far ahead of us thats even though they only played there at there top level for 20 mins.

Nerdlingr

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Context!? Real Madrid are one of the top three clubs in the world Liverpool are well short of that, so in the context of the match that Liverpool did re-discover some of the qualities that served so well last season is important when facing Hull, Newcastle and Swansea back in the real world (I'm assuming no one is deluded enough to think LFC will get past the first knockout stage even if they qualify).

We harried them for 15mins in the first half when the score was 0-0. After that we went to pieces.

LuckyLloyd

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

How I despise posts like this. Look at the scoreboard.

He is making a valid point. There were a lot of positives to take from the game. We played very good football at times last night. Particularly in the first 20 mins, a few defensive feck ups that killed us.

You need to stop being so so negative all the time.

Hangballlouie

I'll ask again like I did after QPR.
I think you all know what I'd answer.
I'm expecting to get abuse but fcuk it, it's how I've felt for the majority of the time Rodgers has been in charge.

For me, The Rodgers is more Pardew than Paisley.

hangballlouie wrote: »

Monday meltdown hasn't been that great lads so I'm gonna throw a spanner in the works and get it kicked off in here.

Tomorrow you have the opportunity to replace Rodgers with Rafa. Ye or nay? Discuss.

hangballlouie

hangballlouie wrote: »

I'll ask again like I did after QPR.
I think you all know what I'd answer.
I'm expecting to get abuse but fcuk it, it's how I've felt for the majority of the time Rodgers has been in charge.

For me, The Rodgers is more Pardew than Paisley.

Not a chance, we would never have played the football we played last season under Rafa and remember how much fun last season was!

MD1990

Dangelo Stocky Rage wrote: »

He is making a valid point. There were a lot of positives to take from the game. We played very good football at times last night. Particularly in the first 20 mins, a few defensive feck ups that killed us.

You need to stop being so so negative all the time.

Are u mad. We were ok first 20 & Coutinho looks to be regaining a bit of form. Other than that there was no positives.

Hangballlouie

Dangelo Stocky Rage wrote: »

Not a chance, we would never have played the football we played last season under Rafa and remember how much fun last season was!

The man who truly made it fun is gone, unfortunately.

Agent Coulson

Rodgers on Spurs spending over £100m. From last season

As a means of deflecting pressure even further from his charges, Rodgers used this weekend’s opponents, Spurs, as his patsy, aiming a wee dig their way, saying they were set up to challenge for the title this season after spending £100 odd million on players.

http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/brendan-rodgers-has-dig-at-spurs-they-were-set-up-to-challenge-for-title-after-spending-100-million-on-players-video/

Boom_Bap

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

How I despise posts like this. Look at the scoreboard.

Completely aware of the scoreboard, and well annoyed with it. Very frustrated with defensive players just not getting stuck in to win the ball which could have prevented the goals.
If we can get them mistakes cut out, we would be looking more at the positive side of our game.

noodler

Dangelo Stocky Rage wrote: »

He is making a valid point. There were a lot of positives to take from the game. We played very good football at times last night. Particularly in the first 20 mins, a few defensive feck ups that killed us.

You need to stop being so so negative all the time.

First 10-15 are the only positives.

The second half was just us being kept on a leash.

The only positive from last night was what happened in Hungary.

Harry Palmr

Dangelo Stocky Rage wrote: »

He is making a valid point. There were a lot of positives to take from the game. We played very good football at times last night. Particularly in the first 20 mins, a few defensive feck ups that killed us.

You need to stop being so so negative all the time.

LL is a megaphone/sloganeering poster. You'll not get much else out of him at times like this except flecks of enraged spittle. You'd think Liverpool were on equal terms with Real Madrid or something.

Talisman

We played at a pedestrian pace last night and the passing lacked conviction. There was very little right about the team - the transitions were slow and the team mentality is still stuck in a rut - players act like Suarez and Sturridge are playing up front. Last season a lot of our quick play was get the ball forward to Sturridge and Suarez, then stand back and watch the opposition panic. Last night we witnessed the same thing - lump the ball for Balotelli and see what happens. There were a few times that Balotelli got possession and there was no support for him - no runs from midfield, no support from the fullback. He is not Suarez and he doesn't have Sturridge as a partner. The whole thing about the shirt swap is pure bollix, media headlines for yet another Balotelli non-story. He's the scapegoat but he's not the source of the problem.

The time has come to get rid of the quarter back role for Gerrard and inject energy into the midfield. He acts as a third centre back in possession and when he drops deep so we lose a man in midfield, that's one less option for Rodgers' sacred passing triangles that he lectured about when he first joined the club as manager. If that's the role Rodgers sees for Gerrard then it's time to bite the bullet and start playing him as a centre back - drop Skrtel and in the process eliminate a large portion of the defensive lapses.

When he first arrived at the club Joe Allen played as the fulcrum of the midfield - simple passes that kept things moving, similar to how Toni Kroos plays for Real Madrid. The defensive side of his game got shown up in a match against Man Utd because Ferguson setup his team to smother Allen and isolate him, that is something Allen and Rodgers needed to adapt to. But instead we got Allen moved further forward into central midfield where he does more running, less passing and more frequently finds himself in positions where he is expected to take opportunities to shoot on goal. He's not a goal scoring midfielder and there is a hesitation / element of panic every time he finds himself in the position. Joe Allen finds himself in situations that Adam Lallana is more suited to so it would make sense to play Lallana in Allen's current position. Sort out the midfield and the team might begin to perform.

As for the defensive errors they were individual mistakes - Skrtel, Johnson and Mignolet. How many times are we undone by such errors by the same individuals?

kevohmsford

I wonder how much more money Rodgers will be given before the owners say no more. We needed more players in the squad this year but he has not improved our starting 11.

gafferino

kevohmsford wrote: »

I wonder how much more money Rodgers will be given before the owners say no more. We needed more players in the squad this year but he has not improved our starting 11.

Barring absolute disaster (8th or below) Rodgers will be here this season and next season.

Turtyturd

The worrying thing for me about 'The Rodgers' is that he seems to have lost his ability to change the game.

Last season a lot of games followed the same blueprint, we hit them from the outset til the middle of the first half, the opposition come back at us, half time. At half time I was always convinced that he could adapt the formation/line up and we would get something from the game, that's completely gone this season, about 10 games later and he hasn't figured out Balotelli needs a strike partner.

Grayditch

I'm glad it was only 3-0. If they didn't have Barca in a few days, and that was in the knockout stages, they would have murdered us.

So, that was us trying our absolute best, and them in 3rd gear, and they still won by 3. Jesus. We're so far off swingin' with the big dicks, it's disheartening. I've no idea how we'll finish in the top 4 with our defence that bad. Last season we had a dangerous offence who tidied up mess after mess at the back. Now it's like we have nothing.

We'll see what happens when Sturridge is back, but I wouldn't hold my breath, it won't change just how bad we are defensively.

BoardsMember

Talisman wrote: »

We played at a pedestrian pace last night and the passing lacked conviction. There was very little right about the team - the transitions were slow and the team mentality is still stuck in a rut - players act like Suarez and Sturridge are playing up front. Last season a lot of our quick play was get the ball forward to Sturridge and Suarez, then stand back and watch the opposition panic. Last night we witnessed the same thing - lump the ball for Balotelli and see what happens. There were a few times that Balotelli got possession and there was no support for him - no runs from midfield, no support from the fullback. He is not Suarez and he doesn't have Sturridge as a partner. The whole thing about the shirt swap is pure bollix, media headlines for yet another Balotelli non-story. He's the scapegoat but he's not the source of the problem.

The time has come to get rid of the quarter back role for Gerrard and inject energy into the midfield. He acts as a third centre back in possession and when he drops deep so we lose a man in midfield, that's one less option for Rodgers' sacred passing triangles that he lectured about when he first joined the club as manager. If that's the role Rodgers sees for Gerrard then it's time to bite the bullet and start playing him as a centre back - drop Skrtel and in the process eliminate a large portion of the defensive lapses.

When he first arrived at the club Joe Allen played as the fulcrum of the midfield - simple passes that kept things moving, similar to how Toni Kroos plays for Real Madrid. The defensive side of his game got shown up in a match against Man Utd because Ferguson setup his team to smother Allen and isolate him, that is something Allen and Rodgers needed to adapt to. But instead we got Allen moved further forward into central midfield where he does more running, less passing and more frequently finds himself in positions where he is expected to take opportunities to shoot on goal. He's not a goal scoring midfielder and there is a hesitation / element of panic every time he finds himself in the position. Joe Allen finds himself in situations that Adam Lallana is more suited to so it would make sense to play Lallana in Allen's current position. Sort out the midfield and the team might begin to perform.

As for the defensive errors they were individual mistakes - Skrtel, Johnson and Mignolet. How many times are we undone by such errors by the same individuals?

This sums it up for me. Re Gerrard, I think we would quickly see he's not able to play CB at the highest level because he wouldn't track back, but at least it would put paid to this absolutely failed experiment of him playing as a quarterback midfielder.

benny79

UNITED are only 1 point behind us for all their troubles. and with a aging squad with a new manager in his first season! this is BR's 3rd season so yes I do think we would of being better off buying 2 or 3 Quality Players, plus that's what CL football is about you attract the best players to your club! We mighten have it next season and the good players we have will be jumping ship to teams that can offer it to them. That's football. Were still one of the biggest clubs around if you want to be the best you have to compete with the best and that applies in the transfer market!

Pyjamarama

People keep saying that we haven't improved the first 11 at all are wrong. Our 1st 11 is clearly far weaker than last year without Luis and Danny but Moreno is a clear upgrade at left back.

As for Rodgers being more pardew than paisley and saying you've felt that way the majority of the time. For 18 months (after inheriting a shambles) he has us playing football that was champions level. And a good portion of ot without Luis. It's funny that it's the same posters who threw strops when he got the job that are first to get on his back. You'd swear he was working under no restrictions financially... We should have bought messi Ronaldo and neymar.

Hangballlouie

Pyjamarama wrote: »

People keep saying that we haven't improved the first 11 at all are wrong. Our 1st 11 is clearly far weaker than last year without Luis and Danny but Moreno is a clear upgrade at left back.

As for Rodgers being more pardew than paisley and saying you've felt that way the majority of the time. For 18 months (after inheriting a shambles) he has us playing football that was champions level. And a good portion of ot without Luis. It's funny that it's the same posters who threw strops when he got the job that are first to get on his back. You'd swear he was working under no restrictions financially... We should have bought messi Ronaldo and neymar.

I didn't throw any strop when he got the job and have been supportive, just not to the extent where people think he's the second coming.

Financial restrictions? He spent an absolute fortune in his 2 and a bit years. Suarez played 33 league games for each of the last two seasons, hardly a good portion.

He is showing me that he cannot learn from his mistakes and fundamentally he can't set up a team correctly. He's also an oul'one with no backbone to drop/rest influential dressing room players.

I've said before he's a good manager, but he isn't a great manager and as much as I was hoping he'd prove that he is great, unfortunately it isn't gonna happen.

Pyjamarama

hangballlouie wrote: »

I didn't throw any strop when he got the job and have been supportive, just not to the extent where people think he's the second coming.

Financial restrictions? He spent an absolute fortune in his 2 and a bit years. Suarez played 33 league games for each of the last two seasons, hardly a good portion.

He is showing me that he cannot learn from his mistakes and fundamentally he can't set up a team correctly. He's also an oul'one with no backbone to drop/rest influential dressing room players.

I've said before he's a good manager, but he isn't a great manager and as much as I was hoping he'd prove that he is great, unfortunately it isn't gonna happen.

Has he really spent a fortune tho?!? He's spent money but our wage cap is an issue. Have any other teams in the top 4 spent less with better results?!?

Hangballlouie

£212 mill on 25 players in two years. How many of them have made an impact?

noodler

We all distinctly remember games last season when we didn't have Suarez,

Stoke (H), Villa (A), UTD (H), Swansea (A).


Theres more of course, they just come to mind as the opening four.

We weren't free flowing or anything but there was a certain stability the performance.

God, I just pray we get Sturridge fit for ten games in a row to have a comparative sample.


That said, it is unhealthy to rely on this heavily on one of last year's signings after spending well over 100m.

ricero

Come back john flanno and save us. Also Sturridge to would be nice

noodler

hangballlouie wrote: »

£212 mill on 25 players in two years. How many of them have made an impact?

Have you a list?

I am a little shaky on which ones were signed when.

Hangballlouie

noodler wrote: »

Have you a list?

I am a little shaky on which ones were signed when.

http://www.lfchistory.net/Transfers/ByManager/25-1

Pighead

hangballlouie wrote: »

£212 mill on 25 players in two years. How many of them have made an impact?

Four at a push so far. Arguments could be made for Lallana, Coutinho, Sturridge and Allen although Sturridge is probably the only one from that list which can be called a 100% hit.

Hangballlouie

Pighead wrote: »

Four at a push so far. Arguments could be made for Lallana, Coutinho, Sturridge and Allen although Sturridge is probably the only one from that list which can be called a 100% hit.

And Rodgers didn't wanna sign him.

Vicxas

hangballlouie wrote: »

£212 mill on 25 players in two years. How many of them have made an impact?

Couthino and Sturridge?

Joe Allen has been quite good too.

Agent Coulson

But but but but but but but etc etc etc.....isn't there a transfer commettee that takes the blame for all those signings not Brendan!!!!!!!!

Hangballlouie

Vicxas wrote: »

Couthino and Sturridge?

Joe Allen has been quite good too.

So a 10% strike-rate? Not great is it?