supplier for convenience/grocery store

businessdit

Hi Guys -

Posting for a friend who is going to be setting up a small convenience / grocery store in a shop unit that they have inherited. The shop is on a main street.

They are finding it difficult to find a supplier with good prices.
Can anyone recommend a good cash and carry or supplier which has competitive rates?

They will be selling just the basics: drinks, choc bars, sweets, milk, bread, cheese, biscuits etc.

Any help with this would be very much so appreciated.

Thanks,
Alan

Bandara

businessdit wrote: »

Hi Guys -

Posting for a friend who is going to be setting up a small convenience / grocery store in a shop unit that they have inherited. The shop is on a main street.

They are finding it difficult to find a supplier with good prices.
Can anyone recommend a good cash and carry or supplier which has competitive rates?

They will be selling just the basics: drinks, choc bars, sweets, milk, bread, cheese, biscuits etc.

Any help with this would be very much so appreciated.

Thanks,
Alan

Tell you friend to lease the unit out

They won't survive 3 months

delahuntv

Basically, he/she would be buying in small quantities and getting the goods delivered.

Prices won't be much different to supermarkets.

On main brand name groceries, you would be lucky to get 20% margin, some like baked beans will cost more in wholesalers than a supermarket.

Sweets / Minerals, margin is higher, but so are stocking costs as you need to have a large variety on offer.

Depending on where you are based, you have Musgraves, (nationwide) Cliffords (Kerry) BWG Valucentre & Mangans (nationwide), Coxes (south Midlands), Barrys (costcutter).

There are others too.

Bread and milk will be from local suppliers - again, margin is tiny.


You also will have to register with HSE as a food premises.


But as per poster above, probably best to lease it out unless he/she has some good experience in the area and willing to risk it for a while.

Is the Spar or Centra style model not the only way to run these kinds of stores these days in ireland?

cookie.monster

the likes of musgraves, bwg(spar/mace), barrys of mallow(costcutter/quikpick), londis are changing how they do business and are taking on the same centralised distribution model that supervalu/centra operate i know this for a fact as i work as a rep for the kerry group and we are hugely affected with redundancies and depot closures, this will be a make or break situation for some shops and there will more than likely be a drop off with some stores having to close, if your friend attaches himself/herself to one of these suppliers with a central billing account they will be subject to either minimum spend per week or minimum case quantity per delivery depending on the supplier they go with.
to be honest i think your friend is off there head to be trying to get into a tough market that is convenience and the first 3 months of any shop opening is the make or break time i know this from experience over the years and have seen lots of shops open and close with my time as a rep on the road and its usually within the first 3 months of being open.

Bandara

cookie.monster wrote: »

this will be a make or break situation for some shops and there will more than likely be a drop off with some stores having to close, if your friend attaches himself/herself to one of these suppliers with a central billing account they will be subject to either minimum spend per week or minimum case quantity per delivery depending on the supplier they go with. /quote]

Slightly of topic but its interesting reading your own perspective as a industry insider on the central distribution roll outs as against my own (as a owner of convenience stores).

From my own business viewpoint it's brilliant that Kerry is now gone centralised distribution, far better for us to control our product lines and stocks, we can receive our complete chill order all at once which saves time and money with staffing.

There is no minimum spend at all with the BWG (Spar/Mace etc) Group, there is a minimum free delivery quantity of 10 cases, which even the smallest shop in the country would do in a week across the huge range of products available across the chill ranges from the Kilshane depot. We can make that 10 cases up from a massive range of raw meats, cooked meats, cheeses, juices, dairy drinks, fresh cakes, bread, milk, yogurt products etc etc. Ten cases is extremely easy, I'd comfortably average between 30-40 cases a week in a 900 sq ft store.

Margin controls are better, no more having to watch the reps sending in stuff you don't want, no more making us take flashed product at fixed 18-20% margins (a practice introduced by Kerry a few years ago- and a massive mistake which they tried to reverse but too late). No more the delivery van not having a product you anyways stock on board, resulting you having to take a substitute product and you have to replace sels, relay the section etc etc

It's obviously very hard for the loss of jobs and depots that will enviably close as a result of this, but it's huge progress for the retailers and one that all the ones I speak to are really extremely happy with.

Regarding the general issue of the symbol groups vs the independents, with some specialist exceptions Symbol Groups are the only real way to go. The huge range and ease of buying, the marketing power and the known name over the door is imo essential. You open 'Tommys Convenience Store' or your open a Spar or Centra, your survival possibilities are infinitely higher as the Symbol Group.

(No offence to you or your job whatsoever intended Cookie Monster - I realise your company faces redundancies).

ScouseMouse

Londis is a minimum 390 euro but will deliver 300 euro with a 10 euro delivery charge. The problem I have is they demand a delivery every week. Even if my shelves are full. Thats how I got burned on central chill distribution.

I recommend JR BYRNE cash and carry, Robinhood, Dublin. If you do go ahead, which I dont recommend, they are excellent. I find Musgrave, impersonal, ignorant and uncaring.

Bandara

superscouse wrote: »

Londis is a minimum 390 euro but will deliver 300 euro with a 10 euro delivery charge. The problem I have is they demand a delivery every week. Even if my shelves are full. Thats how I got burned on central chill distribution.

I recommend JR BYRNE cash and carry, Robinhood, Dublin. If you do go ahead, which I dont recommend, they are excellent. I find Musgrave, impersonal, ignorant and uncaring.

That's pretty harsh by Londis !

You have to get a delivery every week? It's your store, can't you just tell them your not doing it to keep them happy and binning the stock when it inevitably goes out of date on you???

In BWG we can order when ever we want (or not at all). Really surprised at that stance by Londis, it's really anti-retailer

cookie.monster

Bandara wrote: »

That's pretty harsh by Londis !

You have to get a delivery every week? It's your store, can't you just tell them your not doing it to keep them happy and binning the stock when it inevitably goes out of date on you???

In BWG we can order when ever we want (or not at all). Really surprised at that stance by Londis, it's really anti-retailer

yeah and if you don't order one week you will get the previous weeks order sent down as a standing order.

from talking to most of my customers 20% are unhappy with CD and not having a rep calling simply put because they are no longer getting SOR and will only be allowed 1% waste, also bandara the main reason kerry adopted the practice was all down to competition in the market were price flashing at a lower rate than kerry i.e. flynns fine foods from the north and to be honest products move better when people know there getting value for money!!!
as regards your call rate on CD some of the bigger stores would be getting two calls like they were from a van sales rep and not having certain lines on the van from my experience the main reason i won't stock a line is purely down to SOR as we were only left have max 8% SOR on a weekly basis.and for other obvious reason we may have not had a product line you require is because it may have not been available to us from the distribution centre in dublin.
i take it you did'nt get along with your rep?? if you were a customer of mine which i've had since i started with kerry nearly 8 years ago i could almost guarantee ya would'nt have had a problem with the way i run things on my route i look after all my customers and in fact our depot in my time we have all been on the same routes and none of the original crew that i started working with changed in them years we may have been given extra area to cover and gained new customers from other depots and from talking to them they were delighted with seeing the same person week in week out as they used to see different faces from the depot i took in area from.
i hope ye don't miss the van sales rep too much as its quickly becoming extinct lol

ScouseMouse

Its interesting what you say about Kerry. I have an issue at the moment where I am between a rock and a hard place.

Cannot go chill central due to 300 EVERY week requirement and when you go to musgraves, they dont have the stock. Last Saturday, MG had one type of sliced ham for sale and one type of gold medal sausages. I got what I could. Ran out Monday. Tuesday morning Denny van arrives with sandwiches. I begged him for stock COD as MG had none. Sorry, cannot do, not allowed.

I had no stock of Denny ham, but a van full outside my door. Rang rep, sorry, cannot sell to you, not even quietly COD.

Fecking ejits/dopes/******

OP. I dont think you have ANY idea what you are getting into......

Bandara

superscouse wrote: »

Its interesting what you say about Kerry. I have an issue at the moment where I am between a rock and a hard place.

Cannot go chill central due to 300 EVERY week requirement and when you go to musgraves, they dont have the stock. Last Saturday, MG had one type of sliced ham for sale and one type of gold medal sausages. I got what I could. Ran out Monday. Tuesday morning Denny van arrives with sandwiches. I begged him for stock COD as MG had none. Sorry, cannot do, not allowed.

I had no stock of Denny ham, but a van full outside my door. Rang rep, sorry, cannot sell to you, not even quietly COD.

Fecking ejits/dopes/******

OP. I dont think you have ANY idea what you are getting into......

Scouse,

I pretty much stopped dealing with Kerry as it was just a pain.

If you have a deli you could buy some bits off Carrolls cuisine, they have twice weekly van service which carries onboard Carrolls prepack ham (flashed €2.19 at 28% with full returns). They also do the prepack take home lasagne and few other items that sell quite well for me. Again full returns.

cookie.monster

superscouse wrote: »

Its interesting what you say about Kerry. I have an issue at the moment where I am between a rock and a hard place.

Cannot go chill central due to 300 EVERY week requirement and when you go to musgraves, they dont have the stock. Last Saturday, MG had one type of sliced ham for sale and one type of gold medal sausages. I got what I could. Ran out Monday. Tuesday morning Denny van arrives with sandwiches. I begged him for stock COD as MG had none. Sorry, cannot do, not allowed.

I had no stock of Denny ham, but a van full outside my door. Rang rep, sorry, cannot sell to you, not even quietly COD.

Fecking ejits/dopes/******

OP. I dont think you have ANY idea what you are getting into......

i know exactly where your coming from i had customers of mine in same position as yourself and would have loved to had been able to sell into them as they were very good customers and always bought good amount of stock from me and gave back very little, us reps are also stuck between a rock and a hard place with regards this.

cookie.monster

Bandara wrote: »

Scouse,

I pretty much stopped dealing with Kerry as it was just a pain.

If you have a deli you could buy some bits off Carrolls cuisine, they have twice weekly van service which carries onboard Carrolls prepack ham (flashed €2.19 at 28% with full returns). They also do the prepack take home lasagne and few other items that sell quite well for me. Again full returns.

how was dealing with kerry such a pain enlighten me?? 90% of the products on your chill wall are kerry products, if its just regards your profit margins then your just being plain and simply a greedy shop owner who wants the best of both worlds!!! would you rather higher profit margin and no SOR or an average margin of 20% with SOR coz it can't be done both ways, the main reason for van sales being reduced and kerry goin on board CD is with regards high running cost of having a fleet of 130 vans on the road throughout the country

DubTony

Deleted User wrote: »

Is the Spar or Centra style model not the only way to run these kinds of stores these days in ireland?

Yup. For sure. Independent is for those with very deep pockets, or decades of good will.

superscouse wrote: »

Its interesting what you say about Kerry. I have an issue at the moment where I am between a rock and a hard place.

Cannot go chill central due to 300 EVERY week requirement and when you go to musgraves, they dont have the stock.

superscouse wrote: »

Londis is a minimum 390 euro but will deliver 300 euro with a 10 euro delivery charge. The problem I have is they demand a delivery every week. Even if my shelves are full. Thats how I got burned on central chill distribution.

I see ADM Londis are still looking after fleecing their customers victims.

Bandara wrote: »

Scouse,

I pretty much stopped dealing with Kerry as it was just a pain.

If you have a deli you could buy some bits off Carrolls cuisine, they have twice weekly van service which carries onboard Carrolls prepack ham (flashed €2.19 at 28% with full returns). They also do the prepack take home lasagne and few other items that sell quite well for me. Again full returns.

+1 on this. If Carrolls will deliver outside central distribution I'd use them. A good driver will be happy to keep stock on the truck as well if you call him early in the day and give him an order. All my guy ever wanted was the odd cup of coffee from me.

And in fairness to Kerry, I always found them to be excellent, as long as they had the stock.

cookie.monster

hey dubtony so tell me your bad story so??

DubTony

cookie.monster wrote: »

hey dubtony so tell me your bad story so??

:D:D

Over and done with Cookie Monster. (Well, except the hangover). If you want a recap my local pub has a couple of empty stools. You're buying.

Iwernia

What region is your friend thinking of opening?

cookie.monster

DubTony wrote: »

:D:D

Over and done with Cookie Monster. (Well, except the hangover). If you want a recap my local pub has a couple of empty stools. You're buying.

no probs will be loaded soon with a redundancy payment lol

ScouseMouse

And the saga continues.....

Three times in two weeks, we have been to Musgrave cash and carry and they have no stock. Chargehand says Kerry leave them short and do inappropriate subs. Kerry says Musgrave dont order enough.

I sit here without a slice of ham in the shop......

I just rang the senior Kerry rep. He is investigating......

Bandara

superscouse wrote: »

And the saga continues.....

Three times in two weeks, we have been to Musgrave cash and carry and they have no stock. Chargehand says Kerry leave them short and do inappropriate subs. Kerry says Musgrave dont order enough.

I sit here without a slice of ham in the shop......

I just rang the senior Kerry rep. He is investigating......

Can you use Green Park foods ? They do van sales afaik ?

cookie.monster

superscouse wrote: »

And the saga continues.....

Three times in two weeks, we have been to Musgrave cash and carry and they have no stock. Chargehand says Kerry leave them short and do inappropriate subs. Kerry says Musgrave dont order enough.

I sit here without a slice of ham in the shop......

I just rang the senior Kerry rep. He is investigating......

are you a daybreak store and gone CD?? with regards stocks we do a daily order for delivery to us during the night so we have stock for next days business, our central distribution centre in dublin is operated by PRL as it was outsourced three years ago, we have the same gripe with regards not getting certain stocks as they may not be available and we don't find this out until we hop into our trucks the next morning, as regards musgraves they generally have to contact the rep via phone or my sending a fax to the depot with there order. with regards CD we're finding generally from walking in to stores to see if the retailer is ok with there ordering that they are not ordering enough and being cautious and in my view this is damaging there business!! granted there not getting SOR from musgraves

cookie.monster

Bandara wrote: »

Can you use Green Park foods ? They do van sales afaik ?

don't you mean green farm foods?? i've never come across a van fleet for that company but i know they operate through CD

niallweb1

Look into ... eurogeneral[dot].ie and MD Burns top quality products low prices great margins.

ScouseMouse

cookie.monster wrote: »

are you a daybreak store and gone CD?? with regards stocks we do a daily order for delivery to us during the night so we have stock for next days business, our central distribution centre in dublin is operated by PRL as it was outsourced three years ago, we have the same gripe with regards not getting certain stocks as they may not be available and we don't find this out until we hop into our trucks the next morning, as regards musgraves they generally have to contact the rep via phone or my sending a fax to the depot with there order. with regards CD we're finding generally from walking in to stores to see if the retailer is ok with there ordering that they are not ordering enough and being cautious and in my view this is damaging there business!! granted there not getting SOR from musgraves

Ask eamonn.....

cookie.monster

superscouse wrote: »

Ask eamonn.....

who is eamonn??

ScouseMouse

Kerry rep dublin

cookie.monster

superscouse wrote: »

Kerry rep dublin

i would only i,m located in the waterford depot and would'nt know him personally