Kilkenny v Tipp, SHC Final Replay, Sat 27/09 @ 5pm

Xenophile

Congrats to the Cats.

Saint Kieran should be immediately named as the Patron Saint of Cats.

Mountainlad

allthedoyles wrote: »

Noel Skehan has 9 All-Ireland medals and he won them just as fast as any other of the above players 1999 -2014

21 years is not as fast as 15 I'm afraid. Point taken but still it's a pretty unique achievement, Cody has 10 as Manager now. I'd be happy to say we won't see it again.

Moneymaker

Was at the game today with most of mothers side of the family(all Tipp)

Not a single one of us felt Tipp deserved anything and all agreed Kilkenny were the better team.

We all thought Brian Gavin had a terrible game in general, not just for one side.

Buckley, Joyce, Colin Fennelly were the pick of the KK lads imo.

Brendan Maher and Kieran Bergin Tipp's best players. None of Tipp's forwards hurled at all. It was clear Cody had a gameplan and EoS went for the same again and didn't have a Plan B when it wasn't working.

Congrats Kilkenny. Gave an exhibition in hooking, blocking and fielding. No team ever has perfected those skills like Kilkenny.

Mountainlad

mickmackey1 wrote: »

Clare have equally as good hurlers but didn't have the motivation after just one All-Ireland. KK have several lads with 5, 6 or more but keep coming back again and again, truly a great generation.

And their domination has nothing to with resources or population, its just the sheer power of their hurling culture, which all serious fans wil acknowledge and applaud.

In fairness, I doubt Kilkenny's average age was as young when they won in 2000, and Kilkenny did not win the all-ireland in 2001 you might recall.

Not for a second am I saying they'll achieve as much, just there is an awful lot of BS about this now. People writing off Clare's all ireland last year because they didn't beat Kilkenny is like saying this all-ireland isn't impressive because Kilkenny didn't beat the Munster champions...it's a ludicrous claim.

BarryD

mickmackey1 wrote: »

Clare have equally as good hurlers but didn't have the motivation after just one All-Ireland. KK have several lads with 5, 6 or more but keep coming back again and again...

Open draw, no seeding, no backdoor - that'd be the best motivation for the other counties. There'd be more uncertainty then and a sense then that things might fall your way.

Rightwing

Tipp were the better team in the 1st half but completely faded in the 2nd. KK deserved it and should have won by more. A poor final overall.

MfMan

For all the subs EoS made, how he left on Bonnar Maher on for the entire match defies belief. Touch and ability completely deserted him. How Cody withdrew M Fennelly and Richie Hogan, and left on John Power, Larkin, Colin Fennelly (anonymous for the first half) is equally strange.

El Inho

is the hotel on tonight?

allthedoyles

El Inho wrote: »

is the hotel on tonight?

I know Kilkenny fellas that went to City-west today and no further .

So team or no team , the hotel is definately on.

Sunday Game is on tomorrow night at 9.30 so presume this is also the victory banquet from the hotel

El Inho

allthedoyles wrote: »

I know Kilkenny fellas that went to City-west today and no further .

So team or no team , the hotel is definately on.

Sunday Game is on tomorrow night at 9.30 so presume this is also the victory banquet from the hotel

was thinking that meself, but apparently they advertised it after the match...no matter...im sure they'll cover it tomorrow so.

Mountainlad

MfMan wrote: »

For all the subs EoS made, how he left on Bonnar Maher on for the entire match defies belief. Touch and ability completely deserted him. How Cody withdrew M Fennelly and Richie Hogan, and left on John Power, Larkin, Colin Fennelly (anonymous for the first half) is equally strange.

John Power scored the winning goal, and a point second half. Colin Fennelly scored 0-3 in the second half, justified? Thought Richie Power and Colin Fennelly had Tipp at sixes and sevens for the start of the second half.

citykat

wobbles wrote: »

Super finish to a great game. Any team could have took it on the day.

I expect a double announcment of Cody/Shefflin retirement after today.

Cody's going nowhere. Henry'll go alright.

El Inho

on the Saturday Night show so tis.

citykat

daisybelle2008 wrote: »

Fair play to Kilkenny, they always set the template for how to win a match. Small county, big hurlers. Tipperary are the only team to beat them in an an all-Ireland in recent times. As a Clare woman I loved our all Ireland victory last year, but we didn't beat Kilkenny. Fair play to both counties today.

Doesn't matter who ye beat. All Ireland is an All Ireland.

keeponhurling

It looked on TV that Gearoid Ryan and Michael Fennelly played very deep , was this how they lined out at the start ?

Brian017

citykat wrote: »

Doesn't matter who ye beat. All Ireland is an All Ireland.

True, but an All Ireland win over the aul' enemy makes it that much sweeter

citykat

MfMan wrote: »

For all the subs EoS made, how he left on Bonnar Maher on for the entire match defies belief. Touch and ability completely deserted him.

Says he from the comfort of his chair. Bonnar was outhurled by the motm but never gave up. Ffs he was in the running for HOTY. Eos was never going to take him off and rightly so.

wazzer1

It wasnt happening for Maher and he should have been taken off. Richie Hogan will probaly get HOTY, yet when he went out of the game what did Cody do? Haul him off. Thats the difference on the line, and hence why Cody has 10 all irelands as manager.

citykat

wazzer1 wrote: »

It wasnt happening for Maher and he should have been taken off. Richie Hogan will probaly get HOTY, yet when he went out of the game what did Cody do? Haul him off. Thats the difference on the line, and hence why Cody has 10 all irelands as manager.

What a difference victory makes. Cody was lambasted for not making a change til the 66th min in the drawn game. Now he's Obi Won.

Rightwing

wazzer1 wrote: »

It wasnt happening for Maher and he should have been taken off. Richie Hogan will probaly get HOTY, yet when he went out of the game what did Cody do? Haul him off. Thats the difference on the line, and hence why Cody has 10 all irelands as manager.

He brought Shefflin who hardly touched the ball. Great players can be out of a game, and bang, score a goal out of nowhere. Hindsight is great.

Tipp were well below par today.

jacko

citykat wrote: »

Says he from the comfort of his chair. Bonnar was outhurled by the motm but never gave up. Ffs he was in the running for HOTY. Eos was never going to take him off and rightly so.

i dont see any merit in this quote. What about Cody taking off Hogan, surely Hogan can have as much if not more of a claim to HOTY. he was take off and rightly so. Bonnar had a bad bad day and should have been changed.

Cody not afraid to make decisions. thats why kk are champs

Mountainlad

jacko wrote: »

i dont see any merit in this quote. What about Cody taking off Hogan, surely Hogan can have as much if not more of a claim to HOTY. he was take off and rightly so. Bonnar had a bad bad day and should have been changed.

Cody not afraid to make decisions. thats why kk are champs

What I'd like to know is if the talk of Bonnar not being fully fit were true? If they were then I think it was poor he stayed on the field through out. But it's strange the sub choices as well. Denis Maher didn't get a look in the last two games, seemed to be exactly what Tipp needed there today although I doubt myself he'd have been able to make a difference to get them over the line.

They were just bet all over the field. And still only lost by three, that's what I can't really get over. I know it's immaterial how much you win by, but from watching it I felt Kilkenny were far in ascendancy today but didn't bury Tipp.

citykat

jacko wrote: »

i dont see any merit in this quote. What about Cody taking off Hogan, surely Hogan can have as much if not more of a claim to HOTY. he was take off and rightly so. Bonnar had a bad bad day and should have been changed.

Cody not afraid to make decisions. thats why kk are champs

Hindsight is 20/20. Talk around here is that Hogan was carrying an injury. He definitely didn't look himself today. All very well taking a lad off once you're 100% the lad coming on is going to be better.

citykat

Mountainlad wrote: »

What I'd like to know is if the talk of Bonnar not being fully fit were true? If they were then I think it was poor he stayed on the field through out. But it's strange the sub choices as well. Denis Maher didn't get a look in the last two games, seemed to be exactly what Tipp needed there today although I doubt myself he'd have been able to make a difference to get them over the line.

They were just bet all over the field. And still only lost by three, that's what I can't really get over. I know it's immaterial how much you win by, but from watching it I felt Kilkenny were far in ascendancy today but didn't bury Tipp.

There was also talk of Brendan Maher carrying an injury but he looked fine to me. He played well today. Joyce didn't let Bonnar get the ball. Maybe he was hampered by injury. If he was I'd be surprised at Shea leaving him on for the entire game.

citykat

keeponhurling wrote: »

It looked on TV that Gearoid Ryan and Michael Fennelly played very deep , was this how they lined out at the start ?

Fennelly played MF vs McGrath. Ryan lined up against Buckley.

Don't Chute!

BarryD wrote: »

I'd say the average neutral punter is fed up with the 'same teams winning all the time'. Mind you, the hurling champ was miles better than the football but it ain't great at the end of the day for Kilkenny to dominate over so many recent years with a couple of blips. There'd be lads there, fine hurlers on good teams who haven't a single All Ireland medal to their names after years of toil. Whilst there'd be Kilkenny lads who probably can't find space on the dresser for them..

The logical way out of this as far as I can see as a not very knowledgeable punter is for a single All Ireland draw for the hurling championship and NO backdoor - if you're bet your bet. Try that for say five years and let Kilkenny takes their chances against some of the Munster teams early on in the tournament.

06 cork
07 limerick
08 waterford
09 tipp
11 tipp
14 tipp

As far as i can tell they are all munster teams that kilkenny took their chances with!

Mountainlad

citykat wrote: »

There was also talk of Brendan Maher carrying an injury but he looked fine to me. He played well today. Joyce didn't let Bonnar get the ball. Maybe he was hampered by injury. If he was I'd be surprised at Shea leaving him on for the entire game.

Very true, Brendan Maher was excellent. Your probably right, I guess we don't know what's going on behind the scenes I'd say O Shea had his reasons.

Even Conor O Mahony coming on at the end though I wondered what real difference that was going to make, thought Tipp took a long time to make a change, probably got a bit too comfortable with players form in previous matches. But as you said, you have to be sure about the player you're bringing on being capable of doing a good job replacing the one coming off.

jacko

lots of players from tipp just didnt play or simply weren't let play by KK. kk really smothered them but would have to question why tipp weren't trying to get players into the game more. Corbett was completely anonymous, I only remember the pass for the goal. his days are numbered.

Tipp defence was good if slightly naive at times, kk defence better. thats the difference. yes its easy in hindsight and if tipp had a bit of better luck and maybe scored 1 or 2 of the goals it would be a different story. but then again got to credit kk, they hooked, blocked and didn't allow tipp to pick off the scores like they did first time out.

Gryire

jacko wrote: »

lots of players from tipp just didnt play or simply weren't let play by KK. kk really smothered them but would have to question why tipp weren't trying to get players into the game more. Corbett was completely anonymous, I only remember the pass for the goal. his days are numbered.

Tipp defence was good if slightly naive at times, kk defence better. thats the difference. yes its easy in hindsight and if tipp had a bit of better luck and maybe scored 1 or 2 of the goals it would be a different story. but then again got to credit kk, they hooked, blocked and didn't allow tipp to pick off the scores like they did first time out.

I think the way Gavin referees suits Kilkenny. A lot of 'tugs' are allowed.at to.es today some Tipp forwards were crowded and small fouls committed but Gavin just let's these go. Suits Kilkenny. Barry Kelly would have blown a lot of these and Tipp may have won.

citykat

Mountainlad wrote: »

Very true, Brendan Maher was excellent. Your probably right, I guess we don't know what's going on behind the scenes I'd say O Shea had his reasons.

Even Conor O Mahony coming on at the end though I wondered what real difference that was going to make, thought Tipp took a long time to make a change, probably got a bit too comfortable with players form in previous matches. But as you said, you have to be sure about the player you're bringing on being capable of doing a good job replacing the one coming off.

He took McGrath off at 53 mins I think. I thought he hurled well up to that, scored 3 pts. Delighted to see him going off tbh.

tastyt

Does anyone else think bonnar is immune to criticism from fans and the media?? Don't get me wrong he's a top player with a great attitude but it's because of his style and heart that even when he has a poor game that he gets a free pass from some whereas when it's lar or callinan they get dogs abuse.

GerB40

I'm a Tipp man and I was surrounded by fellow Tipp folks on the hill. When Shefflin came on I couldn't believe the booing and abuse he got from some of the Tipp lads, it was embarrassing.
I've often heard of the the bad reputation Tipperary fans have, today I witnessed it first hand.
It must be noted that this was a small but loud group but it still left a bad taste....

Fair play to Kilkenny, played better and won as a result. Can't argue with that.
This Tipp team have a lot of potential and plenty of young talent, Cathal Barrett continues to astound me.. Bring on 2015 but for now, enjoy the victory KK

tastyt

GerB40 wrote: »

I'm a Tipp man and I was surrounded by fellow Tipp folks on the hill. When Shefflin came on I couldn't believe the booing and abuse he got from some of the Tipp lads, it was embarrassing.
I've often heard of the the bad reputation Tipperary fans have, today I witnessed it first hand.
It must be noted that this was a small but loud group but it still left a bad taste....

Fair play to Kilkenny, played better and won as a result. Can't argue with that.
This Tipp team have a lot of potential and plenty of young talent, Cathal Barrett continues to astound me.. Bring on 2015 but for now, enjoy the victory KK

Shameful if true. Any proper sports fan respects shefflin for the great he is, they were more than likely dopes on a day out who wouldn't know a sliotar from a tennis ball

Don't Chute!

GerB40 wrote: »

I'm a Tipp man and I was surrounded by fellow Tipp folks on the hill. When Shefflin came on I couldn't believe the booing and abuse he got from some of the Tipp lads, it was embarrassing.
I've often heard of the the bad reputation Tipperary fans have, today I witnessed it first hand.
It must be noted that this was a small but loud group but it still left a bad taste....

Fair play to Kilkenny, played better and won as a result. Can't argue with that.
This Tipp team have a lot of potential and plenty of young talent, Cathal Barrett continues to astound me.. Bring on 2015 but for now, enjoy the victory KK

I wouldn't worry about nonsense like that every county has people like them!

Mountainlad

citykat wrote: »

He took McGrath off at 53 mins I think. I thought he hurled well up to that, scored 3 pts. Delighted to see him going off tbh.

Yeah didn't get that myself. Himself, Brendan Maher and the goal seemed the only reason Kilkenny weren't in control on the scoreboard at half time.

citykat

GerB40 wrote: »

It must be noted that this was a small group

KK

You got it there in a nutshell.

jacko

Gryire wrote: »

I think the way Gavin referees suits Kilkenny. A lot of 'tugs' are allowed.at to.es today some Tipp forwards were crowded and small fouls committed but Gavin just let's these go. Suits Kilkenny. Barry Kelly would have blown a lot of these and Tipp may have won.

yea good point. lots of crowding today. was nearly like what we're used to with the football these days. a different ref could have seen it completely differently and we could have ended up wit a game of frees instead of a game of hurling.

no doubt cody knew what they could get away wit and how to plan. well it worked and more power to them.
i dont think tipp can have any gripes, they just didn't perform to their full potential. I'd be surprised if you asked every tipp player today if they played well enough to deserve winning an all ireland if the majority of them said yes.

citykat

jacko wrote: »

I'd be surprised if you asked every tipp player today if they played well enough to deserve winning an all ireland if the majority of them said yes.

Wow. Well I think it's time to show us your medals time here. IMO both teams are warriors. They owe NOTHING to nobody. Shame on anybody for saying otherwise.

GFish

GerB40 wrote: »

I'm a Tipp man and I was surrounded by fellow Tipp folks on the hill. When Shefflin came on I couldn't believe the booing and abuse he got from some of the Tipp lads, it was embarrassing.

Agreed
No need for that kind of hillbilly reaction.

citykat

citykat wrote: »

Wow. Well I think it's time to show us your medals time here. IMO both teams are warriors. They owe NOTHING to nobody. Shame on anybody for saying otherwise.

Fair play Citykat, great comment.

The better team won today ive no problems there. Ye beat us in two critical areas - work rate and reading of the game. Kilkenny traditionally seem to win games between minute 35 and 50 and i think thats when most damage was done today as i feared at the time could happen. Well done

allthedoyles

allthedoyles wrote: »

Just seen Brian Cody interview and he raises his eyebrows on hearing Kieran Joyce was Man of the Match .

Joyce was good but for me Buckley was fanstastic.

citykat

Deleted User wrote: »

Fair play Citykat, great comment.

The better team won today ive no problems there. Ye beat us in two critical areas - work rate and reading of the game. Kilkenny traditionally seem to win games between minute 35 and 50 and i think thats when most damage was done today as i feared at the time could happen. Well done

Very sporting of you TG. However, there was only 2 pts in it at 69 mins. I was expecting a draw at that stage. IMO there was f***all between the teams.

jacko

citykat wrote: »

Wow. Well I think it's time to show us your medals time here. IMO both teams are warriors. They owe NOTHING to nobody. Shame on anybody for saying otherwise.

I'm not saying they owe us or anybody anything. both teams gave their all and that can never be doubted. some days things just dont work, we've all had them and its as frustrating as hell. really feel for the players today, it must be really tough on them, but thats the nature of sport, there has to be winners and losers

allthedoyles

Eddie Brennan said before match that there is only the hop of a ball between the two teams .

( but of course the hop seems to be in KK direction most of the time )

allthedoyles

allthedoyles wrote: »

Eddie Brennan said before match that there is only the hop of a ball between the two teams .

( but of course the hop seems to be in KK direction most of the time )

Because they anticipate it to be fair. Our forwards just dont work in the same sync as theirs. To give you a better indication of the work rate between the two have a look at the stats and in particular 'hooks, blocks, and tackles'. That's the difference. I have always felt that Sheedy placed better emphasis on this side of the game whereas Eamon O'Shea never really did

MisterAnarchy

Gryire wrote: »

I think the way Gavin referees suits Kilkenny. A lot of 'tugs' are allowed.at to.es today some Tipp forwards were crowded and small fouls committed but Gavin just let's these go. Suits Kilkenny. Barry Kelly would have blown a lot of these and Tipp may have won.

Firstly Gavin shouldnt be refereeing a match of this stature ,he is only 37 but at least 2-3 stone overweight and was miles behind the play today.
Whats the GAA's obsession with refs from the midlands anyway ?
Why not a Munster referee today ?

The main problem with the game refereed by Gavin a la Cody is that when refs see a foul they play an advantage to keep play moving. Often there is no advantage because if you have already been hit by one defender you are very likely to surrender possession to the next one or hit a weak shot.
Frees are frees and should be given.

Cody has laid down the law to Refs/GAA with his annual whinge that manliness is in danger of going out of the game.
Ignore the rules. Let us play our way.

Now, in order to compete at this level ,all teams have to ratchet up the physical attrition to stop opponents and many matches are reduced to serial scrums,pulling,dragging like today's match.
I've nothing against good hard tackling but there's nothing manly about some of the dark arts that have been allowed to quietly creep into hurling these days.

Gryire

Gryire wrote: »

I think the way Gavin referees suits Kilkenny. A lot of 'tugs' are allowed.at to.es today some Tipp forwards were crowded and small fouls committed but Gavin just let's these go. Suits Kilkenny. Barry Kelly would have blown a lot of these and Tipp may have won.

Im no fan of Gavin but ive little complaints tonight to be honest. The referee didnt lose us that game and gave us a considerable amount of decisions. We lost the game. The big criticism id have of him though is how indecisive he was. He was lagging behind the play and his attitude was 'if in doubt, give a throw ball'

randd1

Gryire wrote: »

I think the way Gavin referees suits Kilkenny. A lot of 'tugs' are allowed.at to.es today some Tipp forwards were crowded and small fouls committed but Gavin just let's these go. Suits Kilkenny. Barry Kelly would have blown a lot of these and Tipp may have won.

So what are you saying? That Barry Kelly should blow every time a Kilkenny hurler goes near the ball? That he should do a number Kilkenny when he can? Is that what hurling is becoming?

As for the refs, what about the Tipp fouls today that went unpunished? Or the fact that Tipp got a nothing penalty today? Was that not letting it go and favouring Tipp in those situations? Is it acceptable when its against Kilkenny but not for Kilkenny?

Seriously, I wish people would just get over the "Kilkenny only win by fouling and should be punished" bulls**t that's peddled around by bitter tw*ts that know nothing about hurling.
Kilkenny are no better or worse than any side out there for fouling, cynicism or off the ball stuff. The only difference is the have the hurling, and the hurlers on their panel, to back it up.

Seriously, calling for refs to punish Kilkenny because they're is akin to saying, "they're too good, lets punish them for it". It demeans the sport.

jacko

Deleted User wrote: »

Because they anticipate it to be fair. Our forwards just dont work in the same sync as theirs.

not sure what you're trying to imply here. if its that kk are aware of what they can and cant do based on who the ref is then, its the same ref for both teams so, its a level playing field

GerB40

GerB40 wrote: »

I'm a Tipp man and I was surrounded by fellow Tipp folks on the hill. When Shefflin came on I couldn't believe the booing and abuse he got from some of the Tipp lads, it was embarrassing.
I've often heard of the the bad reputation Tipperary fans have, today I witnessed it first hand.
It must be noted that this was a small but loud group but it still left a bad taste....

Fair play to Kilkenny, played better and won as a result. Can't argue with that.
This Tipp team have a lot of potential and plenty of young talent, Cathal Barrett continues to astound me.. Bring on 2015 but for now, enjoy the victory KK

The hill is full of drunk youngsters these times. I was there for the 2009 final and the carry on of both sets of fans was painful. half 12 in the day and 15/16 year olds locked out of their heads.