ROKEBY & HAWKRIDGE [Article] Lucan estate full of €1.7m mansions remains a ghost town

Eric Cartman

gaius c wrote: »

You'd be surprised at how little value some people put on gardens. Have a brother-in-law with a nice west facing garden on their fairly big house and they only venture into that garden for two reasons.
1. To hang out the washing.
2. To cut the grass.

Either way, those house prices look a bit ambitious now but there will be a price level at which somebody won't mind the small garden and buy the house.

its not really about the gardens per se , but buying a 5 bed house for 500k plus and being able to touch your neighbours wall with a sweeping brush out a side window would put a lot of people off.

the_syco

gaius c wrote: »

1. To hang out the washing.
2. To cut the grass.

If you don't need a garden, apartments may suit some such people, but having the ability to hang out the wash is great.

Oh, and I don't think there is any garden per se for many of them?

The_Conductor

the_syco wrote: »

If you don't need a garden, apartments may suit some such people, but having the ability to hang out the wash is great.

Oh, and I don't think there is any garden per se for many of them?

Big time.
Wait until you have 4 clothes horses drying clothes simultaneously- and the children on their third change of clothes of the day- and you'll rapidly appreciate the simple luxury of having a clothes line outside.......... Its a very under appreciated luxury.

awec

The_Conductor wrote: »

Big time.
Wait until you have 4 clothes horses drying clothes simultaneously- and the children on their third change of clothes of the day- and you'll rapidly appreciate the simple luxury of having a clothes line outside.......... Its a very under appreciated luxury.

We live in an apartment and without the spare bedroom to dry clothes in we would go crazy. At least we can put them out of sight.

One of the bigger annoyances in apartment living is having to hang your clothes in your living room / hall / somewhere they are constantly in your way.

Rew

Wow those gardens are a joke, 1 house has a proper garden and 1 has an OK one the rest are pathetic.

gaius c

Eric Cartman wrote: »

its not really about the gardens per se , but buying a 5 bed house for 500k plus and being able to touch your neighbours wall with a sweeping brush out a side window would put a lot of people off.

Oh I agree. The price is too high and will come down to what people who want a big house and tiny garden are willing to pay.

But there will be willing buyers once that price is right.

the_syco

awec wrote: »

We live in an apartment and without the spare bedroom to dry clothes in we would go crazy. At least we can put them out of sight.

You closing the windows and door, and leaving the dehumidifier on?

gaius c wrote: »

Oh I agree. The price is too high and will come down to what people who want a big house and tiny garden are willing to pay.

But there will be willing buyers once that price is right.

When you bring it down to affordable, they won't buy it as heating will cost too much.

Actually, RAS house the entire place?

awec

the_syco wrote: »

You closing the windows and door, and leaving the dehumidifier on?


When you bring it down to affordable, they won't buy it as heating will cost too much.

Actually, RAS house the entire place?

Nah, just leave the vents open (or the window itself in summer).

The room is well aired so there's no damp issue, the door is usually left open a lot of the time too.

jamescullen

So oflynn construction are looking for 850k for some of the houses in rokeby park.... 4 beds of circa 2000 sq foot. does anyone else think this is a bit crazy? People who pay this kind of money for a house of this size in lucan are definitely losing the run of themselves imo. Posters on this board are way off the mark who think 500k is the value of large houses in lucan. But 800K is surely celtic tiger fairytale nonsense. The purchasers of these houses will have plenty of time to mull over their debt mountain while stuck in the notorious Laraghcon traffic over the next 30 years.
I'm baffled.

The_Conductor

James- it depends on the location- and Laraghcon/Coldblow- is, and always has been, a desireable location.

Further- the simple fact of the matter is- there will be no further development in the immediate area- the surrounding lands are all zoned Green and/or Farming. There is a scarcity factor here.

These properties are nice, standalone properties, on just under a quarter acre each- built around a green. There are no cul-de-sacs and finicky little roadways- like you have in Laraghcon (this is partly why so many of the people on the waiting list for them- are pre-existing people living in Laraghcon- they see Rokeby as a logical step up on Laraghcon).

They are properly constructed, A BER rated, 4-6 bed houses- in a one off development in a desirable area.

I'd laugh at someone paying this sort of money in 'Hawkridge'- I can easily understand why someone would in Laraghcon/Coldblow though- you are comparing chalk with cheese.......

If I had the money (and I most certainly do not)- I'd be tempted- its the sort of a residential proposition you are not going to find in a desirable area for a long time to come again.

Vis-a-vis traffic- another 64 houses isn't going to massively impact the traffic on the Clonee Road- its the people who are using it as a rat run who are causing more trouble than anyone else. Yes- there is an issue with the traffic coming down from Laraghcon- but its a reflection of the amount of traffic trying to enter and leave Lucan village- than it is Laraghcon itself........ If you want to live in Dublin- you are going to have to accept that the traffic is worse than it was at the peak of the boom- and until we invest in public transport- its not going to get any better.......

jamescullen

I agree with most of what you say, though I wouldn't be so sure about future developments up there. I am told a builder bought the site across the road from Rokeby/Laraghcon. Given the scarcity of new homes I have no doubt he will be able to get planning permission, maybe even at a higher density. The Rokeby site and Laraghcon site were also zoned similarly. Also Rokeby isn't exactly very accessible to Dublin by public transport. I agree though that Hawkridge is much less exclusive.

The_Conductor

jamescullen wrote: »

I agree with most of what you say, though I wouldn't be so sure about future developments up there. I am told a builder bought the site across the road from Rokeby/Laraghcon. Given the scarcity of new homes I have no doubt he will be able to get planning permission, maybe even at a higher density. The Rokeby site and Laraghcon site were also zoned similarly. Also Rokeby isn't exactly very accessible to Dublin by public transport. I agree though that Hawkridge is much less exclusive.

If they were to develop Coldblow (the opposite side of the road)- the only way they'd get permission in my opinion is actually- as low density housing. Access to facilities is at a premium there- hence the purported 34m that was paid to the Stanley Brothers for access to Rokeby from Laraghcon- 12 years ago). Developing Coldblow- is a wholly different proposition to Laraghcon- and the ground works and facilities would be a completely different ballpark......

Keep in mind- the planning permission for the final phases of Adamstown on the other side of Lucan- have all been redrawn recently- and all at a lower density than had previously been granted permission for (in light of the abandonment on the light rail project etc).

The whole area has changed beyond all recognition from when I was a kid......

sapper

Theres no waiting list for Rokeby. The developer released some of phase 1 sale this week ahead of having a showhouse, seemingly to try and beat the downward market. The plan earlier this year was to release once the showhouses were built but these have been delayed and wont be there until Sep - in reality they will prob be built sooner but they dont launch in the summer apparently.

Unfortunately the houses that are in phase 1 are very close to the clonee road and also right beside Boyle Motors, which is basically a large yard full of abandoned cars, vans and one double decker bus. The houses looking over Boyle Motors will not have any special planting ie trees etc If I was going to drop 760k, I would wait until phase 2,3,4 which are further back and in some cases not overlooked. Also waiting could see prices drift down more, although the developer could just stick to their guns and wait it out. Then again not selling out of phase 1 could slow down the build of phases 2-4

The_Conductor

sapper wrote: »

Theres no waiting list for Rokeby. The developer released some of phase 1 sale this week ahead of having a showhouse, seemingly to try and beat the downward market. The plan earlier this year was to release once the showhouses were built but these have been delayed and wont be there until Sep - in reality they will prob be built sooner but they dont launch in the summer apparently.

Unfortunately the houses that are in phase 1 are very close to the clonee road and also right beside Boyle Motors, which is basically a large yard full of abandoned cars, vans and one double decker bus. The houses looking over Boyle Motors will not have any special planting ie trees etc If I was going to drop 760k, I would wait until phase 2,3,4 which are further back and in some cases not overlooked. Also waiting could see prices drift down more, although the developer could just stick to their guns and wait it out. Then again not selling out of phase 1 could slow down the build of phases 2-4

I don't know why I'm defending the developer- I should be asking for a commission.......

Boyle Motors- Martin Boyle has been there since the 1970s. Its not the deserted scrapyard you're making him and his company to be. He is a good decent mechanic. I've often gotten work done in there. He is a good decent salt of the earth guy.

There has always been significant planting between Laraghcon House's boundaries and Boyle Motors- this included separate Poplar hedges and mature Cypress hedges. These were pulled up by the developer- I had a look in when they were struggling to dig out the roots- it was some job. There is nothing to stop a person reconstituting a hedge along the 8 foot block wall separating the premises.

I was told the release was August- seems like its delayed a few weeks? There was a launch evening up at Sherry Fitz at Superquinn last Thursday- I wasn't able to make it. If someone was there- perhaps they can enlighten us.

Sherry Fitz have been given a list of interested parties along with a waiting list- by the developer- and are now managing it.

The nature of the development- is that all the properties- will have boundaries with adjoing property- they are being built around the boundary of the property- with a green area in the middle of the site. On the Clonee boundary side- you have Boyle Motors- and then Hemerycks- the whole way around to the Laraghcon side- which has poor boundary definitions with the Laraghcon estate (which they are trying to improve).

The market is changing- it does appear to be rapidly going south- the froth has gone. Some developments and some individual units- are making good money in the area- others are not. Even in the village- places like the Hermitage and the Village Weir- on either side of the road at the bridge- are having completely opposing fortunes- a 3 bed in one recently went for 70k over asking, and numerous 2 beds at 30% over sale prices achieved a year ago- whereas multiple 2 beds and a 3 bed- appear to be unsaleable in the other. As for Hill view across from St. Mary's Church- I see McDonald brothers have a unit in there for 6 months now- which means either there is something seriously wrong with it- or the asking price is just ott- in any event- it should have been reduced some time ago.

I've been looking at property in the area on behalf of family members for some time- and to be totally honest- am finding the market completely jekyl and hyde in nature- its not making sense.

jamescullen

. I agree with sapper. The developer is trying to get cash in the bank asap. The houses being sold are north facing and are looking onto that carpark/scrapyard. It doesn't matter how respectable the business is. Also anyone who buys in the first release will be living on a building site for the next few years because there is no other access for the site. Hardly ideal. Wait for the next phase...houses will probably be cheaper. At the very least won't be more expensive

The_Conductor

The developer has good reason for wanting to cash in- its a NAMA development- he is getting a commission of the sale price......

Does Sherry Fitz have a brochure?

sapper

The_Conductor wrote: »

The developer has good reason for wanting to cash in- its a NAMA development- he is getting a commission of the sale price......

Does Sherry Fitz have a brochure?

+1 on Boyle motors. Have used him myself a few times and he's great He does have a double decker bus in his yard though.....

jamescullen

Yeah sherry have a brochure. The internal layout of the houses isn't quite open plan.a bit unusual. I prefer the layout of laraghcon personally. The largest house type is around 2300 sq ft or so. All 4 beds. Main launch will be sept I believe. Nice houses but the prices seem to be 20percent too high imo.

sapper

The_Conductor wrote: »

The developer has good reason for wanting to cash in- its a NAMA development- he is getting a commission of the sale price......

Does Sherry Fitz have a brochure?

AFAIK O Flynn is out of Nama and was when he broke ground on rokeby.

I'm one of those interested people I guess but I was hoping for a bit more value for money and I know of a few others saying the same. Was at the info evening in Lucan - and of course they say they have loads and loads of interest.

A 2200 ft house recently went sale agreed in Laraghcon - was asking 675 and got (I hear) 750 which is a bit mad (and oddly the same price as the rokeby houses). Agreed the market around here is a bit weird - generally down but still the odd blip

jamescullen

Yeah, that last sale in laraghcon has the estate agents and developers licking their lips. Hope people don't get sucked into the property heist again. If you look at the property price register though, one anomalous sale price doesn't mean that oflynn et Al can charge what they like. Very few houses have sold in Lucan over 500k over the last few years.

The_Conductor

jamescullen wrote: »

Very few houses have sold in Lucan over 500k over the last few years.

Aside from Laraghcon- next door to Rokeby- which has consistently sold for these price types (and in some extreme cases- a multiple of them.........)........

One swallow does not a spring make. There is form though in Laraghcon/Rokeby for these prices.........

sapper

Anecdotally (and I've heard of this elsewhere) there are only one or two bona fide buyers these days for houses in Laraghcon - but that's all you need to keep prices up when there's only one house for sale. I think when there's 15-20 houses for sale in rokeby plus a few for sale in Laraghcon plus hawkridge it might be a different story

The_Conductor

sapper wrote: »

Anecdotally (and I've heard of this elsewhere) there are only one or two bona fide buyers these days for houses in Laraghcon - but that's all you need to keep prices up when there's only one house for sale. I think when there's 15-20 houses for sale in rokeby plus a few for sale in Laraghcon plus hawkridge it might be a different story

I'd well believe it- but all it takes are two interested parties to bid prices up to unreal levels.

I wouldn't worry about Hawkridge to be honest- but 64 houses in Rokeby alongside another 9 in Laraghcon- hitting the market together- and a market as sensitive/touchy as the current one, may be a bridge too far.......

NuckChorris1

Hawkridge houses 1-8 being sold on a "best bids" process later this month. Have since bid on another place but will definitely go up for a look and maybe try a cheeky bid. Probably not tho.

jamescullen

What is a best bids process?

NuckChorris1

Anyone interested makes a blind bid for what they think the house is worth. The best 8 bids get the houses. Would expect that highest bid gets first choice on which house and it works it's way down. They did something the same with Castlepark in Maynooth so just assuming that's how it works. They could also just ask for bids on a house by house basis and take the best offer on each one. Will be very interesting to see what the cheapest one goes for.

jamescullen

But are there minimum prices?

jamescullen

But are there minimum prices?

The_Conductor

jamescullen wrote: »

What is a best bids process?

Auction with no reserve as far as I know- bids may possibly be blind (aka without knowledge of the other bids)....... Google wasn't any help........

sapper

NuckChorris1 wrote: »

Hawkridge houses 1-8 being sold on a "best bids" process later this month. Have since bid on another place but will definitely go up for a look and maybe try a cheeky bid. Probably not tho.

Here's the letter attached - isn't a "best bids process" an auction? Very interesting - again smacks of desperation. Estate agents seem to shun launching new builds in the summer months so it's either now (which is a bit late - lots of people on hols now) or September. This crowd don't want to sell in Sep though as there will be 16 houses for sale in rokeby - seems like someone just realised this and is scrambling!

Big houses though, but lots of drawbacks as discussed on this thread. Obviously the big question is what the minimum will be.

I reckon the EA will be chasing q3 2014 prices at at least 300 a sq ft - ie minimum 950k. Which is mental but worth a shot right?

Would like to hear some opinions from anyone who goes...can't make either day myself (at 900k Id only be a rubbernecker anyway!)