Gambling Culture is Killing Ireland

DulchieLaois

aye, we always see people boasting how much they win but never about how much they lose

ArmaniJeanss

DulchieLaois wrote: »

aye, we always see people boasting how much they win but never about how much they lose

It'd be a strange thing to boast about.

SteelyDanJalapeno

Highflyer13 wrote: »

But how much did you lose?:P

Would have to check my tracker, point is, i've made 10K more than I've lost......

Bafucin

OP look after yourself don't worry about what the rest of us do.

TiltedBrain

TiltedBrain wrote: »

I've made over 10K last year on football, and touching 6K this year so far, come at me

TiltedBrain wrote: »

Would have to check my tracker, point is, i've made 10K more than I've lost......

Very impressive

What amount did you stake in total last year to make the €10K?

Also, presumably you didn't start gambling last year, what is your total P or L since you started tracking?

Highflyer13

TiltedBrain wrote: »

Would have to check my tracker, point is, i've made 10K more than I've lost......

Ha no, just joking with you. I used to play poker for a living and got asked that whenever I disclosed my profession. Of course its doable as long as your in control and tracking everything. Wider society thinks all gamblers are losers though.

Jawgap

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sbsquarepants

The Strawman Argument wrote: »

Isn't that where most the increase in gambling has came from since online gambling took off, small but consistent bets on football matches and the like?

I vividly remember thinking to myself one time, even if the bookies was open, there is no way I would walk in off the street at 3am and place a €4.86 accumulator on 4 j league matches, this is ridiculous. But then it came up and I won nearly €200, so I told myself to shut the fúck up!

FloatingVoter wrote: »

The lotto is a tax on stupidity. Given that I won €700,000 on it a few years back I am living proof.

Did you really?

Dayum

Everyone has their poison be it unhealthy food, gambling, cigarettes, alcohol, sex (mine is sex). I can't stop thinking about it. Torturous.

sbsquarepants

Are you a hot chick?

Peist2007

Joined a gambling site online in February 2008 and recently totted up where i stood overall after winning €7k on a 10 euro bet. I have withdrawn €14,500 more than i have deposited since February 2008. This would be about an average of €30 betting per week on football, gaa, golf, american football. No horses.

So, while gambling is a problem for some, it isnt for others and i do not want my government deciding for me what is or is not too dangerous. If people cannot sort themselves out and seek help if gambling is becoming too much of an addiction, then it really is their fault. Personal responsibility is being eroded nowadays too much in my opinion.

It reminds me of Bill Hicks talking about drugs and saying when he heard of the story of the guy who takes LSD and tries to jump of a building thinking he could fly -saying he was ruining the fun for everyone else.

eamonnq

Peist2007 wrote: »

Joined a gambling site online in February 2008 and recently totted up where i stood overall after winning €7k on a 10 euro bet. I have withdrawn €14,500 more than i have deposited since February 2008. This would be about an average of €30 betting per week on football, gaa, golf, american football. No horses.

Correct me if I have this wrong, but if you 'recently' won 7k (and this is part of the 14,500) then prior to this you would have won 7,500 over 6 years ( approx 1250 per year ).

Peist2007

eamonnq wrote: »

Correct me if I have this wrong, but if you 'recently' won 7k (and this is part of the 14,500) then prior to this you would have won 7,500 over 6 years ( approx 1250 per year ).

Not all of the 7k is part of the 14,500. Winning the 7k inspired me to have a trawl through an see where i stood. I knew i was in the black but post-7k win felt like the right time to see how much was in the black.

I would say that i was up €10k over 6 years. In terms of deposit/withdrawal. Lots of winnings would be recycled into other bets. I once went 9 months without depositing or withdrawing anything and was betting the entire time.

Donkey Oaty

Peist2007 wrote: »

Joined a gambling site online in February 2008 and recently totted up where i stood overall after winning €7k on a 10 euro bet.

Those are impressive figures - but do you gamble in any form whatsoever elsewhere, or is it purely restricted to that site?

Grayson

Peist2007 wrote: »

Joined a gambling site online in February 2008 and recently totted up where i stood overall after winning €7k on a 10 euro bet. I have withdrawn €14,500 more than i have deposited since February 2008. This would be about an average of €30 betting per week on football, gaa, golf, american football. No horses.

So, while gambling is a problem for some, it isnt for others and i do not want my government deciding for me what is or is not too dangerous. If people cannot sort themselves out and seek help if gambling is becoming too much of an addiction, then it really is their fault. Personal responsibility is being eroded nowadays too much in my opinion.

It reminds me of Bill Hicks talking about drugs and saying when he heard of the story of the guy who takes LSD and tries to jump of a building thinking he could fly -saying he was ruining the fun for everyone else.

How do you know if gambling is a problem if you're winning? You might still be addicted. We only notice gambling addiction when it causes problems, but that doesn't mean addiction can't exist without problems.

I read a study which said that up to 1/3 of those that gamble online are addicted. That's a fcuk load. 1/3 of people who take LSD don't jump off a building.

DulchieLaois

People who may considered having a bet here and there all the time are addictive gamblers.

The mind never switches off and always constantly thinking about a bet - the same way an alcoholic always thinks about drink.

The mind cannot take a rest and while people may win and lose all the time, they are thinking ahead to the next bet all the time which is unhealthy.

And what is worse, that need for money may take a hold on a person and the desire to win more erodes into misery if they are losing more money than winning

ArnieSilvia

More so, even 14k is a poor return considering amount of time it took to win. Not impressed at all. In most cases people would be better off using betting time and money into their career instead of constantly thinking about bets they placed. Unless it's betting drama that counts where actual return is a second priority. Price to pay for that is way too high I reckon.

Henlars67

There are loads of people who just gamble for the fun of it.

I've been gambling small amounts on sporting events for the last 15 years or more

I only gamble what I can afford to lose and have had a few good days when a decent accum came up.

I'm definitely down money overall, but never more than a few euro a week.

I know loads others who gamble in a similar fashion.

It makes watching sporting events more exciting and I don't want to or intend to ever stop. It's in no way problematic to me.

Peist2007

Donkey Oaty wrote: »

Those are impressive figures - but do you gamble in any form whatsoever elsewhere, or is it purely restricted to that site?

I was surprised by them. It is with one site. I used another site during the 2010 World Cup while in the middle of a purple patch and was pretty much hounded with telephone calls every day asking me questions about who i was. Was a little odd given the (relatively) small sums involved.

Peist2007

Grayson wrote: »

How do you know if gambling is a problem if you're winning? You might still be addicted. We only notice gambling addiction when it causes problems, but that doesn't mean addiction can't exist without problems.

I read a study which said that up to 1/3 of those that gamble online are addicted. That's a fcuk load. 1/3 of people who take LSD don't jump off a building.

Over 6 years there was plenty of losing. Many many times where i would close the laptop and say no more. As i said previously, €30 a week is nothing in the scheme of things.

Maybe 1/3 are addicted. I never carried out any studies. 1/3 of those that take LSD arent addicted either. I said it reminded me of a Bill Hicks comment on drugs is all, it was never proposed as an analogy.

Peist2007

Henlars67 wrote: »

There are loads of people who just gamble for the fun of it.

I've been gambling small amounts on sporting events for the last 15 years or more

I only gamble what I can afford to lose and have had a few good days when a decent accum came up.

I'm definitely down money overall, but never more than a few euro a week.

I know loads others who gamble in a similar fashion.

It makes watching sporting events more exciting and I don't want to or intend to ever stop. It's in no way problematic to me.

This. I have had some lucky breaks and also an amazing 12 months between August 2009 and July 2010.

Peist2007

ArnieSilvia wrote: »

More so, even 14k is a poor return considering amount of time it took to win. Not impressed at all. In most cases people would be better off using betting time and money into their career instead of constantly thinking about bets they placed. Unless it's betting drama that counts where actual return is a second priority. Price to pay for that is way too high I reckon.

I think being up at all over a considerable length of time against any bookie is an achievement. Mine was through fluke admittedly but i defy you to find anyone up on any bookie website over a 6 year period. The bookie always wins.

SteelyDanJalapeno

If you're gambling on mainstream events you're pretty muggy, you've got no edge betting on a market that has exchanged over millions already, the odds are affected by the money placed throughout the market being open.

You've gotta find an edge to beat the bookies, and when you do, your accounts wont stay open very long.

SnitchingBubs

I gamble every week, not massive amounts of money just a few pound here and there. I play poker every weekend again for small amounts of money. Although I don't necessarily agree that poker is gambling. It's a game of skill, deduction and wits.

I gamble because I enjoy it and I know my limits. I would say im definitely down money from gambling over the years. But I liken to alcohol, you have to know your limits. I wouldn't say im addicted to gambling. A bad weekend for me I would be down 50 euro.

I watch all of the soccer over the course of the weekend, from the 12.45 kick off on a saturday to the 4.00 kick off on sunday, il watch it all. And if I have to stick a tenner on a match to make bloody QPR v West Ham more exciting who are you to judge me. Gambling culture is not killing Ireland, weak willed people who have no self control are the problem.

eamonnq

SnitchingBubs wrote: »

I watch all of the soccer over the course of the weekend, from the 12.45 kick off on a saturday to the 4.00 kick off on sunday, il watch it all.

I hope you win enough to pay for your sports subscriptions!!

SnitchingBubs

eamonnq wrote: »

I hope you win enough to pay for your sports subscriptions!!

Who needs subscriptions when you have the internet

darkdubh

Theres just something depressing about betting shops.The fact that theyve mushroomed at an alarming rate on every high street,their garish shop fronts,and theres always these dreary looking fellas smoking outside them.They just give off this air of grimness.

http://www.independent.co.uk/migration_catalog/article5297438.ece/alternates/w620/Pg-12-gambling-main.jpeg

eamonnq

darkdubh wrote: »

Theres just something depressing about betting shops.The fact that theyve mushroomed at an alarming rate on every high street,their garish shop fronts,and theres always these dreary looking fellas smoking outside them.They just give off this air of grimness.

http://www.independent.co.uk/migration_catalog/article5297438.ece/alternates/w620/Pg-12-gambling-main.jpeg

Ah now that must be a fairly old picture, it has been a few years since I have been in a bookies, but they were much better than that even back then.

Grayson

SnitchingBubs wrote: »

I gamble every week, not massive amounts of money just a few pound here and there. I play poker every weekend again for small amounts of money. Although I don't necessarily agree that poker is gambling. It's a game of skill, deduction and wits.

I gamble because I enjoy it and I know my limits. I would say im definitely down money from gambling over the years. But I liken to alcohol, you have to know your limits. I wouldn't say im addicted to gambling. A bad weekend for me I would be down 50 euro.

I watch all of the soccer over the course of the weekend, from the 12.45 kick off on a saturday to the 4.00 kick off on sunday, il watch it all. And if I have to stick a tenner on a match to make bloody QPR v West Ham more exciting who are you to judge me. Gambling culture is not killing Ireland, weak willed people who have no self control are the problem.

I had a great aunt who gambled well into her 90's. It was always on horses but she always had a limit. It was only ever a few quid a week. She'd bet 20p on one horse, 50p on another.

I wouldn't say that people who get sucked in are weak willed. The act of gambling is addictive. the endorphins released provide a very real high. Personally i wouldn't want to see gambling banned but I would like to see limits in place.

SnitchingBubs

Grayson wrote: »

I had a great aunt who gambled well into her 90's. It was always on horses but she always had a limit. It was only ever a few quid a week. She'd bet 20p on one horse, 50p on another.

I wouldn't say that people who get sucked in are weak willed. The act of gambling is addictive. the endorphins released provide a very real high. Personally i wouldn't want to see gambling banned but I would like to see limits in place.

Well then by the same logic, would you like to see limits on the number of pints people can buy in a pub, or the number of cigarettes people can buy/smoke. Both are equally if not more addictive than gambling, and do alot of harm to people too.

Grayson

SnitchingBubs wrote: »

Well then by the same logic, would you like to see limits on the number of pints people can buy in a pub, or the number of cigarettes people can buy/smoke. Both are equally if not more addictive than gambling, and do alot of harm to people too.

We limit stuff like that already. Cigarettes have limits on the amount of tar and nicotine. Alcohol can only be of a certain strength and it has to be a safe alcohol (i.e. not rubbing alcohol).

catallus

SnitchingBubs wrote: »

Well then by the same logic.....

This is becoming a bit of a bore on here; people using the word "logic" to make senseless arguments against one thing by conflating them with another by presuming incorrectly that they are of the same category.

It is not "logical" to say if (x) means (y), then (z) means (y); it is infantile.

SnitchingBubs

Grayson wrote: »

We limit stuff like that already. Cigarettes have limits on the amount of tar and nicotine. Alcohol can only be of a certain strength and it has to be a safe alcohol (i.e. not rubbing alcohol).

So you're saying people should have limits about how much they can gamble. How would the government regulate that? By income? Sounds like something you would hear coming out of a communist country. This is not a police state.

SnitchingBubs

catallus wrote: »

This is becoming a bit of a bore on here; people using the word "logic" to make senseless arguments

Welcome to the internet, where people throw ducks at balloons and nothing's the way it seems.

Grayson

SnitchingBubs wrote: »

So you're saying people should have limits about how much they can gamble. How would the government regulate that? By income? Sounds like something you would hear coming out of a communist country. This is not a police state.

So the US, where gambling is incredibly regulated is a communist country?

Do you read what you're writing?

catallus

They have foodstamps in the USA.

SnitchingBubs

Grayson wrote: »

So the US, where gambling is incredibly regulated is a communist country?

Do you read what you're writing?

I never said that a country that has these laws are communist, I said it sounds like something you'd hear from a communist country. Big difference, no countries laws are perfect. But then again this is the internet I shouldn't be surprised someone is trying to twist my words.

Besides ,you can't compare Ireland to the US where each state is free to regulate and prohibit all types of gambling within its own borders. You have states like Hawaii where almost all gambling is illegal or Nevada where you can beat on almost anything. America is a law unto itself like they are with many things.

I believe people should be free to beat or gamble on whatever sporting event or casino type game they please, and any Government that hinders that is over-stepping their mark. There's no need to get so defensive because I have a different opinion than yours.

Bafucin

SnitchingBubs wrote: »

Besides ,you can't compare Ireland to the US where each state is free to regulate and prohibit all types of gambling within its own borders. You have states like Hawaii where almost all gambling is illegal or Nevada where you can beat on almost anything. America is a law unto itself like they are with many things.

I believe people should be free to beat or gamble on whatever sporting event or casino type game they please, and any Government that hinders that is over-stepping their mark. There's no need to get so defensive because I have a different opinion than yours.

Here here. It would all go underground anyway you can't stop it. And it brings in tax revenue. It is a source of entertainment. And it brings help to other parts of an economy. Vegas only gets half it's revenue from gambling and the rest is from entertainment and tourism which did not exist there before it became a spot of gambling. The Galway races and cheltenham bring in lots of money for other areas of the economy.

Most people don't become addicts. No one is hurt by gambling except the gamblers themselves, should they lose. Since no one is being raped, robbed or murdered, why is gambling even a matter of law instead of private choice? Laws should only be about things that affect others such as violence, robbing or defrauding people.

It creates many jobs for people. It increases the wealth of the economy, increases employment, growth in tourism. Places that have allowed it in the states actually have befitted. The only reason the US bans it online or tried to is because it Vegas loses that is how valuable it is.

I'd agree with the original sentiment. This is a massive issue. Like drinking at home, a lot of it is not seen so doesn't appear to the outside world but there are so many mediums through which people can bet now and its all so anonymous in many cases and there are so many different bets can be done on one single event.

For most people its just small bets and adds a bit of extra interest to an event but for others its much bigger.

The lads spending all day in the bookies or in the casino are the easy ones to spot but there is a darker side lurking below the surface for an increasing number of people.

The easy access to betting nowadays is very dangerous for people vulnerable or desperate enough to be taken in.

Bafucin

Bafucin wrote: »

No one is hurt by gambling except the gamblers themselves, should they lose.

I'd disagree with that. There is often a significant knock on effect. Having worked in this industry I have seen what effect this can have on families and how desperate things can be for the families of people trapped in the spiral of heavy gambling.

These people often have to get loans off shady characters to keep their addiction afloat or in some cases resort to stealing. This isn't always the case of course but I have seen enough instances of it to know it does happen.

NightOfTheHunt

It's certainly something which is changing Irish society in recent times and negatively impacting a lot of people's lives.. And I do think the government should be monitoring it closer. But I suppose I'm not allowed hold that opinion because it means I'm in favor of communism or some rubbish

The Purveyor of Truth

Borders no.2 wrote: »

I'd disagree with that. There is often a significant knock on effect. Having worked in this industry I have seen what effect this can have on families and how desperate things can be for the families of people trapped in the spiral of heavy gambling.

These people often have to get loans off shady characters to keep their addiction afloat or in some cases resort to stealing. This isn't always the case of course but I have seen enough instances of it to know it does happen.

That's true but you could say that about almost anything where money is involved. People gamble when they start their own businesses and end up borrowing more and more money trying to make it work. Everything is a gamble where there is an initial outlay of money in the hope of making a profit.

I think anything were there is a predetermined outcome (or even random in the case of software based games) should be banned as they are the crack cocaine of gambling. Between the horse and dog races, bookie shops now also have virtual motor racing, virtual football games, virtual roulette, virtual cycling and even virtual horse racing and it's these that play to the compulsive gamblers more than anything else I feel.

I've seen people cheering on these virtual sports games as if they were really happening. Course, they do even have live commentary to go along with most of them, so somewhat understandable for those with addictions to get drawn into the idea that they are real. Truly is the one thing which I feel needs to be banned or at least heavily regulated.

The Purveyor of Truth

The following new measures about to be placed on Bookmakers in the UK:

1) A voluntary ban on advertising sign-up offers on television before the watershed at nine o’clock.
2) Withdrawal of advertising gaming machines in betting shop windows.
3) Dedicating 20% of shop window advertising to responsible gambling messages.

Wonder if we will follow suit.

Source.

KungPao

I used to like putting 10p into those horse racing games (plastic horses not virtual) in the arcades in bray.

thankfully I never progressed from that...I don't even know how to put a bet on in the bookies.

I can see how it could become addictive though.

gugleguy

KungPao wrote: »

I used to like putting 10p into those horse racing games (plastic horses not virtual) in the arcades in bray.

thankfully I never progressed from that...I don't even know how to put a bet on in the bookies.

I can see how it could become addictive though.

I remember a time in Butlins holiday camp where you could bet on such things at 2p a go.

The Purveyor of Truth

There was carnival in Howth three weeks back that had a large virtual horse racing game. Like those ones they had in the 80s and clipped to the kitchen table.

I suppose all games where you pay money in the hope of winning a prize is gambling though. Seen lots of people have four and five goes (€3 a pop) to win a teddy bear that most likely would only cost around €10.

Knew someone who worked in Dr.Quirukys and he told me the large roulette machines are the ones that people get most addicted to. He seen people putting thousands into them in one day. New spin every two minutes or so and so they would be like crack to someone chasing losses.

Fandango2011

When a gambler life is unmanageable then there is a problem. There is plenty of GA meetings around Ireland to help, Gambling is the hardest addiction to give up.

Grayson

The Purveyor of Truth wrote: »

The following new measures about to be placed on Bookmakers in the UK:



Wonder if we will follow suit.

Source.

It's not a bad idea. it might also be a good idea to limit the amount that can be placed on a bet outside of a racetrack or casino.

Davarus Walrus

I used to play a lot of online poker cash games. Was always fairly profitable in the long-term. Lot of complete chumps were throwing their money away online during the celtic tiger days. Made a decision though that staying up half the night playing 4 tables was a terrible waste of time.

Tarzana

hfallada wrote: »

You can go through dozens of middle to upper-middle class suburbs in Dublin and not find a single bookies.

I don't think there are that many middle and upper-middle class suburbs in Dublin! :pac: