Apple Pay - What are you thoughts

Inquitus

It's all good any NFC terminal supports any NFC payment method, so when implemented they will support both Google wallet and Apple Pay, which is obviously a good thing for us in Europe where Android market share is around 75%, without cross compatibility Apple Pay would be irrelevant here.

Frank Lee Midere

Inquitus wrote: »

It's all good any NFC terminal supports any NFC payment method, so when implemented they will support both Google wallet and Apple Pay, which is obviously a good thing for us in Europe where Android market share is around 75%, without cross compatibility Apple Pay would be irrelevant here.

Google wallet depends on the manufacturers caring enough to implement it.

elderlemon

If this is proprietary to Apple (which I believe it is) and has the potential to lock others (Google at al, Microsoft etc) out of the market by signing up retailers, then I can see this being stopped dead in it's tracks in Europe.

Just a thought.

ukoda

elderlemon wrote: »

If this is proprietary to Apple (which I believe it is) and has the potential to lock others (Google at al, Microsoft etc) out of the market by signing up retailers, then I can see this being stopped dead in it's tracks in Europe.

Just a thought.

Well Apple Pay is propriety to Apple, but there's nothing stopping anyone else doing it for android etc. as we've discussed NFC is available to any card issuer / bank / retailer

And by the way, there's already a competitor with google wallet

It certainly won't stop dead in Europe as all the major cards are backing it

elderlemon

But this is not just NFC. Yes it uses NFC to initiate the handshake but there is more going on between Apple and the card issuers. Also I believe it requires a new terminal (not just any old NFC enabled terminal).

We'll find out more over the coming months but my initial feeling on this is that it locks out competitors by having contracts between the card issuer, the retailer and Apple. This is very different from how Google Wallet and other systems work and could be seen as locking out others from the retailer and therefore anti-competitive.

We'll see but I wouldn't be surprised.

ukoda wrote: »

Well Apple Pay is propriety to Apple, but there's nothing stopping anyone else doing it for android etc. as we've discussed NFC is available to any card issuer / bank / retailer

And by the way, there's already a competitor with google wallet

It certainly won't stop dead in Europe as all the major cards are backing it

ukoda

elderlemon wrote: »

But this is not just NFC. Yes it uses NFC to initiate the handshake but there is more going on between Apple and the card issuers. Also I believe it requires a new terminal (not just any old NFC enabled terminal).

We'll find out more over the coming months but my initial feeling on this is that it locks out competitors by having contracts between the card issuer, the retailer and Apple. This is very different from how Google Wallet and other systems work and could be seen as locking out others from the retailer and therefore anti-competitive.

We'll see but I wouldn't be surprised.

No it doesn't lock out anyone else and does not need any special type of terminal, just the normal terminal that we currently have that are NFC enabled, have a read of the articles posted above, it uses normal NFC terminals, which like I say, anyone can use

There's no exclusivity here, the card issuers would never agree to solely support apple devices, plus their own cards have NFC chips that will still work as normal, so it's the one terminal

All Apple is doing is routing the transaction through its payment service, same thing google do with google wallet.

challengemaster

godtabh wrote: »

it will never be seen here. Irish banks are two conservative. Sure wireless payments barley have a presence here

You'd be surprised - most of my day to day transactions now are contactless payments.

Buddy Holly wrote: »

Also while ios may have a 50% market share in the US, they will need either an iPhone 6 or 6 plus, further reducing the amount of people who can use apple pay. Not getting wallmart on board could come back to bite them.

The difference in the US is that a lot of schemes are in place so people are continually upgrading their (luxury) assets, such as phones and cars. There's a mentality about always having the newest, apart from the framework is there to support it. Plenty of US cars are on finance, and every 2nd year they get upgraded and re-financed - and that's the system they work on. I'd assume similar things exist for phones on contract, after 12 months they get early upgrades or whatever. I'd say the majority of the iOS share will be upgrading.

DubDJ

A few things I've picked up on this as there's seems to be a general confusion.

Apple are getting a fee from this service, supposedly 0.15%. The service works over NFC so current terminals are supposed to work but will most likely require a firmware update to support Apple's system. I think this is probably down to the way ApplePay works, relating to the secure token the Apple service uses. Also the iPhone 5, 5c and 5s will work with the service as long as you have it paired with the upcoming Apple watch.

Also good to see from the article above that it will be coming to Europe soon, and as I mentioned retailers here should be able to update existing terminals to support it.

One thing I'm curious about, will the app support of ApplePay work at launch. Eg paying for eBay items with the 'pay with ApplePay' button. I don't see a reason not, it says visa and MasterCard are supported but then goes on to list supporting banks, maybe it won't work because of the whole secure token thing but I'm not sure.

challengemaster

DubDJ wrote: »

One thing I'm curious about, will the app support of ApplePay work at launch. Eg paying for eBay items with the 'pay with ApplePay' button. I don't see a reason not, it says visa and MasterCard are supported but then goes on to list supporting banks, maybe it won't work because of the whole secure token thing but I'm not sure.

I'd say app support will possibly require an app update, but for major brands Apple have got on their side - it seems new apps have already been in development for a while.

The supporting banks thing I'd imagine is relating to how the cards get added, more specifically verified.

DubDJ

challengemaster wrote: »

I'd say app support will possibly require an app update, but for major brands Apple have got on their side - it seems new apps have already been in development for a while.

The supporting banks thing I'd imagine is relating to how the cards get added, more specifically verified.

Yeah but for the partners Apple used for the demo, I wonder will an Irish visa debit or even a credit card work. Will you be able to add your own card to passbook and pay with it, until NFC gets the support for ApplePay. Or maybe the whole token system Apple uses will need to be supported by Irish banks for this too.

challengemaster

I've a feeling there'll be some workaround - seeing as it works via passbook, and you can use the card you've got registered on iTunes. I reckon if you have a card added that way it'll be a valid work around until local banks add support, because they don't need to verify that card.

Rock of Gibraltar

I think this could be rolled out quite quickly here, possibly quicker than in the States given NFC is more widespread here and already growing rapidly.
For example this NFC vending machine in UCD.



There's also an ongoing government strategy to move to more cashless society, as of this month the government no longer accepts cheques.
I'm not sure why people think it's necessary for Irish banks to be on-board with Apple Pay and NFC payments, they don't really have a role in NFC transactions. Visa and Mastercard are the technology behind NFC not banks. It is necessary for Visa and Mastercard for this to take off here which it appears they've already committed to this.
Tim Cook didn't get up an say we've Bank of America etc signed up, he spoke about the payment service companies Mastercard, Visa, American Express etc.

challengemaster

Rock of Gibraltar wrote: »

I'm not sure why people think it's necessary for Irish banks to be on-board with Apple Pay and NFC payments, they don't really have a role in NFC transactions. Visa and Mastercard are the technology behind NFC not banks. It is necessary for Visa and Mastercard for this to take off here which it appears they've already committed to this.
Tim Cook didn't get up an say we've Bank of America etc signed up, he spoke about the payment service companies Mastercard, Visa, American Express etc.

The validation process where Apple verifies the card you add to passbook is actually yours. This requires the banks cooperating with Apple and dealing with them rather than the end user. Without that, you can't add cards to passbook to use with Apple Pay - rendering the service useless.

ukoda

Rock of Gibraltar wrote: »

Tim Cook didn't get up an say we've Bank of America etc signed up, he spoke about the payment service companies Mastercard, Visa, American Express etc.

well actually he did, he listed the 5 major US banks who are already on board and that another 5 are coming soon.

Although the major players are the card companies, the banks have to process the transactions so they do have a role to play - altho I'm sure they'll quickly come on board when the likes of Visa / MasterCard etc are pushing for it

ukoda

Interesting article here

basically saying the credit card companies will not look to increase transaction charges on Apple Pay - and that it may actually lead to reduced charges as its more secure (so reducing money spent on fraud prevention and payouts)