Why is the broadcasting charge postponed ?

TheQuietFella

If RTE went under in the morning who would really miss it?

Another quango, jobs for the boys!

endakenny

TireeTerror wrote: »

Why should I pay for a tv licence when I have Sky TV from the UK.

Because UK viewers have to pay a licence fee, which funds the BBC.

TireeTerror wrote: »

I cannot receive RTE.

You can get Saorview or Saorview if you want to.

lertsnim

TheQuietFella wrote: »

If RTE went under in the morning who would really miss it?

Another quango, jobs for the boys!

The majority of the country who watch it I would guess.

TheQuietFella

lertsnim wrote: »

The majority of the country who watch it I would guess.

I would suggest the use of the word minority!

makeorbrake

endakenny wrote: »

Because UK viewers have to pay a licence fee, which funds the BBC.

You can get Saorview or Saorview if you want to.

The key is in the last 4 words...

lertsnim wrote:

The majority of the country who watch it I would guess.

I'd wager that you are correct - it would be the majority. However, don't make the rest of us pay for something we simply don't see the value in.

If RTE firmly believed in and had confidence that everyone perceived value in what they offer, then dvb-t could have been encrypted - with the unencryption charge being €160/year. That platform could then be used by others - at a fee - to provide bolt-on pay tv offerings. Furthermore, that would negate any need for tv license inspectors knocking on doors.


Everything has to stand on its own merits.

Sam Russell

TheQuietFella wrote: »

I would suggest the use of the word minority!

Not so.

Over 1 million saw Nidge get wacked. Over 24% of all TV watched in Ireland is RTE 1. Most of the top 10 TV shows watched in Ireland are on RTE 1.

A lot of viewers in the UK would love to get RTE on their local TV.

We are fortunate in that we can freely get UK TV through Freesat at no cost to us. Some near the border or Wales get it on Freeview from an aerial. Happy days. Why would you begrudge €160 a year for that? You can pay Sky that a month.

makeorbrake

Sam Russell wrote: »

Why would you begrudge €160 a year for that? You can pay Sky that a month.

That's your opinion - I don't share it. And by the way, I don't see value in sky's offering either....but at least with that, there's a choice.

lertsnim

TheQuietFella wrote: »

I would suggest the use of the word minority!

How many people watched Love/Hate, the Late Late Show, the news, GAA, soccer, rugby? To suggest that only a minority watch RTE is ridiculous.

Elmo

Largely speaking we have people not wanting to pay the TV licence/Broadcasting Charge not coming up with suggestions to replace it other than let them go commerical. You'd see most sports go to pay TV services charging far more than 13.33 per month for so called choice. You'd wonder how many times you can repeat an episode of Friends or The Big Bang Theory and get people thinking that that is choice.

TheQuietFella

lertsnim wrote: »

How many people watched Love/Hate, the Late Late Show, the news, GAA, soccer, rugby? To suggest that only a minority watch RTE is ridiculous.

If RTE was a PPV as suggested earlier in the thread do you think there would be a large subscription to it?

I personally don't watch a lot of TV anyway, maybe a little sport & docu' but they are always available on other channels.

icdg

If there is any further discussion of the licence fee the rule regarding stickies will apply and this thread will be merged into it

TireeTerror

Thurston? wrote: »

Why did you go to the trouble of getting a UK Sky sub. to use in Ireland?

Sky sub? I use card sharing, but its not a topic that is permitted to be discussed in detail on boards.

As for those stating "Its the law!", well that is exactly the sheep like mentality that will have you paying water charges and for a broadcasting licence. While sheep whinge a bit, but ultimately bend over and take it, there will always be Governments and corporations who will exploit you.

Me not paying will not make a jot of difference, I would take prison time over a tv licence, but they would first of all have to catch me, prove it and even then I would still not pay a licence fee. I would tell the judge that too. People have a huge amount of power, they just dont have the balls or gumption to do much more than wave a few placards and shout "outrage!"

Let anarchy prevail.

icdg

TireeTerror take a 48 hour ban for advocating breaking the law. This isn't a politics forum - while the politics of the broadcasting charge are allowed to be discussed, the second you move into wider political issues you are moving off topic. And calling on people to commit crimes is completely out of order

lertsnim

TireeTerror wrote: »

Sky sub? I use card sharing, but its not a topic that is permitted to be discussed in detail on boards.

As for those stating "Its the law!", well that is exactly the sheep like mentality that will have you paying water charges and for a broadcasting licence. While sheep whinge a bit, but ultimately bend over and take it, there will always be Governments and corporations who will exploit you.

Me not paying will not make a jot of difference, I would take prison time over a tv licence, but they would first of all have to catch me, prove it and even then I would still not pay a licence fee. I would tell the judge that too. People have a huge amount of power, they just dont have the balls or gumption to do much more than wave a few placards and shout "outrage!"

Let anarchy prevail.

Fight the power!!!!

Back to reality......

The people that say no tv license means prison time have no understanding of how the legal system works.

You go to jail only if you purposely disobey the orders from a judge, for example not paying a fine.

sky1234

I don't own a TV so it's completely unfair

Elmo

sky1234 wrote: »

I don't own a TV so it's completely unfair

And I don't own a Radio, never seen the NSO, don't go to measuems, haven't been to the burren, rarely watch Irish Cinema etc etc.

Sam Russell

Elmo wrote: »

And I don't own a Radio, never seen the NSO, don't go to measuems, haven't been to the burren, rarely watch Irish Cinema etc etc.

You should get out more!

sky1234

Elmo wrote:

And I don't own a Radio, never seen the NSO, don't go to measuems, haven't been to the burren, rarely watch Irish Cinema etc etc.

I have been to the Burren. Out of that list that is all. I get out plenty. .. Maybe that is why!

Elmo

sky1234 wrote: »

I have been to the Burren. Out of that list that is all. I get out plenty. .. Maybe that is why!

The simple things.

The list is not infinite but we pay plenty in tax for things we may never use and that many find pointless.

icdg

Looks like it's been abandoned now officially, at least by the present Government:

http://m.rte.ie/news/2014/1211/666126-tv-licence/

Capt'n Midnight

icdg wrote: »

Looks like it's been abandoned now officially, at least by the present Government:

http://m.rte.ie/news/2014/1211/666126-tv-licence/

So I'll have to keep paying an extra ~15% for licence evasion and ~€10 to AnPost for not collecting that 15%

Unlike water this isn't double taxation. Also it should be very easy to setup an opt-out scheme , tick the box on your ESB bill if you don't have a device that can receive broadcast TV etc.

http://businessetc.thejournal.ie/this-is-exactly-how-your-tv-licence-fee-is-used-542836-Aug2012/

18MonthsaSlave

If you feel so strongly about it why don't you sell your television or remove the tuner and then you won't have to pay for people you perceive to be freeloaders.
That 15% is a rubbish statistic; it is an estimate that matters to someone who has a motivation to estimate it.

brick man

They should have went ahead and brought in the charge its not as if its a new charge so the only ones that would be complaining is the people who dont pay.

18MonthsaSlave

brick man wrote: »

They should have went ahead and brought in the charge its not as if its a new charge so the only ones that would be complaining is the people who dont pay.

including the people who don't consume Irish TV programming? That doesn't seem fair does it.

brick man

I suppose they dont ever consume RTE radio either as licence fee covers radio as well

lertsnim

18MonthsaSlave wrote: »

including the people who don't consume Irish TV programming? That doesn't seem fair does it.

By that logic people who watch the BBC in this country would be happy to contribute to the UK TV license? Like hell they would.

It isn't the RTÉ license, it's the television license. It doesn't matter what you use it for.

I don't believe anybody who says that they never watch any programming on RTÉ.

bluemartin

brick man wrote: »

They should have went ahead and brought in the charge its not as if its a new charge so the only ones that would be complaining is the people who dont pay.

Maybe they are people out there who don't own a TV, why then should they be charged a tax just because they own a mobile smart phone?

18MonthsaSlave

I'm happy with the situation as it is at present. Those who wish to dispose of their TV or desolder the TV antenna module don't have to pay the license.
You can't complain about them free-loading if they can't receive the channels.

TV license is not a Radio license.

The tyranny of the mob has been fended off for a while longer.

brick man

lertsnim wrote: »

By that logic people who watch the BBC in this country would be happy to contribute to the UK TV license? Like hell they would.

It isn't the RTÉ license, it's the television license. It doesn't matter what you use it for.

Well said and the tv licence fee helps pay for programmes like aras Attracta last Tuesday & if it cost 200,000 to make, that was the best money ever spent to highlight awful treatment in our very own Country

18MonthsaSlave

brick man wrote: »

Well said and the tv licence fee helps pay for programmes like aras Attracta last Tuesday & if it cost 200,000 to make, that was the best money ever spent to highlight awful treatment in our very own Country

I could do a small bit of investigative journalism if you promised me a franchise to rake in a license fee from every household in the country.

bluemartin

brick man wrote: »

Well said and the tv licence fee helps pay for programmes like aras Attracta last Tuesday & if it cost 200,000 to make, that was the best money ever spent to highlight awful treatment in our very own Country

The 200,000 might be better spend in inspecting and monitoring the going ons of these establishments in the first place. Why does it have to take a TV programme for the authorities to get off their backsides and do something about it.

Sorry I am deviating form the original topic here.

brick man

18MonthsaSlave wrote: »

I'm happy with the situation as it is at present. Those who wish to dispose of their TV or desolder the TV antenna module don't have to pay the license.
You can't complain about them free-loading if they can't receive the channels.

TV license is not a Radio license.

The tyranny of the mob has been fended off for a while longer.

Yes but Millions of it goes to pay for providing RnaG, Lyric fm & Radio 1 plus TG4, BAI Sound and vision, an post and 2 orchestras, and if I remember correctly I think it is around 50 million all of that costs

lertsnim

bluemartin wrote: »

Maybe they are people out there who don't own a TV, why then should they be charged a tax just because they own a mobile smart phone?

They won't. That idea is scrapped for now.

brick man

bluemartin wrote: »

The 200,000 might be better spend in inspecting and monitoring the going ons of these establishments in the first place. Why does it have to take a TV programme for the authorities to get off their backsides and do something about it.

Sorry I am deviating form the original topic here.

I agree and as a HSE employee I am disgusted but believe me you would need RTE the whole time keeping the pressure on them . sorry for sightly off topic

18MonthsaSlave

brick man wrote: »

Yes but Millions of it goes to pay for providing RnaG, Lyric fm & Radio 1 plus TG4, BAI Sound and vision, an post and 2 orchestras, and if I remember correctly I think it is around 50 million all of that costs

what's an orchestra got to do with a TV or DeVelera's obsession to force everyone to learn the Irish Language got to do with a TV?

As I said I'm glad the tyranny of the mob has been fended off but we must remain vigilant; only a few years to go until broadcast TV becomes irrelevant.

icdg

we might keep the wider political issues for other forums please

brick man

18MonthsaSlave wrote: »

what's an orchestra got to do with a TV or DeVelera's obsession to force everyone to learn the Irish Language got to do with a TV?

As I said I'm glad the tyranny of the mob has been fended off but we must remain vigilant; only a few years to go until broadcast TV becomes irrelevant.

They could not teach us Irish in school let alone on TV. I do think they use the Licence fee to prop up all these pet projects like BAI SOUND & VISION & TG4

bluemartin

brick man wrote: »

They could not teach us Irish in school let alone on TV. I do think they use the Licence fee to prop up all these pet projects like BAI SOUND & VISION & TG4

yeah 13 years spend learning Irish in schools and the majority of us can hardly string a sentence together, what a joke!

bluemartin

Does any other country have a broadcasting charge? I goggled and could only see reference to Ireland, after the water debacle I cant ever see this coming to fruition.

brick man

Its a licence fee in Germany @ 17.98 per month, in France it is dual funded like RTE but commercials are to be phased out over the next while .

Sam Russell

If I were bringing in a broadcasting charge, I would not call it that for a start, perhaps Media and Communication Charge - or something other than broadcasting.

I would structure it so that the cost per household would be €10 per month added to the electricity bill. If you get electricity, then you pay.

A second strand would be to levy broadband users by €2.50 per month.

A third strand would be to place a levy of €0.01 on each text message sent.

The overall charge would be limited to raising the same amount as currently raised by the Licence fee.

So, current licence is €160. New charge is €120, plus (for those with broadband) is €30. This is more than currently raised because 15% do not pay, and An Post get a fair bit as well. The text message bit is a bonus, but would be huge in total but trivial for each message.

ESB Networks collect the €10 per month, and the few broadband providers collect their bit. Mobile operators pay over the text message bit.

I think the Irish Water thing has spooked the politicos.

18MonthsaSlave

The arrogance of it all; Big brother certain that it knows what the public wants and charging them for it whether they like it or not.

Maidhci

I believe it has been deferred for the present, not due to the fact that it is an ill-conceived piece of legislation, which is essentially a tax on the Internet, but for political expediency, given the Government’s record of blundering and backtracking in respect of recent ill-thought out legislation.

As proposed, this is an additional tax on persons who do not own a television set but who have a broadband connection for essential work or business related purposes. Its introduction would also bring the current licence evaders into the net, but there are methods of achieving this, other than the imposition of a universal broadband charge. The objective for its imposition seems to me to be a cynical attempt to raise additional revenues to fund 2 public service broadcasters and BAI. Additionally, its imposition may yet involve the establishment of yet another quango to administer the Broadband Charges.

I am of the opinion that Government would be better employed in reviewing the current structure of RTE, TG4 and BAI – is it necessary for such a small country to have 2 public service broadcasters which are inextricably linked? We all know that RTE re-invents itself every now and then, especially when there is a reduction in their advertising revenue, but the licence fee is guaranteed, irrespective of the level and quality of the service provided. Furthermore, RTE licence revenues were diluted by the current Government’s decision to fund TG4 through the TV licence revenue as opposed to direct Exchequer funding, coupled with the fact that RTE are obliged to provide TG4 with 1 hour’s programming per day, including the new service – RTE are apparently intent on recouping these amounts and are incapable of doing so through advertising revenue.

Perhaps I am a little naïve here but I do not believe that there are people out there who choose to watch television programmes on their smartphones/ipads/laptops, simply to avoid the necessity of having a TV licence. What is the rationale for having public service tv content available online – was it made available as a result of popular demand or some other motive by the broadcasters? Surely, if there is a cost involved in making this content available online, it should be possible to make it subscription based or password protected?

Capt'n Midnight

bluemartin wrote: »

Does any other country have a broadcasting charge? I goggled and could only see reference to Ireland, after the water debacle I cant ever see this coming to fruition.

You don't even have to leave the island to find somewhere where they charge €183.63 for a TV licence ( £145.50 )

An old link that lists who gets what from the licence
http://businessetc.thejournal.ie/this-is-exactly-how-your-tv-licence-fee-is-used-542836-Aug2012/

TireeTerror

Sam Russell wrote: »

If I were bringing in a broadcasting charge, I would not call it that for a start, perhaps Media and Communication Charge - or something other than broadcasting.

I would structure it so that the cost per household would be €10 per month added to the electricity bill. If you get electricity, then you pay.

A second strand would be to levy broadband users by €2.50 per month.

A third strand would be to place a levy of €0.01 on each text message sent.

The overall charge would be limited to raising the same amount as currently raised by the Licence fee.

So, current licence is €160. New charge is €120, plus (for those with broadband) is €30. This is more than currently raised because 15% do not pay, and An Post get a fair bit as well. The text message bit is a bonus, but would be huge in total but trivial for each message.

ESB Networks collect the €10 per month, and the few broadband providers collect their bit. Mobile operators pay over the text message bit.

I think the Irish Water thing has spooked the politicos.

This kind of idea is frightening. Forcing people to pay for things in a sneaky manner. How about they simply find a model to fund themselves like every other commercial station.

makeorbrake

Sam Russell wrote: »

I think the Irish Water thing has spooked the politicos.

of course it's spooked them. Water charge is logical - it's for an essential service. If they can't get that over the line, what chances do they have in getting this unreasonable charge in that supports a white elephant, encourages inefficiency and forces everyone to pay when not everyone sees value in what they're getting.

If they truly believe in what they are offering, they can encrypt dvb-t (and dvb-s) and let people pay the license fee in that way. Mark my words - they will NEVER do this!

Maidhci

Interesting to read over the weekend that RTE are considering the sale of part of the Montrose compound in light of the Government's decision to defer the introduction of the Broadcasting Charge! I was waiting for this - this is the third time they have played this trick over the years when things were getting tight.

I am sure the current Minister is as sympathetic to their plight as the previous Minister who initiated this crazy legislation, after all they have a vested interest in supporting this revenue guzzling organisation. I wonder did RTE ever hear of 'cutting your cloth to your measure' and stop crying wolf and get on with it.

I cannot understand why the current legislation isn't being enforced, if that is necessary? After all, the Dept. of Communications etc. etc. have a database of all unlicenced householders?

If the current penalties are not sufficient to ensure acceptable compliance, then these could be amended? After all, they will have the same problem with the proposed legislation, the ONLY difference being that the base will have been broadened to include a charge on the Internet - which the entire rationale for all of this.

Radio_Fan_67

As i said in another thread. RTE should shut down RTE News now, Junior and * 1. The licence fee has not increased since 2008 but RTE are broadcasting these services that have no income and tiny ratings. The dab radio network should also be shutdown.

Widescreen

As far as I remember the licence fee went up suddenly astronomically in the mid noughties - even the price we pay now is a total rip off.

Look at saorview - just the 4 domestic channels plus repeats and kids stuff.


Look at the UK freeview, now theres a platform its worth paying a licence for!

Radio_Fan_67

I think the sound and vision fund should be abolished. Commercial stations should not be getting a cent of the licence fee.