Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread V

MugMugs

former legend wrote: »

I don't understand the question. He played 80 minutes on Friday.

I didn't realise he had played the A game on Friday.

I thought he was still absent due to illness.

dregin

http://www.leinsterrugby.ie/team/results/12755.php

Neil3030

Teo with some big hits in the opening exchanges apparently.

Few lads got vanged.

sydthebeat

Neil3030 wrote: »

Teo with some big hits in the opening exchanges apparently.

Few lads got vanged.

Are we REALLY doing that? ?

Neil3030

sydthebeat wrote: »

Are we REALLY doing that? ?

Yup. All the cool kids got a memo about it.

Awkward.

sydthebeat

Neil3030 wrote: »

Yup. All the cool kids got a memo about it.

Awkward.

Always was more of a parka and under cut kid myself

.ak

sydthebeat wrote: »

Always was more of a parka and under cut kid myself

That's what all the hipsters are wearing now though...

sydthebeat

.ak wrote: »

That's what all the hipsters are wearing now though...

Pastiche

vienne86

So we've to scrape up a team for Friday......five day turnaround.....Ireland camp.....this could be a big chance for some young lads.

molloyjh

I'd expect:

01. E Byrne
02. B Byrne
03. Bent
04. Denton
05. Douglas
06. Leavy
07. VDF
08. Conan

09. Boss
10. Gopperth
11. Fitz
12. Reid
13. Te'o
14. Fanning
15. Kirchner

16. Dundon
17. Dooley
18. Furlong
19. Marshall
20. Coughlan
21. L McGrath
22. Crosbie/Marsh
23. M McGrath

A lot of guys in there with very few to no caps in the senior set-up this season, especially in the pack. But the back line is pretty goos.

former legend

vienne86 wrote: »

So we've to scrape up a team for Friday......five day turnaround.....Ireland camp.....this could be a big chance for some young lads.

If no-one gets released from Ireland camp, we could be looking at:

Kirchner
Fanning
Te'o
Reid
Luke
Gopperth
Boss
Bent
Byrne
Furlong
Douglas
Denton
McLaughlin (is he fit? Marshall if not)
van der Flier
Conan

Oh dear.

vienne86

molloyjh wrote: »

I'd expect:

01. E Byrne
02. B Byrne
03. Bent
04. Denton
05. Douglas
06. Leavy
07. VDF
08. Conan

09. Boss
10. Gopperth
11. Fitz
12. Reid
13. Te'o
14. Fanning
15. Kirchner

16. Dundon
17. Dooley
18. Heffernan
19. Marshall
20. Coughlan
21. L McGrath
22. Crosbie/Marsh
23. M McGrath

A lot of guys in there with very few to no caps in the senior set-up this season, especially in the pack. But the back line is pretty goos.

Actually yes, that back line is quite impressive. Very hard to know how that pack would go.....it'll be interesting!

molloyjh

Just realised I left Furlong out. Corrected.

molloyjh

vienne86 wrote: »

Actually yes, that back line is quite impressive. Very hard to know how that pack would go.....it'll be interesting!

I've been hugely impressed with the Byrne brothers this season. They've looked good in the chances they've gotten. Denton has improved and we should be ok with himself and Douglas (although I haven't been as impressed with Douglas as some personally). The back row is full of potential, but is fairly green. We might struggle at line-out time but we should be ok in the scrum.

The bench is a little bit of a worry though. Its very callow.

We're apparently on the look-out for prop cover too (http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/rugby-in-brief-leinster-on-the-lookout-for-prop-30697640.html). Trevor Nyakane is ambipropsterous apparently, but is mainly a LH. Caylib Oosthuizen is a LH.

So after buying McCarthy who hasn't worked out we're back on the market for another LH. Bent is primarily a LH and between him and Byrne I'd have thought we were well enough covered there. At TH we're currently starting a LH with a very young and inexperienced TH on the bench. Surely TH is where the need really is?

former legend

Actually, we might well see Leavy involved. I thought it was odd that he was specifically named in a squad update last week when the academy guys normally don't feature in them.

Assuming Fanning plays this Friday, it will be his 11th start in 11 weeks (including the pre-season friendly matches), and he has played every minute of the eight matches so far in the competitive campaign. Some achievement.

molloyjh

former legend wrote: »

Actually, we might well see Leavy involved. I thought it was odd that he was specifically named in a squad update last week when the academy guys normally don't feature in them.

Assuming Fanning plays this Friday, it will be his 11th start in 11 weeks (including the pre-season friendly matches), and he has played every minute of the eight matches so far in the competitive campaign. Some achievement.

He's been getting better and better too. I thought he was pretty good on Sunday. Cleaned up a lot of messy ball, carried fairly well and as usual had a huge work rate.

thomond2006

molloyjh wrote: »

So after buying McCarthy who hasn't worked out we're back on the market for another LH. Bent is primarily a LH and between him and Byrne I'd have thought we were well enough covered there. At TH we're currently starting a LH with a very young and inexperienced TH on the bench. Surely TH is where the need really is?

McCarthy hasn't worked out?

former legend

thomond2006 wrote: »

McCarthy hasn't worked out?

Sean McCarthy

Buer

Sean.

molloyjh

thomond2006 wrote: »

McCarthy hasn't worked out?

Sean McCarthy, not Mike. The prop we picked up from Jersey who played LH and hooker against Munster A. He's not even playing B&I and from what I've heard he's not working out at AIL level either.

thomond2006

former legend wrote: »

Sean McCarthy

I know but is it fair to say already that he's been a dud signing?

molloyjh

thomond2006 wrote: »

I know but is it fair to say already that he's been a dud signing?

He'd need a massive turnaround from where he is now. He is only 23 so it's possible, but if he's going as badly at AIL level as I'm hearing then I wouldn't hold out hope.

former legend

thomond2006 wrote: »

I know but is it fair to say already that he's been a dud signing?

I'm going to say, "yes".

We've had a front row crisis and he is nowhere to be seen. I don't think he's injured but can't even make the A team, in fact I think his last game for them was at hooker rather than prop.

Maybe he was signed so D'Arcy could have someone to discuss beards with, but now that D'Arcy has shaved, McCarthy has been cut loose.

Buer

thomond2006 wrote: »

I know but is it fair to say already that he's been a dud signing?

He has been poor to the extent that they're trying to turn him into a hooker now. He wouldn't get a start for the A team if we had near a fit squad.

molloyjh

Buer wrote: »

He has been poor to the extent that they're trying to turn him into a hooker now. He wouldn't get a start for the A team if we had near a fit squad.

We don't have a near fit squad and he's still not even benching for the As. He started at hooker against Plymouth, but hasn't been involved at all in the 2 since.

Stuttering.

Thats how I'd describe us so far. Struggling to get the engine running properly. Not sure what's off really, but we're just not dominating where we want to be.

Tox56

thomond2006 wrote: »

I know but is it fair to say already that he's been a dud signing?

From everything we have seen, as a loosehead he is currently behind Healy, McGrath, Bent, Byrne and Dooley, and all of those except maybe Bent are only going to get better. It was a really strange signing, we are overrun with talented young looseheads at the moment

Buer

Deleted User wrote: »

Stuttering.

Thats how I'd describe us so far. Struggling to get the engine running properly. Not sure what's off really, but we're just not dominating where we want to be.

I'm not too concerned as of yet. I'm delighted we managed to get two wins. If someone showed me our injury list for the opening two HEC games back in August and asked me how we'd do, I would have said we'd be going well to get 4 points from the two games.

7 first 23 players absent and we're still grinding out the wins with a couple of guys showing massive leadership. I'll take it. We need Ross, Kearney, McFadden and Jennings back in a hurry though with Te'o hopefully settling in rapidly. That should transform the team.

The Quins double header will be crucial. Their win puts a lot of pressure on us now. I suppose them having an away game 40 minutes from home did help them but we need to take something from The Stoop now.

thomond2006

Buer wrote: »

The Quins double header will be crucial. Their win puts a lot of pressure on us now. I suppose them having an away game 40 minutes from home did help them but we need to take something from The Stoop now.

I don't think you do, three more wins puts Leinster on 20 points and that should be enough to qualify.

Buer

thomond2006 wrote: »

I don't think you do, three more wins puts Leinster on 20 points and that should be enough to qualify.

I really don't want to be in the mix for a runner up spot. If we go away in the QF, we lose.

I think we need to hit 22 points.

stephen_n

molloyjh wrote: »

I'd expect:

01. E Byrne
02. B Byrne
03. Bent
04. Denton
05. Douglas
06. Leavy
07. VDF
08. Conan

09. L McGrath
10. Gopperth
11. Fitz
12. Reid
13. Te'o
14. Fanning
15. Kirchner

16. Dundon
17. Dooley
18. Furlong
19. Marshall
20. Coughlan
21. Boss
22. Crosbie/Marsh
23. M McGrath

A lot of guys in there with very few to no caps in the senior set-up this season, especially in the pack. But the back line is pretty goos.

That's actually a pretty good looking backline considering all the injuries and international involvement, no way would I have Boss starting at this stage, he has literally dropped off a cliff in terms of form and seems to be still falling.

Mahatma Geansai

Buer wrote: »

I'm not too concerned as of yet. I'm delighted we managed to get two wins. If someone showed me our injury list for the opening two HEC games back in August and asked me how we'd do, I would have said we'd be going well to get 4 points from the two games.

7 first 23 players absent and we're still grinding out the wins with a couple of guys showing massive leadership. I'll take it. We need Ross, Kearney, McFadden and Jennings back in a hurry though with Te'o hopefully settling in rapidly. That should transform the team.

The Quins double header will be crucial. Their win puts a lot of pressure on us now. I suppose them having an away game 40 minutes from home did help them but we need to take something from The Stoop now.

If anything, I'd consider a lack of leadership to be one of the biggest problem in the Leinster side at present. Heaslip has stepped up with captain's performances over the last two weeks, but there isn't anyone else standing out in the leadership stakes alongside him imo.

molloyjh

stephen_n wrote: »

That's actually a pretty good looking backline considering all the injuries and international involvement, no way would I have Boss starting at this stage, he has literally dropped off a cliff in terms of form and seems to be still falling.

Agreed, but we both know Boss will start.

Buer

McGrath and Heaslip, the future captain and the current captain, have both stepped up hugely and taken on a lot of responsibility in the last few weeks. Toner has done a really good job, emerging as a senior player and picking up MOTM at the weekend.

You don't turn around the scoreline last week and win away in France without leadership.

Noopti

Great to have two wins, but we are so inconsistent. Game to game we are inconsistent, and even within games we are inconsistent. Good for 15 minutes, then awful, then good, then awful etc etc.

It just conveys to me a team lacking in direction and confidence.

Gopperth may be low on confidence, but we haven't got the time to be giving him to regain it in Europe.

1. Give Madigan the 10 jersey and a chance. Gopperth can get his chance again off the bench in the big games
2. Reddan at 9, with McGrath on the bench (or starting when necessary). Boss isn't anywhere near where he needs to be
3. Furlong needs to move above Bent in the pecking order
4. Big focus on rucks. They have been our single biggest failing so far this season. Sometimes we look ok (see inconsistency issue), but mostly we are slow to protect our own ball, and poor contesting opposition ball. Leinster have always done well off quick ball, it is a no brainer that it should be an area of massive focus for this team

I know it is very easy for me to say all this, but especially on point 1 - I don't get why MOC is sticking with Gopperth right now. The form players should be playing, and right now Gopperth just isn't at the level he needs to be at for Europe.

MOC needs to start taking more (reasonable) risks, but he is obviously not a risk taker as can be seen in some selection decisions and the general way the team is currently playing. If he keeps winning, then I suppose we can't say much, but we are barely scraping by these days and we will be caught out badly soon I feel. Quinns at the Aviva needs to be the game we show consistent performance, maintaining a high level throughout the 80 mins.

Teferi

I've been championing Gops since the start of the season but I agree that it's time to give Mads his chance starting at 10. That might be hard heading into November and maybe in that time Gopperth will turn it around again.

CatFromHue

The Indo have it that Leinster are looking for another prop

The Irish Independent understands they have made contact with a South African prop and hope to finalise a deal in the coming week.

and that Jack McGrath is playing with a bit of an arm injury at the moment too as is Furlong too

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/rugby-in-brief-leinster-on-the-lookout-for-prop-30697640.html

Tox56

CatFromHue wrote: »

The Indo have it that Leinster are looking for another prop



and that Jack McGrath is playing with a bit of an arm injury at the moment too as is Furlong too

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/rugby-in-brief-leinster-on-the-lookout-for-prop-30697640.html

Another prop?! We're down Moore and Ross on the tighthead side and we're surviving with Bent and it won't be long before furlong really comes through, and we're overflowing with looseheads

Noopti

Noopti wrote: »

---
3. Furlong needs to move above Bent in the pecking order
--

He'll need to get better at rugby in order to do this. Contrast the scrum performance with Bent & Cronin vs Furlong & Strauss vs Wasps.

I was surprised and disappointed tbh.

Teferi

Are we surviving with Bent? He was getting absolutely mullered on the weekend despite a decent showing the week before. That points to inconsistency to me which is why there might be a bit of a panic purchase.

Noopti

Deleted User wrote: »

He'll need to get better at rugby in order to do this. Contrast the scrum performance with Bent & Cronin vs Furlong & Strauss vs Wasps.

I was surprised and disappointed tbh.

Bent has been OK at TH, but our scrum has been generally weak without Moore and Ross. MOC needs to take more reasonable risks, and give players like Furlong a proper chance. You mention the game against Wasps, but against Castres our scrum improved noticeably when he was on (and Strauss). Obviously there are a load more factors than just the front row (stage of the game, second row subs etc) - but if you cite the wasps game then you should also cite the Castres game.

Our team is always going to weakened when you lose 1st and 2nd string players though!

Imagine Cathal Marsh or Noel Reid starting at 10 vs Wasps last week. That's the equivalent to what's going on at TH.

Bent's done fine, I'd be happy for Furlong to push ahead of him though. Absolutely. I think Bent is a good LH and an acceptable TH.

CatFromHue

For a third choice prop he did well enough.

McGrath was at fault for one scrum and on another we minced them so it's not all bad news Bent.

the baby bull elephant

Deleted User wrote: »

He'll need to get better at rugby in order to do this. Contrast the scrum performance with Bent & Cronin vs Furlong & Strauss vs Wasps.

I was surprised and disappointed tbh.

Contrast who was behind them as well. For all Douglas is doing around the pitch I think McCarthy has shown himself to be more effective in the scrum. Bent's style at tighthead is also something which seems to work better with a strong scrummaging lock.

Noopti

Agree with all the above. I think Bent is doing OK at TH, and good to have him to fill that gap. He has also done well for us at LH when needed. I am definitely not a Bent basher, that's for sure. Just want to see Furlong get his chance, as he is a very promising TH and he needs some game time.

former legend

CatFromHue wrote: »

For a third choice prop he did well enough.

McGrath was at fault for one scrum and on another we minced them so it's not all bad news Bent.

Exactly this. He's well down the pecking order on both sides but he's doing OK all things considered.

justsomebloke

Have to say I've been impressed with Bent over the last couple of games. Stepped up and gave a solid enough performance considering he is 3rd choice for the other side of the scrum. I was expecting him to be the weak link by a good bit in the scrum, were McGrath and Douglas seemed to have more problems.

molloyjh

CatFromHue wrote: »

The Indo have it that Leinster are looking for another prop

Yeah, but apparently the 2 mentioned will be touring with the Boks so not sure what the story is there....

molloyjh wrote: »

We're apparently on the look-out for prop cover too (http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/rugby-in-brief-leinster-on-the-lookout-for-prop-30697640.html). Trevor Nyakane is ambipropsterous apparently, but is mainly a LH. Caylib Oosthuizen is a LH.

So after buying McCarthy who hasn't worked out we're back on the market for another LH. Bent is primarily a LH and between him and Byrne I'd have thought we were well enough covered there. At TH we're currently starting a LH with a very young and inexperienced TH on the bench. Surely TH is where the need really is?

Teferi wrote: »

Are we surviving with Bent? He was getting absolutely mullered on the weekend despite a decent showing the week before. That points to inconsistency to me which is why there might be a bit of a panic purchase.

For 3rd choice LH playing at TH I think he's doing pretty good. But the talk of us looking for another LH (after already bringing in McCarthy from Jersey) is worrying. Our problems are at TH not LH.

justsomebloke

molloyjh wrote: »

Our problems are at TH not LH.

Unless they know something we don't

Larbre34

As with last season, it hasnt been pretty, but I think we've done fairly well to get through a tough period shorn of so many front liners. We have a bit of a lull ahead, and hopefully Ospreys will be similarly under strength when we meet them at the end of November. The next while is hopefully about getting some guys back and clawing back a few places in the league. If we trade wins with Quins and hopefully shade them on points difference we'll be in decent shape.

The style of play is lowest common denominator stuff though, some guys just not being exploited for what they can do.