Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread V

vienne86

awec wrote: »

Cian Healy seems to have lost about three inches off his waistline. Is this sort of weight loss desirable for a prop?

I would have thought definitely NOT. Bit worrying.

case885

awec wrote: »

Cian Healy seems to have lost about three inches off his waistline. Is this sort of weight loss desirable for a prop?

I heard Joe is leaving McGrath at loosehead and moving Healy into the centre :pac:

S12b

Ah I wouldn't worry about it. Firstly, from his interview on Off The Ball last week I got the sense he has been given a nice bit of time off and away from the game to refresh. Of course he's still following his rehab programme 100% but other than that he can relax a bit. Secondly, Healy is the kind of physical specimen that a few weeks back eating and lifting and he'll back to where he needs to be....some guys are lucky and can afford to take a break, others could be set back significantly by easing up for a month.

Btw, he must be the only prop in the world who stops training and eats what he wants and loses weight!!

.ak

He'd put that back on in a flash. No point in trying to maintain a high weight mass when you're not playing.

vienne86

case885 wrote: »

I heard Joe is leaving McGrath at loosehead and moving Healy into the centre :pac:

I always fancied Cronin for centre, but that would involve a lot of swapping!!!!

case885

vienne86 wrote: »

I always fancied Cronin for centre, but that would involve a lot of swapping!!!!

That could be schmidt's plan b if we are down in the world cup final (highly unlikely we'll be behind though).

DGRulz

The idea of a SOB and Healy 12 and 13. Think of the carnage!

molloyjh

Rob signs on for another 3 years.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/leinster-rugby/rob-kearney-signs-new-threeyear-irfu-contract-30735249.html

MattD

DGRulz wrote: »

The idea of a SOB and Healy 12 and 13. Think of the carnage!

We might actually get some soft offloads in midfield with those two too!

vienne86

molloyjh wrote: »

Rob signs on for another 3 years.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/leinster-rugby/rob-kearney-signs-new-threeyear-irfu-contract-30735249.html

Gosh, I'd forgotten about Rob's contract! Great news. Got to hand it to the IRFU - since the Sexton debacle, they've played a blinder.

Buer

I don't think there was a chance he was ever leaving. Sexton mentioned how shocked and upset RK was when he announced he was leaving. He's probably a case of one of the guys the IRFU could low ball.

vienne86

Buer wrote: »

I don't think there was a chance he was ever leaving. Sexton mentioned how shocked and upset RK was when he announced he was leaving. He's probably a case of one of the guys the IRFU could low ball.

I don't think he was ever going to leave either. In fact I don't know who of our top players would willingly move. In a way, we were lucky that it was Johnny who was the one who took the jump - he has nerves of steel and was not going to be fobbed off by the IRFU....others might have balked. We all have a lot to thank him for and I for one hope he makes a packet of money out of his new deal.

Buer

Hard to say who in terms of top players. I wouldn't be surprised if someone like Dave Kearney left. He would be someone that has ambitions to play at a high level but would also potentially outside our first choice 23 with the presence of guys like McFadden, Fitzgerald and Kirchner.

Beyond that, I can't see any of them considering it. Ruddock possibly at a push given his heritage and potentially not being involved with Ireland if all were fit.

molloyjh

Buer wrote: »

Hard to say who in terms of top players. I wouldn't be surprised if someone like Dave Kearney left. He would be someone that has ambitions to play at a high level but would also potentially outside our first choice 23 with the presence of guys like McFadden, Fitzgerald and Kirchner.

Beyond that, I can't see any of them considering it. Ruddock possibly at a push given his heritage and potentially not being involved with Ireland if all were fit.

I think Ruddock will be there or thereabouts for Ireland. We saw his performance on Saturday and he's still a few years from his prime. All fit the bench spot for the back row is between himself and Henry, and while I like Henry I think Ruddock offers a lot more impact off the bench. Plus Rhys will be first choice at Leinster for the foreseeable.

Dave Kearney might be a possibility as he won't feature for Ireland unless there's a glut of injuries and he'll struggle to get onto Leinster's European squad as well without there being injuries. Which is a shame because I really like the guy. I honestly believe had that ball not bounced into touch against Scotland from Jackson's kick we'd be talking a lot more about Dave. The way he grounded it was pretty awesome.

dregin

vienne86 wrote: »

I always fancied Cronin for centre, but that would involve a lot of swapping!!!!

Sure didn't Tom Youngs start life as a 12?

justsomebloke

Buer wrote: »

Hard to say who in terms of top players. I wouldn't be surprised if someone like Dave Kearney left. He would be someone that has ambitions to play at a high level but would also potentially outside our first choice 23 with the presence of guys like McFadden, Fitzgerald and Kirchner.

Are we allowed keep Kirchner past his current contract though?

thomond2006

justsomebloke wrote: »

Are we allowed keep Kirchner past his current contract though?

You will be. This non-renewal nonsense has been (quietly) scraped.

GBXI

molloyjh wrote: »

Rob signs on for another 3 years.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/leinster-rugby/rob-kearney-signs-new-threeyear-irfu-contract-30735249.html

Quick question, who pays your average Leinster/Connacht/Munster/Ulster player? Is it the IRFU or the province, and do the players get paid for playing for Ireland?

I've heard of central contracts for the best players, so I assume most get paid by their province and then the best by the IRFU.

irishbucsfan

It's hard to believe Kearney isn't on a central contract, but the announcement makes it seem like he is. (Edit: IE on a provincial contract).

Teferi

irishbucsfan wrote: »

It's hard to believe Kearney isn't on a central contract, but the announcement makes it seem like he is. (Edit: IE on a provincial contract).

Nah he is definitely on a central. All of the announcements have started with "The IRFU and Leinster..." which tends to indicate central contracts.

irishbucsfan

Teferi wrote: »

Nah he is definitely on a central. All of the announcements have started with "The IRFU and Leinster..." which tends to indicate central contracts.

You're right, the Leinster announcement really leaves no doubt:

"The IRFU and Leinster are pleased to announce that Rob Kearney has signed a new three year contract with the IRFU which will see him remain at Leinster until at least June 2018."

awec

GBXI wrote: »

Quick question, who pays your average Leinster/Connacht/Munster/Ulster player? Is it the IRFU or the province, and do the players get paid for playing for Ireland?

I've heard of central contracts for the best players, so I assume most get paid by their province and then the best by the IRFU.

Central contracts are negotiated and paid by the IRFU. They are essentially free players for provinces, the drawback being that you will definitely lose them at every Ireland training camp.

Provincial contracts are negotiated and paid by the province, with money they earn from sponsors, gates and their IRFU cash.

NIQ contracts are paid in part by the IRFU with the balance paid by the province.

Players who are on central deals are not paid for Ireland appearances as its usually part of their normal salary. Anyone else is paid an appearance fee whenever they play.

Players on central deals also sign away their own image rights afaik.

Sometimes players can make more money by refusing a central deal.

I think.

GBXI

awec wrote: »

Central contracts are negotiated and paid by the IRFU. They are essentially free players for provinces, the drawback being that you will definitely lose them at every Ireland training camp.

Provincial contracts are negotiated and paid by the province, with money they earn from sponsors, gates and their IRFU cash.

NIQ contracts are paid in part by the IRFU with the balance paid by the province.

Players who are on central deals are not paid for Ireland appearances as its usually part of their normal salary. Anyone else is paid an appearance fee whenever they play.

Players on central deals also sign away their own image rights afaik.

Sometimes players can make more money by refusing a central deal.

I think.

Can't believe they get paid to play for their country, was sure they'd have expenses covered but that would be it. Must go back and apologise to the guy I was having the debate with!

And do you know what type of appearance fees the players get when playing for Ireland? For example, I doubt Henshaw is on a central contract (yet) so would he make a significant amount while playing for Ireland during these Autumn internationals relative to his overall salary paid by Connacht?

awec

GBXI wrote: »

Can't believe they get paid to play for their country, was sure they'd have expenses covered but that would be it. Must go back and apologise to the guy I was having the debate with!

And do you know what type of appearance fees the players get when playing for Ireland? For example, I doubt Henshaw is on a central contract (yet) so would he make a significant amount while playing for Ireland during these Autumn internationals relative to his overall salary paid by Connacht?

Think it's about 10 grand or something per-game.

Pretty sure I read that somewhere on here before.

stephen_n

GBXI wrote: »

Can't believe they get paid to play for their country, was sure they'd have expenses covered but that would be it. Must go back and apologise to the guy I was having the debate with!

And do you know what type of appearance fees the players get when playing for Ireland? For example, I doubt Henshaw is on a central contract (yet) so would he make a significant amount while playing for Ireland during these Autumn internationals relative to his overall salary paid by Connacht?

Why? they're professional athletes, why wouldn't they get paid, rugby is a professional sport and generates a huge amount or revenue of their endeavour. Same way soccer players get paid play, or golfers or pretty much any professional sport.

vienne86

GBXI wrote: »

Can't believe they get paid to play for their country, was sure they'd have expenses covered but that would be it. Must go back and apologise to the guy I was having the debate with!

And do you know what type of appearance fees the players get when playing for Ireland? For example, I doubt Henshaw is on a central contract (yet) so would he make a significant amount while playing for Ireland during these Autumn internationals relative to his overall salary paid by Connacht?

Would you think Johnny Sexton would play for just expenses? No way. Wasn't somebodly like SOB on a provincial contract for a long time because it was worth more money? It may not have been him, but it was one of our big names.

thirteen.

vienne86 wrote: »

Would you think Johnny Sexton would play for just expenses? No way. Wasn't somebodly like SOB on a provincial contract for a long time because it was worth more money? It may not have been him, but it was one of our big names.

It was SOB, but it had something to do with image rights I think.

wicklowwonder

vienne86 wrote: »

Would you think Johnny Sexton would play for just expenses? No way. Wasn't somebodly like SOB on a provincial contract for a long time because it was worth more money? It may not have been him, but it was one of our big names.

He didn't want to give up his image rights as far as I remember. I think they relaxed the image rights thing. You still have do certain amount of IRFU sponsorship stuff but likes of BOD and Rob Kearney had their own deals recently with Gillette and Audi if I remember correctly.

vienne86

thirteen. wrote: »

It was SOB, but it had something to do with image rights I think.

OK fair enough.....just interesting that at the time he preferred not to have a central contract.

.ak

Good thing too, otherwise we'd never have gotten such high standard media....

awec

Worst photoshopped jersey ever ^^

GBXI

stephen_n wrote: »

Why? they're professional athletes, why wouldn't they get paid, rugby is a professional sport and generates a huge amount or revenue of their endeavour. Same way soccer players get paid play, or golfers or pretty much any professional sport.

My point is that they get paid a salary by their clubs (provinces in Ireland), similar to pro soccer players, i.e. the employers are the club not country. So I thought, like soccer, players wouldn't get paid to play for their country, just have expenses covered.

vienne86

GBXI wrote: »

My point is that they get paid a salary by their clubs (provinces in Ireland), similar to pro soccer players, i.e. the employers are the club not country. So I thought, like soccer, players wouldn't get paid to play for their country, just have expenses covered.

I think this is the best way - no agro when the country need the player for a vital match and the club might want them rested. I'd hate it to be like the soccer.

GBXI

vienne86 wrote: »

Would you think Johnny Sexton would play for just expenses? No way. Wasn't somebodly like SOB on a provincial contract for a long time because it was worth more money? It may not have been him, but it was one of our big names.

I'm talking about their international games. Sexton's salary is paid by Racing, they are his employer, same as (this is the best example I can give) Seamus Coleman getting paid a salary by his club, Everton, and playing for Ireland 7-10 times a year but not getting paid, just expenses covered. As far as I'm aware anyway.

.ak

Sexton gets a bonus from the IRFU for playing for Ireland, not a salary. I'd imagine it's the same for soccer. It's actually the same for the non-central contracted player, they get appearance fees if they're called up for Ireland.

GBXI

.ak wrote: »

Sexton gets a bonus from the IRFU for playing for Ireland, not a salary. I'd imagine it's the same for soccer. It's actually the same for the non-central contracted player, they get appearance fees if they're called up for Ireland.

Apologies for taking the Leinster chat off topic, by the way. I just had a friend ask, while watching Ire vs SA, do these lads get paid for playing for Ireland. I said no way, just expenses, similar to soccer. One of the other lads said he thought they did get paid.

I think the Henshaw example I gave is interesting because, theoretically, he could make more in year playing for Ireland through appearance fees than his salary at Connacht, assuming he gets €10k p/game for Ireland and less than €100k p/annum at Connacht. This in turn could lead to problems with keeping himself for Ireland games, etc. (not that Henshaw would ever do that!). Sexton on the other hand, gets paid so much by Racing that the appearance fee for Ireland wouldn't make a difference to his motivations.

.ak

Well yeah, but obviously test footy is where everyone wants to play. Not just for pride of your country, but also yes you can earn more and you're also putting your market value up if you play international test rugby.

Basically central contracted players have the benefit of knowing what they will earn every season. Someone on a provincial contract CAN earn more if they get a call up, but have no guarantee.

CatFromHue

GBXI wrote: »

I'm talking about their international games. Sexton's salary is paid by Racing, they are his employer, same as (this is the best example I can give) Seamus Coleman getting paid a salary by his club, Everton, and playing for Ireland 7-10 times a year but not getting paid, just expenses covered. As far as I'm aware anyway.

I think the Soccer players get match fees for Ireland.

irishbucsfan

GBXI wrote: »

Apologies for taking the Leinster chat off topic, by the way. I just had a friend ask, while watching Ire vs SA, do these lads get paid for playing for Ireland. I said no way, just expenses, similar to soccer. One of the other lads said he thought they did get paid.

I think the Henshaw example I gave is interesting because, theoretically, he could make more in year playing for Ireland through appearance fees than his salary at Connacht, assuming he gets €10k p/game for Ireland and less than €100k p/annum at Connacht. This in turn could lead to problems with keeping himself for Ireland games, etc. (not that Henshaw would ever do that!). Sexton on the other hand, gets paid so much by Racing that the appearance fee for Ireland wouldn't make a difference to his motivations.

Rugby is a little different to soccer because of it's attritional nature. A player can play less games in a season and playing for an international team makes them unavailable for longer than it does in rugby.

IE in soccer you could play for a club on a Sunday, your international team on a Wednesday night, and your club again the next weekend. There's less recovery time needed.

In rugby the international windows take months out of a players' season so it affects their value to professional clubs proportionally more than it would a soccer player. So there is more pressure on the Unions for that reason. If FIFA turned around and made the soccer international windows a lot longer, the players' unions in soccer would put pressure on them for reimbursement I'd imagine.

GBXI

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Rugby is a little different to soccer because of it's attritional nature. A player can play less games in a season and playing for an international team makes them unavailable for longer than it does in rugby.

IE in soccer you could play for a club on a Sunday, your international team on a Wednesday night, and your club again the next weekend. There's less recovery time needed.

In rugby the international windows take months out of a players' season so it affects their value to professional clubs proportionally more than it would a soccer player. So there is more pressure on the Unions for that reason. If FIFA turned around and made the soccer international windows a lot longer, the players' unions in soccer would put pressure on them for reimbursement I'd imagine.

I think this is the point that makes most sense to me. Given that the players are missing so much time from their provinces (who are still playing regular league games) the IRFU are in a way obliged to pay the players to make up for this. That doesn't really happen in soccer, as all club games are stopped while internationals take place.

GBXI

CatFromHue wrote: »

I think the Soccer players get match fees for Ireland.

I wouldn't derail the Leinster chat any further by trying to find out if this is true! As you were, goys!

.ak

GBXI wrote: »

I wouldn't derail the Leinster chat any further by trying to find out if this is true! As you were, goys!

Feel free to start a thread on it - it's interesting, and kind of a grey area.

Morf

awec wrote: »

Worst photoshopped jersey ever ^^

Tullow! Boo! Hiss!

scott1974

20% off The Harlequins game at Christmas... need to register an account though!!

https://axaroi.groupscheme.com/discounts/product/leinster-rugby/20-off-tickets-to-see-leinster-v-harlequins-on-saturday-13th-december-at-1945-in-the-aviva-stadium./384/954?utm_source=2014-11-11-stuff-your-stocking-with-savings&utm_medium=20-off-tickets-to-see-leinster-v-harlequins-on-saturday-13th-december-at-1945-in-the-aviva-stadium.&utm_campaign=axaroi.groupscheme.com

vienne86

Anyone else get a ticket with the wrong kick off time on it for the Harlequins match? Mine says 6.30 - glad they emailed us - that could have been embarrassing.

thomond2006

vienne86 wrote: »

Anyone else get a ticket with the wrong kick off time on it for the Harlequins match? Mine says 6.30 - glad they emailed us - that could have been embarrassing.

Not the first time they've made a mistake. Eh Molloy? :pac:

molloyjh

thomond2006 wrote: »

Not the first time they've made a mistake. Eh Molloy? :pac:

No it most certainly is not.

stephen_n

CatFromHue wrote: »

I think the Soccer players get match fees for Ireland.

in the region of 50K a game iirc.

Synode

stephen_n wrote: »

in the region of 50K a game iirc.

:pac: No chance. Nowhere near that (unless you mean as a total, if so, carry on)

Tim Robbins

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Rugby is a little different to soccer because of it's attritional nature. A player can play less games in a season and playing for an international team makes them unavailable for longer than it does in rugby.

IE in soccer you could play for a club on a Sunday, your international team on a Wednesday night, and your club again the next weekend. There's less recovery time needed.

In rugby the international windows take months out of a players' season so it affects their value to professional clubs proportionally more than it would a soccer player. So there is more pressure on the Unions for that reason. If FIFA turned around and made the soccer international windows a lot longer, the players' unions in soccer would put pressure on them for reimbursement I'd imagine.

In Soccer the CEO of the FAI gets paid a fortune and doesn't do much.