Murder rate gone up by 33%.

darkdubh · 22-09-2014 4:02pm #1

So the official crime rates for this country have been released and murder is up in the last year by over 30%.Theres also big increases for kidnapping and other violent crime.So despite what the Guards and government keep telling us Irish society seems to getting more violent.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0922/645448-crime/

Karl Stein · 22-09-2014 4:06pm

Ireland is one of the safest liberal democracies on planet Earth to live in.

Enjoy your stay.

endacl · 22-09-2014 4:08pm

Scumbag v scumbag self solving problem crimes are up.

Crimes that effect real people are down.

Happy days.

Nodin · 22-09-2014 4:13pm

Karl Stein wrote: »

Ireland is one of the safest liberal democracies on planet Earth to live in.

Enjoy your stay.

Don't fill his head with that nonsense, or he'll be killed in the coming Crimepocalypse.

darkdubh · 22-09-2014 4:15pm

endacl wrote: »

Scumbag v scumbag self solving problem crimes are up.

Crimes that effect real people are down.

Happy days.

Thats fine till innocent people start getting killed.Its not in societys interests to have heavily armed gangs operating freely.Look at the amount of people who've either been shot in cases of mistaken identity(Shane Geoghan) or killed because they were witnesses(Anthony Campbell).The Gardai have done an excellent job in Limerick in putting away the leading scumbags but in Dublin there seems to be no end to the problem and now you have gangland killings in places like Cavan.

Beano · 22-09-2014 4:16pm

darkdubh wrote: »

So the official crime rates for this country have been released and murder is up in the last year by over 30%.Theres also big increases for kidnapping and other violent crime.So despite what the Guards and government keep telling us Irish society seems to getting more violent.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0922/645448-crime/

The stats for murder in this country are so low it doesnt take a massive increase (in this case 15) to give seemingly alarming figures of a 33% increase.

Mr McBoatface · 22-09-2014 4:18pm

TBH :- Stats are bollix . An increase of 15 murders generally involving people engaged in murder and crime does not make this country more dangerous.

PS - 100% of the people who will respond to or read this thread will die.

BoJack Horseman · 22-09-2014 4:19pm

darkdubh wrote: »

So the official crime rates for this country have been released and murder is up in the last year by over 30%.Theres also big increases for kidnapping and other violent crime.So despite what the Guards and government keep telling us Irish society seems to getting more violent.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0922/645448-crime/

So.... Homicides in 2013/14 are numbering around the same as they were in 2011/12.
(With a very low year in between.)

Karl Stein · 22-09-2014 4:20pm

darkdubh wrote: »

Thats fine till innocent people start getting killed.

As tragic and detestable as the cases you cite are they're incredibly rare.

Holsten · 22-09-2014 4:22pm

In realilty the rate is much higher due to the huge amount of unreporting that goes on, mostly down to Garda negligence.

B.A._Baracus · 22-09-2014 4:22pm

Here's the thing about Ireland...
It's not some warzone or anything like that. Dispite what certain people may think :pac: Go over to other parts of the world to know what a dangerous kip is really like.

But within saying that, is Ireland getting a more dangerous place to live in? ... of course.

Riskymove · 22-09-2014 4:23pm

Holsten wrote: »

In realilty the rate is much higher due to the huge amount of unreporting that goes on, mostly down to Garda negligence.

Murders are not reported?

Beano · 22-09-2014 4:24pm

Holsten wrote: »

In realilty the rate is much higher due to the huge amount of unreporting that goes on, mostly down to Garda negligence.

And your basis for saying that is?

Riskymove · 22-09-2014 4:24pm

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Here's the thing about Ireland...
It's not some warzone or anything like that. Dispite what certain people may think :pac: Go over to other parts of the world to know what a dangerous kip is really like.

a quick google shows Ireland 36th lowest rate of 217 countries

We had 1.2 homicides per 100,000 people in 2012

Honduras has 90....yes 90

MadYaker · 22-09-2014 4:25pm

An increase in the number of scumbag drug dealers killing other scumbag drug dealers, doesn't bother me too much to be honest.

If you actually read the statistics crimes against ordinary law abiding citizens have reduced.

ScumLord · 22-09-2014 4:25pm

darkdubh wrote: »

Look at the amount of people who've either been shot in cases of mistaken identity(Shane Geoghan) or killed because they were witnesses(Anthony Campbell).

So, two.

No matter what we do as a nation, people are going to murder other people for all sorts of reasons. Innocent people are going to get injured or worse, **** happens. The bottom line in Ireland is that very little **** happens and you won't get better numbers unless you plan to lock the entire nation up for their own good.

Robbo · 22-09-2014 4:26pm

Holsten wrote: »

In realilty the rate is much higher due to the huge amount of unreporting that goes on, mostly down to Garda negligence.

The amount of people who don't know they've been murdered is shocking.

Worse still those who are aware that they've been murdered but have no faith in the Gardai so they do nothing about it.

Beano · 22-09-2014 4:27pm

http://www.cso.ie/Quicktables/GetQuickTables.aspx?FileName=cja01c1.asp&TableName=Homicide+Offences&StatisticalProduct=DB_CJI think this gives a better picture of the situation. We had a low in 20011 and it has climbed since then but the overall trend is downwards since 2006.

The stats quoted in that article are YTD figures which dont seem to match with the other CSO figures i linked to above

Beano · 22-09-2014 4:29pm

Robbo wrote: »

The amount of people who don't know they've been murdered is shocking.

Worse still those who are aware that they've been murdered but have no faith in the Gardai so they do nothing about it.

It happened to me once but i didnt bother reporting it. I'm sure the guards are busy enough without me bothering them with my little problems.

darkdubh · 22-09-2014 4:31pm

ScumLord wrote: »

So, two.

No matter what we do as a nation, people are going to murder other people for all sorts of reasons. Innocent people are going to get injured or worse, **** happens. The bottom line in Ireland is that very little **** happens and you won't get better numbers unless you plan to lock the entire nation up for their own good.

Two examples,there have been many more.I'm not going to go trawling through old news reports for stats but my point is that people have a "its not affecting me so I don't care" attitude.

Ralf and Florian · 22-09-2014 4:36pm

A few reasons for the increases seem to be a big increase in people getting killed in drunken assaults/stabbings at house parties.Maybe the easy avilability of cheap booze should be looked at and off licenses more heavily regulated.There seems to be more and more gangland killings certainly and people being killed for more trivial reasons.Being in a fight with some scummer in a pub and being shot a few days later,petty rows etc.

MadYaker · 22-09-2014 4:40pm

darkdubh wrote: »

Thats fine till innocent people start getting killed.Its not in societys interests to have heavily armed gangs operating freely.Look at the amount of people who've either been shot in cases of mistaken identity(Shane Geoghan) or killed because they were witnesses(Anthony Campbell).The Gardai have done an excellent job in Limerick in putting away the leading scumbags but in Dublin there seems to be no end to the problem and now you have gangland killings in places like Cavan.

Ah would you stop with the sensationalist nonsense. The gangs aren't heavily armed (shotguns and pistols isn't heavily armed) or operating freely. There have been a tiny amount of cases where an innocent bystander gets killed.

There was a 33% increase compared to last year (15 more dead drug dealers boo hoo) but last year was a statistical outlier, the overall trend has been down since 2006.

Aubrey loves Joe · 22-09-2014 4:42pm

jobyrne30 wrote: »

PS - 100% of the people who will respond to or read this thread will die.

Could you expand more on this please?

22-09-2014 4:43pm

Karl Stein wrote: »

As tragic and detestable as the cases you cite are they're incredibly rare.

One of those cases is too many and as someone has pointed out, we have had both Shane Geoghegan and Anthony Campbell getting caught in the crossfire to begin with.

hfallada · 22-09-2014 4:44pm

You can make statistics look like anything you want. That was my first statistics lecture in college was about. To make statistics reliable, they need to be look over a long period of time and compared to other years.

One year is not a fair representation

Beano · 22-09-2014 4:44pm

Deleted User wrote: »

One of those cases is too many and as someone has pointed out, we have had both Shane Geoghegan and Anthony Campbell getting caught in the crossfire to begin with.

Unfortunately the world is not perfect, so there will always be innocent victims of criminal gangs.

darkdubh · 22-09-2014 4:46pm

MadYaker wrote: »

Ah would you stop with the sensationalist nonsense. The gangs aren't heavily armed (shotguns and pistols isn't heavily armed) or operating freely. There have been a tiny amount of cases where an innocent bystander gets killed.

There was a 33% increase compared to last year (15 more dead drug dealers boo hoo) but last year was a statistical outlier, the overall trend has been down since 2006.

They were all drug dealers?

Beano · 22-09-2014 4:46pm

Aubrey loves Joe wrote: »

Could you expand more on this please?

you've gone and done it now. Because you responded you have lost your chance for immortality.

Specialun · 22-09-2014 4:48pm

I think that they should stop counting a scumbag being killed as a number and when a sexy lady is killed it should count and be punished as double

timetogo · 22-09-2014 4:52pm

Non sensationalist info for the murder rates around the world here.

http://www.unodc.org/documents/gsh/data/GSH2013_Homicide_count_and_rate.xlsx

22-09-2014 4:55pm

Beano wrote: »

Unfortunately the world is not perfect, so there will always be innocent victims of criminal gangs.

Be that as it may, the authorities have to be seen to tackle it head on to prevent anymore all the same. Gangland killings cant be just seen as a necessary evil.

Ill admit i dont care much for those who are involved in gangland and are slain but at the same time it would be absolutely irresponsible and reckless of the Gardaí if they just stood idly by and done nothing to prevent these killings. All well and good saying 'well so and so was only a scumbag anyway' but you have to place yourself in the scenario of walking down the street and happening to be a few feet away as someone is being assassinated. The bullet could have hit you as easily if the assassin has a poor shot and the shooter could also decide there and then that a witness to such a murder needs to be eliminated. Look at the case for example a few years back where Mr Joe Duffy phone in was shot in a taxi. Imagine how terrifying it is for that driver having such fear as he only tries to earn a living.

Or indeed would you like your child to witness a murder as they are being dropped off at school? Its not as open and shut as we like to think

Beano · 22-09-2014 4:59pm

I wouldnt like any child to witness a murder. But you seem to be implying that the Gardai are standing idly by and doing nothing. The significant drop in the murder rate since 2006 shows this not to be true. It just isnt possible to prevent every murder.

ibstar · 22-09-2014 5:00pm

MadYaker wrote: »

An increase in the number of scumbag drug dealers killing other scumbag drug dealers, doesn't bother me too much to be honest.

If you actually read the statistics crimes against ordinary law abiding citizens have reduced.

because we have nothing left for them to rob from us.
the banks and politicians got there before them

Dyr · 22-09-2014 5:00pm

It'll be interesting to see what peoples criteria for killings are to qualify as "scumbag on scumbag"

There's been a few cases this year of joe citizens being murdered because they fell foul of gangsters. if you think these ****ers are only willing to kill their own then you're deluded

ScumLord · 22-09-2014 5:00pm

darkdubh wrote: »

Two examples,there have been many more.I'm not going to go trawling through old news reports for stats but my point is that people have a "its not affecting me so I don't care" attitude.

I wish more people had that attitude, in Irelands it's more a case of, "some things happened, people need to hear my uninformed opinion, but I'll whisper it back here in case anyone asks me to help or realises I don't actually know what I'm talking about".

22-09-2014 5:05pm

Beano wrote: »

I wouldnt like any child to witness a murder. But you seem to be implying that the Gardai are standing idly by and doing nothing. The significant drop in the murder rate since 2006 shows this not to be true. It just isnt possible to prevent every murder.

i never implied that. Im just speaking against the attitude that a few have that 'sure its only scumbags being killed anyway and it's rare for innocent people to be getting killed by these people'. My point is that the death of one innocent person is more than enough and its paramount that the powers that be continue to stand against this sort of crime no matter who is involved.

Never once did i suggest the Gardaí are standing idly by. In fact id say they are doing a remarkable job with those stats given how under resourced and under funded they are.

Stone Deaf 4evr · 22-09-2014 5:08pm

Riskymove wrote: »

a quick google shows Ireland 36th lowest rate of 217 countries

We had 1.2 homicides per 100,000 people in 2012

Honduras has 90....yes 90

maybe years of call of duty have desensitized me , but 1 in every 1111 people doesn't seem so high to me. I'll worry when its one in every 111 people.

Little CuChulainn · 22-09-2014 5:16pm

endacl wrote: »

Scumbag v scumbag self solving problem crimes are up.

Crimes that effect real people are down.

Happy days.

Tell that to the kid who was shot in the back in Ballyfermot

shruikan2553 · 22-09-2014 5:37pm

People should have to take a test before being allowed to quote statistics.

Nodin · 22-09-2014 6:00pm

Aubrey loves Joe wrote: »

Could you expand more on this please?

He can't, he's dead.

MadYaker · 22-09-2014 6:04pm

He was murdered doncha know

Nodin · 22-09-2014 6:07pm

MadYaker wrote: »

He was murdered doncha know

33% more than he would have been this time last year.

endacl · 22-09-2014 6:08pm

darkdubh wrote: »

Two examples,there have been many more.I'm not going to go trawling through old news reports for stats but my point is that people have a "its not affecting me so I don't care" attitude.

It's more of an "it is affecting them so I don't care" attitude.

Skylinehead · 22-09-2014 6:15pm

Nodin wrote: »

33% more than he would have been this time last year.

Won't be long now until we start seeing people getting double murdered.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 22-09-2014 6:36pm

Robbo wrote: »

The amount of people who don't know they've been murdered is shocking.

Worse still those who are aware that they've been murdered but have no faith in the Gardai so they do nothing about it.

Funniest post I've seen in donkeys

cajonlardo · 22-09-2014 6:43pm

shruikan2553 wrote: »

People should have to take a test before being allowed to quote statistics.

and I am one of them

Just wondering if anyone knows if murder stats relate to population increase over the decades?
If the population increased over a period by x, is there a corresponding rise in murder ( or any crime for that matter). Just don't want to believe that back in the '80's there was less than 30 murders per annum and now we are looking at over 50 and there isn't other factors involved.

Karl Stein · 22-09-2014 7:23pm

cajonlardo wrote: »

in the '80's there was less than 30 murders per annum and now we are looking at over 50 and there isn't other factors involved.

I'm going to hazard a guess that any increase (per capita) might be to do with increasing disposable income > increasing recreational drug use > increased drug gang feuding over territory/money.

Total guess, mind you.

c_man · 22-09-2014 7:30pm

Murder rate gone up by 33%

We really need to legalise concealed carry of AR-15s so that ordinary people can stay safe.

Calibos · 22-09-2014 8:15pm

cajonlardo wrote: »

and I am one of them

Just wondering if anyone knows if murder stats relate to population increase over the decades?
If the population increased over a period by x, is there a corresponding rise in murder ( or any crime for that matter). Just don't want to believe that back in the '80's there was less than 30 murders per annum and now we are looking at over 50 and there isn't other factors involved.

There's certainly seems to be a lot of Baltic on Baltic that there wasn't in the 80's

Dyr · 22-09-2014 8:20pm

c_man wrote: »

We really need to legalise concealed carry of AR-15s so that ordinary people can stay safe.

Sure where would ye get an AR-15 in Ireland?

*cough*

Frank Lee Midere · 23-09-2014 1:56pm

Robbo wrote: »

The amount of people who don't know they've been murdered is shocking.

Worse still those who are aware that they've been murdered but have no faith in the Gardai so they do nothing about it.

There's people getting murdered these days who never got murdered before.

Murder rate gone up by 33%.

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