Problem with plumbing in apartment - advice needed.

wayne0308

Hi,

Apologies for the long post. I was hoping someone could advise me on what course of action I should take.

So, I'm renting an apartment from an agent. The lease is for 1 year and it has recently expired at the end of August. The landlord wanted to renew it and increase the rent, which I was happy to do, as I knew I wanted to stay for at least another year. A new lease agreement was to be sent out, but before it arrived a problem arose with the plumbing.

On the Sunday before last, the distribution pump for the hot and cold water stopped working properly. It tripped the circuit breaker while I was away and if I turn it back on, it stays on. It's only supposed to come on when there is a demand for water i.e. if you turn on a tap. I can't leave it on as it gets very hot, it's not designed to come on for long periods of time and I'd be afraid a fire would start.

I notified the landlord on Monday morning that there was a problem. He called a plumber that day and the plumber text me that evening that he would ring me Tuesday morning. I didn't receive a call and rang him that afternoon. He said he would get out to me the following day but couldn't give me a time. He said he'd ring to organise it in the morning. He didn't call me so I rang him and it was pushed to the next day.

Since then, I've been making all the phone calls trying to organise him to come out. He did come out on Thursday to take a look but he told me what I was told by a number of others. That is that the PCB needs to be replaced or the pump itself needs replacing. He's cancelled appointments each day this week and I've had to ring him to find this out, he hasn't rang me or text me to cancel.

I rang the landlord Friday to find out what was going on, and he explained that he only uses two plumbers and one is on holidays. He admitted this guy is very busy and said he would get him to come Monday. He didn't and as I said above, since then it's been pushed to the next day each day.

I just rang the landlord again and he is going to ring the plumber himself and get back to me and hopefully get him out tomorrow. I've been trying since Tuesday the 16th to get this done so I don't expect him to come.

As it is now, I can have a shower by switching on the breaker for the 5-10mins or so it takes. I can't use the washing machine as that takes 30-45mins with the pump on constantly and it gets very hot as mentioned above but I can use a local laundrette.

I feel like on the one hand I'm being very pushy, and perhaps unreasonable trying to get this sorted and on the other hand I feel like realistically this should have been done and dusted last Thursday at the very latest.

What is the best course of action to take at this stage? What would you do in my situation?

quietsailor

Your not being pushy at all, quite restrained in fact. Your washing facilities are non-existent now & that's a breach of the minimum standards - it is something that should be dealt with immediately not later - you said it happened on the 16th, and it's the 24th today - over a week - and it hasn't been inspected much less fixed.

Call the LL and tell them your not happy, that it has to be inspected tomorrow and a firm date given for fixing it, if they can't give you the appointment AND the date to fix it then tell them you will contact 3 plumbers yourself, get quotes & time-frames and go with the best one paying them yourself and deducting that cost from the next month's rent.

Follow up this phone call with a letter stating all this, include a copy of the Residential Tenancies Act or minimum standards & highlight the relevant bits.

Keep calm and don't let it go into a shouting match, the LL will not want to do this as they have no control over the plumber you use. Point out to them you need to be able to shower and wash your clothes - you've been very nice so far and haven't looked for costs to cover laundrette fees

wayne0308

quietsailor wrote: »

Your not being pushy at all, quite restrained in fact. Your washing facilities are non-existent now & that's a breach of the minimum standards - it is something that should be dealt with immediately not later - you said it happened on the 16th, and it's the 24th today - over a week - and it hasn't been inspected much less fixed.

Call the LL and tell them your not happy, that it has to be inspected tomorrow and a firm date given for fixing it, if they can't give you the appointment AND the date to fix it then tell them you will contact 3 plumbers yourself, get quotes & time-frames and go with the best one paying them yourself and deducting that cost from the next month's rent.

Follow up this phone call with a letter stating all this, include a copy of the Residential Tenancies Act or minimum standards & highlight the relevant bits.

Keep calm and don't let it go into a shouting match, the LL will not want to do this as they have no control over the plumber you use. Point out to them you need to be able to shower and wash your clothes - you've been very nice so far and haven't looked for costs to cover laundrette fees

Thanks for your reply. It good to get a sanity check on how I've been handling this so far.

The agent just rang me back a sec ago and the plumber said he would be out here tomorrow evening, the plumber said to the agent that he had told me this already today but this is not true and I said this.

The pump was inspected last Thursday, and the plumber knows what needs to be done, it's just I can't get him here to do it sadly.

I did say during the phone call there that if this doesn't happen tomorrow, that I want him to get a different plumber. At this point I'll definitely follow your advice and put a deadline in writing. I'll write this tonight and get it ready for tomorrow. I'm not sure what to do at that point though, I've been thinking of giving my notice and going someplace else TBH.

If I do hire my own plumber, can I actually take it out of the rent? I was looking through some old posts and it looks like I cant do this.

Marcusm

This is why I am happy to see NAMA sell entire blocks of apartments to professional landlords. When I had a similar problem it was fixed within the hour on a Thursday evening. When the washing machine broke, it was replaced the next working day. Your landlord sounds like a reasonable guy but he doesn't have the power to force the job to completed.



This iOS predictive text stuff needs more attention.

quietsailor

wayne0308 wrote: »

Thanks for your reply. It good to get a sanity check on how I've been handling this so far.

The agent just rang me back a sec ago and the plumber said he would be out here tomorrow evening, the plumber said to the agent that he had told me this already today but this is not true and I said this.

The pump was inspected last Thursday, and the plumber knows what needs to be done, it's just I can't get him here to do it sadly.

I did say during the phone call there that if this doesn't happen tomorrow, that I want him to get a different plumber. At this point I'll definitely follow your advice and put a deadline in writing. I'll write this tonight and get it ready for tomorrow. I'm not sure what to do at that point though, I've been thinking of giving my notice and going someplace else TBH.

If I do hire my own plumber, can I actually take it out of the rent? I was looking through some old posts and it looks like I cant do this.

Giving your notice - that I'm hazy on as although it's a breach of the minimum standards the LL can argue that they are trying to fix it and "it's out of their control due to waiting on the plumber" - what I would do now is sit down with phone and look at incoming & outgoing calls, then write down everything you can remember about this, in chronological order with times attached. If the situation gets worse an you have to issue your notice and don't get your deposit back you'll have to open a PRTB complaint and the more proof you have the better that you've tried to follow the guidelines as much as possible.
It might be best to be prepared - have a look at the PRTB "Good Tenant Guide"

Termination for breach of landlord obligations
(see section 68 of the act)
A tenant may give 28 days notice owing to a landlord’s
breach of his/her obligations under the Act/letting agreement,
regardless of the length of the tenancy. However, the tenant
will have to notify the landlord of the failure to comply with
his/her obligations in writing, allowing reasonable time for the
landlord to remedy the failure. If the situation is not remedied
within this time, the notice may be served.
If the landlord’s behaviour is such that it poses imminent
danger of death or serious injury or imminent danger to the
fabric of the dwelling, then a 7 day notice may be served. No
prior notice needs to be served in this situation.

and also the Residential Tenancies act, especially section 68 - tenant giving notice


I've a nasty suspicion you're being given a run-around though, "tomorrow evening" is Friday evening and well "You know bud, something came up and I couldn't get to you......" is a wonderful excuse to drag it out past the weekend. I'd check the pump name and model and Google it, you can also ask over in the plumbing forum on here has this pump a reputation of breaking often/being an expensive repair -- it's POSSIBLE the LL is delaying it as much as possible.
Once you go down this road things will probably get awkward with the LL & agent, nothing you can do about it except keep calm and don't let it go to a shouting match.

I'd write the letter anyway and hand it to the LL & agent, emailing on a copy as well for proof of dates - get a friend to be around when you meet them if at all possible. This way if you do hand in notice in the future you've given them the written warning required.
Bear in mind they will probably try to find an excuse to keep the deposit if they are being sticky about money now. Can you/Do you have the money for a deposit & 1st months rent on another place if you decide to hand in notice?

"If I hire my own plumber can I take it from the rent?"
I can't find a link to back it up but I know it's been advocated on here before - I'd certainly threaten it in the letter the LL/agent but I'd contact THreshold and ask them have they seen this used before to get repairs completed.

One other thing - who is your local authority - you are allowed to contact them to get the house inspected, they may not as they will have a huge workload, but it's another threat to push the LL along.

Thoie

Swapping out the PCB is an easy fix, takes about 10 minutes, and you can do it yourself if you have a screwdriver. The PCB generally costs about €60.

I've done mine - the hardest part about it was lying on the floor in an awkward position to get at it. One hint if you or the landlord is going that route is to take a photo of the original before you start disconnecting things, and use that for reference for reassembling. It's just a small circuit board with multiple small wires attached to it. Once you reattach the wires to the same places on the new one, all is good.

Suggest to the landlord that if the plumber isn't here asap that he source a new PCB this evening and drop it over to you, and the two of you can try that together. If it's not the PCB then switching out the pump itself is a bigger job I'd leave to the plumber.

Edit:
My advice doesn't touch on the legal side of things - it's just a suggestion to get you back up and running (water). A new pump could cost about €800.

wayne0308

quietsailor wrote: »

Giving your notice - that I'm hazy on as although it's a breach of the minimum standards the LL can argue that they are trying to fix it and "it's out of their control due to waiting on the plumber" - what I would do now is sit down with phone and look at incoming & outgoing calls, then write down everything you can remember about this, in chronological order with times attached. If the situation gets worse an you have to issue your notice and don't get your deposit back you'll have to open a PRTB complaint and the more proof you have the better that you've tried to follow the guidelines as much as possible.
It might be best to be prepared - have a look at the PRTB "Good Tenant Guide"

Termination for breach of landlord obligations
(see section 68 of the act)
A tenant may give 28 days notice owing to a landlord’s
breach of his/her obligations under the Act/letting agreement,
regardless of the length of the tenancy. However, the tenant
will have to notify the landlord of the failure to comply with
his/her obligations in writing, allowing reasonable time for the
landlord to remedy the failure. If the situation is not remedied
within this time, the notice may be served.
If the landlord’s behaviour is such that it poses imminent
danger of death or serious injury or imminent danger to the
fabric of the dwelling, then a 7 day notice may be served. No
prior notice needs to be served in this situation.

and also the Residential Tenancies act, especially section 68 - tenant giving notice


I've a nasty suspicion you're being given a run-around though, "tomorrow evening" is Friday evening and well "You know bud, something came up and I couldn't get to you......" is a wonderful excuse to drag it out past the weekend. I'd check the pump name and model and Google it, you can also ask over in the plumbing forum on here has this pump a reputation of breaking often/being an expensive repair -- it's POSSIBLE the LL is delaying it as much as possible.
Once you go down this road things will probably get awkward with the LL & agent, nothing you can do about it except keep calm and don't let it go to a shouting match.

I'd write the letter anyway and hand it to the LL & agent, emailing on a copy as well for proof of dates - get a friend to be around when you meet them if at all possible. This way if you do hand in notice in the future you've given them the written warning required.
Bear in mind they will probably try to find an excuse to keep the deposit if they are being sticky about money now. Can you/Do you have the money for a deposit & 1st months rent on another place if you decide to hand in notice?

"If I hire my own plumber can I take it from the rent?"
I can't find a link to back it up but I know it's been advocated on here before - I'd certainly threaten it in the letter the LL/agent but I'd contact THreshold and ask them have they seen this used before to get repairs completed.

One other thing - who is your local authority - you are allowed to contact them to get the house inspected, they may not as they will have a huge workload, but it's another threat to push the LL along.

Certainly feels like I'm being given the run around. I called the plumber at lunch today and sent a text message when he didn't answer. I haven't got a reply so far. I'm going to ring the agent again at 4.30ish and let him know what the story is, that I'm just being ignored now and ask that we change plumbers. The last time I actually got through to the plumber he said he had the replacement pump, I'm starting to doubt this now.

Thanks for your advice, I've taken screenshots of my call log for since the issue began. So far I've made 25 calls, mostly to the plumber. It's shocking to see :-) I've received 4 back. I'll tie this up with what my memory to document what was discussed while everything is fresh, thanks for the advice so far!

quietsailor

Can you get time off work on Monday and go into threshold and ask their advice on paying a plumber yourself to fix it and deducting from the rent.

Warning It's very important to state "deducting" rather than withholding rent in any correspondence - withholding is illegal and damages your case with the
PRTB.

wandererz

wayne0308 wrote: »

Certainly feels like I'm being given the run around. I called the plumber at lunch today and sent a text message when he didn't answer. I haven't got a reply so far. I'm going to ring the agent again at 4.30ish and let him know what the story is, that I'm just being ignored now and ask that we change plumbers. The last time I actually got through to the plumber he said he had the replacement pump, I'm starting to doubt this now.

Thanks for your advice, I've taken screenshots of my call log for since the issue began. So far I've made 25 calls, mostly to the plumber. It's shocking to see :-) I've received 4 back. I'll tie this up with what my memory to document what was discussed while everything is fresh, thanks for the advice so far!

I doubt the plumber will be able to fix this - unless he is an electrician as well.

On the subject of water pumps, i had to get mine repaired recently (Stuart Turner pump).

There are two main things that can go wrong with them: the circuit board or the capacitor.

The costs were as follows:
- Circuit board: 70 euro
- Capacitor: 30 euro
- Labour: 70

So a total of 170euro for the replacement of both. Compared to a cost of 600-700 euro or more being quoted for a new pump.

They also provide a 1year guarantee on those parts.

Details are:
- Domesticpumps.ie
- 085 7433777

It took the guy 15-30mins to replace (or less).

Get it fixed and bill the landlord for it.