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Abbey Park, Ferrybank, Waterford.

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13

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    #62
    Hijpo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,827 ✭✭✭Hijpo


    Digital Society wrote: »
    Okay i will ask first why this group of louts who just give everyone dirty looks as they drive into or walk into estates in Ferrybank think they represent me? Why are they not just blocking their own individual install?

    Also why do they think its ok to have their 4 year olds playing on the main road causing people to have to creep past to dodge them?

    From the message that was sent out yesterday the protesters have been made aware that they can't stop them from installing meters in people houses who actually want them so as far as I know they are at the front of the estate keeping an eye out for IW then protesting on their own property.

    As for the kids, being in an estate I'm sure they have signs saying children at play and you should be crawling on those roads anyway. Unless the kids are actually playing chicken with the cars I don't think theres much you can do.
    Wouldnt they be playing on the road anyway? Even of there was no protests?

    Just reread what you posted, when you say main road do you mean the one outside of the estate? Then the gaurda should be notified as thats an accident waiting to happen.


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    #63
    Digital Society
    Registered Users Posts: 972 ✭✭✭Digital Society


    Hijpo wrote: »
    From the message that was sent out yesterday the protesters have been made aware that they can't stop them from installing meters in people houses who actually want them so as far as I know they are at the front of the estate keeping an eye out for IW then protesting on their own property.

    As for the kids, being in an estate I'm sure they have signs saying children at play and you should be crawling on those roads anyway. Unless the kids are actually playing chicken with the cars I don't think theres much you can do.
    Wouldnt they be playing on the road anyway? Even of there was no protests?

    Just reread what you posted, when you say main road do you mean the one outside of the estate? Then the gaurda should be notified as thats an accident waiting to happen.

    Last crowd that acted like that down there where in a caravan. And the way they are acting with their kids they seem to care just about as much.

    Ive the same level of respect for them both after being looked at like i'm dirt by both the groups i just mentioned.


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    #64
    Hijpo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,827 ✭✭✭Hijpo


    Digital Society wrote: »
    Last crowd that acted like that down there where in a caravan. And the way they are acting with their kids they seem to care just about as much.

    Ive the same level of respect for them both after being looked at like i'm dirt by both the groups i just mentioned.

    I cant see what reason they would have for looking at you that way. Do you have an Irish water bumper sticker?

    I'm actually finding it difficult to distinguish what your thoughts are on this subject. In one post you've said how fighting it is useless and that we will all be billed anyway, then you go on to say how horrific it will be for someone paying the bill on a 4 bed semi and selling off the company will bring even more hardship and bills. Now you got offended because you thought I put you in the protester group and now you give out about all the protesters. Can you clear it up for me.


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    #65
    S.O
    Closed Accounts Posts: 397 ✭✭S.O


    Digital Society wrote: »
    Last crowd that acted like that down there where in a caravan. And the way they are acting with their kids they seem to care just about as much.

    Ive the same level of respect for them both after being looked at like i'm dirt by both the groups i just mentioned.

    I find it very peculiar that people would look at you like dirt without any particular reason.


  • Options
    #66
    KevIRL
    Registered Users Posts: 39,546 ✭✭✭✭KevIRL


    Digital Society wrote: »
    Okay i will ask first why this group of louts who just give everyone dirty looks as they drive into or walk into estates in Ferrybank think they represent me? Why are they not just blocking their own individual install?

    Whats worse is people who dont even live on the estate, or indeed even in the area hanging around outside the place 'protesting'. I came home yesterday and counted 6 people outside and none of whom live here. Going by comments on Facebook, people are coming over from Waterford City just to join in. The place looks a mess as out there, a door painted on and other homemade protest posters.

    As a community here we have had numerous issues over the years regarding anti-social behaviour from people in temporary dwellings, unfinished estate and all the issues that go with that including illegal dumping. A small group of us came together and have had some success resolving these, but these blow ins were nowhere to be seen, and will disappear again once all this dies down

    The only solace I have as someone who wants the meter put in is that some of the actual residents protesting have taken a list of addresses of those who do want the meters in (and I am far from the only one on it) and have said they will allow IW in to do these. I can only only hope and trust that this will happen when IW do arrive on our estate for meter installation.

    I fear though that they may not arrive at all now, or that if they do arrive certain outside militant influences will take control and prevent this from happening even


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    #67
    Hijpo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,827 ✭✭✭Hijpo


    Don't worry keV, I'm sure they will oblige you. Would you say they will reduce your motor tax, VAT and USC not only as a reward for being such an upstanding citizen but because you'll be paying for water again and they might feel sorry for you?

    Good work on the anti social behaviour. People jumping on the band wagon from outside the area is not right though.


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    #68
    Sully
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 24,056 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sully


    Hijpo wrote: »
    See now isnt it easier to just accept and admit that protesters are not all thuggish scumbags as your first post suggested?
    Well done sully, you've taken the first step towards an unbiased view, keep it up champ ;-)

    I didn't say that. The behaviour by many protesters (with a selection of protesters who act peaceful without disruption), as can be seen by numerous videos and comments online by protesters plus the recent legal case against a group of protesters and on the record on forms of media and the houses of oireachtas, is thuggish, disgraceful, disgusting and shows a high level of ignorance. It's bullying.

    The same behaviour was thrown around by protesters in the Dublin Greyhound dispute - calling people who wanted to actually earn some money 'scabs' and being threatening and violent because they weren't getting their way.

    I really don't believe that IW workers are deliberately setting out to be provocative to get a raise out of protesters if they are not being interfered with in any shape or form. Even so, it's idiotic and stupid for them to drop to the level of some of the protesters and the Gardai should act swiftly on these individuals too.
    Its laughable that you would compare water supply to broadband. Broadband does not cake your 200 euro phone in limescale or leave a manky after taste in your mouth when your finished talking to someone. The people do not want to be metered and charged for water and will do anything to halt its progress. I can condone stopping the meters but not by the measures used by some.

    BB and water lol

    Also if you could show evidence that the ferry bank protesters stole those barriers it would be great. I've often seen people yellow carded for speculative accusations like that.

    You're failing to spot the glaringly obvious point I am making. People are using the reason of poor water supply as to a reason why they won't allow for a meter to be installed. They don't want to pay (directly) for water because the service isn't to the standard they expect. Yet, people happily pay for a phone & broadband service across the country that isn't anywhere near a good quality of service but they continue to pay (directly and indirectly through taxation in many cases) the same price as those who get the high quality service without protest.

    It's obvious the reason isn't really about quality of water (seeing as you pay for it already, even if it's a really small amount per house hold) - if the water is perfect, people would still be out protesting. There are estates (like mine) where the water quality is perfect and I have no doubt protests will take place in these estates anyway.
    KevIRL wrote: »
    Whats worse is people who dont even live on the estate, or indeed even in the area hanging around outside the place 'protesting'. I came home yesterday and counted 6 people outside and none of whom live here. Going by comments on Facebook, people are coming over from Waterford City just to join in. The place looks a mess as out there, a door painted on and other homemade protest posters.

    As a community here we have had numerous issues over the years regarding anti-social behaviour from people in temporary dwellings, unfinished estate and all the issues that go with that including illegal dumping. A small group of us came together and have had some success resolving these, but these blow ins were nowhere to be seen, and will disappear again once all this dies down

    The only solace I have as someone who wants the meter put in is that some of the actual residents protesting have taken a list of addresses of those who do want the meters in (and I am far from the only one on it) and have said they will allow IW in to do these. I can only only hope and trust that this will happen when IW do arrive on our estate for meter installation.

    I fear though that they may not arrive at all now, or that if they do arrive certain outside militant influences will take control and prevent this from happening even

    This is normal. There are call outs on Facebook to get people from neighbouring counties / estates to 'help' with their protest. I'd wager that many protesters are a minority in an estate and there is definitely outside interference. theJournal did an article about it once in a Dublin estate, a follow up after their coverage of nasty protests which lead to arrests, and a lot of the protesters were not from the area and it was a small crowd protesting in a very intimidating way.

    I also think, just like the greyhound dispute, that people will attempt to block IW doing work outside houses that don't object to a meter being installed and the householder will be heavily intimated.

    I'm all for a perfectly reasonably informed discussion and debate and a peaceful protest but that's not what's been happening. It's the same looneybin nonsense of 'no contract' 'it's a gift, return it' 'double taxation' 'we get loads of water every year sure' etc. without a proper discussion as to what to expect, when to expect it, and setting up a decent service (and at the moment, it's a fiasco of a business).


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    #69
    robtri
    Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭robtri


    Sully wrote: »
    I didn't say that. The behaviour by many protesters (with a selection of protesters who act peaceful without disruption), as can be seen by numerous videos and comments online by protesters plus the recent legal case against a group of protesters and on the record on forms of media and the houses of oireachtas, is thuggish, disgraceful, disgusting and shows a high level of ignorance. It's bullying.

    The same behaviour was thrown around by protesters in the Dublin Greyhound dispute - calling people who wanted to actually earn some money 'scabs' and being threatening and violent because they weren't getting their way.

    I really don't believe that IW workers are deliberately setting out to be provocative to get a raise out of protesters if they are not being interfered with in any shape or form. Even so, it's idiotic and stupid for them to drop to the level of some of the protesters and the Gardai should act swiftly on these individuals too.



    You're failing to spot the glaringly obvious point I am making. People are using the reason of poor water supply as to a reason why they won't allow for a meter to be installed. They don't want to pay (directly) for water because the service isn't to the standard they expect. Yet, people happily pay for a phone & broadband service across the country that isn't anywhere near a good quality of service but they continue to pay (directly and indirectly through taxation in many cases) the same price as those who get the high quality service without protest.

    It's obvious the reason isn't really about quality of water (seeing as you pay for it already, even if it's a really small amount per house hold) - if the water is perfect, people would still be out protesting. There are estates (like mine) where the water quality is perfect and I have no doubt protests will take place in these estates anyway.



    This is normal. There are call outs on Facebook to get people from neighbouring counties / estates to 'help' with their protest. I'd wager that many protesters are a minority in an estate and there is definitely outside interference. theJournal did an article about it once in a Dublin estate, a follow up after their coverage of nasty protests which lead to arrests, and a lot of the protesters were not from the area and it was a small crowd protesting in a very intimidating way.

    I also think, just like the greyhound dispute, that people will attempt to block IW doing work outside houses that don't object to a meter being installed and the householder will be heavily intimated.

    I'm all for a perfectly reasonably informed discussion and debate and a peaceful protest but that's not what's been happening. It's the same looneybin nonsense of 'no contract' 'it's a gift, return it' 'double taxation' 'we get loads of water every year sure' etc. without a proper discussion as to what to expect, when to expect it, and setting up a decent service (and at the moment, it's a fiasco of a business).

    And this is the same blueshirt, yes sir, toe the party line waffle.....
    paying direct for a service... it will improve... (Just like the HSE)


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    #70
    Sully
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 24,056 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sully


    robtri wrote: »
    And this is the same blueshirt, yes sir, toe the party line waffle.....
    paying direct for a service... it will improve... (Just like the HSE)

    Cut me deep there dude, completely blown my argument right out of the water!!

    There problem with the HSE is no government has the balls to take it on head first and gut it like a fish starting at the top. Any attempt at reform sees mass outrage from all sides. Same could be said for public service as a whole tbh.


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    #71
    robtri
    Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭robtri


    Sully wrote: »
    Cut me deep there dude, completely blown my argument right out of the water!!

    There problem with the HSE is no government has the balls to take it on head first and gut it like a fish starting at the top. Any attempt at reform sees mass outrage from all sides. Same could be said for public service as a whole tbh.

    buts that ur argument, loonybin comments....

    i agree FG have not done any of the election promises for reform... thanks for reenforcing that


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    #72
    Wanderer2010
    Registered Users Posts: 6,739 ✭✭✭Wanderer2010


    Sully wrote: »
    Cut me deep there dude, completely blown my argument right out of the water!!

    There problem with the HSE is no government has the balls to take it on head first and gut it like a fish starting at the top. Any attempt at reform sees mass outrage from all sides. Same could be said for public service as a whole tbh.

    Why are you involved in these debates?. You are a moderator and hence you should not be allowed just chime in and derail threads. And please dont give me your standard reply of "If you arent happy then report the post".

    Why are you getting involved in debates if you are a mod?


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    #73
    Status Offline
    Registered Users Posts: 173 ✭✭Status Offline


    Wanderer2010 wrote: »
    Why are you involved in these debates?. You are a moderator and hence you should not be allowed just chime in and derail threads. And please dont give me your standard reply of "If you arent happy then report the post".

    Why are you getting involved in debates if you are a mod?

    In fairness he's allowed to have and voice his opinion just the same as anyone, as long as it doesn't interfere with his modding the forum. If he was banning people for having different opinion or deleting posts which disagreed with his, I'd say something. I wouldn't agree with about 80% of his posts but I can't say I've ever seen him abuse his position as mod or be unfair to posters. There's a few posters here that would have been banned (were) on other forums for posting the same garbage they've posted here.Just for disclosure I'm not a friend, I'm not a lick, nor am I Billythepig.


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    #74
    robtri
    Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭robtri


    Status Offline wrote: »
    In fairness he's allowed to have and voice his opinion just the same as anyone just as long as it doesn't interfere with his modding the forum. If he was banning people for having different opinion or deleting posts which disagreed with his, I'd say something. I wouldn't agree with about 80% of his posts but I can't say I've ever seen him abuse his position as mod or be unfair to posters. There's a few posters here that would have been banned (were) on other forums for posting the same garbage they've posted here.Just for disclosure I'm not a friend, I'm not a lick, nor am I Billythepig.

    I would agree, been around these parts a long time, and will always say sully is fair
    And he is entitled to his opinion, no matter how i wrong i think it is


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    #75
    Wanderer2010
    Registered Users Posts: 6,739 ✭✭✭Wanderer2010


    Status Offline wrote: »
    In fairness he's allowed to have and voice his opinion just the same as anyone, as long as it doesn't interfere with his modding the forum. If he was banning people for having different opinion or deleting posts which disagreed with his, I'd say something. I wouldn't agree with about 80% of his posts but I can't say I've ever seen him abuse his position as mod or be unfair to posters. There's a few posters here that would have been banned (were) on other forums for posting the same garbage they've posted here.Just for disclosure I'm not a friend, I'm not a lick, nor am I Billythepig.

    There is a responsibility for mods to keep their noses out of debates, unless there was obvious racism, abuse etc. Hes a mod, not a member, and he likes his long, detailed replies to people which are more appropriate from active members and not someone who is thin skinned enough to always storm off in a huff with the predictable "If you dont like it then report the post" line which is tiresome at this stage. If you do report a post, nothing ever happens. The mods stay the mods.

    Sully, you really should keep your views OUTSIDE the forums you moderate. It makes no sense to jump right in there with people who you clearly like online wrestling with.


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    #76
    Cabaal
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,489 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    Wanderer2010 wrote: »
    There is a responsibility for mods to keep their noses out of debates, unless there was obvious racism, abuse etc. Hes a mod, not a member, and he likes his long, detailed replies to people which are more appropriate from active members and not someone who is thin skinned enough to always storm off in a huff with the predictable "If you dont like it then report the post" line which is tiresome at this stage. If you do report a post, nothing ever happens. The mods stay the mods.

    Sully, you really should keep your views OUTSIDE the forums you moderate. It makes no sense to jump right in there with people who you clearly like online wrestling with.

    Guys, if you have a problem with a post then report it, I cannot stress this enough.
    Additionally, attack the post not the poster.

    Finally, Wanderer2010 you can take a week break for your last few posts.

    You are on boards.ie long enough to know back seat modding is not ok as such you are well aware that it is not your place to tell other users that they should not be posting in a thread or forum. additionally attacking mods and/or other users is out of order.

    If you post again like this you will be banned for a month,


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    #77
    honeybadger
    Registered Users Posts: 869 ✭✭✭honeybadger


    cabal with his sharia law has arrived and landed once again the only man or woman from kk not celebrating there big win in dublin today :P


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    #78
    Jambo
    Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭Jambo


    Cabaal wrote: »
    I've heard numerous claims that the water is unsafe to drink, thing is...its just hard water.

    Its naturally occurring in the area, hell its naturally occurring in most of Kilkenny....hell, most of Ireland & England.

    hardwateruk.gif

    I myself have lived in a hard water area for decades, its certainly not unsafe to drink.

    There are ways of removing the lime, water softeners using salt is one way.

    But this actually does have downsides and treated water of this nature is not recommended for small children. (I've heard this from several water softener installers).

    Treated water containing salt also isn't great for plants and can built up in soil with extended use.

    From my own experience, a water softner is the best long term solution to hard water. It will extend the life of appliances, heating pipes etc. When getting one fitted its best to install a separate drinking water (untreated tap) esp if you have children.

    It also removes the need to use silly things like Calgon tablets which are expensive for what they do, a bag of salt for a water softner will cost around 6.50-7.50 and lasts 4-6 weeks.

    Now I suppose residents could claim they should get water that isn't hard water, but then that limits the area's the water can be obtained from so this means you can't have everybody getting water from a non hard water area. Its just not workable.

    In addition if you want the water treated before it reaches your home their are increased costs associated with this and potentially downsides depending on how its treated. No doubt you'll also have people unhappy with the treatment,

    The issue of lime in Ferrybanks water supply was almost completely non existent until approx 2010 when Kilkenny County Council switched us to a different supply (mullinabro) there after the extremely bad lime issues started for everyone.

    If they reverted back to the old supply alot of the end users limescale issues would be resolved.


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    #79
    thomasm
    Registered Users Posts: 1,503 ✭✭✭thomasm


    Jambo wrote: »
    The issue of lime in Ferrybanks water supply was almost completely non existent until approx 2010 when Kilkenny County Council switched us to a different supply (mullinabro) there after the extremely bad lime issues started for everyone.

    If they reverted back to the old supply alot of the end users limescale issues would be resolved.

    A big bone of contention was that his was done with no consultation with residents. First anyone knew was when our appliances and showers started showing signs. My understanding is that the supply was changed to ensure continuity of supply to a small number of areas that had supply problems at certain times.

    However the solution to a problem affecting a small number of people was to change everyone to an inferior supply that they knew would do the damage it did and effectively foist the cost on us as this was the cheaper option than fixing the existing problem.

    This was done with such stealth that even the planners and designers of the €400 million Glanbia plant were unaware and had to reengineer accordingly when it happened.


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    #80
    Sully
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 24,056 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sully


    Wanderer2010 wrote: »
    Why are you involved in these debates?. You are a moderator and hence you should not be allowed just chime in and derail threads. And please dont give me your standard reply of "If you arent happy then report the post".

    Why are you getting involved in debates if you are a mod?

    If you find that it's too difficult in a debate with me that you have to run around with petty insults or that moderators shouldn't get into debates than perhaps you should just bow out or ignore what I have to say? It looks worse on you that your idea of a constructive reply is such and you can't fight back constructively in the debate.


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    #81
    Hijpo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,827 ✭✭✭Hijpo


    Sully wrote: »
    I didn't say that. The behaviour by many protesters (with a selection of protesters who act peaceful without disruption), as can be seen by numerous videos and comments online by protesters plus the recent legal case against a group of protesters and on the record on forms of media and the houses of oireachtas, is thuggish, disgraceful, disgusting and shows a high level of ignorance. It's bullying.

    How many protestors were arrested for assaulting or bullying irish Water workers? Or were they arrested for stopping them from working?

    When you compare the number of people arrested to the number of people protesting does it look like the majority are thugs or a minority that have finally snapped under the pressure of excesive taxation?

    Where any of these people in the Ferry Bank protests?

    What are your thoughts on the Frank Feighan video, are the protesters worse, the same or a bit less thuggish, disgraceful, disgusting with a high level of ignorance?
    Sully wrote: »
    You're failing to spot the glaringly obvious point I am making. People are using the reason of poor water supply as to a reason why they won't allow for a meter to be installed. They don't want to pay (directly) for water because the service isn't to the standard they expect. Yet, people happily pay for a phone & broadband service across the country that isn't anywhere near a good quality of service but they continue to pay (directly and indirectly through taxation in many cases) the same price as those who get the high quality service without protest.

    It's obvious the reason isn't really about quality of water (seeing as you pay for it already, even if it's a really small amount per house hold) - if the water is perfect, people would still be out protesting. There are estates (like mine) where the water quality is perfect and I have no doubt protests will take place in these estates anyway.

    You keep singling out bad water as if it was the only reason the people are protesting, its not. Im not missing your point, your point is just minor nonsence because BB services has no equivalence to water services.

    Your failing to see the big reason as to why you cannot compare BB to IW. Maybe if an ISP were walking in peoples front doors, connecting a modem, forcing a contract on them then charging them three times for the terrible service you might have some hope of equivalence or even if broadband was destroying the other costly devices in your house that needed to be replaced sooner than people with better BB.
    Atleast with BB you know that your going to get some level of service for 40 or 70 quid, compare this to IW where they hook you up, get your bank details and then tell you how much it will cost you after your locked in and cannot get out.

    Sully wrote: »
    This is normal. There are call outs on Facebook to get people from neighbouring counties / estates to 'help' with their protest. I'd wager that many protesters are a minority in an estate and there is definitely outside interference. theJournal did an article about it once in a Dublin estate, a follow up after their coverage of nasty protests which lead to arrests, and a lot of the protesters were not from the area and it was a small crowd protesting in a very intimidating way.

    I also think, just like the greyhound dispute, that people will attempt to block IW doing work outside houses that don't object to a meter being installed and the householder will be heavily intimated.

    I'm all for a perfectly reasonably informed discussion and debate and a peaceful protest but that's not what's been happening. It's the same looneybin nonsense of 'no contract' 'it's a gift, return it' 'double taxation' 'we get loads of water every year sure' etc. without a proper discussion as to what to expect, when to expect it, and setting up a decent service (and at the moment, it's a fiasco of a business).

    The people cannot have a discussion with IW because only IW reps are allowed on our local radio, the installers dont know wtf they are on about with regards the rights and laws of how they are operating and there isnt a politician in the land thats involved with this thats going to put his kneck out and answer some hard questioning.

    Its not just a fiasco of how its run, its a fiasco all the way from how it was set up to how important priority details have not been decided upon.


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    #82
    TheQuietFella
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,857 ✭✭✭TheQuietFella


    http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0924/645936-irish-water/

    Nice to see the protest getting some national coverage!


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    #83
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Scandelous waste of Garda time. The protesters dilute their arguament by adding in water quality as one of their objections. Does that mean they WILL pay IF the water quality improved?


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    #84
    Hijpo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,827 ✭✭✭Hijpo


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Scandelous waste of Garda time. The protesters dilute their arguament by adding in water quality as one of their objections. Does that mean they WILL pay IF the water quality improved?

    If you think that poor quality does not qualify as a valid reason then I would suggest you email Phil hogan demanding he pay his fees in Portugal.

    If the gaurds themselves knew what they were at then they wouldn't be wasting resources protecting a private company in civil matters. The protesters didn't call them so I don't see how you can blame the protesters.


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    #85
    Hoffmans
    Registered Users Posts: 1,069 ✭✭✭Hoffmans


    TheQuietFella wrote: »
    http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0924/645936-irish-water/

    Nice to see the protest getting some national coverage!

    well done to all the decent people standing up to the attempted privatising of our water supply.

    of course the pc brigade/ indo /rte primetime/vinb zombies will support this
    metering misadventure..

    could they now explain what has changed that water needs to be monitized?

    watersupply is and has been funded through taxes your paye/vat etc...
    this is an attempt to monitize your supply on the double pay twice or thrice seeing lpt is also a new funding stream back to councils coffers..


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    #86
    TheQuietFella
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,857 ✭✭✭TheQuietFella


    http://www.westmeathexaminer.ie/news/roundup/articles/2014/07/04/4031299-mullingar-householder-posts-meter-back-to-irish-water/

    A Legend!!!


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    #87
    Potential-Monke
    Registered Users Posts: 13,999 ✭✭✭✭Potential-Monke


    Hijpo wrote: »
    If the gaurds themselves knew what they were at then they wouldn't be wasting resources protecting a private company in civil matters. The protesters didn't call them so I don't see how you can blame the protesters.

    Not directed at you, but at people with similar posts. The Gardaí do not want to be there. They have precious little time to follow up on incidents as it is, without having to go to these estates and protect the peace. The Gardaí are not on the side of Irish Water, regardless of what spin people put on it. If the protests were peaceful, there would be no Gardaí.

    And on that point, people know what a peaceful protest is yeah? That's one that does not break any criminal law. And i have yet to see one in the many i have seen. And here's a few reasons why:

    - Obstruction under Section 98 of the Road Traffic Act 1961 - A person shall not do any act (whether of commission or omission) which causes or is likely to cause traffic through any public place to be obstructed.
    - Disorderly Conduct under Section 5 of the Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994
    - Threatening, Abusive or Insulting words or behaviour under Section 6 of the Criminal Justice (Public Order) Act 1994

    These are just 3 examples of the carry on that goes on at these "peaceful" protests. Regardless of what rights people think they have, doing any of the above is illegal. A peaceful protest does not interfere with anyone, working or not, it does not block peoples movement, and it certainly doesn't involved getting up into the faces of Gardaí, workers or anyone who doesn't agree with the protest.

    I'm actually very surprised more people haven't been arrested, and looking at the videos there were plenty who should have had (and if any of the videos showed Irish Water staff doing similar, they too should have been arrested). What is happening is simply thuggish behaviour, relying on numbers to overwhelm Irish Water and Gardaí alike. And i will physically remove anyone who tried to stop the meter being installed on my property. I don't agree with the charges, etc, but i'm not in a position to protest it (peacefully) and because I work in the public service, i will be the first to be targeted with non-payment fines, etc.

    I listened to this same crowd when it came to the Household Tax and now i'm paying twice the price monthly for listening to them, and i'm pretty sure none of them would be willing to pay the extra charges i got.


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    #88
    shinzon
    Registered Users Posts: 5,460 ✭✭✭shinzon


    Just before I post what im going to post so everyone doesn't jump down my throat I do not condone violence of any kind and anyone who does it either worker or protester should be arrested.

    But what exactly is a peaceful protest in the context of the meters being installed, is everyone advocating getting there signs out and basically shouting from a distance whilst IW still fits the meters to properties who don't want them in under any circumstances.

    By the very nature of the work being carried out the individual has to obstruct the work being done in order to succeed in not having the meter installed in the first place. Again im not advocating people being abusive or violent, so perhaps protest is actually the wrong context for this, more civil disobedience maybe

    Shin


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    #89
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    shinzon wrote: »
    Just before I post what im going to post so everyone doesn't jump down my throat I do not condone violence of any kind and anyone who does it either worker or protester should be arrested.

    But what exactly is a peaceful protest in the context of the meters being installed, is everyone advocating getting there signs out and basically shouting from a distance whilst IW still fits the meters to properties who don't want them in under any circumstances.

    By the very nature of the work being carried out the individual has to obstruct the work being done in order to succeed in not having the meter installed in the first place. Again im not advocating people being abusive or violent, so perhaps protest is actually the wrong context for this, more civil disobedience maybe

    Shin

    The protesters are targeting the wrong people. The workers are not the ones who took the decision to meter water. They are only doing their job, in very difficult circumstances in places. I'm all for peaceful protest, but what they are doinhg is wrong on so many fronts. Firstly, they are intimidating innocent people doing a legal job. Secondly, by their actions, Gardai are having to divert scarce resources to try and keep the peace. The verbal abuse directed towards the Gardai is also wrong as they, too are only doing their job.
    The protesters are losing any support they had by their behaviour.
    The protests are far too late, as the legislation is already in place. Their protests need to be aimed at the Dail. A mass protest outside Dail Eireann would show how much or how little support there actually is for their activities.


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    #90
    shinzon
    Registered Users Posts: 5,460 ✭✭✭shinzon


    Deleted User wrote: »
    The protesters are targeting the wrong people. The workers are not the ones who took the decision to meter water. They are only doing their job, in very difficult circumstances in places. I'm all for peaceful protest, but what they are doinhg is wrong on so many fronts. Firstly, they are intimidating innocent people doing a legal job. Secondly, by their actions, Gardai are having to divert scarce resources to try and keep the peace. The verbal abuse directed towards the Gardai is also wrong as they, too are only doing their job.
    The protesters are losing any support they had by their behaviour.
    The protests are far too late, as the legislation is already in place. Their protests need to be aimed at the Dail. A mass protest outside Dail Eireann would show how much or how little support there actually is for their activities.

    The only time a mass protest outside the Dail worked in recent times was the grey protest over medical cards, people do not want Water Meters anywhere near there water supply, a protest in Dublin is not going to do diddly squat while Irish water are still installing meters whilst everyones up there protesting. Legislation or no legislation people will do the only thing they can do and obstruct (not violently)the workers doing there work as that is the only way the meter does not get installed. and as Ive stated anyone who acts violently either worker or protestor should get the book thrown at them.

    Shin


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    #91
    Cabaal
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,489 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    You'll find mass protects are very often affective, but really the only groups that seem to be decent at them are pensioners, farmers and teachers.

    I hear again and again that
    people do not want Water Meters anywhere near there water supply

    and I've seen some silly made up stats such as 500 thousand households have returned the Irish Water letters saying no contract, no consent or 98% people are against the charges.

    But in all reality if people were that unhappy then why hasn't a decent sized protest happened? Its silly claiming a protect will have no affect when you haven't even bothered with a decent protest containing the majority of people that are claimed are against Irish Water.....which some people would lead you to believe that would be upto 98% of the country.

    If 98% of the country were truly against water charges then it should be easy to manage a protest with say 20-30k in Dublin for just one day, hell...the majority of them are already in Dublin and the surrounding area's.

    I guess at the end of the day even the pensioners don't really hate the idea of paying for water you use, we'd be seeing them protest if they really didn't like the ideas wouldn't we?


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