Ireland's "Peaceful Protestors" - Pest Control?

oceanman

mickydoomsux wrote: »

Refusing to pay for an essential service provided by the Government.

True patriots.

are you for real?.....we do pay!

VinLieger

VinLieger wrote: »

What's wrong with refuse privatisation? We now have several options and each has to actively compete for our money and business.

Surely it's a much better system than a state run monopoly where pay is determined by the unions and not the market?

In my part of the country, we always had to pay for refuse, either by taking it to the tip ourselves or paying per bag to a private company. I believe it was the same in most rural areas.

Fr. Ned

VinLieger wrote: »

What's wrong with refuse privatisation? We now have several options and each has to actively compete for our money and business.

Surely it's a much better system than a state run monopoly where pay is determined by the unions and not the market?

Ask the staff in Greyhound waste.
The race to the bottom seems to suit some people.

Banjo String

VinLieger wrote: »

What's wrong with refuse privatisation? We now have several options and each has to actively compete for our money and business.

Surely it's a much better system than a state run monopoly where pay is determined by the unions and not the market?

How many options will we have when choosing who will supply our water?

Fr. Ned

mickydoomsux wrote: »

Obviously a sufficient amount as well with all the leaks and undrinkable water.

Let's scrap the water charges and continue on like we are. I'm sure the pipes will fix themselves and the cryptosporidium will simply disappear

A national water authority funded by central government (our taxes) would have been a good idea.
The proposed tax cuts in Tuesday's budget (rumoured to be worth between €400-€500 for the average family) will be wiped out by what people will have to pay to this new quango.
What changes? Nothing.
Will there be improvements in our water service above and beyond what the LA's would have done ether ways? No.

Are there jobs for the boys (ex county managers who 'retired' with massive lump sums and pensions touching €100k pa), bonuses for staff of €7k, Millions spent on the infamous 'consultants' even though it was to be the simplest of setup's using Bord Gais's systems, Meter contracts awarded to friends of FG after the taxpayer writes off €100 million in company debt for him? Absolutely.

These things don't bother people like you and others on this board who are almost manic in their support for the super quango. I find that quite strange.

Fr. Ned

Banjo String wrote: »

How many options will we have when choosing who will supply our water?

Good point.
Is there not an EU law against monopoly's providing services?

Fr. Ned

Fr. Ned wrote: »

A national water authority funded by central government (our taxes) would have been a good idea.
The proposed tax cuts in Tuesday's budget (rumoured to be worth between €400-€500 for the average family) will be wiped out by what people will have to pay to this new quango.
What changes? Nothing.
Will there be improvements in our water service above and beyond what the LA's would have done ether ways? No.

Are there jobs for the boys (ex county managers who 'retired' with massive lump sums and pensions touching €100k pa), bonuses for staff of €7k, Millions spent on the infamous 'consultants' even though it was to be the simplest of setup's using Bord Gais's systems, Meter contracts awarded to friends of FG after the taxpayer writes off €100 million in company debt for him? Absolutely.

These things don't bother people like you and others on this board who are almost manic in their support for the super quango. I find that quite strange.

What changes is that EVERYONE pays for what water they use, not just the tax payer. As for hiring former Council people who have retired, it makes sense to have people who have knowledge of the current water system. They won't be there too long and will be replaced by those they train in. I know you don't agree with this, but if you think about it logically it does make sense.

Fr. Ned

Deleted User wrote: »

What changes is that EVERYONE pays for what water they use, not just the tax payer. As for hiring former Council people who have retired, it makes sense to have people who have knowledge of the current water system. They won't be there too long and will be replaced by those they train in. I know you don't agree with this, but if you think about it logically it does make sense.

So, you agree that this makes perfect sense?

Take this guy, David O'Connor,
https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CCYQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishexaminer.com%2Fireland%2Fcouncil-boss-retires-with-250k-lump-sum-250500.html&ei=aVI6VNhogp_uBu6zgMgO&usg=AFQjCNFKRHYwSV4w57leiJSpcU8CujydTQ&bvm=bv.77161500,d.ZGU

€300,000 payoff, €73,394 pa pension and walks into a job in the super quango without even being interviewed.

You think that makes sense?
Will it be acceptable when, as you say, he 'retires' again from this quango and gets another payoff and pension?
Are you really serious that this makes sense?

And BTW, this is one of the same LA managers who, according to all in favour of the super quango, wasn't able to provide the country with a proper water infrastructure. Do you think he'll be able to do it in his new role going on past performance?
It's an absolute joke and a scam and all we see on this thread are people attacking others who protest against it.

Timberrrrrrrr

Fr. Ned wrote: »

Ask the staff in Greyhound waste.
The race to the bottom seems to suit some people.

You expect us to have ANY sympathy with these scumbags?

Fukuyama

Fr. Ned wrote: »

Ask the staff in Greyhound waste.
The race to the bottom seems to suit some people.

They're bin men. Nothing wrong with the job but it's hardly worth €16 per hour. Sure it's a dirty job, but there's plenty willing to do it. I wish an angry mob would show up at my low-skilled job and make my boss pay me more.

An interesting thing to note however is that Joan Collins etc... got elected a few years back to Dublin city council on the "No Bin Charges" ticket, and these rent-a-mobs actively took part in protests blocking Dublin City Council bin trucks etc...

Now they seem to have switched sides and are advocating for higher wages for privatized bin companies, which would result in a RISE in bin charges. :pac:

Timberrrrrrrr

I see this posted in the water thread, great lads them protesters :rolleyes:

AlekSmart

Streetwalker wrote: »

Congrats to each and every one of the patriots who turned up yesterday at the protest and gave a big F you to FF heavy and the champagne socialists. Great mix of people from the unemployed to families of civil servants including Gardaí to a very nice guy who owned a business in Goatstown and who had had enough. Onward and upward.

Great day,for sure...With significantly less of the "Activist" element and far more of the genuinely concerned populace.
Now however,we appear to have no plan to build upon the success of the protest...what next ?

Was the Goatstown Man's missus with him..?

Beaner1

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I see this posted in the water thread, great lads them protesters :rolleyes:

Disgusting. Stuff about these protests was shared by three people on my Facebook stream. All three haven't worked in years. One since 2001.

Lucy and Harry

In a democracy people can protest the colour of ****e if they want.To take away that right and ask for them to be beaten is fubar OP.Last time they tried that stuff up in Belfast we ran amuck and many joined the IRA after bloody Sunday.Irish love a battle and if those protesters were beaten up people would flock to their cause.Beating protesters in Egypt and Algeria and Libya got rid of the governments as people power takes over.

AlekSmart

Beaner1 wrote: »

Disgusting. Stuff about these protests was shared by three people on my Facebook stream. All three haven't worked in years. One since 2001.

Nice handbag though....:rolleyes:

Lucy and Harry

Maybe you should delete them off face book.

Fr. Ned

Lucy and Harry wrote: »

In a democracy people can protest the colour of ****e if they want.To take away that right and ask for them to be beaten is fubar OP.Last time they tried that stuff up in Belfast we ran amuck and many joined the IRA after bloody Sunday.Irish love a battle and if those protesters were beaten up people would flock to their cause.Beating protesters in Egypt and Algeria and Libya got rid of the governments as people power takes over.

There's posters on here who want the Gardai to 'beat and pepper spray' protesters off the street.
The same posters who harp on about democratic process, elected to do a job and all that, yet want people beaten off the street for disagreeing with that process.
Is it Ireland or North Korea we live in?

Fr. Ned

Apparently I'm not to post on the main water tax thread so this will have to do.

An interesting article here on how Burton really has lost touch with the people who elected her.
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/gene-kerrigan/smile-joan-for-our-expensive-cameras-30656523.html

How have 'labour', the party of the working man/woman come to this..They might as well just merge with FFail and FG and become one single right wing party.
The pretence that these three party's are any different from each other is sickening and indeed an insult to anyone with functioning brain.

Beaner1

Are there any pro water charge Facebook pages out there? Would be good to lend my support.

Sunnyisland

Beaner1 wrote: »

Are there any pro water charge Facebook pages out there? Would be good to lend my support.

Why don't you set one up yourself ?

Fr. Ned

realies wrote: »

Why don't you set one up yourself ?

That won't happen.
People who are the biggest pushers of this tax don't come out in the open.
At least the ones who have facebook pages against the tax, and who protest against the tax show their faces, recorded for posterity in glorious technicolour (Hollywood style) on expensive smart phones.;)

Beaner1

realies wrote: »

Why don't you set one up yourself ?

Good idea.

Fr. Ned

Beaner1 wrote: »

Good idea.

Throw a link up here when you do.;)

Fukuyama

Fr. Ned wrote: »

There's posters on here who want the Gardai to 'beat and pepper spray' protesters off the street.
The same posters who harp on about democratic process, elected to do a job and all that, yet want people beaten off the street for disagreeing with that process.
Is it Ireland or North Korea we live in?

And yet again, you fall back on your 'old faithful' argument of accusing those who don't agree with you to be anti-democratic fascists.

Not a single call for any additional garda tactics yesterday as the protest passed off peacefully and legally. That was the purpose of this thread.

It's your inability to make an argument that stops the majority of people from agreeing (or at very least, aligning themselves) with your cause.

Fr. Ned

Dean0088 wrote: »

And yet again, you fall back on your 'old faithful' argument of accusing those who don't agree with you to be anti-democratic fascists.

Not a single call for any additional garda tactics yesterday as the protest passed off peacefully and legally. That was the purpose of this thread.

It's your inability to make an argument that stops the majority of people from agreeing (or at very least, aligning themselves) with your cause.

What would you call the wish to beat and pepper spray all protesters off the streets, Dean?
Democratic?

Do you want me to dig up the posts where this was called for?

Fukuyama

Fr. Ned wrote: »

That won't happen.
People who are the biggest pushers of this tax don't come out in the open.
At least the ones who have facebook pages against the tax, and who protest against the tax show their faces, recorded for posterity in glorious technicolour (Hollywood style) on expensive smart phones.;)

There's plenty of people vocally supporting (or at least showing their tacit support) for it on Facebook. The idea of a 'pro' tax group is ridiculous. Why organize to implement something that's already on the way in? :pac:

On a local level, and I can only speak for myself here, I'd be wary of outright confronting protesters where I live as many of them are the type of people who I wouldn't want neighborly conflict with. They also seem to have all the time in the world for this craic whereas I don't. I've seen tyres slashed, property damaged etc... over trivial things.

I'd have no trouble debating the issue, but it's another thing to engage with the few 'leaders' who seem to condone intimidation and violence (well, the Dublin Says No group anyways).

Timberrrrrrrr

Fr. Ned wrote: »

There's posters on here who want the Gardai to 'beat and pepper spray' protesters off the street.
The same posters who harp on about democratic process, elected to do a job and all that, yet want people beaten off the street for disagreeing with that process.
Is it Ireland or North Korea we live in?

Disagree, moan, whinge, protest all you like and it doesn't bother me.

Assault, intimidate, bully people going about their days work then yes you deserve to be pepper sprayed and beaten off the street.

Simple question, Would it be ok for me tomorrow to film you as you work, to intimidate and bully you, to.spit on you and call.you names, to damage your property and shout and heckle.you as you try to feed your family?

end of the road

coolemon wrote: »

the navy and SAR I think serve constructive functions. protecting fisheries and search and rescue.

The Irish army however. Well, protecting cash vans seem to be their predominant function.

helping in flood situations where nobody else can. keeping the peace in other countries. they do a good job and serve a major function. show them respect

Timberrrrrrrr

Fr. Ned wrote: »

That won't happen.
People who are the biggest pushers of this tax don't come out in the open.
At least the ones who have facebook pages against the tax, and who protest against the tax show their faces, recorded for posterity in glorious TRIcolour (Hollywood style) on expensive smart phones.;)

FYP

Fukuyama

Fr. Ned wrote: »

What would you call the wish to beat and pepper spray all protesters off the streets, Dean?
Democratic?

Do you want me to dig up the posts where this was called for?

Go ahead, dig up all the quotes where myself and several posters discussed increased garda tactics. It'd add no more weight to your argument.

It's pretty obvious to anyone that reads the thread that calls were made for arrests etc... in cases where the law was broken (Public Order Act). There was video evidence of violence and intimidation.

There were no calls to the effect of an organized garda crack down on protesting. And everyone pretty much agreed that there's no apatite for such actions.

Feel free to fall back on your old faithful argument though.