Aer Lingus - New Routes

Jack1985

New S/H routes from DUB to AGA (now year-round) and to NTE.

Jack1985

Staff have also accepted the IASS deal.

man98

The RTÉ News is a source right?

Tenger

Jack1985 wrote: »

Staff have also accepted the IASS deal.

Oh that was quick, I though voting only finished today? (Well not really 'quick' as this has been onging for 2-3 years now, when it should have been sorted in 2006 as part of the IPO)

man98 wrote: »

The RTÉ News is a source right?

about 80% of the time!!


http://www.rte.ie/news/business/2014/1105/657104-aer-lingus-pension/

Staff at Aer Lingus have voted to accept proposals to address the €780m deficit in the pension scheme which they share with the Dublin Airport Authority and the Shannon Airport Authority. The proposals hammered out over three years of negotiations will still see significant cuts in benefits for the 15,000 members of the scheme across the three companies.

Under the proposals, the trustees of the existing defined benefit scheme - the Irish Aviation Superannuation Scheme - will freeze it on 31 December.

They will use the remaining assets to purchase bonds to deliver funding for as much as possible of the benefits accrued to date. In addition, Aer Lingus and the DAA will contribute cash lump sums of €146.7m and €57.3m respectively to kickstart new defined contribution schemes to provide future pension coverage for current employees.

5,000 IASS members who are already receiving pensions will see those pensions cut by 10% for those over €12,000 and by 20% for pensions over €54,000.


I wonder will we see the stock price go up after this. EI have always implied that the FR shareholding and the pension deficit have been holding back its share value.
At least this deal gives clarity to possible investors.....then we will see it drop again when FR offload their shares....

EDIT: just had a look, share was at 142c on Monday morning, opened this morning at 151c, up to 161c as of 3pm today.

BuffyBot

The IAD relaunch is good news..it might scupper United's route which would be a shame. I'd imagine with that level of competition they might find a more profitable use of a 757.

Tenger

BuffyBot wrote: »

The IAD relaunch is good news..it might scupper United's route which is bad news.

I would hope that they will codeshare on the route to increase traffic. Don't they codeshare on all other flights to USA?

IRLConor

BuffyBot wrote: »

The IAD relaunch is good news..it might scupper United's route which would be a shame.

I would expect that to depend on the blend of passengers currently flying on United's route. If it was mostly Irish people doing return flights to DC then it might be hit harder than if it was a mix of nationalities with a good proportion connecting in IAD. Time will tell.

conor_ie

Tenger wrote: »

I would hope that they will codeshare on the route to increase traffic. Don't they codeshare on all other flights to USA?

They sure do!

Jack1985

In addition to all of the above in S15 ,

Frequency increases on Short-Haul ex-Dublin:

DUB-CDG - Now operates up to five daily on Mon, Fri and Sun.
DUB-PMI - Increase from four to six weekly flights.
DUB-STR - Increase from four to five weekly flights.
DUB-BIO - Increase from five to six weekly flights.
DUB-FUE - Increase from one to two weekly flights.
DUB-BOD - Increase from five to six weekly flights.
DUB-LYS - Increase from six weekly to daily operation.
DUB-VCE - Increase from four to five weekly.
DUB-FAO - Increase from 17 to 18 weekly with widebody operation on Tues/Sat.
DUB-ADB - Increase from two to three weekly.
DUB-BOJ - Increase from four to five weekly.

Frequency increases on Short-Haul ex-Cork:

ORK-AGP - Increase from seven to eight weekly.

basill

"With our third Dublin-New York service, I believe we are about to mature in frequencies to certain destinations to the United States. So the remaining opportunity to grow would be the shell-size of the aircraft, and so far the A350 is a very tempting and very good proposition – that's the reason we bought it in the first place. That is basically what our fleet team is currently calculating in a couple of business plan alternatives."

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/aer-lingus-still-mulling-a330neo-before-finalising-a350-405662/

Pretty much summarises the ambition or lack thereof of the outgoing CEO. Hopefully the next CEO will have some better ideas about expansion and be willing to use a bit of the cash pile that we are sitting on.

Tenger

basill wrote: »

.....Pretty much summarises the ambition or lack thereof of the outgoing CEO. Hopefully the next CEO will have some better ideas about expansion and be willing to use a bit of the cash pile that we are sitting on.

Definitely a boring statement in relation to actual expansion of the network. Increase in frequency and/or capacity is a good thing. However in the long term sticking to the same small network will not make the airline any more robust to resist possible future drops in the market.


"....so far the A350 is a very tempting and very good proposition – that's the reason we bought it in the first place..." On the other hand this is a change in stated attitude from the CEO who called the A350 "overspecified for our route network" in the past.

Jack1985

basill wrote: »

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/aer-lingus-still-mulling-a330neo-before-finalising-a350-405662/

Pretty much summarises the ambition or lack thereof of the outgoing CEO. Hopefully the next CEO will have some better ideas about expansion and be willing to use a bit of the cash pile that we are sitting on.

I really don't think you can call a near doubling of the long-haul network portfolio and changes to make it highly profitable (as well as now sustainable ex-SNN for example) a lack of ambition by the CEO. Why take risk in for example Eastern Asia when you can be swamped by the goliaths with insane aircraft orders, or why not increase your home proposition and expand your known profitable market. It was a clever plan which has more than payed off. Lack of ambition my arse, thank's to the foresight in planning by Mueller many more of us are in a job with a long future now, and he's been the one CEO who has now dealt with IASS. Don't get me wrong he has bad days in my book particularly last May, but he's been the best CEO we've ever had.

Just look at DXB/AUH now ex-DUB, there seems to be overcapacity leaking into the frame on the pax side. That's the risk of Asia, overcapacity which has actually really to hit the Transatlantic market yet. Whatever about being reliant on a single market, the current team have made two inroads into that - Supporting the business on connections and home demand - For the first time the Atlantic is not reliant on a weak Irish economy with regards present travel demand. Regards using the cash pile why? There's plenty of cheap cash floating about especially for Irish airlines. It's what kept Aer Lingus in the air in and around 2008-2010, why not keep extra security.

Preset No.3

I have a cautious optimism on the return to IAD. I know as a route it's taken a while for it develop for United, and for passengers heading to Ireland it is an alternate route to EWR.

For EI I think it's slightly on the lazy side. A great chance has been lost for now on not taking up MIA for the ever increasing cruise passenger.

The 'other' 330, is that -EWR/-SHN?

man98

BuffyBot wrote: »

The IAD relaunch is good news..it might scupper United's route which would be a shame. I'd imagine with that level of competition they might find a more profitable use of a 757.

Sure Toronto has more competition from ACA and Transat... they should go to Montreal again, even if just a few times a week. Nothing can be done now though!

Zonda999

Good news on the new routes! It was IAD as I was expecting, a shame in some ways though I think, MIA would have been a new route not served from DUB which I think would have been a success, not to say IAD won't be obviously.

Am I right in saying EI103 would be the earliest Transatlantic flight into JFK, if not the earliest transatlantic flight to arrive, period? I don't see anything earlier leaving LHR, CDG, FRA or AMS. This flight will do well I reckon, there won;t be connecting passengers but plenty Dublin based pax will really like this departure time I think!

Zonda999

Zonda999 wrote: »

Good news on the new routes! It was IAD as I was expecting, a shame in some ways though I think, MIA would have been a new route not served from DUB which I think would have been a success, not to say IAD won't be obviously.

Am I right in saying EI103 would be the earliest Transatlantic flight into JFK, if not the earliest transatlantic flight to arrive, period? I don't see anything earlier leaving LHR, CDG, FRA or AMS. This flight will do well I reckon, there won;t be connecting passengers but plenty Dublin based pax will really like this departure time I think!

Delta 46 from Tel Aviv at 0500, EL AL 1 0600. From Western Europe it will be in before BA's flight from Heathrow.

Tenger

Preset No.3 wrote: »

I have a cautious optimism on the return to IAD.........
For EI I think it's slightly on the lazy side. A great chance has been lost for now on not taking up MIA for the ever increasing cruise passenger.

The 'other' 330, is that -EWR/-SHN?

EI-EWR will return, MSN 330. Is in Saudia livery at present, leased from AirAsia.
-SHN MSN 54, went to France,then Air Algerie,then Air Madrid, now with AirAsiaX as 9M-XAA.
-DUB MSN 55, went to Vladivostock and apparently is still there as VQ-BEU.
-JFK MSN 86, went to Vladivostock and is now with Shaheen Air as AP-BKN.
-CRK MSN 70, went to Vladivostock and is now with Shaheen Air as AP-BKM.
-ORD MSN 59, got cannibalised in the desert.

As a comparison, EI-LAX MSN 269 is currently the oldest EI A330.
EI-EWR was the last of the EI A330's to receive an 'airport reg' back in 2000.
The next delivery was EI-DAA (MSN 397) in 2001.

EDIT: didn't really need those 10 mins of my life!

JCX BXC

Will the 767 going to Shannon be painted in the Aer Lingus colours? That would be nice to see!

When will Aer Lingus update their website to have the 767 seat map?

b757

Carnacalla wrote: »

Will the 767 going to Shannon be painted in the Aer Lingus colours? That would be nice to see!

When will Aer Lingus update their website to have the 767 seat map?

Doubt it. Only 3 months, may just have titles.

I believe the 767 in question operate's into SNN on a regular basis already.

highlydebased

b757 wrote:

I believe the 767 in question operate's into SNN on a regular basis already.  

Omni?!

Hardly the starair freighter either :-)

JCX BXC

highlydebased wrote: »

Omni?!

Hardly the starair freighter either :-)

I agree, what other 767's operate from shannon?

EchoIndia

I'd guessed Omni also. One requirement must be to have backup capacity if the designated aircraft becomes unserviceable. Omni have eight 767s, which enables that requirement to be met.

man98

Just about Miami, I don't think it was ever really on the cards. The 757 which they had in mind for a new TATL route wouldn't make it to MIA full of passengers. Granted, some manoeuvring would have made this possible but not right now.

JCX BXC

man98 wrote: »

Just about Miami, I don't think it was ever really on the cards. The 757 which they had in mind for a new TATL route wouldn't make it to MIA full of passengers. Granted, some manoeuvring would have made this possible but not right now.

I honestly don't see Aer Lingus ever doing Miami. I'd say American Airlines or no one.

highlydebased

EI have also used Omni more than once for adhoc/last minute substitutions

JCX BXC

highlydebased wrote: »

EI have also used Omni more than once for adhoc/last minute substitutions

Hardly for 12 weeks in the summer tho.

highlydebased

Carnacalla wrote:

Hardly for 12 weeks in the summer tho.

Nothing stopping it from happening really!

JCX BXC

highlydebased wrote: »

Nothing stopping it from happening really!

Would they need the planes for troops? And what about business class and IFE?

Zonda999

Deleted User wrote: »

Delta 46 from Tel Aviv at 0500, EL AL 1 0600. From Western Europe it will be in before BA's flight from Heathrow.

Thanks, you'd tend to forget about the sheer volume of flights between Tel Aviv and the US!

Interestingly, thinking about this earlier, I remember in early 2009 when fuel was cheap (Oil << $50/barrel but the Irish economy was in freefall), Aer Lingus were advertising their transatlantic routes very cheaply, DUB - IAD from €150 one way, comes to mind (That one stick out in my mind for some reason).Clearly, IAD was obviously the weakest of the East Coast routes up to that point. The route was cancelled for Winter 09/10 so clearly that summer was not a good one for the IAD service. Its great to see most of the North American routes returning on what looks to be a far sounder footing than before the economic collapse.

JCX BXC

Zonda999 wrote: »

Thanks, you'd tend to forget about the sheer volume of flights between Tel Aviv and the US!

Delta use a 747 on their JFK-Tel Aviv

Tenger

Zonda999 wrote: »

........ I remember in early 2009 when fuel was cheap (Oil << $50/barrel but the Irish economy was in freefall), Aer Lingus were advertising their transatlantic routes very cheaply, ........IAD was obviously the weakest of the East Coast routes up to that point. .......

No UA codeshare and no hub operation in DUB with full CBP. I think IAD was their newest route at the time too.

As for MIA, I too think it will not happen. MIA is an American hub, no UA presence. FLL for connections to Jetblue perhaps.

Preset No.3

Tenger wrote: »

EI-EWR will return, MSN 330. Is in Saudia livery at present, leased from AirAsia.
-SHN MSN 54, went to France,then Air Algerie,then Air Madrid, now with AirAsiaX as 9M-XAA.
-DUB MSN 55, went to Vladivostock and apparently is still there as VQ-BEU.
-JFK MSN 86, went to Vladivostock and is now with Shaheen Air as AP-BKN.
-CRK MSN 70, went to Vladivostock and is now with Shaheen Air as AP-BKM.
-ORD MSN 59, got cannibalised in the desert.

As a comparison, EI-LAX MSN 269 is currently the oldest EI A330.
EI-EWR was the last of the EI A330's to receive an 'airport reg' back in 2000.
The next delivery was EI-DAA (MSN 397) in 2001.

EDIT: didn't really need those 10 mins of my life!

Yeh I was asking because EWR and SHN were CFM engined 330's. Fleet commonalty and all that.

Preset No.3

Carnacalla wrote: »

Delta use a 747 on their JFK-Tel Aviv

United use a 777 on that route to EWR, and El Al use a 747/777 to JFK and EWR. US use an A330 to PHL.

Noxegon

lxflyer wrote: »

eff 08JUN15 Dublin – New York JFK NEW 3rd daily service, on board Boeing 757, until 29AUG15

EI103 DUB0750 – 1020JFK 757 D
EI102 JFK1200 – 2340DUB 757 D

This pleases me immensely.

I hope it's successful and ends up year round.

Bummer1234

I see the following been popular

EI103 DUB0750 – 1020JFK 757 D

Not sure if the return leg will be as popular as the return at night

EI102 JFK1200 – 2340DUB 757 D

LXFlyer

Bummer1234 wrote: »

I see the following been popular


Not sure if the return leg will be as popular as the return at night

Not too sure about that - if people get home say two hours later, that's almost 9pm New York time, so it might be a bit easier to go to sleep!

Bummer1234

lxflyer wrote: »

Not too sure about that - if people get home say two hours later, that's almost 9pm New York time, so it might be a bit easier to go to sleep!

Depends if your a good sleeper on flights i suppose.

Tenger

Bummer1234 wrote: »

......
Not sure if the return leg will be as popular as the return at night

Pretty good for those who are in work the next morning in Ireland.
Short trip to NYC with the evening flight (4pm?) out of DUB and the early flight back.

Again the multiple frequencies will suit all sorts of travellers, even if it doesn't look obvious to you/me personally.

roundymac

EI 103/ lands in JFK at 10.20, EI 102 departs at 12.00. Will that the fastest turnaround for EI planes in the US?

LXFlyer

roundymac wrote: »

EI 103/ lands in JFK at 10.20, EI 102 departs at 12.00. Will that the fastest turnaround for EI planes in the US?

Yes - 2 hours is the fastest at Chicago and Orlando.


However, it's not the fastest in North America.


The B757 turns around in Toronto in 1 hour 35 minutes.

Noxegon

Bummer1234 wrote: »

Not sure if the return leg will be as popular as the return at night

I'll certainly be using it.

I've taken to using the British Airways morning service from JFK-LHR and an onward connection to DUB just so I don't have to spend a night on a plane. I find it destroys me far less than a flight that arrives at Stupid O'Clock in the morning.

It's not just me, too. There's an article saying much the same thing on IrishCentral that the boards system won't let me post because I'm too new apparently... disregarding the fact that I registered this account over ten years ago and lurked for a long time

Tenger

Noxegon wrote: »

I'll certainly be using it.................................. There's an article saying much the same thing on IrishCentral that the boards system won't let me post because I'm too new apparently... disregarding the fact that I registered this account over ten years ago and lurked for a long time

The lock out is linked to post count rather than length of membership. You need 50 posts

JCX BXC

Tenger wrote: »

The lock out is linked to post count rather than length of membership. You need 50 posts

Being too new and having 50 posts are a different thing aren't they?

What confuses me is that Aer Lingus upgrade the SNN-BOS service to a 767 daily flight during the summer, but leave the JFK at a 757 and 6 times a week.
There is delta and united competition, but new york would be a far more destination. Sureley in the peak summer season there is enough PAX to utilize 7 flights a week?

Besides that I also think a year round SNN-ACE may yet be announced, as they have the timetables suited towards the lanzarote flight.

Carnacalla

Carnacalla wrote: »

Being too new and having 50 posts are a different thing aren't they?

What confuses me is that Aer Lingus upgrade the SNN-BOS service to a 767 daily flight during the summer, but leave the JFK at a 757 and 6 times a week.
There is delta and united competition, but new york would be a far more destination. Sureley in the peak summer season there is enough PAX to utilize 7 flights a week?

Besides that I also think a year round SNN-ACE may yet be announced, as they have the timetables suited towards the lanzarote flight.

You probably answered your own question to be honest, I would imagine the competition has made it difficult to fill and expand on JFK but BOS without competition can handle the extra seats per day. Plus I'd think they are more looking for the 757 to move to Dublin.

LXFlyer

Bear in mind also that Boston is their year-round transatlantic destination from Shannon (JFK is suspended from the start of January to the middle of March) which suggests that loadings are higher on that route than JFK.

highlydebased

Indeed Boston much more popular for EI from SNN. I've heard they've been disappointed with the JFK numbers even with 757. There seems to be great loyalty to United who fly all year.

JCX BXC

highlydebased wrote: »

Indeed Boston much more popular for EI from SNN. I've heard they've been disappointed with the JFK numbers even with 757. There seems to be great loyalty to United who fly all year.

I can't see why people wouldn't be loyal to united. They are usually cheaper and havnt screwed Shannon through its fall. It was the only transatlantic service from 2010 to this year that operated through jan-mar. Aer Lingus announced year round transatlantic services this year from Shannon, but made people believe New York was year round too, but it wasnt.

During the peak summer season I have heard of the flight leaving full alot of the time.

knockon

highlydebased wrote: »

Indeed Boston much more popular for EI from SNN. I've heard they've been disappointed with the JFK numbers even with 757. There seems to be great loyalty to United who fly all year.

I agree. Aer Lingus left the airport and a lot of us, their customers high and dry when they did a number of things, i.e. suspended LHR flight for 1 year some time ago and with regard to JFK they have reduced the service and has none at all for three months. You can debate Continental now United is a full service airline (they don't close off service at 48 West 3 hours out of JFK!) and the UA flight to EWR has you in Manhattan 3-4 hours earlier than EI - good for doing business.

Zonda999

Interesting that point about EI being disappointed with the JFK numbers ex SNN. I'm not sure many would be too inclined to choose EI over United in fairness, especially if United are usually cheaper on the route as some here are saying.

Without going too far off topic, has any other carrier given EI competition on the Boston route in the past?

JCX BXC

Zonda999 wrote: »

Without going too far off topic, has any other carrier given EI competition on the Boston route in the past?

American Airlines operated SNN-BOS in 2005 ish for a year on a 757. This was changed the following year to dub-snn-ord with a 767 and then it was cancelled around 2007.