2016 US Presidential Race - Mod Warning in OP

JPNelsforearm

jobbridge4life wrote: »

The imputation is that he didn't and therefor he is as bad as Trump. But since you support Trump you don't really have a leg to stand on.

'Guys seriously my candidate is at least as bad as yours'

The future is bright.

Sorry that was semi sarcastic relating to the above "KKK supports X candidate" debate, I was mocking the whole idea that because some lunatic supports a candidate, that candidate is somehow suspect, as Bernard has arguably garnered the worst "celebrity" support out of any of the candidates

"I support Trump, therefor I dont have a leg to stand on" what does that mean

Billy86

JPNelsforearm wrote: »

Or honestly not giving a ****, he's a lying scumbag, so what? Hillary isnt? that is the choice, its not a deep field of civic minded honest people who are running. Trump is the least worst.

He's clearly not. The reasons why have been pointed out to you over and over again. That you refuse to acknowledge the truth, or in any way address any of these points, is your own issue.

As for your points, half of it was left wing propaganda, whats the point, I'll focus on one, Trump has said he will not defund planned parethood, he can say he is personally opposed to abortion, but he has not said he will flog the dead horse that is Roe V Wade.

Covered already, and you are wrong on both counts of PP and abortion.

Laura Ingraham: Yesterday, Planned Parenthood was exposed again in an eighth video released by the Center for Medical Progress. Do you still believe there are two Planned Parenthoods or is it time to defund this organization?

Donald Trump: Well, you should defund anyway because they are doing the abortions. It is like an abortion factory, which is terrible. So you should defund anyway. But those videos are horrible. Every time you see them, they get worse and worse. And it’s not only that, the messengers are so bad. There always, I mean these people, what they say and the way they, it’s like you are selling parts to an automobile or something. It’s a terrible situation going on with Planned Parenthood. There’s no question about it.

You can post as many left wing sites proclaiming he will return women to the stone age, but its just not true, republicans and right wing sutes harbour the same misgivings about his fealty to overturning or even pretending to fight Roe v Wade as leftists do in the other direction.

The above quote is from a website that YOU originally linked to, not me. And it is a pro life propaganda website - how very left wing of them! I've said it before, you're well past the point of self parody at this stage.

In short, Trump will not do anything about abortion or planned parenthood, its a complete media fabrication to think that he will.

Laura Ingraham: Yesterday, Planned Parenthood was exposed again in an eighth video released by the Center for Medical Progress. Do you still believe there are two Planned Parenthoods or is it time to defund this organization?

Donald Trump: Well, you should defund anyway because they are doing the abortions. It is like an abortion factory, which is terrible. So you should defund anyway. But those videos are horrible. Every time you see them, they get worse and worse. And it’s not only that, the messengers are so bad. There always, I mean these people, what they say and the way they, it’s like you are selling parts to an automobile or something. It’s a terrible situation going on with Planned Parenthood. There’s no question about it.

There are as much conservative blogs and politicians going after Trump on the same issue left wing and feminists are to make one question their motives and honesty. In short, thats why I support Trump, both types of people I think are morons are going after him on the same issues.

Again, the above quote is from a PRO LIFE website than YOU linked to. :pac:

But good job justifying your incomprehensible-to-even-yourself stance of supporting Trump by claiming everyone else is crazy and you're the only sane ones. He does hate the Muslims too though, so you've always got that!

Billy86

JPNelsforearm wrote: »

"I support Trump, therefor I dont have a leg to stand on" what does that mean

It means you don't even know what it is you are standing for, and therefore you have no credibility nor leg to stand on.

JPNelsforearm

Billy86 wrote: »

Covered already, and you are wrong on both counts of PP and abortion.

Not covered, watch the videos I posted, he has said in the Republican debates he will not defund planned parenthood and clearly supports Row v Wade

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3tlPnkMT2I

Trump will ameliorate that stance to garner enough votes for the Repub nomination, but once he is the nominee.. Clearly he is appealing to the republican base to garner votes as Republicans are attacking him for the opposite reasons you are attacking him, for holding pro choice, pro planned parenthood views.

JPNelsforearm

Billy86 wrote: »

It means you don't even know what it is you are standing for, and therefore you have no credibility nor leg to stand on.

Yeah, he's not a Democrat, he's not a Republican, he's not Hillary and he's not Sanders. He also pisses off conservatives and liberals.I support Trump due to the forces arrayed against him and some of the things he has said some of the time, in addition to his pugnaciousness and anti PC stance. I know what everyone else stand for and I dont like it, so Trump is the least worst, as I have said a million times.

Billy86

JPNelsforearm wrote: »

Not covered, watch the videos I posted, he has said in the Republican debates he will not defund planned parenthood and clearly supports Row v Wade

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3tlPnkMT2I

You just posted to a video of him denying he would keep it funded and saying he does not support abortions.

I could put up a video of Trump saying his favourite colour is black, and if you preferred white you would say he just called white his favourite colour.

You are arguing against yourself.

Never mind not knowing what you are standing for, you actually seem to believe you are standing for the opposite of what Trump is saying. Like I said, beyond self parody. Like the other poster said, not a leg to stand on.

JPNelsforearm

Why would religious conservatives be organising against Trump if he is "the second coming of Hitler who will put womens rights back a century" as many on here forecast?

http://theresurgent.com/statement-from-conservatives-against-trump/

"This morning I participated in a meeting of grassroots conservative activists from around the country who are committed to opposing Donald Trump. We have agreed to release the statement below:

We are a group of grassroots conservative activists from all over the country and from various backgrounds, including supporters of many of the other campaigns. We are committed to ensuring a real conservative candidate is elected. We believe that neither Hillary Clinton nor Donald Trump, a Hillary Clinton donor, is that person.

We believe that the issue of Donald Trump is greater than an issue of party. It is an issue of morals and character that all Americans, not just those of us in the conservative movement, must confront.

We encourage all former Republican candidates not currently supporting Trump to unite against him and encourage all candidates to hold their delegates on the first ballot.

Lastly, we intend to keep our options open as to other avenues to oppose Donald Trump. Our multiple decades of work in the conservative movement for free markets, limited government, national defense, religious liberty, life, and marriage are about ideas, not necessarily parties.

JPNelsforearm

Billy86 wrote: »

You just posted to a video of him denying he would keep it funded and saying he does not support abortions.

I could put up a video of Trump saying his favourite colour is black, and if you preferred white you would say he just called white his favourite colour.

You are arguing against yourself.

Never mind not knowing what you are standing for, you actually seem to believe you are standing for the opposite of what Trump is saying. Like I said, beyond self parody. Like the other poster said, not a leg to stand on.

I posted that to show a contrast to the other video's overleaf, Trump has to say these things to win the Republican nomination, fine if you dont think that, believe the man has suddenly morphed into Hitlerium Patriarchus overnight, he is doing what he needs to do to win, nothing more.

Why are the main lines of attack from his fellow Republicans that he is a liberal pretending to be conservative, whilst the Democrats main line of attack is that he is Hitler masquerading as a conservative, they cant both be right, I contend they are both wrong.

KingBrian2

We see the media is well capable of spinning lies and disinformation. They are highlighting all the awful remarks he is making and none of the substantial points are included but of course those small comments are eaten up by the tabloid media. Used to blacken his name and since Trump is such a gaffe pro he walks straight onto landmines. He is angered so many sectional interests that the entire media is coming down on him like a pile of bricks. To date no media has been supportive of him or said anything sympathetic to him. Fox, CNN, MSNBC, all the media paints him as a demagogue. Not to be taken serious. He is a whiner, a ranter, a egotistical maniac in some quarters yet when he talks of the very real concern of border control or corruption in Washington he gets no mention he is much like Sanders but unlike Sanders Trump also gets an enormous amount of protest voters not interested in policy.

B_Wayne

Erm, saying that he's lying to get a nomination but you have absolutely no basis for what his actual belief is... So you've done a fine job at illustrating that nobody has a clue what Trump actually stands for. However he has fostered hatred in his campaign, that's one clear result of his campaign. Actual views, generally pretty impossible to determine because he's so dishonest.

Brian?

walshyn93 wrote: »

Do you realise that his perception of success is what makes his brand a success? So you're demanding that he actively harm his own company's brand to satisfy your need to see someone humbled.

He has owned 551 companies and only about 12 have been pointed out as failures. There could be more I'm not aware of, but it's still irrelevant.

Mitt Romney's business record has a less than 50% success rate yet he's an undeniably skillful and successful businessman. That's the nature of business. It's not your failures that define your success, because more often than not the profits from your successful business ventures will far outweigh your losses on the unsuccessful ones.

Attacking a billionaire's business success is a total non-starter. There are some elements of Trump's record you could attack. But he's a multi-billionaire. His business career is above reproach. Saying otherwise is pure desperation.

The stunt he pulled with the steaks in FL was a genius bit of campaigning too. Even if it's no longer in business, that's not what the media picked up on and that's really all that matters at the end of the day.

I am not attacking Trump for his record as a business man. I said this in the post you quoted. I'm attacking him for being a liar. He is undoubtedly a liar.

FISMA.

Brian? wrote: »

He is undoubtedly a liar.

Should be a great politician so...

ECO_Mental

JPNelsforearm wrote: »

Yeah, he's not a Democrat, he's not a Republican, he's not Hillary and he's not Sanders. He also pisses off conservatives and liberals.I support Trump due to the forces arrayed against him and some of the things he has said some of the time, in addition to his pugnaciousness and anti PC stance. I know what everyone else stand for and I dont like it, so Trump is the least worst, as I have said a million times.

TBH I don't think there is any talking sense to Trump supporters. The more time you spend trying to convince them that trump is a charlatan the more his followers support him. He has also convinced them that the media are not to be trusted and he is the only one that speaks the truth. To reinforce this he has the media segregated at his events(Or Trump inc infomercials) and he actively mocks them. As a result of this anything we say against him or point to a media source he can easily say they are "lying"

These people want to believe what they want to believe no matter what you say. Also there is nothing wrong with being PC, what is so wrong with it. Being PC is just being civil/polite to other people. But Trump and the far right want to turn it into bad word so they can outrageous stuff and "say what's on my mind"and not be PC. I would love to say what's on my mind all the time, like to my boss you're an arsehole but I can't. But Trump has now gotten to a stage where he can say anything he wants and excuses it as not being PC, sadly.

Sad part is he is treating his followers for fools, it's been referenced lot of time here before about "The Art of the deal" book where he says to make crazy outrageous stuff to get attention then back down from there to get the deal done (For him the biggest real estate deal, The white House) and when he gets there he will soon realise he can't say what's on his mind to the Chinese or the Russians. International politics is WAY different then buying a golf course, especially when the actual lives are on the line.

Finally it's a sad state of affairs when your own people don't want you(GOP) that's got to tell a lot

KingBrian2

ECO_Mental wrote: »

TBH I don't think there is any talking sense to Trump supporters. The more time you spend trying to convince them that trump is a charlatan the more his followers support him. He has also convinced them that the media are not to be trusted and he is the only one that speaks the truth. To reinforce this he has the media segregated at his events(Or Trump inc infomercials) and he actively mocks them. As a result of this anything we say against him or point to a media source he can easily say they are "lying"

These people want to believe what they want to believe no matter what you say. Also there is nothing wrong with being PC, what is so wrong with it. Being PC is just being civil/polite to other people. But Trump and the far right want to turn it into bad word so they can outrageous stuff and "say what's on my mind"and not be PC. I would love to say what's on my mind all the time, like to my boss you're an arsehole but I can't. But Trump has now gotten to a stage where he can say anything he wants and excuses it as not being PC, sadly.

Sad part is he is treating his followers for fools, it's been referenced lot of time here before about "The Art of the deal" book where he says to make crazy outrageous stuff to get attention then back down from there to get the deal done (For him the biggest real estate deal, The white House) and when he gets there he will soon realise he can't say what's on his mind to the Chinese or the Russians. International politics is WAY different then buying a golf course, especially when the actual lives are on the line.

Finally it's a sad state of affairs when your own people don't want you(GOP) that's got to tell a lot

Trump does not need to convince his supporters the media and GOP HQ are against they clearly are. Every headline portrays him as the bad guy. His meteoric rise is a result of all the scaremongering. The media is making him more and more hostile remember these are the same commentators that called President Obama a Marxist Socialist Kenyan that want to turn America into Europe. Truth is not part of a campaign. Negative campaigning and insulting your opponents is a core tenant of electioneering.

K-9

JPNelsforearm wrote: »

Absolutely, Trump is as flawed as anyone, I think all politicians and politics is a joke, but Trump stands on his own and represents himself, selling himself. but its also the people who are against him, leftists, and other assorted lunatics.

When you have these people against you, you know you are doing something right.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0diJNybk0Mw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YU3vcvGpALQ

Trump detractors are using similar logic, the enemy of my enemy is my friend. I would use that logic sometimes, if the extreme right and left are for something...

In fairness Sanders and Trump do make good points sometimes so it isn't a good idea to dismiss something because they might have different beliefs. As the timeless Monty Python sketch goes:
People's front of Judea: How much do you hate the Romans?
Graham Chapman: A lot,
People's front of Judea: You're in then.

The problem with Trump for me is that if I supported him I'd know he was playing me, his politics was always Democrat, liberal on abortion, gay rights, free trade etc and over the last decade he seems to have had several road to Damascus moments on core principles. A politician changing a view on issue is admirable considering the flack they'll get, a whole raft of issues?

Was listening to a podcast a few weeks ago, might have been American life. It followed a young student heading the Trump campaign at his local University. Touching story of a guy who'd gone through foster home after home and finally got adopted.

His mother and step dad were stereotypical Cruz supporters so you'd imagine the reaction when the guy came out as gay. They got over it eventually, the young fella is obviously intelligent, funny, just very likeable. The main reason he supported Trump was his pro gay marriage stance, the young lads ideal, his red line issue if you will.

A few months later Trump announces in one of the debates he is now against same sex marriage. It makes no difference to the young lad, at this stage he has invested so much time campaigning for Trump and believing and in awe of the man, nothing will change that. He's a demigod to him, ideals and red line issues are gone. I'd say there are elements of brain washing to it.

Which is my point, you know what Sanders stands for, like him or hate him he has largely been consistent throughout his life, Cruz to an extent, though he has shifted even further right apparently.

Centrist politicians like Clinton, Kasich and Rubio, yep they shift positions, but you get a general idea of what they stand for. Trump, nope. He has shape shifted on so many issues I couldn't trust him.

Akrasia

JPNelsforearm wrote: »

I'll focus on one, Trump has said he will not defund planned parethood, he can say he is personally opposed to abortion, but he has not said he will flog the dead horse that is Roe V Wade. You can post as many left wing sites proclaiming he will return women to the stone age, but its just not true, republicans and right wing sutes harbour the same misgivings about his fealty to overturning or even pretending to fight Roe v Wade as leftists do in the other direction.
In short, Trump will not do anything about abortion or planned parenthood, its a complete media fabrication to think that he will.

It's not a complete fabrication. Trump has said that he will de-fund planned parenthood as long as they perform abortions

Yeah, if it didn’t have to do with abortions. Look, I understand that I have many, many friends who are women who understand Planned Parenthood better than you or I will ever understand it. And they do some very good work. Cervical cancer, lots of women’s issues, women’s health issues are taken care of. I know one of the candidates, I won’t mention names, said, “We’re not going to spend that kind of money on women’s health issues.” I am. Planned Parenthood does a really good job at a lot of different areas. But not on abortion. So I’m not going to fund it if it’s doing the abortion. I am not going to fund it. Now they say it’s 3 percent and it’s 4 percent, some people say it’s 60 percent. I don’t believe it’s 60 percent, by the way. But I think it’s probably a much lower number. But Planned Parenthood does some very good work. But I would defund as long as they’re doing abortions.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/02/22/donald-trump-i-would-defund-planned-parenthood-as-long-as-theyre-doing-abortions/

Look, Trump holds every position at the same time. You have absolutely no idea what he would do as president.

Overheal

JPNelsforearm wrote: »

Absolutely, Trump is as flawed as anyone, I think all politicians and politics is a joke, but Trump stands on his own and represents himself, selling himself. but its also the people who are against him, leftists, and other assorted lunatics.

When you have these people against you, you know you are doing something right.

What about the people you have with you - are you doing something wrong?

http://fusion.net/story/280795/donald-trump-dayton-rally/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=socialshare&utm_content=theme_top

@ER" "F*CK THOSE DIRTY BEANERS"

It's not a complete fabrication. Trump has said that he will de-fund planned parenthood as long as they perform abortions

Empty promise, you need an act of congress to change the medicare laws first.

B_Wayne

Overheal wrote: »

What about the people you have with you - are you doing something wrong?

http://fusion.net/story/280795/donald-trump-dayton-rally/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=socialshare&utm_content=theme_top

@ER" "F*CK THOSE DIRTY BEANERS"Empty promise, you need an act of congress to change the medicare laws first.

Find it interesting that they were desperate to remove him from the event but he hadn't done a thing. Really think that this has revealed some of the worst aspects of the US.

Overheal

As does social media, sometimes. Following the comments on a report today of another protest outside of a trump rally, you have many people calling for them to be run over, hit with water cannons, or my least fav comment:

We need Apache helicopters with machine guns shooting at these people they will run like hell

Which just illustrates the dangerous level of ignorance-driven hate in the country right now.

Black Swan

Trump rallies appear to have a greater potential for violence than other Republican or Democrat rallies. WIRED essentially suggests that the in-group vs out-group collective identities have become more manifest at Trump rallies, along with related consequences:

"That sense of collective identity, and the desire to protect it from outside threats, may explain the fist-fights, punching, and sporadic tussles between Trump supporters and protesters..."

Of course Trump supporters will claim (peaceful) innocence and blame protesters, while protesters will claim (peaceful) innocence and blame Trump supporters, and how one interprets such falls upon your individual (and/or collective) POV.

jobbridge4life

Red King wrote: »

That attack ad was brilliant in fairness, Hillary's response not so much

You really think an ad in the Presidential campaign that reduced Hillary Clinton to a barking dog (the implication being that she is a b!tch) is brilliant? If so you should probably go hang out with a group of teenagers you'll find endless hours of entertainment.

KingBrian2

jobbridge4life wrote: »

You really think an ad in the Presidential campaign that reduced Hillary Clinton to a barking dog (the implication being that she is a b!tch) is brilliant? If so you should probably go hang out with a group of teenagers you'll find endless hours of entertainment.

Hillary Clinton has hardly told the whole truth during this campaign. She is trying to get elected so she is massaging her record to the best of her abilities. Trump supporters are so passionate about the subjects he is talking about they get so much attention while Clinton has so much backing from the Democrats, quite recently she even impressed on Americans how foreign dignitaries would be annoyed if Trump got elected.

Why would Americans care how foreigners view their politics? Most Americans like people in Michigan, Texas, Florida and even New York are more concerned about really important issues not what Clinton is not talking about. She likes to imagine their is no immigration crisis or terrorism crisis. Nothing to do about her policies being good or bad it is simple her liberalism is not supported by much of the American electorate in large parts of America and here is the vulnerability in the Democratic party.

Large areas of country have been abandoned to the GOP. These regions will now exclusively vote Republican. Trump has resonance with all these people hence the increased passion in all the rallies. America ceded too much ground to the Republicans by remaining so centrist.

Billy86

KingBrian2 wrote: »

Hillary Clinton has hardly told the whole truth during this campaign. She is trying to get elected so she is massaging her record to the best of her abilities. Trump supporters are so passionate about the subjects he is talking about they get so much attention while Clinton has so much backing from the Democrats, quite recently she even impressed on Americans how foreign dignitaries would be annoyed if Trump got elected.

There is a reason Trump becoming president is viewed as one of the biggest risks to the global economy.

Why would Americans care how foreigners view their politics? Most Americans like people in Michigan, Texas, Florida and even New York are more concerned about really important issues not what Clinton is not talking about. She likes to imagine their is no immigration crisis or terrorism crisis. Nothing to do about her policies being good or bad it is simple her liberalism is not supported by much of the American electorate in large parts of America and here is the vulnerability in the Democratic party.

Trumps "bomb the sh*t out of then and torture their families" idea is only going to make terrorism a bigger issue, and his wall plan isn't even remotely economically viable.

Large areas of country have been abandoned to the GOP. These regions will now exclusively vote Republican. Trump has resonance with all these people hence the increased passion in all the rallies. America ceded too much ground to the Republicans by remaining so centrist.

America is one of the more right leaning countries in the western world, your compass might need readjusting.

Overheal

Funny how she hasn't said anything about Flint since Michigan voted, but it's still a point of contention on the Sanders platform. I feel she will say what she needs to for the votes, and will leave a long line of discarded promises in her wake.

KingBrian2

Overheal wrote: »

Funny how she hasn't said anything about Flint since Michigan voted, but it's still a point of contention on the Sanders platform. I feel she will say what she needs to for the votes, and will leave a long line of discarded promises in her wake.

Yes that's right that feeds the aggression. Flint is an example of the Federal gvt killing its citizens. For the Trump supporters it is a great reason for small gvt. People talk about Trump causing the protests. He is a release valve. A lot of the states are actually under pressure and a few years back faced budget cuts. Listen I believe Trump best represents that core group of Americans that have a very low opinion of the Federal gvt and he is somebody who can get Congress more active in changing the way gvt operates. Sanders is unlikely to get elected although he may pick up the nomination.

Overheal

Remember that wiley old racist that elbowed that black guy in the face and the cops arrested the guy he punched? Turns out the Sheriffs department has suspended 3 deputies and demoted 2 others involved in that incident. Hurrah!

http://occupydemocrats.com/2016/03/19/trump-rally-cops-suspended-cuffing-black-protester-instead-racist-punched/

KingBrian2 wrote: »

Yes that's right that feeds the aggression. Flint is an example of the Federal gvt killing its citizens. For the Trump supporters it is a great reason for small gvt. People talk about Trump causing the protests. He is a release valve. A lot of the states are actually under pressure and a few years back faced budget cuts. Listen I believe Trump best represents that core group of Americans that have a very low opinion of the Federal gvt and he is somebody who can get Congress more active in changing the way gvt operates. Sanders is unlikely to get elected although he may pick up the nomination.

That would be incredibly bad thinking. Small government means even less regulation over our water supplies, and hundreds of communities in the US are determined now to have unsafe levels of lead in the municipal supply. Checking the News feed you'll find buzz about the lead scare going everywhere from Washington to Louisiana to Florida: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2016/03/17/its-not-just-flint-lead-taints-water-across-the-u-s-the-epa-says/

As for the Federal Government "killing it's citizens", with all due respect, that's total horsesh*t. The Federal Government really wasn't involved in the decision making of this situation much at all, and really neither was the EPA. This boiled down to the Michigan State Government and the water authority of Detroit, the city of Flint, and another local water authority. In fact speaking of government oversight an/or private business corruption, it was a Real Estate scandal in the 1960s that stopped Flint from building out its own pipeline to Lake Huron, the same source of water that Detroit uses and treats, which would have demonstrably avoided this whole situation for Flint. But hey, I won't sit here and say that people aren't blaming the EPA, but no doubt the agency is a lot different now than its original mandate, and it wouldn't be a terrible idea to audit it and bring it back up to the standard. I certainly think the farthest things from peoples minds should be to get rid of it. Arguably they could have done more, did not do more, but at the end of the day these were decisions and actions carried out by the state of Michigan and the city of Flint. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flint_water_crisis#History_of_Flint_water_supply

K-9

Not sure how smaller Government would have meant no water crisis in Flint, budget cuts seem to have led to poor decisions. Just sounds like another meaningless soundbite really.

Manach

It could be argued that too much state intervention also has a root in the Flint water issue. I've read some books on the Detroit region, which Flint seems to be related as part of the same governmental structures. Post 1960s the growth of the state was marked in that area, but the tax base remained stagnant and then shrank. A large portion of the tax went to dubious projects, not core infrastructure, as a means to reward specific voter stakeholders and not the general community. In Detroit by Lebuff, this is chronicled with the main example being the skeletal fire department striving to fullfill its duties despite of the large government and its practices.

Manach

An interesting piece by the noted conservative writer David Brooks on the rise of Trump. He differentiates between the Candidate (who the author does not support and casts as dishonest at a fundamental level) and his supporter base ( which has been ignore by the elites in both parties and are not gaining from the anemic economic recovery "voters are a coalition of the dispossessed. They have suffered lost jobs, lost wages, lost dreams. The American system is not working for them, so naturally they are looking for something else.".
This would seem a mirror image of those who support Sanders (in that both share a wish to make their voices known in an electoral system that has failed). A societal alienation.
Link
http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/03/18/opinion/no-not-trump-not-ever.html?_r=2

maryishere

At least Trump wants to get America back on its feet. National debt nearly doubled during Obama presidency, and also increased during the Clinton Presidency. That is not sustainable.