2016 US Presidential Race - Mod Warning in OP

MightyMandarin

nokia69 wrote: »

O'Reilly said he would never get the wall built, he never said if it was a good or a bad idea

millions of Americans agree with what Trump says about Mexico and since he's the only one pointing out the down side to massive illegal immigration he has a real chance of getting the nomination

O'Reilly said he was crazy to think that Mexico would pay for the wall, and that Trump was a complete hypocrite by saying he was totally for free trade, yet he'd impose huge tariffs on Mexican imports to force the Govt. to pay for it.

Millions of Americans also think he's a blatant racist who is completely wrong and that he has zero chance of getting the nomination because he has alienated a massive proportion of Americans who are Hispanic, immigrants or have roots in both. It's no wonder the rest of GOP candidates avoid him or talking about him and some such as Rubio have no problem saying that his opinion on Mexico is flat out wrong.

nokia69

the Donald is now winning the race for nomination

eire4

MightyMandarin wrote: »

O'Reilly said he was crazy to think that Mexico would pay for the wall, and that Trump was a complete hypocrite by saying he was totally for free trade, yet he'd impose huge tariffs on Mexican imports to force the Govt. to pay for it.

Millions of Americans also think he's a blatant racist who is completely wrong and that he has zero chance of getting the nomination because he has alienated a massive proportion of Americans who are Hispanic, immigrants or have roots in both. It's no wonder the rest of GOP candidates avoid him or talking about him and some such as Rubio have no problem saying that his opinion on Mexico is flat out wrong.

You do have to just shake your head and laugh when he says he will do well with the latino vote. Right and Ireland will win the next World Cup as well!! Not happening.

PopePalpatine

If there's people out there dumb enough to fly the old confederate battle flag, there's people out there dumb enough to vote for Trump.

alaimacerc

Amerika wrote: »

I laugh at all the hysteria over Trump being regarded as an clown, buffoon, lunatic etc.

You're laughing at all the people laughing at Trump? Well, this is all very jolly, isn't it!

... that is the sort of "hysteria" you meant, right? If anyone thought he stood a chance in heck of winning the GOP primary, anyone "left" of (a very right-wing) centre would surely be delighted, as he'd be the deadest of all dead-cert losers in the general.

eire4

PopePalpatine wrote: »

If there's people out there dumb enough to fly the old confederate battle flag, there's people out there dumb enough to vote for Trump.

Sadly you are very much correct on that score.

Amerika

eire4 wrote: »

Sadly you are very much correct on that score.

I'd like to disagree with your view of Americans and the voting process, but we did elect Barack Obama... Twice. I believe that supports your contention.

alaimacerc

Amerika wrote: »

I'd like to disagree with your view of Americans and the voting process, but we did elect Barack Obama... Twice. I believe that supports your contention.

Playground-level stuff. How did we get from "confederate flag" to "Barack Obama"? If you're not just mailing this in, couldn't you at least bother to try to cite some vaguely topical issue that you then claim is positively correlated with voting Democrat, and A Bad Thing?

Amerika

alaimacerc wrote: »

Playground-level stuff. How did we get from "confederate flag" to "Barack Obama"? If you're not just mailing this in, couldn't you at least bother to try to cite some vaguely topical issue that you then claim is positively correlated with voting Democrat, and A Bad Thing?

I noticed you din't ask how did we get from 'confederate flag' to 'Donald Trump.?' But that faux outrage and double standard is nornal from your side.

What has Obama accomplished? The ACA is collapsing and the bill is coming due on all the lies used to sell it to the people. The Iran deal is lousy. Real unemployment continues to be high and the average citizens plight hasn't much improved. Over 40 million are on food stamps. He has spent an average of $1 Trillion more each year than the government takes in. And our border and illegal invasion is out of control. Perhaps you can counter these points with all the wonderful things that would indicate he was a wise choice by the people.

MightyMandarin

Amerika wrote: »

I noticed you din't ask how did we get from 'confederate flag' to 'Donald Trump.?' But that faux outrage and double standard is nornal from your side.

What do Donald Trump and the Confederate Flag have in common? Easy, both are symbols of racism in modern America.

alaimacerc

Amerika wrote: »

I noticed you din't ask how did we get from 'confederate flag' to 'Donald Trump.?'

Because I was able to follow the chain of reasoning. Weren't you? Which party's candidates do you think people flying Confederacy flags will be voting for?

But that faux outrage and double standard is nornal from your side.

I think I'm too ironied out to reply.

What has Obama accomplished? The ACA is collapsing and the bill is coming due on all the lies used to sell it to the people. The Iran deal is lousy. Real unemployment continues to be high and the average citizens plight hasn't much improved. Over 40 million are on food stamps. He has spent an average of $1 Trillion more each year than the government takes in. And our border and illegal invasion is out of control. Perhaps you can counter these points with all the wonderful things that would indicate he was a wise choice by the people.

Of all the people I'm confident won't be president for the next time -- and I'm very, very, very confident it won't be Trump -- I think we can say for sure it won't be Obama. So the above jumble of polemic -- poor as it is -- isn't even remotely on topic.

Amerika

alaimacerc wrote: »

Because I was able to follow the chain of reasoning. Weren't you? Which party's candidates do you think people flying Confederacy flags will be voting for?

I would would say they would be voting for both parties. Southern pride doesn't have a party.

I think I'm too ironied out to reply.


Of all the people I'm confident won't be president for the next time -- and I'm very, very, very confident it won't be Trump -- I think we can say for sure it won't be Obama. So the above jumble of polemic -- poor as it is -- isn't even remotely on topic.

Hmmm. You ask for more details. I provide them and request you to counter them if you can. You then change the subject. 'Par for the course' as we say over here.

alaimacerc

Amerika wrote: »

I would would say they would be voting for both parties. Southern pride doesn't have a party.

Observation would appear to contradict your characterisation of blatant race-baiting as "Southern Pride". Psephology would certainly contradict the contention that it doesn't have a party. Do you need a bigger hint as to which one it is?

Hmmm. You ask for more details. I provide them and request you to counter them if you can. You then change the subject. 'Par for the course' as we say over here.

Hmmm. You change the subject. I point out you've changed the subject. You then complain about... changing the subject. Triple bogey, as I'd say I'd say if I were a golf fan.

Since when was "the subject" Barack Obama? Since you sharply pivoted to it from the above topic? I'd be delighted to discuss any of those policy areas as they pertain to any actual or prospective candidates. (I think we already covered them for Trump -- "make everything much worse, spoof outrageously, call solutions problems, and problems solutions.) But let's not pretend your "No! Obama stoopid!" jibe fits the above description remotely.

The Black Oil

My guess is Trump's carelessness (bashing McCain now) will be his undoing.

eire4

Amerika wrote: »

I would would say they would be voting for both parties. Southern pride doesn't have a party.




Hmmm. You ask for more details. I provide them and request you to counter them if you can. You then change the subject. 'Par for the course' as we say over here.

Southern "pride" aka as bigotry seems to vote mostly Republican.

PolaroidPizza

am I the only one worried at the close links between Tourism Ireland and Donald Trumps Doonbeg venture? This man has openly called the entire nation of Mexico 'rapists and thieves', and yet our government board is happy to accept his advertisement money for his development, and host conferences at his golf club.

Quite a number of US companies have already severed ties with him based on these recent openly racist outbursts, yet tourism Ireland have no problem associating with him?
Another case of us accepting US dollars unquestioningly I think.

MightyMandarin

PolaroidPizza wrote: »

am I the only one worried at the close links between Tourism Ireland and Donald Trumps Doonbeg venture? This man has openly called the entire nation of Mexico 'rapists and thieves', and yet our government board is happy to accept his advertisement money for his development, and host conferences at his golf club.

Quite a number of US companies have already severed ties with him based on these recent openly racist outbursts, yet tourism Ireland have no problem associating with him?
Another case of us accepting US dollars unquestioningly I think.

I'm Trump's biggest critic, but I'm not so sure with this one. Scotland also has big links with him and his development there, but there's more controversy between him and the locals there than about his racist comments in America. What have the Trump ads on the radio got to do with Failte Ireland? I assume it's his own money being used to pay for them.

I don't think there's much here tbh. The staff working at his hotel probably couldn't care less what he says as long as the hotel stays open and they have a job, I know I wouldn't. I also haven't seen Failte Ireland openly advertise his resort, as opposed to areas in Ireland which aren't Dublin, which is what they usually do.

PolaroidPizza

its not too evident from Ireland, but in the US there's a lot of airtime given to Tourism Ireland adverts, and Doonbeg features quite strongly in them. Whether or not he pumps money into these ads, if NBC, NASCAR, the PGA....etc etc can cut ties with his resorts, I think it would be decent of Tourism Ireland to do the same. We have a lot of business ties with Mexico, plus quite a few Mexicans live here, so isn't it the right thing to do?

MightyMandarin

PolaroidPizza wrote: »

its not too evident from Ireland, but in the US there's a lot of airtime given to Tourism Ireland adverts, and Doonbeg features quite strongly in them. Whether or not he pumps money into these ads, if NBC, NASCAR, the PGA....etc etc can cut ties with his resorts, I think it would be decent of Tourism Ireland to do the same. We have a lot of business ties with Mexico, plus quite a few Mexicans live here, so isn't it the right thing to do?

MSNBC cut ties with him, not necessarily Doonbeg; I don't they had anything to do with his hotels, it was more to do with 'the Apprentice'. The same probably goes with NASCAR and the PGA.

I doubt the Mexicans here give a sh*te about Tourism Ireland advertising people to come here and happening to showcase Doonbeg in their adverts, at least they haven't said anything.

It's a nothing issue really imo.

Eric Cartman

i think trump will do incredibly well in the south and a lot of republican strongholds. The media in california and new york are quick to jump at every comment he makes, but I think despite the mexican comments being over the top, his willingness to deal with immigration and put the employment of natural born americans first will resonate quite well in a lot of states.

on the opposing side, hillary has pretty much just hit her core support and theres only a fraction of the coverage of other dem candidates as there is of trump.

I think Jebb bush or trump are the only ones with a chance at winning this election , and I have to say if the choice is have another bush or have trump, I'm going with trump.

My ideal candidate would probably be rand paul but thats unlikely to happen.

eire4

Eric Cartman wrote: »

i think trump will do incredibly well in the south and a lot of republican strongholds. The media in california and new york are quick to jump at every comment he makes, but I think despite the mexican comments being over the top, his willingness to deal with immigration and put the employment of natural born americans first will resonate quite well in a lot of states.

on the opposing side, hillary has pretty much just hit her core support and theres only a fraction of the coverage of other dem candidates as there is of trump.

I think Jebb bush or trump are the only ones with a chance at winning this election , and I have to say if the choice is have another bush or have trump, I'm going with trump.

My ideal candidate would probably be rand paul but thats unlikely to happen.

I would not be so dismissive of Scott Walker on the Republican side. IMHO the Republican nomination will come down to Bush v Walker.

Eric Cartman

eire4 wrote: »

I would not be so dismissive of Scott Walker on the Republican side. IMHO the Republican nomination will come down to Bush v Walker.

possible, I must look in to walker more, hasn't been near as much media noise compared to the others but he could have a lot more ground support.

KingBrian2

PolaroidPizza wrote: »

am I the only one worried at the close links between Tourism Ireland and Donald Trumps Doonbeg venture? This man has openly called the entire nation of Mexico 'rapists and thieves', and yet our government board is happy to accept his advertisement money for his development, and host conferences at his golf club.

Quite a number of US companies have already severed ties with him based on these recent openly racist outbursts, yet tourism Ireland have no problem associating with him?
Another case of us accepting US dollars unquestioningly I think.

He is on the campaign trail he can afford to say whatever comes to his mind.

MightyMandarin

Eric Cartman wrote: »

i think trump will do incredibly well in the south and a lot of republican strongholds. The media in california and new york are quick to jump at every comment he makes, but I think despite the mexican comments being over the top, his willingness to deal with immigration and put the employment of natural born americans first will resonate quite well in a lot of states.

on the opposing side, hillary has pretty much just hit her core support and theres only a fraction of the coverage of other dem candidates as there is of trump.

I think Jebb bush or trump are the only ones with a chance at winning this election , and I have to say if the choice is have another bush or have trump, I'm going with trump.

Every candidate in the GOP has a 'willingness to deal with immigration and put the employment of natural born americans first', Trump has just made rash claims about 'taking on Mexico' which have little or no chance of ever happening. When Bill O'Reilly thinks that the plan of an ultra-conservative opponent of immigration is stupid, it's probably stupid. Trump is polling well at the moment, but this is silly season, and he'll be gone in a few months when the rest of the GOP candidates team up against him.

Trump is in the headlines because he's saying dumb things and is a minor celebrity, nothing much to see here really. Hillary is loving it at the moment, but as Bernie Sanders seems to be growing, she's going to answer to a lot of the Democratic base, although Bernie won't pose much of a threat to her imo.

I'm 99% sure the GOP won't win this election. Trump is not a serious candidate and is merely in this race to get some airtime and boost his profile; he'll be gone in 6 months. Bush is highly likely to get the nomination, but he'll need to hit the ground running in Iowa and New Hampshire and make sure another McCain doesn't spring a surprise. Even then, Bush and all the GOP candidates have a major problem because their base is far more conservative than the Dems is liberal; once they get the nomination they have to become more centrist as they'll alienate most 'swing voters' in the middle, but this also runs the risk of being hypocritical at the same time. This is why Romney struggled a lot in 2012; because the Tea Party has ripped the Republicans apart.

Hillary will win this barring a major upset imo, and I say this not as one of her supporters.

InTheTrees

MightyMandarin wrote: »

Even then, Bush and all the GOP candidates have a major problem because their base is far more conservative than the Dems is liberal; once they get the nomination they have to become more centrist as they'll alienate most 'swing voters' in the middle, but this also runs the risk of being hypocritical at the same time. This is why Romney struggled a lot in 2012; because the Tea Party has ripped the Republicans apart.

I agree. And this seems to be a common view of the GOP.

Basically the people who will pick the GOP candidate are the same people who have been ripping it apart from inside and they have little in common with the voters who will decide the next president.

Or...as a democrat thats what I'm hoping. Seems to going that way.

InTheTrees

Eric Cartman wrote: »

possible, I must look in to walker more, hasn't been near as much media noise compared to the others but he could have a lot more ground support.

Walker just tried to introduce leglislation in WI last week that would have completely rolled back the freedom of information laws in the state.

Unbelievable.

There was statewide outcry and the bill was defeated by his own party.

This was just last week.

MightyMandarin

InTheTrees wrote: »

I agree. And this seems to be a common view of the GOP.

Basically the people who will pick the GOP candidate are the same people who have been ripping it apart from inside and they have little in common with the voters who will decide the next president.

Or...as a democrat thats what I'm hoping. Seems to going that way.

It's not just Democrats who identified this, Independent analysts and Republicans know that there are simply more Hispanic and Black people than White people in the US right now, and will continue to struggle to win Presidential elections as long as their candidates continue to adhere to strong Conservative values. While local and State elections are a completely different matter, it's becoming increasingly difficult for the GOP to take the White House, mostly due to the Tea Party. The main reason that Democrats consistently lead 'Get out the Vote' campaigns is because they know the votes are there, they just have to drag them to the polling booth.

Eric Cartman

MightyMandarin wrote: »

Every candidate in the GOP has a 'willingness to deal with immigration and put the employment of natural born americans first', Trump has just made rash claims about 'taking on Mexico' which have little or no chance of ever happening. When Bill O'Reilly thinks that the plan of an ultra-conservative opponent of immigration is stupid, it's probably stupid. Trump is polling well at the moment, but this is silly season, and he'll be gone in a few months when the rest of the GOP candidates team up against him.

Trump is in the headlines because he's saying dumb things and is a minor celebrity, nothing much to see here really. Hillary is loving it at the moment, but as Bernie Sanders seems to be growing, she's going to answer to a lot of the Democratic base, although Bernie won't pose much of a threat to her imo.

I'm 99% sure the GOP won't win this election. Trump is not a serious candidate and is merely in this race to get some airtime and boost his profile; he'll be gone in 6 months. Bush is highly likely to get the nomination, but he'll need to hit the ground running in Iowa and New Hampshire and make sure another McCain doesn't spring a surprise. Even then, Bush and all the GOP candidates have a major problem because their base is far more conservative than the Dems is liberal; once they get the nomination they have to become more centrist as they'll alienate most 'swing voters' in the middle, but this also runs the risk of being hypocritical at the same time. This is why Romney struggled a lot in 2012; because the Tea Party has ripped the Republicans apart.

Hillary will win this barring a major upset imo, and I say this not as one of her supporters.

I think your points make a lot if sense and the tea party has definitely changed the face of what it takes to secure the GOP vote and still seem rational to swing voters.

But I still dont think hillary has a chance of sitting in the oval office , between the distrust of women in politics which is an elephant in the room that a lot of voters wont admit to , the email and benghazi scandals, her flipflopping on marraige equality , her anti business minimum wage and contract work views shes alienated a lot of donors and voters alike , she gets a lot of media steam from the more liberal networks, but fox news will tear chunks out of her and we have to remember that while we laugh at it like it was the onion, a huge chunk of the US take it as gospel

MightyMandarin

Eric Cartman wrote: »

I think your points make a lot if sense and the tea party has definitely changed the face of what it takes to secure the GOP vote and still seem rational to swing voters.

But I still dont think hillary has a chance of sitting in the oval office , between the distrust of women in politics which is an elephant in the room that a lot of voters wont admit to , the email and benghazi scandals, her flipflopping on marraige equality , her anti business minimum wage and contract work views shes alienated a lot of donors and voters alike , she gets a lot of media steam from the more liberal networks, but fox news will tear chunks out of her and we have to remember that while we laugh at it like it was the onion, a huge chunk of the US take it as gospel

No idea what you're on about there, the email and benghazi scandals are no bigger than a lot of what the GOP candidates have, her 'anti business min. wage' is just your opinion; raising the min. wage is a vital element of solving income inequality and that is a shared opinion among 99.9% of Democrats, not just her supporters. Flipflopping on gay marriage can be attributed to most candidates in American politics, not just her. Besides, it's of little relevance now that gay marriage is legal in all 50 states. Nobody gives a damn what FOX news does to her, because aside from a very, very small minority of Americans, nobody gives a damn about FOX news at all.

The longer Trump stays in the race, the bigger Hillary's lead over the Jeb Bush and the GOP candidates grows. She will walk this election.

zielarz

I think many people on the 'left' are afraid of Trump. Misquoting or cutting his statements became a norm. They just keep repeating the same misconceptions about him and keep labeling him as racist, clown etc. This is typical liberal way of discrediting a person. I just hope American people are wiser and won't buy it.

I like him, he's authentic, honest, he can say what he think, exposes many things that are wrong with America today. I think republican voters take him seriously, otherwise he wouldn't be at the top of the polls.