2016 US Presidential Race - Mod Warning in OP

Memnoch

I honestly would vote for trump. I think we're seriously overdue the apocalypse and humanity's continued existence on this planet is pretty evil anyway.

MightyMandarin

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/07/23/border-patrol-union-pulls-out-trump-meeting/

Trump said the Republican National Committee "has not been supportive," and suggested if he does not clinch the nomination and is not "treated" well by Republicans, he'd consider an independent bid.

Trump's making some threats about running as an Independent. If he does then the GOP will get battered this election, and Hillary will walk the election. I can hear Karl Rove and the Koch boys quaking in their boots.

sinead88

I'd be voting for Bernie Sanders if I was in the US just now I reckon. He's the only one who isn't bought by Wallstreet. He also has a much better voting record than Hilary, in the sense that he voted against the Iraq war, and he'll give Palestine some sort of a chance at all. America is well on it's way to becoming an oligarchy to be honest. Also, if I was there, I'd be trying to vote for anyone who took a decent shot at gun control, and prison reform. Their prison system is archaic and lags behind the majority of the developed world.

eire4

sinead88 wrote: »

I'd be voting for Bernie Sanders if I was in the US just now I reckon. He's the only one who isn't bought by Wallstreet. He also has a much better voting record than Hilary, in the sense that he voted against the Iraq war, and he'll give Palestine some sort of a chance at all. America is well on it's way to becoming an oligarchy to be honest. Also, if I was there, I'd be trying to vote for anyone who took a decent shot at gun control, and prison reform. Their prison system is archaic and lags behind the majority of the developed world.

I am in complete agreement with you there Sinead. It is arguable that the US already has become an oligarchy. The gun culture the US has is insane and isn't just about what happens on the streets and in homes, the police are overly aggressive and militarized and US foreign policy is so often of the shoot first variety as well. The prison system is nuts too. I think in the early 80's the US had about half a million in prison now the US has over 3 million. Crazy mandatory sentences and even more stupid drug laws play a big part. But so also does privatizing prisons which some US states like Florida have done. Thus bringing a private profit motive into locking people up thats nuts.

ECO_Mental

nokia69 wrote: »

the Donald is going after the Saudis now

Again trump showing his presidential class resorting to using "F**k" in a speech.:rolleyes: it's a comedy show hopefully we'll get a few more weeks of this. But what I think will happen is that he can't stop himself saying s**t and sooner rather than later he is going say something totally crazy or say he doesn't believe in God and he is the messiah(he does believe he can save the world:o) and this will be the end of him.

Amerika

Memnoch wrote: »

I honestly would vote for trump. I think we're seriously overdue the apocalypse and humanity's continued existence on this planet is pretty evil anyway.

I realize your post was meant tongue-in-cheek, but that viewpoint on Trump seems to have overtaken the mainstream media here in the states. The Donald Derangement Syndrome has become epidemic with them. I have seen barely any substantive reporting on his worthy ideas, and the media have focused primarily on his Joe Biden type propensity for sticking his foot in his mouth. And unfortunately, unlike Biden, Trump gets no pass on them.

Last week, Trump talked about the government student loan problem in an interview with The Hill. He criticized the federal government for earning a profit on the program. He stated “That’s probably one of the only things the government shouldn’t make money off -- I think it’s terrible that one of the only profit centers we have is student loans,” and stated, correctly, college students are “swimming in these loans.” He went on to say “I’ll see so many young people and they work really hard for four years… They borrowed money. Their parents don’t have much. They work all together and they mortgage their future.” And then they can’t find good jobs when they get out of college, which he plans to change.

Bold stuff if he can make a difference in the situation. But has anyone seen reporting on this?

Brian?

Amerika wrote: »

I realize your post was meant tongue-in-cheek, but that viewpoint on Trump seems to have overtaken the mainstream media here in the states. The Donald Derangement Syndrome has become epidemic with them. I have seen barely any substantive reporting on his worthy ideas, and the media have focused primarily on his Joe Biden type propensity for sticking his foot in his mouth. And unfortunately, unlike Biden, Trump gets no pass on them.

Last week, Trump talked about the government student loan problem in an interview with The Hill. He criticized the federal government for earning a profit on the program. He stated “That’s probably one of the only things the government shouldn’t make money off -- I think it’s terrible that one of the only profit centers we have is student loans,” and stated, correctly, college students are “swimming in these loans.” He went on to say “I’ll see so many young people and they work really hard for four years… They borrowed money. Their parents don’t have much. They work all together and they mortgage their future.” And then they can’t find good jobs when they get out of college, which he plans to change.

Bold stuff if he can make a difference in the situation. But has anyone seen reporting on this?

I applaud Trump for getting behind student loan reform. But it's not exactly original thinking. Obama, H Clinton and Bernie Sanders have all talked about it recently. Where were you when they did? I don't remember any praise forthcoming?

http://uk.businessinsider.com/bernie-sanders-debt-free-college-plan-2015-6?r=US&IR=T

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/stephen-dash/how-hillary-clinton-would_b_7012814.html

In fact Obama actually did something substantive on the issue:

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-03-19/obama-cuts-student-debt-collector-commissions-to-aid-borrowers

So well done Mr. Trump, I applaud your plans to reduce student debt. You'll get Dem support if you end up as POTUS because they've been working on it for years.

Also, Biden does not get a pass on his gaffes. His gaffes just aren't that bad. They're silly mistakes, not questioning war heroes or calling Mexicans rapists. When Biden puts his foot in his mouth it's clearly a mistake, the problem with Trump is he believes the madness he spouts.

Amerika

Brian? wrote: »

I applaud Trump for getting behind student loan reform. But it's not exactly original thinking. Obama, H Clinton and Bernie Sanders have all talked about it recently. Where were you when they did? I don't remember any praise forthcoming?

http://uk.businessinsider.com/bernie-sanders-debt-free-college-plan-2015-6?r=US&IR=T

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/stephen-dash/how-hillary-clinton-would_b_7012814.html

In fact Obama actually did something substantive on the issue:

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-03-19/obama-cuts-student-debt-collector-commissions-to-aid-borrowers

So well done Mr. Trump, I applaud your plans to reduce student debt. You'll get Dem support if you end up as POTUS because they've been working on it for years.

Also, Biden does not get a pass on his gaffes. His gaffes just aren't that bad. They're silly mistakes, not questioning war heroes or calling Mexicans rapists. When Biden puts his foot in his mouth it's clearly a mistake, the problem with Trump is he believes the madness he spouts.

Actually, Trumps stand on it is more akin to Elizabeth Warren's recent positions on student loans... and she got tons of publicity for it.

dwayneshintzy

How many on here actually have a vote?

I'll need to get my California registration changed to overseas, registered as a Democrat (primary in June 2016).

Amerika

dwayneshintzy wrote: »

How many on here actually have a vote?

I'll need to get my California registration changed to overseas, registered as a Democrat (primary in June 2016).

I have a vote.

And being as you’re a Democrat, I suggest you wait until November 2016 to change your registration.

Brian?

Amerika wrote: »

Actually, Trumps stand on it is more akin to Elizabeth Warren's recent positions on student loans... and she got tons of publicity for it.

I was using examples of presidential candidates and the current POTUS for a direct comparison to Trump. Elizabeth Warren has some fine ideas, I'm glad we agree on her.

Are you going to respond to the rest of my post?

Amerika

Brian? wrote: »

I was using examples of presidential candidates and the current POTUS for a direct comparison to Trump. Elizabeth Warren has some fine ideas, I'm glad we agree on her.

Are you going to respond to the rest of my post?

Actually, I believe we should cut down on the amount of student loans the government hands out, and they should only be given to those who show the ability to actually handle college and graduate. They give them out to anybody and everybody, regardless of whether the students can actually make it through college or the quality of their education, and their expected salaries upon graduation. Our school system have brainwashed students from early ages into believing they have no chance in this world unless they get a college education. Only 60% if college freshmen graduate. And the majority of that other 40% are saddled with tens of thousands of dollars in student debt… and no degree. In addition, the government student loan program is the leading culprit for the unprecedented increases in cost of a college education, with all that lovely guaranteed government backed money coming in. Cut down on the student loans and I bet you will see college costs decrease.

A daughter of mine it going to be a college freshman in August. She was accepted into all 9 colleges she applied, including Yale and Princeton. And received six figure scholarships from most. But the majority of those colleges would still have left her with six figure debt, even receiving six figure scholarships. So we weighed all the benefits of her desired program, the quality of the colleges, and the costs... and she chose to go to a state college which will provide 90% of her tuition and other costs through scholarships. She will be getting an excellent education (second best in the state after Carnegie Mellon in her desired program), and will be left with almost no student loan debt.



And answer what other? Joe Biden...

“If we do everything right, if we do it with absolute certainty, there's still a 30% chance we're going to get it wrong."

This is our Vice President? What do you think would have been the reaction of the media if Sarah Palin had said something like this?

Amerika

The first GOP debate on August 6th is being limited to 10 candidates. They will be decided by five unspecified national polls released by 5 pm on August 4th. I’m guessing the 10 will be Jeb Bush, Scott Walker, Marco Rubio, Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, Donald Trump, Ben Carson, Carly Fiornia, Rick Perry and Chris Christie. But a big push over the next two weeks could really shake up the debate as so many are really close to one another in the polls.

Brian?

Amerika wrote: »

The first GOP debate on August 6th is being limited to 10 candidates. They will be decided by five unspecified national polls released by 5 pm on August 4th. I’m guessing the 10 will be Jeb Bush, Scott Walker, Marco Rubio, Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, Donald Trump, Ben Carson, Carly Fiornia, Rick Perry and Chris Christie. But a big push over the next two weeks could really shake up the debate as so many are really close to one another in the polls.

I haven't seen any indication that Fiornia will make it ahead of Huckabee. What are you basing that on?

Amerika

Brian? wrote: »

I haven't seen any indication that Fiornia will make it ahead of Huckabee. What are you basing that on?

Fiornia has gotten much more publicity from the media than Huckabee. True, he appeals to the Evangelical Protestants, but I don't believe they're as powerful as they once had been, and I think they'll be splitting their votes between Huckabee, Cruz and Perry. And Huckabee no longer has much mass appeal.

And the fact she's the only GOP woman in the race.

Thargor

Is Christie considered out of the running now?

KingBrian2

nokia69 wrote: »

the Donald is going after the Saudis now

He is right to highlight the behaviour of the Saudi's.

Memnoch

Amerika wrote: »

I realize your post was meant tongue-in-cheek, but that viewpoint on Trump seems to have overtaken the mainstream media here in the states. The Donald Derangement Syndrome has become epidemic with them. I have seen barely any substantive reporting on his worthy ideas, and the media have focused primarily on his Joe Biden type propensity for sticking his foot in his mouth. And unfortunately, unlike Biden, Trump gets no pass on them.

Last week, Trump talked about the government student loan problem in an interview with The Hill. He criticized the federal government for earning a profit on the program. He stated “That’s probably one of the only things the government shouldn’t make money off -- I think it’s terrible that one of the only profit centers we have is student loans,” and stated, correctly, college students are “swimming in these loans.” He went on to say “I’ll see so many young people and they work really hard for four years… They borrowed money. Their parents don’t have much. They work all together and they mortgage their future.” And then they can’t find good jobs when they get out of college, which he plans to change.

Bold stuff if he can make a difference in the situation. But has anyone seen reporting on this?

Comparing trump and Biden is a false equivalence. Admittedly I'm not au fait with all of Biden's gaffes but there is a simple and key difference.

Biden has, from time to time, said some pretty stupid things. Trump however has said things recently that I consider heinous and deplorable.

ECO_Mental

KingBrian2 wrote: »

He is right to highlight the behaviour of the Saudi's.

I think the Saudis can do what they want with their oil. Them flooding the market ATM is actually f**k Ing the Russians. If they want to sell it high or low is up to them that's CAPITALISM, I think the Donald knows something about that.....?

Now if he wants to lecture the Saudis about their human rights behaviour eg slaves, women's rights, gays, treatment of foreign workers etc etc knock yourself out. But I don't think he did

MightyMandarin

Amerika wrote: »

Actually, I believe we should cut down on the amount of student loans the government hands out, and they should only be given to those who show the ability to actually handle college and graduate. They give them out to anybody and everybody, regardless of whether the students can actually make it through college or the quality of their education, and their expected salaries upon graduation. Our school system have brainwashed students from early ages into believing they have no chance in this world unless they get a college education. Only 60% if college freshmen graduate. And the majority of that other 40% are saddled with tens of thousands of dollars in student debt… and no degree. In addition, the government student loan program is the leading culprit for the unprecedented increases in cost of a college education, with all that lovely guaranteed government backed money coming in. Cut down on the student loans and I bet you will see college costs decrease.

While I agree with most of your post (shocking, I know:P) isn't the main culprit of rising costs of college education the colleges themselves? While a lot of public universities are struggling, private colleges are swimming in cash; the big name Ivy Leagues have billions in their endowment. So wouldn't the best solution be to figure out a way for the private colleges to cut down on their fees.

I know these colleges spend a lot on research, facilities and expensive lecturers, but as an Irish student whose annual fees are a measly €2750, it doesn't seem right that colleges in America charge fees of 50k a year but may only provide a slightly better standard of education. It just doesn't seem right that the vast majority of graduates will be paying off their loans for decades to come while colleges have billions in the bank.

InTheTrees

MightyMandarin wrote: »

It just doesn't seem right that the vast majority of graduates will be paying off their loans for decades to come while colleges have billions in the bank.

Welcome to America.

Just getting legislation passed guaranteeing students access to student loans was considered rampant socialism by the republicans.

I'll just throw out a random factoid, if you look up the highest paid pubic official in almost every state you'll find its the football coach at the major state university. not the Governor of the state, or the dean of the Uni.

alaimacerc

MightyMandarin wrote: »

While not many people like Hillary (including myself), a lot more people hate Trump, and wouldn't like choose Bush over another Clinton either.

One would think that if the Republicans had but the gumption to nominate a non-toxic centrist, they would be a shoo-in.

All indications are that said scenario isn't one we'll be troubled with.

Ludo

alaimacerc wrote: »

One would think that if the Republicans had but the gumption to nominate a non-toxic centrist, they would be a shoe-in.

All indications are that said scenario isn't one we'll be troubled with.

Such a creature no longer exists in the Republican party. The last one was probably John McCain before he ran for president. That non-toxicness had to be dropped during the primaries and he joined the loons.

Amerika

MightyMandarin wrote: »

While I agree with most of your post (shocking, I know:P) isn't the main culprit of rising costs of college education the colleges themselves? While a lot of public universities are struggling, private colleges are swimming in cash; the big name Ivy Leagues have billions in their endowment. So wouldn't the best solution be to figure out a way for the private colleges to cut down on their fees.

I know these colleges spend a lot on research, facilities and expensive lecturers, but as an Irish student whose annual fees are a measly €2750, it doesn't seem right that colleges in America charge fees of 50k a year but may only provide a slightly better standard of education. It just doesn't seem right that the vast majority of graduates will be paying off their loans for decades to come while colleges have billions in the bank.

The rampant growth of high salaried administration in colleges has also fueled the sudden high costs of college. But the availability of all this credit, in the form of student loans, is the main enabler of colleges charging ridiculous and excessive rates for their education.

You can’t put Ivy league colleges into the same class as other colleges. Yes the Ivy League’s have billions in their endowments, and my daughter would have had tuition paid from them at the two Ivy League schools she was accepted at, but it still leaves an annual bill of near $50,000 for other costs. Textbooks alone run about $1,250 per semester.

We did extensive searches of the quality of colleges in her field and costs, and picked a state school that is one of the highest rated in the country for producing educators.

And my daughter is smart going into the math field in education. In the US, there is a big push to get more educators in the Math and Science fields. In our state of Pennsylvania, population 12.7 million, we only graduate about 1,350 college math majors each year. Once she graduates and goes into teaching, either in elementary or secondary education for math, she has the ability to have 90& of her student loan debt forgiven by the government.

Amerika

InTheTrees wrote: »

I'll just throw out a random factoid, if you look up the highest paid pubic official in almost every state you'll find its the football coach at the major state university. not the Governor of the state, or the dean of the Uni.

This is true, but the football programs (and some colleges it's their basketball program) are one of the largest revenue producers for the colleges. Most college entire athletic programs are completely funded by the revenues brought in by their football programs. It makes sense that they pay their coach a high salary if he is able to bring in some of the top recruits and produces winning seasons which keeps the stands filled and the TV money rolling in.

Amerika

alaimacerc wrote: »

One would think that if the Republicans had but the gumption to nominate a non-toxic centrist, they would be a shoo-in.

All indications are that said scenario isn't one we'll be troubled with.

They do in Jeb Bush. It doesn't mean squat.

Amerika

Thargor wrote: »

Is Christie considered out of the running now?

He’s barely treading water. The trumped up, and false, Bridgegate scandal orchestrated by Democrats achieved it’s goal and just about killed his chances at the presidency. Democrats don’t like him, and Republicans don’t like what he has done with New Jersey’s fiscal matters. He might not even poll well enough to get into the first GOP debate.

Overheal

Amerika wrote: »

Actually, I believe we should cut down on the amount of student loans the government hands out, and they should only be given to those who show the ability to actually handle college and graduate. They give them out to anybody and everybody, regardless of whether the students can actually make it through college or the quality of their education, and their expected salaries upon graduation.

When was the last time you ever involved yourself in the student loan system?derp FAFSA already incorporates completion and graduation rates into its operations, and quality is most certainly considered - look into the Corinthian Colleges situation, where lack of quality education shut out those schools. Either way, there is no fortune-teller that can say Billy will graduate but Jennifer won't, all they can see are two 18 year old kids with decent high school grades.

Our school system have brainwashed students from early ages into believing they have no chance in this world unless they get a college education. Only 60% if college freshmen graduate. And the majority of that other 40% are saddled with tens of thousands of dollars in student debt… and no degree. In addition, the government student loan program is the leading culprit for the unprecedented increases in cost of a college education, with all that lovely guaranteed government backed money coming in. Cut down on the student loans and I bet you will see college costs decrease.

Its not that you have no chance without college, and indeed most people I know who are happy healthy and have families do not have college degrees. I don't think this "brainwashing" claim is at all accurate; what is accurate to say is that metadata confirms that those with college degrees make on average more lifetime earnings, etc., than people without a college degree.

A daughter of mine it going to be a college freshman in August. She was accepted into all 9 colleges she applied, including Yale and Princeton. And received six figure scholarships from most. But the majority of those colleges would still have left her with six figure debt, even receiving six figure scholarships. So we weighed all the benefits of her desired program, the quality of the colleges, and the costs... and she chose to go to a state college which will provide 90% of her tuition and other costs through scholarships. She will be getting an excellent education (second best in the state after Carnegie Mellon in her desired program), and will be left with almost no student loan debt.

OK. That only demonstrates its possible to choose a more affordable education.

And answer what other? Joe Biden...

“If we do everything right, if we do it with absolute certainty, there's still a 30% chance we're going to get it wrong."

This is our Vice President? What do you think would have been the reaction of the media if Sarah Palin had said something like this?

Does it matter? What if Mark Twain, Einstein, DeGrasse Tyson, Bill Nye, or Elmo had said it?

At the end of the day, do you really, really care, what the media thinks?

Overheal

Amerika wrote: »

This is true, but the football programs (and some colleges it's their basketball program) are one of the largest revenue producers for the colleges. Most college entire athletic programs are completely funded by the revenues brought in by their football programs. It makes sense that they pay their coach a high salary if he is able to bring in some of the top recruits and produces winning seasons which keeps the stands filled and the TV money rolling in.

And none of that money goes to the players. They get a half baked athletic-student's education, a meal plan, and a room. Meanwhile for example our stadium gets some sort of renovation, it appears, annually. And they recently voted that freshmen enrolling in 2016 will have some tuition costs siphoned into the athletic program, so that buggers that argument as far as I'm concerned that its totally off the books.

Amerika

Overheal wrote: »

And none of that money goes to the players. They get a half baked athletic-student's education, a meal plan, and a room. Meanwhile for example our stadium gets some sort of renovation, it appears, annually. And they recently voted that freshmen enrolling in 2016 will have some tuition costs siphoned into the athletic program, so that buggers that argument as far as I'm concerned that its totally off the books.

They could always just start a Triple A program for NFL teams, eh? It will never work. College football in engrained in our psyche. It’s as American as apple pie. That would be like asking Europeans to give up that other boring football thing they call soccer. I think the college football system works just fine and why not have some tuition cost siphoned into the athletic program? What would the players have in life if it were not for their football scholarships, regardless if they graduate or not?