Prime Time on state of Dublin City Center tomorrow night

alastair

January wrote: »

Want to give us a source for these figures?

The exact same source the Herald op-ed journo referenced (but obviously didn't actually read).
http://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/rc/recordedcrimequarter12014/#.VEfKuIfBp0E

alastair

Kermit.de.frog

Open your eyes.

It's people like you being apologetic for the state of the city center and the characters in it that is stopping what needs to be done.

Proper policing, closure of clinics, new licensing laws and a major crackdown on dealers is needed right now. Not next week, not next year - now.

You seem to think we all stupid, afraid or fragile.

The fact is your standards for our city are shockingly low that you deem the place to be acceptable.

Stop apologising for this mess and support action to fix it.

The majority here clearly see that we have a major problem with anti social behaviour and low level criminality in the city center.

wiseoldelf34

Seen the best thing I've seen in a while today on abbey street .two lads in an out and out fist fight .no pulling knives or bottles .made me yearn for a simpler time

alastair

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Open your eyes.

My eyes are wide open - and strangely enough, my experience tallies with the actual crime figures, unlike the scaremongers and advocates of CCTV's every 20 metres :rolleyes:

alastair

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

The majority here clearly see that we have a major problem with anti social behaviour and low level criminality in the city center.

Would that be the manner of 'majority' that is comparable with the 'alarming increase' in crime, referenced by the Herald?

Kermit.de.frog

alastair wrote: »

My eyes are wide open - and strangely enough, my experience tallies with the actual crime figures, unlike the scaremongers and advocates of CCTV's every 20 metres :rolleyes:

You are not living in the same city as the rest of us are living in.

To think that anyone would say the center of our capital city is policed properly is ludicrous.

Kermit.de.frog

wiseoldelf34 wrote: »

Seen the best thing I've seen in a while today on abbey street .two lads in an out and out fist fight .no pulling knives or bottles .made me yearn for a simpler time

This is perfectly ok according to alastair. It happens on a daily basis on the royal mile in London and the Champs de Elysee in Paris.

alastair

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

You are not living in the same city as the rest of us are living in.

Ehh - you don't live in the city. I do. I think I'll trust my own real-world impressions more than your uninformed rants, cheers.

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

To think that anyone would say the center of our capital city is policed properly is ludicrous.

Yeah - what it needs is a camera every 20 metres, right? :P

drumswan

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Open your eyes.

It's people like you being apologetic for the state of the city center and the characters in it that is stopping what needs to be done.

Proper policing, closure of clinics, new licensing laws and a major crackdown on dealers is needed right now. Not next week, not next year - now.

You seem to think we all stupid, afraid or fragile.

The fact is your standards for our city are shockingly low that you deem the place to be acceptable.

Stop apologising for this mess and support action to fix it.

The majority here clearly see that we have a major problem with anti social behaviour and low level criminality in the city center.

Someone painted a mural for you Kermit



I took that when I was outside after dark, woooo scary

alastair

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

It happens on a daily basis on the royal mile in London.

I think that's Edinburgh you're thinking of. I've lived in London btw, and it's got higher crime rates than Dublin - still a great city all the same.

alastair

drumswan wrote: »

Someone painted a mural for you Kermit



I took that when I was outside after dark, woooo scary

It's okay - the lane has a CCTV.

griffdaddy

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

new licensing laws

Out of interest, what do you think should be changed in our licensing laws? They're about as draconian as they can get as is

drumswan

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

You are not living in the same city as the rest of us are living in.

No harm to be honest, yours sound dreadful and full of crippling paranoia. I, on the other hand, am off out for a nice pint this fine evening. As the light declines.

Dionysius2

People who say that the dopey ones and the lowlifes who hang around Dublin City Centre's street corners should be subjected to more rigorous action by our authorities. That's an interesting way of viewing the problem and in an ideal world would be worth taking seriously but this is not an ideal world. Let's just look at the categories of those involved and how effective they may be.

The Gardai - what is their contribution ?

Well, they enforce the drug laws, patrol the streets, investigate crime of all kinds, make arrests, bring prosecutions, try to maintain social order, present cases in court, bring the offenders to prison if sentenced, operate the Juvenile liaison system, deliver drug talks, lectures, advice to the public. Interestingly, they also keep the prisons full via the high arrest levels (and the prisons are full ! ).
But, I hear some say : ' all that is all very well but it's not working......these wasters need to be thrashed a bit more than they are. They are still doing the bad stuff and need to be stopped......they will have to be thrashed with more vigour because they haven't learned to respect the rest of us '.
Longer sentences ? Tougher prison regimes ? Cut off the dole ? Reduce the methadone ? Close the hostels that tend to facilitate the derelicts who 'have nowhere else to go' ?...... ......Anybody see any of that stuff as a solution ?

The Corporation.....why don't they do more ?

Like what ? Provide more social housing ? Sweep up the needles with greater frequency ? Obliterate more graffiti !

The Hospitals ? Now take Saturday nights in any On-Call hospital on a weekend night.
Well, that situation is just beyond description so I won't go there except to say: 'that way to the crocodiles !'.

And good luck to anyone who thinks that by toughening up sanctionwise via any of these agencies that improvements can be achieved in the social order in Dublin's City Centre. Ordinary working folk find it hard to tolerate druggies who are after all sick by their own doings. It's a self induced illness and predicament which the rest of us are supposed to pickup the tab for without option via our taxes.


Sanctions have their place in maintaining social order and work best with those who already respect others and see themselves as having a stake in life. But sanctions don't work with those who feel excluded and never have nor do I have a solution to suggest.
What I am trying to get across is that sanctions don't work with the Irish. We have a high percentage of marginalised people who, for whatever reason (and there are innumerable reasons) choose to live on the wild side and nothing will change that.

Kermit.de.frog

It's easier to just have actual zero tolerance for loitering with menacing intent, dealing, drug taking and anti social behaviour.

Sunnyisland

Home in Ireland the last two weeks, have been up and down o Connell st, Henry street capel street,many times , The only thing bothering me was the bloody rain, quite enjoyed the walk around and so did most people by the look of them...

Jumboman

alastair wrote: »

Fairly typical tabloid hyperbole.

There's no no-go areas in the city.

The 'alarming increase' in the annual crime figures they reference is a shocking fall of 6.1% for Attempts or threats to murder, assaults, harassments and related offences, and a fall of 1.4% in Burglary and related offences. Public order offences are down by 14.8%. Admittedly, Theft and related offences are up - but by 2.5%. Hardly alarming stuff.

Innocent people continue to walk the streets of the city - day and night, and, for the most part, without any fear for their safety.

I would take the crime figures with a pinch of salt. Most crime never even gets reported especially low level crime like when a Scumbag on O'Connell street threatened to "smash my face in" I never reported that to the gardai because it wasn't worth the hassle.

Alot of people would think its pointless to report low level crime to the police. So those sort of crimes never end up in the figures.

alastair

Jumboman wrote: »

I would take the crime figures with a pinch of salt. Most crime never even gets reported especially low level crime like when a Scumbag on O'Connell street threatened to "smash my face in" I never reported that to the gardai because it wasn't worth the hassle.

Alot of people would think its pointless to report low level crime to the police. So those sort of crimes never end up in the figures.

I'll place a bit more faith in actual compiled crime figures than forum randomner's anecdotes. Bottom line is the official crime rates are down, rather than up, as advertised.

What above 'crime' exactly is you believe you didn't report, as a matter of interest?

Jumboman

alastair wrote: »

What above 'crime' exactly is you believe you didn't report, as a matter of interest?

A Scumbag threatened to beat me up on O'Connell Street because I wouldnt give him a cigarette.

Jumboman

TheNog wrote: »

There is simply not Gardai working at any particular time that would make your idea work. Right now Garda numbers are actually below 13,000 of which the last commissioner stated he could not guarantee a proper/effective policing service below that number.

In the Indo article one eye witness stated no Gardai came for about 15 minutes. Unless this is backed up by CCTV it is most likely not correct. Witness testimony can be seriously flawed if relying on memory only. From experience it would probably have been more like 5-10 minute wait.

Some ex politicians get 24 hour garda protection. Yet they can't put a 24 hour garda presence on our countries main street but they are able to give politicians round the clock garda protection.

Peter Anthony

drumswan and Alastair the Fine Gael member still with their head in the sand. Sad really, they've ruined this thread with their bias.

Peter Anthony

Jumboman wrote: »

A Scumbag threatened to beat me up on O'Connell Street because I wouldnt give him a cigarette.

Didnt you know? Crimes don't count if they aren't in Fine Gaels released figures or if Alastair didn't see them.

All I'll say is Alastair must be one very lucky man, but I think its more likely he rarely sets foot in Dublin City centre, and is posting from his pad in Rathmines that Daddy paid for.

drumswan

Its sad the way some people choose to live their lives, projecting their fears and negativity onto the world around them, blaming their surroundings for their own miserable outlook and failures in life. Nothing is their fault; its the government, the police, poor people, rich people, druggies, the elites to blame. Whoever.

They say visitor numbers are falling due to some perceived crime-wave, show them that the opposite is true and visitor numbers are rising - they ignore it. Show them endless positive media and travel pieces about the city - fingers in the ears, lalala junkies, something, tracksuits. They say inward investment is falling, show them it is actually rising - they ignore it. They say crime is rising to the point it is out of control - show them it is actually falling - yep, they ignore that too, because it doesnt fit with the narrative in their heads. Say there is a policing issue on a handful of streets in the north city that needs to be addressed, well they'll ignore that too because that solution is too easy and they need somebody or something to blame.

The internet is unfortunately full of cranks and weirdos and its hard not to feel sorry for some of the people posting on this thread. Luckily for the rest of us who live in the real world, the city is a vibrant place full of people having an absolute ball and loving the fact that they live here. Ive been lucky enough to live in some great cities, none of which are without their problems - being cities and all, but Dublin trumps the lot.

SameDiff

drumswan wrote: »

Ive been lucky enough to live in some great cities, none of which are without their problems - being cities and all, but Dublin trumps the lot.

I'd love to know which cities Dublin has "trumped".

Even grim old Manchester is better.

Don't kid yourself pal.

Esel

SameDiff wrote: »

I'd love to know which cities Dublin has "trumped".

Even grim old Manchester is better.

Don't kid yourself pal.

Welcome to Boards, Pal - if that is your real name...

FreudianSlippers

alastair wrote: »

My eyes are wide open - and strangely enough, my experience tallies with the actual crime figures, unlike the scaremongers and advocates of CCTV's every 20 metres :rolleyes:

There is a serious flaw in your logic though. Firstly, those are reported crime figures - the fact that one of the complaints is a lack of Gardaí on the street would result in fewer crimes detected/reported. Secondly, incidents like the fistfight above and the aggressive begging, etc. would not necessarily be reported.

drumswan

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

There is a serious flaw in your logic though. Firstly, those are reported crime figures - the fact that one of the complaints is a lack of Gardaí on the street would result in fewer crimes detected/reported. Secondly, incidents like the fistfight above and the aggressive begging, etc. would not necessarily be reported.

Good point.

Why arent they being reported?

And what are the whingers here actually doing to improve the flaws they perceive in the city?

My guess is nothing but moaning on the internet.

Pobb

I've lived in Dublin all my life and walk about 30 km a week between the two canals and I can genuinely say I have never felt threatened in the city. That's because I don't assume that everyone in a tracksuit poses the same threat level as an ebola carrier or that everyone with a strong Dublin accent is carrying a screwdriver up their sleeve.

If you want to convince yourself that Dublin is a dangerous city, keep reading the moral panic on Boards or in the Herald. If you want to live a happy, peaceful life in Dublin - just go ahead and do it like most other folk do.

alastair

Jumboman wrote: »

A Scumbag threatened to beat me up on O'Connell Street because I wouldnt give him a cigarette.

And what crime would that be? Were you beaten up? Did you give him/her a ciggy?