Arsenal Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014/15

wawaman

Soups123 wrote: »

What makes you say that I hope your right

Unfortunately the guy that posted it said on Twitter that they were arsenal fans. Like others have said I think wengers time is up but he deserves a hell of a lot more respect than that

Pierce_1991

I'd say it was a long train journey home for everyone involved in the team.

Harry Palmr

efb wrote: »

Don't sound like London accents???

Really? That's as Larndarn as you can get. I bet most of then live under the Westway.

purplepanda

Both sides of the wenger debate are getting more abusive & volatile, this has been getting steadily worse over the last two years, with confrontations amongst fans in & around grounds. I think it's getting to the stage of a fans civil war.

The club allowing pro Wenger banners & slogans inside the stadium whilst prohibiting anti Wenger material just adds more fuel to the fire, as does Peter Hill Woods unwise words last week.

Whatever the future holds, this current confrontation could end up leaving a lot of bitterness amongst club & supporters.

I will add that other supporters & media pundits calling Arsenal fans fickle is way off the truth. Perhaps they should look at other clubs supporters hounding club owners & demanding managers be sacked before their first season even ends.

It's taken Arsenal supporters a long time to even demand change in comparison to many others. :pac:

emergingstar

emergingstar wrote: »

Critise all they want, want change all the want

Abusing a man in public is not on I don't care what the situation is, it's not on and it's not acceptable

I dont agree with the abuse either but i cannot understand why Arsene is making his position alot harder than it needs to be either. Its beyond farcial. Tactically inept, and in case he was short on numbers he sold Vermaelen and let Jenkinson off on loan and brought in no one.

tayto lover

Deleted User wrote: »

I dont agree with the abuse either but i cannot understand why Arsene is making his position alot harder than it needs to be either. Its beyond farcial. Tactically inept, and in case he was short on numbers he sold Vermaelen and let Jenkinson off on loan and brought in no one.

For the last number of years he's been sawing the branch he's sitting on.
Can't understand it either.

purplepanda

purplepanda wrote: »

Both sides of the wenger debate are getting more abusive & volatile, this has been getting steadily worse over the last two years, with confrontations amongst fans in & around grounds. I think it's getting to the stage of a fans civil war.

The club allowing pro Wenger banners & slogans inside the stadium whilst prohibiting anti Wenger material just adds more fuel to the fire, as does Peter Hill Woods unwise words last week.

Whatever the future holds, this current confrontation could end up leaving a lot of bitterness amongst club & supporters.

I will add that other supporters & media pundits calling Arsenal fans fickle is way off the truth. Perhaps they should look at other clubs supporters hounding club owners & demanding managers be sacked before their first season even ends.

It's taken Arsenal supporters a long time to even demand change in comparison to many others. :pac:

I personally think Peter Hill-wood is a priveleged snob. Is not and never was a true football man and if flowers were microphones, he'd gave all day in the garden.

efb

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Really? That's as Larndarn as you can get. I bet most of then live under the Westway.

To me that accent seemed northern

wonga77

Deleted User wrote: »

I personally think Peter Hill-wood is a priveleged snob. Is not and never was a true football man and if flowers were microphones, he'd gave all day in the garden.

Absolutely, not in touch with the common fan at all

wonga77

wonga77 wrote: »

Absolutely, not in touch with the common fan at all

A pretentious idiot to be quite honest. Like all that social class across the pond, they smell their own farts they are so fond of themselves.

wonga77

Just watching motd there running through the goal of the month thingy, still sickens me to see rvp in a Utd shirt.

jonneymendoza

Yea it was sad to see that and thats coming from a guy who wants wenger out

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7XKJSd4cpQ&app=desktop

gosplan

Deleted User wrote: »

I dont agree with the abuse either but i cannot understand why Arsene is making his position alot harder than it needs to be either. Its beyond farcial. Tactically inept, and in case he was short on numbers he sold Vermaelen and let Jenkinson off on loan and brought in no one.

Verm I can get cause of the money. Jenks I just don't get.

Last year we had seven players for four defensive positions.

That's the closest we've cone to being adequately stocked there in a decade. And unsurprisingly we had our best defensive season in ages.

So what does Wenger do? 3 out and 2 in.

I get that maybe Jenks was going because Chambers is new no2 RB but then he effectively let our 3rd and 4th choice CBs go and signed no-one for those positions.

I still love Wenger, it's sad and the abuse is terrible but he brings it on himself.

jank

Deleted User wrote: »

A pretentious idiot to be quite honest. Like all that social class across the pond, they smell their own farts they are so fond of themselves.

Whatever about the abilities of the Chairman I don't see what class as to do with it.

To me the match can be summed up when Adams rugby tackled Sanchez. Nobody in the team stood up for him. Do you think Adams or Vieira would have let that pass? They would have murdered him even if he tried. It was similar last year when Arteta was pushed around at Everton.

Team is just soft, sad to say. People can have a go and not be afraid to.

jank

jank wrote: »

Whatever about the abilities of the Chairman I don't see what class as to do with it.

To me the match can be summed up when Adams rugby tackled Sanchez. Nobody in the team stood up for him. Do you think Adams or Vieira would have let that pass? They would have murdered him even if he tried. It was similar last year when Arteta was pushed around at Everton.

Team is just soft, sad to say. People can have a go and not be afraid to.

Lets face it the manager is tactically clueless too. If you didnt know what he has actually achieved in football and watched the continous mistakes that are being made week in week out you would say that he is an awful buffoon. People are gentle on him for what he has achieved over a decade ago but its becoming more and more of an irrelevance with each passing game.

gosplan

Deleted User wrote: »

Lets face it the manager is tactically clueless too. If you didnt know what he has actually achieved in football and watched the continous mistakes that are being made week in week out you would say that he is an awful buffoon. People are gentle on him for what he has achieved over a decade ago but its becoming more and more of an irrelevance with each passing game.

He's not tactically clueless.

Well he might be but that's the wrong way to phrase it.

He believes in off the cuff 'jazz' football. It's all about patterns and flow, not tactics.

It's why we only play one way, why we don't rehearse set pieces, why he insists on buying few players and bedding them in over time, why we can totally lose our heads and look clueless.

He really does have a purists philosophy on the game and he sticks by it.

In a way that's to be admired.

We need much more quality if it's going to work for him though.

shano_88

Disgraceful treatment of the man. Fair enough if you dont want him to manage the football club anymore but seriously Wenger has done so much for the club and deserves way more than this.

symbolic

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Lets face it the manager is tactically clueless too.

That's not the case though is it? Is just how he believes the game should be played. Haven't got the quotes to hand. But there are some quotes about it in Bergkamps book. To be honest is the reason I started watching Arsenal. I'd love to see him get another league title. Maybe ye are right though and he won't ever manage it again.

I just think clueless and incompetent are things said in the forum here that shouldn't be. As everyone enjoyed his approach when it brought titles. Although maybe people always thought he was clueless and incompetent?

gosplan

gosplan wrote: »

He's not tactically clueless.

Well he might be but that's the wrong way to phrase it.

He believes in off the cuff 'jazz' football. It's all about patterns and flow, not tactics.

It's why we only play one way, why we don't rehearse set pieces, why he insists on buying few players and bedding them in over time, why we can totally lose our heads and look clueless.

He really does have a purists philosophy on the game and he sticks by it.

In a way that's to be admired.

We need much more quality if it's going to work for him though.

All very well and good being noble but his style of football is suicidal from a defensive point of view. Mertesacker getting continously caught up the field despite having no pace. There is one of two answers as to why we continue to make the same defensive errors. He is either tactically clueless or is being ignored by his own players.

Long ball merchants often get criticised for simplistic football but at least it is played with some purpose. 60 passes into cul de sacs is every bit as boring as aimless pumping it long. We are guilty time and again of no urgency.

I dont agree with any personal abuse Wenger is getting but im not going to let the abuse he is gettng interfere with my honest opinion of where he currently stands. Arsenal need a change, i dont know who that man is but things cannot simply go on as they are. Its painful to watch.
Had we not got Alexis Sanchez in our team this year then we would be really struggling at the bottom end of the table.

I had a horrible feeling that not bringing a replacement in for Vermaelen would come back to haunt us and so my worst fears seem to be coming into fruition. Wenger loyalists need to get over their stockholm syndrome and admit how it really is. He is now spending more money and still managing to make a cat malojan out of it. Time up and thats the harsh reality.

symbolic

symbolic wrote: »

That's not the case though is it? Is just how he believes the game should be played. Haven't got the quotes to hand. But there are some quotes about it in Bergkamps book. To be honest is the reason I started watching Arsenal. I'd love to see him get another league title. Maybe ye are right though and he won't ever manage it again.

I just think clueless and incompetent are things said in the forum here that shouldn't be. As everyone enjoyed his approach when it brought titles. Although maybe people always thought he was clueless and incompetent?

Last season
6-3 at City
5-1 at Anfield
6-0 at Chelsea

This season
Beaten 2-0 at Chelsea
Beaten at Swansea
Man Utd beat us handy despite having few shots on target
Embarrassed for a large part at Stoke.

Then of course we had the many brusing defeats to the big teams. Enough is enough

symbolic

Actually here is the quote:

As Arsene Wenger explains: ‘The football I like is of a high technical level, based on movement and on team play with a build-up from the back. Why do I like that? Because I just think the game is created to give everybody a chance to express what it is in him, and not to be just a servant for everybody else.’ To Wenger, that’s the moral difference with defensive football. ‘What brings you to the game is the pleasure to play. And just because you are professional doesn’t mean you should get away from that pleasure of playing. It’s all just based on the positive philosophy of the human being and the right to express who you are.’ ☺

Wengers teams in recent years if anything look seriously restricted in attack and incredibly naive in defence

K4t

symbolic wrote: »

Actually here is the quote:

As Arsene Wenger explains: ‘The football I like is of a high technical level, based on movement and on team play with a build-up from the back. Why do I like that? Because I just think the game is created to give everybody a chance to express what it is in him, and not to be just a servant for everybody else.’ To Wenger, that’s the moral difference with defensive football. ‘What brings you to the game is the pleasure to play. And just because you are professional doesn’t mean you should get away from that pleasure of playing. It’s all just based on the positive philosophy of the human being and the right to express who you are.’ ☺

The difference in ability between the players he has and most other premier league teams, nevermind the top 4, is not wide enough to allow them to play the way he envisions them to. Wilshire is also a massive loss as he can control a game and would have done so at Stoke, unlike Cazorla and Ramsay who were bullied out of the first half where the damage was done.

Also, why he didn't start Welbeck against Stoke is mind boggling, he visibly changed the game when he came on and had Shawcross unsettled throughout the second half. Chamberlain was bemoaning Giroud not tracking back early in the first half which is not a good sign at the Britannia, and Welbeck would have offered more with his pace and defensive work as well as providing much needed support to Giroud.

Wenger has a talented, young and hungry team there but he needs to accept that whatever he's trying to do at the moment simply is not working. Stoke were better than Arsenal in only one way on Saturday, as a team.

12gauge dave

When will this pathetic zonal marking stop aswell lads there has been countless times its cost us goals. Its a shambles on so many levels there is so much change needed its frightening

emergingstar

Saying a manager that had won legaue titles and fa cups, and brought s team through a season unbeaten

Calling him clueless is silly

Ed Winchester

That video of the fans booing Wenger at the train station is just awful. Brain dead morons.

No matter how bad things are are might get, he'll never deserve that treatment.

greendom

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Wengers teams in recent years if anything look seriously restricted in attack and incredibly naive in defence

At times, mostly they.have looked more than competent at both

jonneymendoza

emergingstar wrote: »

Saying a manager that had won legaue titles and fa cups, and brought s team through a season unbeaten

Calling him clueless is silly

But he is clueless NOW At present

efb

jonneymendoza wrote: »

But he is clueless NOW At present

Clueless gets to the KO stages of the UCL???

bad2dabone

It feels like the club is in a bad way on and off the pitch. Fans split, players dreadfully out of form, squad greatly lacking in key areas, and owner who doesn't care once CL revenue is coming in, a board in thrall to the manager, a manager who is sadly dismantling his legacy before our eyes.
Depressing.

jonneymendoza

efb wrote: »

Clueless gets to the KO stages of the UCL???

Di matteo won a CL. #justSaying

Colonialboy

So now that we know what the problems are ...
whats the plan.

Bring back some on-loan players. Why is jenkinson at West ham who are now to some degree blocking us from taking 4th spot.
Anyone out of form or not performing gets dropped.
Up the ante in training, if your not doing it in training then .
Fire a few coaches, particularily conditioning coaches, and maybe even Bould whos responsible for defending.
Buy a few proven PL players, someone who can do a job required in the PL as cover for our crocks, as competition for places and to shake up the general apathy.

He better do something...
Im most angry cos the issues have been apparent for 4-5 years... yes Wengerites... some of us saw these issues 4-5 years ago.
His solutions arent working and havent been working for 4-5 years.

Wenger has a choice .. stick to his guns and ultimately fail, and then his legacy for the last 8 years in Arsenal will always be tarnished that he didnt realise the light ahead on the tracks was a train heading his way and he didnt change.
At least if he makes some changes, it may work and his legacy will be of someone who went his way was very successful, kept to his guns and started to fail but then he changed and .... who know what might happen...

efb

jonneymendoza wrote: »

Di matteo won a CL. #justSaying

He won the last matches with a very expensively assembled team #justclarifying

Quazzie

efb wrote: »

He won the last matches with a very expensively assembled team #justclarifying

So he won the games Wenger couldn't.

I hears ya

efb

Quazzie wrote: »

So he won the games Wenger couldn't.

I hears ya

Wenger only couldn't win the final to an outstanding Barceloba team playing 10 men for 80 minutes

Colonialboy

efb wrote: »

He won the last matches with a very expensively assembled team #justclarifying

Stoke wage bill for last year was 60M
Arsenals wage bill was 154M ... and this year we are set to overtake Chelsea...
Stoke remember them, they were the ones who were 3-0 up at HT a few days ago and should have been 4-0 up but for a bad linesman... #justclarifying

efb

Colonialboy wrote: »

Stoke wage bill for last year was 60M
Arsenals wage bill was 154M ... and this year we are set to overtake Chelsea...
Stoke remember them, they were the ones who were 3-0 up at HT a few days ago and should have been 4-0 up but for a bad linesman... #justclarifying

And where have Stoke finished? How have they done in the last 10 years? 1 result doesn't make a success or failure

jonneymendoza

efb wrote: »

He won the last matches with a very expensively assembled team #justclarifying

Wenger struggled to beat a piss poor galatasary team and the mightly Anderlect
#justclarifying

Both teams not even Premier league standard mate. Almost any team in the EPL would have qualfied

Talk to me when Wenger managed to beat a top side and no dortmound who are in the bottom 3 of there domestic league doesnt count.

efb

jonneymendoza wrote: »

Wenger struggled to beat a piss poor galatasary team and the mightly Anderlect
#justclarifying

Both teams not even Premier league standard mate. Almost any team in the EPL would have qualfied

Talk to me when Wenger managed to beat a top side and no dortmound who are in the bottom 3 of there domestic league doesnt count.

Really? Any team? I think that's being disingenuous- City and Liverpool arnt faring very well and Liverpool have only one team better than ours

Ken Shamrock

Let's give the hash tag sh1t a rest. Here watch these funny videos instead

jonneymendoza

His way of playing football is not working for many reasons. its not as if it cant work.

Ken Shamrock

I like his philosophy a lot. But he should know more than anyone that in order to play that way you need certain personal that we don't have atm and haven't had since around 2005. I personally think it should be a lot more structured rather tan the free flowing "jazz" style because once something goes wrong it seems that's that.

Now I have to say as shockingly bad as the first halve was on Sat he obviously changed things up for the 2nd halve and the team showed some fight but it would of course be better to try and negate the threat rather than trying to fix it when the damage has been done

Jaafa

Bitta perspective lads, based on the equivalent fixtures last season we're currently sitting -7 point worse off. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1LFMxGrGfj5sGWITJwGfyeNGDru8h05lB2q_q69xY2Uo/edit

So yes its bad, but not by an unfixable margin. Even more interestingly are last years top 7 teams point equivalences.

Team Diff
Chelsea +6
Man C +4
Sp*rs -2
Arsenal -7
Man U -7
Liverpool -9
Everton -11

Most are doing worse, Man C and Chelsea slightly better. Of course playing form comes into it too, in which we've undeniably been much worse but I thought this was interesting to see all the same.

efb

Jaafa wrote: »

Bitta perspective lads, based on the equivalent fixtures last season we're currently sitting -7 point worse off. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1LFMxGrGfj5sGWITJwGfyeNGDru8h05lB2q_q69xY2Uo/edit

So yes its bad, but not by an unfixable margin. Even more interestingly are last years top 7 teams point equivalences.

Team Diff
Chelsea +6
Man C +4
Sp*rs -2
Arsenal -7
Man U -7
Liverpool -9
Everton -11

Most are doing worse, Man C and Chelsea slightly better. Of course playing form comes into it too, in which we've undeniably been much worse but I thought this was interesting to see all the same.

Logic and reasoning on the arsenal thread :O

byrneg28

Whens the last time Arsenal impressed you in a performance?

Probably vs. Norwich at home last October.

Jaafa

Jaafa wrote: »

Bitta perspective lads, based on the equivalent fixtures last season we're currently sitting -7 point worse off. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1LFMxGrGfj5sGWITJwGfyeNGDru8h05lB2q_q69xY2Uo/edit

Yeah -7. To get back to 0 before the end of the season we have to get 56/69 points for the rest of the season. Including away matches to City, United, Southampton, Spurs, Liverpool, West Ham(!), Newcastle etc. At the start of the season I was told the uptick in points the last few seasons was evidence of progress, that'll change now. :rolleyes:

So yes its bad, but not by an unfixable margin. Even more interestingly are last years top 7 teams point equivalences.

Team Diff
Chelsea +6
Man C +4
Sp*rs -2
Arsenal -7
Man U -7
Liverpool -9
Everton -11

Most are doing worse, Man C and Chelsea slightly better. Of course playing form comes into it too, in which we've undeniably been much worse but I thought this was interesting to see all the same.

The only saving grace is other teams' form. And being +6 points after 15 matches for a team who finished 4 points off the top last season isn't "slightly better".
United may not have a great points total so far but anyone who's watched them lately and isn't blind will see that they're on their way to gaining proper form. Realistically our competition for the rest of the season is Southampton for 4th.

Jaafa

Deleted User wrote: »

Yeah -7. To get back to 0 before the end of the season we have to get 56/69 points for the rest of the season. Including away matches to City, United, Southampton, Spurs, Liverpool, West Ham(!), Newcastle etc. At the start of the season I was told the uptick in points the last few seasons was evidence of progress, that'll change now. :rolleyes:
.

A tall task for sure but still not impossible. In 2012/2013 we took 52/69 at the same point in that season. I feel our squad when mostly available is stronger than then too so I think we can do it. Of course that still wouldn't win us the league but 2/3rd and being only 5/6 points off top is ok given the ridiculousness of Chelsea's season so far.

I'm being very optimistic I know (delusional you probably say) but f!uck it thats the only way I can enjoy this whole thing. :P

byrneg28

Deleted User wrote: »

Yeah -7. To get back to 0 before the end of the season we have to get 56/69 points for the rest of the season. Including away matches to City, United, Southampton, Spurs, Liverpool, West Ham(!), Newcastle etc. At the start of the season I was told the uptick in points the last few seasons was evidence of progress, that'll change now. :rolleyes:


The only saving grace is other teams' form. And being +6 points after 15 matches for a team who finished 4 points off the top last season isn't "slightly better".
United may not have a great points total so far but anyone who's watched them lately and isn't blind will see that they're on their way to gaining proper form. Realistically our competition for the rest of the season is Southampton for 4th.

Im not disagreeing. I do think we'll be fighting for 4th.

I just don't think it will be Southampton, they'll be brought down to earth fairly soon.

All that would still only bring us up to 79 points. I'd be amazed if that was good enough for 2nd. And I'm sorry but talking about getting 2nd/3rd and be just a couple of points off the top at the end of the season is pretty delusional.

Lahinchians

Just read that sanchez and kos are defo out for the gala game. Good to hear!