Arsenal Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014/15

Alfred Borden

kellso81 wrote: »

I'm sorry gringo, I don't mean to sound offensive but that's insane

Gotta agree here, need to just focus on getting into the top 4 which is our level sadly.

Mickeroo

Numbers wise I think we're one short in defence, two at a push. We do have a strong squad in fairness though, just not much you can do about thees injuries.

Soups123

Gringo180 wrote: »

I think we will be 2nd by Christmas. I know its outrageous to try and predict but we have a nice run of league fixtures coming up. 2 or 3 wins on the trot and with Walcott to come back will give this team massive confidence. If we can stay within 4-6 points of the leaders coming into the new year we have a huge chance, especially with Ozil, Debuchy and Giroud due back around that time.

Being top 2 at Christmas is not beyond possible but being within 4-6pts of Chelsea is.

Everything after that in your post is very very very very optimistic

greendom

Soups123 wrote: »

Being top 2 at Christmas is not beyond possible but being within 4-6pts of Chelsea is.

Everything after that in your post is very very very very optimistic

A nice counter-balance to all the pessimism round here.

extra gravy

greendom wrote: »

A nice counter-balance to all the realism round here.

FYP

Gringo180

Soups123 wrote: »

Being top 2 at Christmas is not beyond possible but being within 4-6pts of Chelsea is.

Everything after that in your post is very very very very optimistic

I think some are over estimating Chelsea to a point. Okay they have had a great start but aren't the unstoppable force some are portraying them as, an injury to Costa and there in trouble. They will drop points on the road when least expected.

Soups123

Gringo180 wrote: »

I think some are over estimating Chelsea to a point. Okay they have had a great start but aren't the unstoppable force some are portraying them as, an injury to Costa and there in trouble. They will drop points on the road when least expected.

So you are overestimating us but under estimating them? I see how this works

the untitled user

Roaster wrote: »

As I said I don't have a problem with the level of depth, it's the quality and I'm sorry but I just don't think we have it to be challenging on two of the biggest fronts.

To be honest, I don't really want to get into the quality argument at the moment. I don't really think it will improve our prospects enough if we can't at least reduce the amount of injuries. I don't disagree though.

Roaster wrote: »

I also don't agree with your statement if we added the likes of Hummels or Matic that we'd have the same problem. It's been said earlier in this thread that a lot of it has to do with they type of players we sign, i.e. small, lightweight, timid even, bar the odd exception.

Ferdinand and Vidic could be both quite injury prone. Richards, Andy Carroll, Kaboul being other examples who come to mind. I don't think there's any correlation between physique and the frequency of injuries.

Roaster wrote: »

I honestly think that the lack of contact in training is not helping either. The body needs to become accustomed to the physical side of the game and our lads obviously don't. I remember reading a quote from Bergkamp (I think) and he said the first thing Martin Keown did when he arrived was go straight through him and welcome him to English football. Could you imagine any of our current lot doing that?

That may have something to do with it, but again, keep in mind there are plenty of examples of players who don't even train during the week due to chronic conditions who had no problem getting stuck in on match days.

I think the big three factors are:

1. Style of play - we are the least direct team in the premiership which means our players have the ball at their feet a lot more than other teams. That invites tackles.
2. Refereeing - Due to historical English attitudes, the refs don't really punish late or mistime tackles too heavily compared to other leagues. And combined with the above style of play, that makes us more vulnerable than most to injury through bad tackles. For example, almost all of Wilshere and RVP's injury problems started with a really bad kicks to the ankles. And not to mention, the more refs let stuff go the more likely players will take risks like the tackles that broke Ramsey, Eduardo and Diaby's legs.
3. Firmness of the Emirates pitch - A firm pitch is brutal on the joints, and will really aggravate any underlying structural weakness players may have.

Mr Blobby

And the injuries get worse...


Gunnersaurus is out for 6 weeks with a fractured tale.

Alfred Borden

Chelsea have played similar enough fixtures to us and are already 9 ahead. I can only see the gap widen.

tayto lover

the untitled user wrote: »

Sounds like you should be supporting Stoke :P

No. Don't like Stoke but in fairness to them they do well with what they have.:)

Gringo180

Soups123 wrote: »

So you are overestimating us but under estimating them? I see how this works

I think you will find its the other way around in here.

the untitled user

Raf32 wrote: »

Chelsea have played similar enough fixtures to us and are already 9 ahead. I can only see the gap widen.

Not really if you take the cup games into consideration, we've had much more difficult fixtures than theirs either side of our premier league ties.

Two qualifiers they didn't play.
Dortmund (away) vs. Schalke (home).
Southampton (home) vs. Bolton (home).
Galatasary (home) vs. Lisbon (away).

That changes the context of things quite a bit I feel.

Ken Shamrock

Gringo180 wrote: »

I think you will find its the other way around in here.

The last 10 years would disagree with you.

Alfred Borden

the untitled user wrote: »

Not really if you take the cup games into consideration, we've had much more difficult fixtures than theirs either side of our premier league ties.

Two qualifiers they didn't play.
Dortmund (away) vs. Schalke (home).
Southampton (home) vs. Bolton (home).
Galatasary (home) vs. Lisbon (away).

That changes the context of things quite a bit I feel.

The qualifiers are a result of our own ineptitude coming in fourth. The league cup, we played the reserves so that doesnt matter. Lisbon away was a tougher game for them with us that weekend than Gala at home. League fixtures are quite similar and particularly damning.

greendom

extra gravy wrote: »

FYP

Bunch of miseries :pac: That's you and anyone who thanked you

the untitled user

Raf32 wrote: »

The qualifiers are a result of our own ineptitude coming in fourth. The league cup, we played the reserves so that doesnt matter. Lisbon away was a tougher game for them with us that weekend than Gala at home. League fixtures are quite similar and particularly damning.

Uh, ok. But that doesn't mean the qualifiers haven't had an impact on our preparations for league matches.

And sorry, but Wilshere, Cazorla, Chambers, Podolski, Mertesacker, Sanchez, Ox and Gibbs were all in the squad for the Southampton and that does have an impact on preparations, regardless of whether you actually play or not.

Sporting and Galatasary are 34th and 35th respectively in the Uefa coefficients, so no real difference in the standard of opposition played that game week, only the travel to take into consideration.

Ken Shamrock

the untitled user wrote: »

Uh, ok. But that doesn't mean the qualifiers haven't had an impact on our preparations for league matches.

And sorry, but Wilshere, Cazorla, Chambers, Podolski, Mertesacker, Sanchez, Ox and Gibbs were all in the squad for the Southampton and that does have an impact on preparations, regardless of whether you actually play or not.

Sporting and Galatasary are 34th and 35th respectively in the Uefa coefficients, so no real difference in the standard of opposition played that game week, only the travel to take into consideration.

1. The point we are debating here is the difference in quality between Arsenal and Chelsea, us having to qualify is a direct result of our quality or lack thereof in relation to Chelsea.

2. Whatever preparations we did for Southampton Chelsea did for Bolton and they FIELDED more senior players than we did.

3. Rankings? Seriously? What? It doesn't matter if one team is ranked 1st and another 50th, If the team ranked 1st play sh1t and put up little to no resistance and the team ranked 50th play good football and are hard to break down then the implications on our squad and Chelsea's will reflect that, ranking being irrelevant.

the untitled user

Bob.Carcass wrote: »

1. The point we are debating here is the difference in quality between Arsenal and Chelsea, us having to qualify is a direct result of our quality or lack thereof in relation to Chelsea.

The point we're actually debating is the similarity in fixture and what implication if any it may have had on the resulting difference in points accumulated in the leageu.

Bob.Carcass wrote: »

2. Whatever preparations we did for Southampton Chelsea did for Bolton and they FIELDED more senior players than we did.

Not really. Chelsea fielded two youngsters, Ake and Zouma, we fielded Hayden and Bellerin (with Akpom as sub). And we field ours against much much stronger opposition than theirs.

Bob.Carcass wrote: »

3. Rankings? Seriously? What? It doesn't matter if one team is ranked 1st and another 50th, If the team ranked 1st play sh1t and put up little to no resistance and the team ranked 50th play good football and are hard to break down then the implications on our squad and Chelsea's will reflect that, ranking being irrelevant.

We're do a like for like comparison on fixtures on league standings and results accumulated. The rankings become a useful line in the sand to make such comparisons. Lisbon aren't THAT good and Chelsea could have put that fixture to bed before it even began.

So how do you compare, Arsenal make take their chances and make light work of Galatasary, Chelsea miss their chances and have a difficul nervy encounter against Sporting. How do you interpret that in terms of judging two teams quality?

greendom

the untitled user wrote: »

The point we're actually debating is the similarity in fixture and what implication if any it may have had on the resulting difference in points accumulated in the leageu.



Not really. Chelsea fielded two youngsters, Ake and Zouma, we fielded Hayden and Bellerin (with Akpom as sub). And we field ours against much much stronger opposition than theirs.



We're do a like for like comparison on fixtures on league standings and results accumulated. The rankings become a useful line in the sand to make such comparisons. Lisbon aren't THAT good and Chelsea could have put that fixture to bed before it even began.

So how do you compare, Arsenal make take their chances and make light work of Galatasary, Chelsea miss their chances and have a difficul nervy encounter against Sporting. How do you interpret that in terms of judging two teams quality?

In a way that reflects badly on Arsenal and well on Chelsea

the untitled user

greendom wrote: »

In a way that reflects badly on Arsenal and well on Chelsea

Are you being fully objective though?

greendom

the untitled user wrote: »

Are you being fully objective though?

I thought that supporting a team was the one place where subjectivity was allowed. Maybe it is but it seems only if you're being pessimistic

Kirby

I'll be supporting Ireland on Saturday but its ignorant to let that blind me to our deficiencies. If we scrape a 1-0 victory I wont be calling us world beaters or claiming "In Martin we trust".

It's possible to be a fan without being a fanboy.

greendom

Kirby wrote: »

I'll be supporting Ireland on Saturday but its ignorant to let that blind me to our deficiencies. If we scrape a 1-0 victory I wont be calling us world beaters or claiming "In Martin we trust".

It's possible to be a fan without being a fanboy.

No argument with that at all - there just seems to be a little of an overkill of negativity on this thread.

Kirby

I like that fanboy line so much I'm going to use it again. :P

Alfred Borden

greendom wrote: »

No argument with that at all - there just seems to be a little of an overkill of negativity on this thread.

We need the club to give us something to be positive about. A few games with good performances back to back will tide us over until the next big game.

the untitled user

Raf32 wrote: »

We need the club to give us something to be positive about. A few games with good performances back to back will tide us over until the next big game.

True, but we need to get behind the team too. It's quite clearly shorn of confidence at the moment and the excessive levels of criticisms we're seeing at times doesn't really help anybody in that regard.

Alfred Borden

the untitled user wrote: »

True, but we need to get behind the team too. It's quite clearly shorn of confidence at the moment and the excessive levels of criticisms we're seeing at times doesn't really help anybody in that regard.

I doubt a couple of rants by us keyboard warriors will go noticed! :pac: I think the fans at the ground have every right. They are paying the highest ticket prices so deserve to see a higher standard of football then they are receiving this season.

the untitled user

Raf32 wrote: »

I doubt a couple of rants by us keyboard warriors will go noticed! :pac: I think the fans at the ground have every right. They are paying the highest ticket prices so deserve to see a higher standard of football then they are receiving this season.

I guess so, but people need to mindful, the quicker people get on the team's backs, the more difficult it will be for the team to find their rhythm and confidence.

Ken Shamrock

A couple of Irish lads on a forum saying Arsenal are good,bad or indifferent won't have any sort of effect on the way Arsenal perform...The fact of the matter is if me Raf,Button,Soups,Quazzie or whoever else was at an Arsenal game we'd all be screaming are heads off for the lads and doing everything we can to be heard, we would never be shouting your sh1t or anything of the sort.

So discussing our downfalls or what we could do to improve is perfectly fine in my eyes.

Alfred Borden

the untitled user wrote: »

I guess so, but people need to mindful, the quicker people get on the team's backs, the more difficult it will be for the team to find their rhythm and confidence.

Agreed can be critical if it escalates in the stands but I hope the team dont let it get any worse than it is now. Need to realistically take 30 from the next 36.

tayto lover

greendom wrote: »

No argument with that at all - there just seems to be a little of an overkill of negativity on this thread.

In the main the results and performances have been negative. Both team and manager.

symbolic

I'm a neutral, watch football purely for entertainment and if Arsenal end up in the third division and are not part of Sky Super Sundays bla bla etc I probably wouldn't be tuning in as much. Have no ties to Arsenal as such. So i'm a terrible person really!

Love watching Arsenal though. Love going to the Emirates Stadium, fantastic stadium. Big fan of Wenger. Big fan of all the Arsenal players, seem like a really great bunch that Wenger has there now. Obviously results and trophies are very important in the game of football so I really hope Wenger and the team manage something this year. From the outside looking in, you guys have a lot to be optimistic about. And the club have a lot to be proud of. Wenger and the players.

When you's get going you play such great football. And IMO the club, Wenger and players do have a certain class about them. I hope Wellbeck comes good for you guys. Think Wenger is a good thing for football for things like that. Instead of splashing the cash on Falcao for a year or whatever.

Anyway hopefully a good run now and then that will bring the confidence up again. And finishing behind teams like Chelsea and Man City is nothing to be ashamed of. 7 points off top last season. Just nothing in it really. And behind a Liverpool team that were just ridiculous with Saurez.

Maybe a sneaky Champions League trophy this year

tayto lover

Symbolic,

That's all very true but many of us can see that a little more investment in the right players in the right places, a little honing of tactics and an investigation of the continuous bad run of injuries could ensure that we're looking down at the opposition and not up all the time. We are fed up of Top 4 and want to be Top.

Soups123

symbolic wrote: »

I'm a neutral, watch football purely for entertainment and if Arsenal end up in the third division and are not part of Sky Super Sundays bla bla etc I probably wouldn't be tuning in as much. Have no ties to Arsenal as such. So i'm a terrible person really!

Love watching Arsenal though. Love going to the Emirates Stadium, fantastic stadium. Big fan of Wenger. Big fan of all the Arsenal players, seem like a really great bunch that Wenger has there now. Obviously results and trophies are very important in the game of football so I really hope Wenger and the team manage something this year. From the outside looking in, you guys have a lot to be optimistic about. And the club have a lot to be proud of. Wenger and the players.

When you's get going you play such great football. And IMO the club, Wenger and players do have a certain class about them. I hope Wellbeck comes good for you guys. Think Wenger is a good thing for football for things like that. Instead of splashing the cash on Falcao for a year or whatever.

Anyway hopefully a good run now and then that will bring the confidence up again. And finishing behind teams like Chelsea and Man City is nothing to be ashamed of. 7 points off top last season. Just nothing in it really. And behind a Liverpool team that were just ridiculous with Saurez.

Maybe a sneaky Champions League trophy this year

You sir may not know it but you are a gunner

symbolic

tayto lover wrote: »

Symbolic,

That's all very true but many of us can see that a little more investment in the right players in the right places, a little honing of tactics and an investigation of the continuous bad run of fixtures could ensure that we're looking down at the opposition and not up all the time. We are fed up of Top 4 and want to be Top.

That's cool. I'll have to bow out of that, tactics etc and running a football club! I'm far from an expert. Maybe someday!

But is the fact that you were 7 points off not an indication that all those things were almost spot on last year? If not spot on. Genuinely asking. 7 points seems so little to me. i.e if you hadnt lost Villa, hadnt drawn against WBA and hadnt drawn against Southampton then you'd be even on points anyway. (maths maybe wrong) I take onboard what you are saying but from a outsider looking in, and I think I remember watching one of the games you lost/drew and there was an OG from flamini?? . and games where you hit the post. its just so close, to me anyway!

UnknownSpecies

Roy Keane on Vieira. 100% written by Keane. Definitely real.

tayto lover

symbolic wrote: »

That's cool. I'll have to bow out of that, tactics etc and running a football club! I'm far from an expert. Maybe someday!

But is the fact that you were 7 points off not an indication that all those things were almost spot on last year? If not spot on. Genuinely asking. 7 points seems so little to me. i.e if you hadnt lost Villa, hadnt drawn against WBA and hadnt drawn against Southampton then you'd be even on points anyway. (maths maybe wrong) I take onboard what you are saying but from a outsider looking in, and I think I remember watching one of the games you lost/drew and there was an OG from flamini?? . and games where you hit the post. its just so close, to me anyway!

Every team gets their share of good and bad luck. We won a few games we might have drawn too. While 7 points is as near as we got in a few years we need the improvements to bridge the gap. I often think of how many titles we could have won with a bit more investment.

Gringo180

dorgasm wrote: »

Roy Keane on Vieira. 100% written by Keane. Definitely real.

That squad of players we had back then was scary. Best team to ever grace English football imo, even if I am slightly biased.

emergingstar

Gringo180 wrote: »

That squad of players we had back then was scary. Best team to ever grace English football imo, even if I am slightly biased.

And still underachieverd unfortunately

omega man

Lies, damned lies and statistics but I just saw our 15 game record against City, Chelsea and Man Utd and it isn't pretty. 7 draws, 8 defeats. That's fcuking shameful.....

gosplan

omega man wrote: »

Lies, damned lies and statistics but I just saw our 15 game record against City, Chelsea and Man Utd and it isn't pretty. 7 draws, 8 defeats. That's fcuking shameful.....

Yes and while I don't want to get into the DMF argument (which we totally need), it shows that our problems go beyond personnel.

We have no backbone.

The arseblog live podcast was interesting on this, saying that Wenger inherited a club with backbone but lost it during 'project youth'.

We've never fully regained it.

jonneymendoza

Nemeses2050 wrote: »

so it means we won't see him until new year...that's a bummer

Hands up if you wouldnt have notice him these next 3months that he wasnt playing in the team?

Irish Aris

jonneymendoza wrote: »

Hands up if you wouldnt have notice him these next 3months that he wasnt playing in the team?

I presume you have a crystal ball, yeah?

jonneymendoza

Irish Aris wrote: »

I presume you have a crystal ball, yeah?

Yea i have because Ozil has been injured for nearly a year now(last time i saw that world class Ozil from RM play for arsenal was back in November/December of last year)

:pac::pac::pac::pac:

Irish Aris

jonneymendoza wrote: »

Yea i have because Ozil has been injured for nearly a year now(last time i saw that world class Ozil from RM play for arsenal was back in November/December of last year)

:pac::pac::pac::pac:

well, can't argue that to be honest. . .:D

I am sure though that there will be times (especially when Walcott will be back) that we will be thinking "what if he wasn't injured".

Despite him not playing well in general, Ozil has this gift of finding the empty space or the free player. Can't think of any other in our current team that can do that.
I think that, based on the next few games, his absence won't come back to bite us (although I fully expect a few narrow escapes)

wandatowell

Keano is a bit of poet

Mr Blobby

Szczęsny was absolutely amazing against Germany!!

tayto lover

Mr Blobby wrote: »

Szczęsny was absolutely amazing against Germany!!

Saw that.
Prefer him to be amazing for us and very average for them.;)

extra gravy

Welbeck subbed off and headed towards dressing room with England physio. He took a knock a few minutes earlier. Please be nothing serious