Arsenal Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014/15

K4t

gosplan wrote: »

Just to nip this in the bud.

We did not draw against hull because we are missing a better DMF.

It was a factor though. Flamini was bulied fouled by Diame for the first goal and Huddlestone's run wasn't tracked for the second.

Scoring two goals against a very defensively set up Hull team wasn't that bad.

extra gravy

emergingstar wrote: »

Flamini was fouled plain and simple

A bigger stronger DM would have brushed Diame off and cleared the danger. Flamini is too lightweight plus this bull**** of throwing his hands up instead of playing to the whistle. Mert was just as bad in that respect.

gosplan

Raf32 wrote: »

Id argue a proper DM plays to the whistle and puts the ball out for their first.

The squad we have is 100% good enough to win that game.

gosplan

K4t wrote: »

It was a factor though. Flamini was bulied fouled by Diame for the first goal and Huddlestone's run wasn't tracked for the second.

Scoring two goals against a very defensively set up Hull team wasn't that bad.

Didn't have problems in these games last year though. Actually kept a huge amount of clean sheets.

gosplan

Deleted User wrote: »

Flamini wasn't at fault at all?

We don't have the players to beat hull at home?

emergingstar

extra gravy wrote: »

A bigger stronger DM would have brushed Diame off and cleared the danger. Flamini is too lightweight plus this bull**** of throwing his hands up instead of playing to the whistle. Mert was just as bad in that respect.

We need a better DM I was saying that all along

It was still a foul though no matter what way Ya dress it up

Alfred Borden

gosplan wrote: »

The squad we have is 100% good enough to win that game.

I dont agree. Flamini infront of a partnership of Mert and Monreal is desperate imo. Throw in a right back making his debut and no natural left winger and thats half the team. Managers fault though.

gosplan

gosplan wrote: »

We don't have the players to beat hull at home?

Apparently not...

enfant terrible

Deleted User wrote: »

Apparently not...

How much more do you think we need to spend to beat Hull at home?

gosplan

Funnily enough I think you're both letting Wenger off very lightly.

Another manager would have adjusted tactics. Protected Flamini, covered Monreal, and ground out a win.

enfant terrible

enfant terrible wrote: »

How much more do you think we need to spend to beat Hull at home?

Billion dollars?

enfant terrible

Deleted User wrote: »

Billion dollars?

Worked for city

Obviously the players we have should be enough to beat Hull at home. It just so happens today that a better DM likely would've kept us 1-0 up. The tactics played a part today, how much that was to blame is is impossible for anyone outside of the set-up to say.

wonga77

Just home from work, is it meltdown time? Didnt see or hear a single thing about the game

gosplan

Deleted User wrote: »

Obviously the players we have should be enough to beat Hull at home. It just so happens today that a better DM likely would've kept us 1-0 up. The tactics played a part today, how much that was to blame is is impossible for anyone outside of the set-up to say.

We also would have won with Messi and Ronaldo on the wings.

I'm not trying to belittle your point but we could be doing a lot better with the players we have and it's far more worthwhile examining why we're not than banging the same old drum about something in the past that can't be changed for a good few months.

We would have won that game last year.

Alfred Borden

wonga77 wrote: »

Just home from work, is it meltdown time? Didnt see or hear a single thing about the game

No we are gonna go on a run now and win the league :pac:

gosplan

gosplan wrote: »

We also would have won with Messi and Ronaldo on the wings.

I'm not trying to belittle your point but we could be doing a lot better with the players we have and it's far more worthwhile examining why we're not than banging the same old drum about something in the past that can't be changed for a good few months.

There was a specific incident where a proper DM would have made a difference. Playing on/not getting pushed out of the way/not letting him get momentum. 3 things a better player there could have done.

And again, a proper DM would allow more useful tactics than what we currently play. Even if Wenger wanted to stick to current tactics there'd still be a drift away from them due to the players involved etc.

gosplan

Btw I was genuinely about a minute from opening the match thread and calling it the 'arsenal 2 - hull 2 match thread of despair'

I'd be getting such a hard time now if I had done it. Would have been amazing though.

gosplan

Deleted User wrote: »

There was a specific incident where a proper DM would have made a difference. Playing on/not getting pushed out of the way/not letting him get momentum. 3 things a better player there could have done.

And again, a proper DM would allow more useful tactics than what we currently play. Even if Wenger wanted to stick to current tactics there'd still be a drift away from them due to the players involved etc.

But we won those last year?

If the main thing that you took from the Chelsea game was that we need a Matic to play teams like that away, that kind of makes sense.

If that was the main thing you took from today, you're missing a lot.

It like saying, OK we sign Matic but if he's injured or suspended we go back to dropping points at home to hull.

Edit: sorry, don't know why stupid smileys keep coming up in my posts.

omega man

Wenger is slowly destroying his legacy, not just at Arsenal FC but in the wider football community too. I can't help but think winning the FA cup last year was the perfect opportunity for him to walk on his terms with his legacy intact.

Someone mentioned earlier that we should be looking at today's game in isolation but lets be clear this fall from grace for wenger has been building up slowly over a number of years. This season was his chance to redeem himself and the club in general with the so called "shackles" off. I imagine the club probably thought wenger would bounce back after the cup success. Remember his face that day, the sheer relief and joy. The club and fans alike assumed he'd got his mojo back. Sadly that's not the case.

The best analogy I can think of is that of buying a brand new state of the art moden commercial jet liner and then going out and hiring some WW2 bomber pilot to take the controls and entrust him with your highly prised asset. Times have changed. It's now time Arsenal FC change too. I take no joy in saying that, truly I don't.

gosplan

gosplan wrote: »

But we won those last year?

If the main thing that you took from the Chelsea game was that we need a Matic to play teams like that away, that kind of makes sense.

If that was the main thing you took from today, you're missing a lot.

It like saying, OK we sign Matic but if he's injured or suspended we go back to dropping points at home to hull.

It usually wouldn't be a main thing, it just happened today to be a specific incident.
Against Chelsea (and in general against well set-up teams) the lack of a DM makes us so vulnerable in the middle and affects everything ahead. While there should still be enough quality ahead of there to beat teams like Hull (and is usually the case) it's still all part of the compressed play that leaves us looking so blunt so often.

I'm sick of this DM talk...seriously. Would a big strong DM have stopped the goal? Yes possibly. Would the DM have been in that exact position on the pitch dealing with that problem? Maybe. If he wasn't, would it have been ok because at least we had one on the pitch?

To me, even though we are shipping goals, our problems aren't defensive. Our biggest problem is that teams know how to deal with us. Soak up the pressure, we run out of ideas, then try more of the same again.

Have been looking forward to Theo coming back, but I'm beginning to wonder whether he will make a difference. The way we are playing, I don't think so.

Soups123

Basil3 wrote: »

I'm sick of this DM talk...seriously. Would a big strong DM have stopped the goal? Yes possibly. Would the DM have been in that exact position on the pitch dealing with that problem? Maybe. If he wasn't, would it have been ok because at least we had one on the pitch?

To me, even though we are shipping goals, our problems aren't defensive. Our biggest problem is that teams know how to deal with us. Soak up the pressure, we run out of ideas, then try more of the same again.

Have been looking forward to Theo coming back, but I'm beginning to wonder whether he will make a difference. The way we are playing, I don't think so.

No one claims the DM is the only issue but it's an obvious one and it's being ignored, which convinces no one he can fix the less obvious one.

gosplan

Basil3 wrote: »

I'm sick of this DM talk...seriously. Would a big strong DM have stopped the goal? Yes possibly. Would the DM have been in that exact position on the pitch dealing with that problem? Maybe. If he wasn't, would it have been ok because at least we had one on the pitch?

To me, even though we are shipping goals, our problems aren't defensive. Our biggest problem is that teams know how to deal with us. Soak up the pressure, we run out of ideas, then try more of the same again.

Have been looking forward to Theo coming back, but I'm beginning to wonder whether he will make a difference. The way we are playing, I don't think so.

Arteta and Theo will make a difference in the next few days.

Today 100% should have seen a tightening up from Arsenal and a revert to previous formations. Wenger stuck to his principles as he always does but it wasn't pragmatic today.

It'll work a lot better with our strong players back but he's not helping matters at all in the meantime.

Soups123

gosplan wrote: »

Arteta and Theo will make a difference in the next few days.

Today 100% should have seen a tightening up from Arsenal and a revert to previous formations. Wenger stuck to his principles as he always does but it wasn't pragmatic today.

It'll work a lot better with our strong players back but he's not helping matters at all in the meantime.

Seriously though Gosplsn ask yourself how many times have I or thought that.

It's always the excuse

gosplan

Basil3 wrote: »

I'm sick of this DM talk...seriously. Would a big strong DM have stopped the goal? Yes possibly. Would the DM have been in that exact position on the pitch dealing with that problem? Maybe. If he wasn't, would it have been ok because at least we had one on the pitch?

To me, even though we are shipping goals, our problems aren't defensive. Our biggest problem is that teams know how to deal with us. Soak up the pressure, we run out of ideas, then try more of the same again.

Have been looking forward to Theo coming back, but I'm beginning to wonder whether he will make a difference. The way we are playing, I don't think so.

Soups123 wrote: »

Seriously though Gosplsn ask yourself how many times have I or thought that.

It's always the excuse

There is no excuse. Whatever hand he was dealt with injuries or whatever mistakes he made in the transfer market, we could and should have won today.

emergingstar

4-1-4-1 infuriates me

Soups123

gosplan wrote: »

There is no excuse. Whatever hand he was dealt with injuries or whatever mistakes he made in the transfer market, we could and should have won today.

I agree is is reeping what he sowed. For me though now is time for the fans to demand more from the club

extra gravy

Wenger: "I think the performance was quite good, but we put ourselves in trouble because we gave 2 goals away."

"Quite good"? I give up.

gosplan

Here's a question. not an excuse btw but was today the most injuries/absences ever?


Debuchy - xxx - Kos - xxx

---

Arteta --- Ramsey
-Walcott --- Ozil -- xxx

---

Giroud

7 out of 10 starters plus Chambers. Have we ever beaten that?

Ardennes1944

Our squad when we lost 8-2 to United is the only time I can think of?

Soups123

extra gravy wrote: »

Wenger: "I think the performance was quite good, but we put ourselves in trouble because we gave 2 goals away."

"Quite good"? I give up.

I've given up listening to his thoughts and excuses anymore

gosplan

emergingstar wrote: »

4-1-4-1 infuriates me

I don't mind it in essence but it should have been ditched when we got all these injuries.

What's the point in dropping points just so our 2nd string players get used to a different formation.

tayto lover

Missed the game today as I was at my son's conferring.
Can't believe we didn't beat Hull at the Emirates.
Regardless of who we were missing we should still be winning that game.
Wenger is just a bag of excuses now. We need change.

efb

Kos is the rock in our defence

Alfred Borden

efb wrote: »

Kos is the rock in our defence

Carries the rest of them imo. Could get away with Gibbs and Debuchy if they can somehow stay fit but he needs a new partner.

extra gravy

efb wrote: »

Kos is the rock in our defence

That was very obvious today. Mert looks so average without him.

gosplan

Wow, technically Arteta, Ramsey, Diaby and Walcott are all fit.

Ozil, Giroud and Debuchy all expected back in December according to reports/physioroom.

What odds on us not seeing

---

Ramsey
Walcott - Ozil - Sanchez

at all this year?

UnitedWeStand

I wonder if the season continues like this if Wenger will resign. He's a bloody smart guy, and he knows more than anyone how badly this seasons results have gone so far. I don't think anyone really seen this coming, we did fairly well last season and we topped up the team with the class additions of Sanchez, Chambers, Debuchy, Welbeck etc. For all the world I seen us coming at least third this year, and being able to compete a bit more on all three major trophy fronts with our depth, and only struggling against the likes of Chelsea and City perhaps.

Some random scattered thoughts I have right now:

1) I'm not sure how were going to secure major coups/players anymore. After top class players see how Ozil's turned out and flopped huge time after leaving Madrid for us, and noticing our lack of killer instinct that top teams of the past have had such as Utd, its worrying.

2) I'm not sure whether its because he's bored of having had to do these press conferences for nearly 20 years now, but his language in them is disturbing. There appears to be no anger, no sense of disapointment not just that they didn't win, but that players didn't perform to 100%. Contrast this to the rugby game I seen two weeks back in New Zealand vs South Africa, the All Blacks coach was gutted the team lost and could barely hide it on his face. Thats because they have such a winning mentality that a loss is something that would give you a few restless nights. I get the impression that Arsenal players and management sleep easily after a loss, as its that routine at times.

3) Tactically we can be poor at times. Sometimes Wengers tactics are brilliant, lets be honest the reason we love Arsenal in some ways is because of the way Wenger has and had this team playing. If you've ever been abroad and tell someone youre an Arsenal fan the first comments you usually hear are about how beautiful it is to watch them play. But bloody hell we do seem to only having 1)Possession football 2) Counter attacking 3) An occassional switch of the flanks. I can't ever recall us playing a defensive shape in recent memory/ever. I think thats the difference in some ways between a Ferguson in his prime or Mourinho now or even Pep, they play to the situation, whether its desperate 11 men behind the ball football or all out attack. They adapt, we don't.

efb

Mert needs a leash for Kos to reign him in

bad2dabone

Disappointing result today. Been a poor first quarter of the season so far.
No title challenge, struggle for fourth, same old same old.

K4t

tayto lover wrote: »

Missed the game today as I was at my son's conferring.

That's no excuse.

Wenger out!

keano_afc

efb wrote: »

Can we really compete with Chelsea and City and those investing a lot in their squads?

This is a tired and laboured point.

Is it Chelsea and City's fault we had Monreal at CB?
is it Chelsea and City's fault we haven't won a game since August?

I could go on but I'd be here all night. Irrespective of what other clubs are doing, we're a shambles. Wenger should have walked after the cup final, it was clear we needed a change.

tayto lover

keano_afc wrote: »

This is a tired and laboured point.

Is it Chelsea and City's fault we had Monreal at CB?
is it Chelsea and City's fault we haven't won a game since August?

I could go on but I'd be here all night. Irrespective of what other clubs are doing, we're a shambles. Wenger should have walked after the cup final, it was clear we needed a change.

There has been little or no fight or heart in the Arsenal team for a long time now.
A good boss would make sure they gave their all.

gosplan

keano_afc wrote: »

This is a tired and laboured point.

Is it Chelsea and City's fault we had Monreal at CB?
is it Chelsea and City's fault we haven't won a game since August?

I could go on but I'd be here all night. Irrespective of what other clubs are doing, we're a shambles. Wenger should have walked after the cup final, it was clear we needed a change.

Correct.

Maybe we could make that point if we were third behind City and Chelsea.

Really good point by unitedwestand. This is a massive period of regression. We've lost all the solidity of last year.

Alfred Borden

I hope the ticket prices dont go up again or its going to become toxic.

UnitedWeStand

Don't worry guys I've got an idea, what if we sell a marquee player to a rival this season AND increase ticket prices? That'll work right?

wonga77

Looper007 wrote: »

I think we are still missing three top players, Centre back, Defensive Mid and Striker all of world class quality. I'm worried how many of our top players are going to stick around before they are poached away by City or Chelsea.

I agree, though you could probably apply that quote to any of the last 5 or 6 years, we're always just 2 or 3 short or making the next step forwards

enfant terrible wrote: »

There is loads of quality in the squad but Wenger can't get them functioning as a team.

I dont think he can get the best out of the team anymore, theres very little evidence of passion from some of the players

emergingstar wrote: »

Flamini was fouled plain and simple

Play to the whistle, obviously he was fouled but he's playing long enough now to know that waving your f ucking arms in the air doesnt always get you a free, just too risky when your last man back

omega man wrote: »

Wenger is slowly destroying his legacy, not just at Arsenal FC but in the wider football community too. I can't help but think winning the FA cup last year was the perfect opportunity for him to walk on his terms with his legacy intact.

Someone mentioned earlier that we should be looking at today's game in isolation but lets be clear this fall from grace for wenger has been building up slowly over a number of years. This season was his chance to redeem himself and the club in general with the so called "shackles" off. I imagine the club probably thought wenger would bounce back after the cup success. Remember his face that day, the sheer relief and joy. The club and fans alike assumed he'd got his mojo back. Sadly that's not the case.

The best analogy I can think of is that of buying a brand new state of the art moden commercial jet liner and then going out and hiring some WW2 bomber pilot to take the controls and entrust him with your highly prised asset. Times have changed. It's now time Arsenal FC change too. I take no joy in saying that, truly I don't.

This 1000 times. He created an everlasting legacy but he has already started to destroy it and its hard to see how he can turn it around

extra gravy wrote: »

Wenger: "I think the performance was quite good, but we put ourselves in trouble because we gave 2 goals away."

"Quite good"? I give up.

Is that an actual quote or from the Wenger knows best parody account on twitter?

Alfred Borden

if wenger would just change and sign what he needed and played a proper formation, he would win a lot back around. we would actually start picking up as well.

Soups123

Raf32 wrote: »

if wenger would just change and sign what he needed and played a proper formation, he would win a lot back around. we would actually start picking up as well.

To be honest Im done, we've given him so many benefits of doubt I would love to wrong but he needs to go before we compete.

In saying that I see the board recruiting another yes man, the fans need to drive change