Arsenal Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014/15

WoollyRedHat

I actually we have a chance in the Champions League, think we'll go further than usual this time.

tayto lover

WoollyRedHat wrote: »

I actually we have a chance in the Champions League, think we'll go further than usual this time.

Not a hope.

UnknownSpecies

WoollyRedHat wrote: »

I actually we have a chance in the Champions League, think we'll go further than usual this time.

Not a prayer, that's beyond blind optimism.

extra gravy

WoollyRedHat wrote: »

I actually we have a chance in the Champions League, think we'll go further than usual this time.

What have you seen so far this season that would make you think that?

TUBBY

emmetlego wrote: »

Just throwing this out there, I don't necessarily believe it… I heard a manager (can't remember which one) talking about the standard of all the lower clubs being much better this year in the PL, and that's why there are more of the perceived bigger teams dropping points you wouldn't expect to.

Thoughts please.

Tell that to Chelsea.

Pierce_1991

Wilshere out for 8-10 weeks according to some GeoffArsenal retweet

yipeeeee

Pierce_1991 wrote: »

Wilshere out for 8-10 weeks according to some GeoffArsenal retweet

Ah come on,

Someone has to be taken the piss up there.

Gringo180

tayto lover wrote: »

Nice football is easy on the eye but no good if you're losing, i'd prefer winning ugly any day.

We don't even play nice football now, years ago we were an absolute joy to watch but now its just average stuff, its amazing the amount of times our players just aimlessly give the ball away.

efb wrote: »

Campbell was disappointing in the League Cup match he played in.

You can't be serious? Was that his first ever start in English football? You can hardly judge him on that.

Gringo180

I am coming around to the realisation that the players we have in our squad just aren't good enough to win a league or consistently challenge for major honours. Ozil and Sanchez are the only players that would start or get into the squad that we had when we were winning leagues. The likes of Ramsey, Wilshere, Gibbs, Mertesacker, Arteta, Giroud, Welbeck, Oxlade Chamberlain, who are all regulars now are of the same quality or even less than our backup players back then, the likes of Edu, Silvinho, Wiltord, Kanu, Parlour etc.

jonneymendoza

emmetlego wrote: »

Just throwing this out there, I don't necessarily believe it… I heard a manager (can't remember which one) talking about the standard of all the lower clubs being much better this year in the PL, and that's why there are more of the perceived bigger teams dropping points you wouldn't expect to.

Thoughts please.

Disagree. just look how dire united, liverpool, spurs and to an extent city are.

They are playing rubbish at best

Gringo180 wrote: »

I am coming around to the realisation that the players we have in our squad just aren't good enough to win a league or consistently challenge for major honours. Ozil and Sanchez are the only players that would start or get into the squad that we had when we were winning leagues. The likes of Ramsey, Wilshere, Gibbs, Mertesacker, Arteta, Giroud, Welbeck, Oxlade Chamberlain, who are all regulars now are of the same quality or even less than our backup players back then, the likes of Edu, Silvinho, Wiltord, Kanu, Parlour etc.

LOL ozil is pants mate.

Pierce_1991

Gringo180 wrote: »

I am coming around to the realisation that the players we have in our squad just aren't good enough to win a league or consistently challenge for major honours. Ozil and Sanchez are the only players that would start or get into the squad that we had when we were winning leagues. The likes of Ramsey, Wilshere, Gibbs, Mertesacker, Arteta, Giroud, Welbeck, Oxlade Chamberlain, who are all regulars now are of the same quality or even less than our backup players back then, the likes of Edu, Silvinho, Wiltord, Kanu, Parlour etc.

I think all those current players you list would have been capable of at least being squad members in our league winning teams. The difference I would say is that if you put the likes of Ramsey beside Paddy Vieira and he had all those other guys around him like Henry, Pires etc it would make him a better player straight away. Those past league winning teams were built on not just a talented group of players but a group of winners. This team has a lot of very good players that I don't think would look out of place in the successful sides of the Wenger era, but they lack that winning mentality of those teams. Thats not to say we lack any passion or drive, just as a collective unit we don't seem capable of showing any genuine responsibility. Thats partly down to the players themselves but for me it's more the fault of Wenger who doesn't seem to have any kind of cohesive plan in place for what they're supposed to do.

Ed Winchester

jonneymendoza wrote: »

LOL ozil is pants mate.

:rolleyes:

jonneymendoza

Ed Winchester wrote: »

:rolleyes:

tell me whats he done for arsenal?

nout.

who in here misses him? he makes little difference in this arsenal side. Had he played last saturday we would have still lost

Gringo180

jonneymendoza wrote: »

LOL ozil is pants mate.

Ozil is world class, don't be fooled with what the gutter press in England say and all the fans who jump on that bandwagon. Look how well we are doing without him eh :rolleyes:

Ed Winchester

jonneymendoza wrote: »

tell me whats he done for arsenal?

nout.

who in here misses him? he makes little difference in this arsenal side. Had he played last saturday we would have still lost

Well we haven't exactly been burning the place up since he's been out have we?

Our big dip in form coincided with his injury last season too.

A lot of guys here seriously undervalue his worth to the team.

Gringo180

Pierce_1991 wrote: »

I think all those current players you list would have been capable of at least being squad members in our league winning teams. The difference I would say is that if you put the likes of Ramsey beside Paddy Vieira and he had all those other guys around him like Henry, Pires etc it would make him a better player straight away. Those past league winning teams were built on not just a talented group of players but a group of winners. This team has a lot of very good players that I don't think would look out of place in the successful sides of the Wenger era, but they lack that winning mentality of those teams. Thats not to say we lack any passion or drive, just as a collective unit we don't seem capable of showing any genuine responsibility. Thats partly down to the players themselves but for me it's more the fault of Wenger who doesn't seem to have any kind of cohesive plan in place for what they're supposed to do.

Yes but the team back then had a nice balance to it. The spine of the team was hard as nails, Jens Lehamnn, Sol Campbell, Silva, Vieira, Henry. All thses players were natural leaders, mentally strong and were highly intelligent players. Our lads now are anything but that.

Gringo180

Ed Winchester wrote: »

Well we haven't exactly been burning the place up since he's been out have we?

Our big dip in form coincided with his injury last season too.

A lot of guys here seriously undervalue his worth to the team.

I love Ozil. His worth to this team is priceless, he creates so much space for others and the team as a whole are much more cohesive when he plays. He could have the game of his life and still people on here would criticise the lad, just because he doesn't track back :rolleyes: He is a luxury player, if played in his correct position will flourish at the club.

Alfred Borden

Ozil is still our best player for me

efb

Ozil is the best player at arsenal.

efb

I'd rather one Ozil moment of genius than Wilshere's running about like a blue-assed fly

WoollyRedHat

extra gravy wrote: »

What have you seen so far this season that would make you think that?

We'll get into the knockout stages, that I'm sure.

And by then the January transfer window will have come around, and some key players will be fit, including Ozil and Walcott, plus Kos and Debuchy.

I think by the time knockout stages occur, we will have gathered some momentum.

keano_afc

WoollyRedHat wrote: »

We'll get into the knockout stages, that I'm sure.

And by then the January transfer window will have come around, and some key players will be fit, including Ozil and Walcott, plus Kos and Debuchy.

I think by the time knockout stages occur, we will have gathered some momentum.

Thanks for that, Arsene.

omega man

efb wrote: »

Ozil is the best player at arsenal.

Sanchez by a mile for me. Ozil was playing at about 50% of his potential.

efb

omega man wrote: »

Sanchez by a mile for me. Ozil was playing at about 50% of his potential.

Sanchez in the playing best atm, but Ozil is the best player

Mr Blobby

Yeah i'd be taking Sanchez also.
That being said.. I can't wait till Ozil and Sanchez get a run of games together.


But with our injury record it probably won't happen until 2018.

Quazzie

efb wrote: »

Sanchez in the playing best atm, but Ozil is the best player

You're mixing up realistic and potential.

Which reminds me of a joke.
A teenager comes home from school with a writing assignment. He asks his father for help. "Dad, can you tell me the difference between potential and reality?"
His father looks up, thoughtfully, and then says, "I'll display it to you. Go ask your mother if she would sleep with Simon Cowell for a million euro. Then go ask your sister if she would sleep with Justin Bieber for a million euro. Then come back and tell me what you've learned."
The kid is puzzled, but he decides to see if he can figure out what his father means. He asks his mother, "Mom, if someone gave you a million dollars, would you sleep with Simon Cowell?" His mother looks around slyly, and then with a little smile on her face says, "Don't tell your father, but, yes, I would."
Then he goes to his sisters room and asks her, "Sis, if someone gave you a million dollars, would you sleep with Justin Bieber?" His sister looks up and says, "Omigod! Definitely!"
The kid goes back to his father and says, "Dad, I think I've figured it out. Potentially, we're sitting on two million bucks, but in reality, we're living with a couple of sluts."

Ken Shamrock

wonga77 wrote: »

Sanchez is in danger of burnout from excessive riding!

https://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/blogs/early-doors/alexis-sanchez-s-arsenal-career--put-in-jeopardy-by-girlfriend-s-demands-115521182.html

Can't blame him tbh

efb wrote: »

Sanchez in the playing best atm, but Ozil is the best player

Ozil better than Sanchez? Yeah on what planet is this?

efb

Bob.Carcass wrote: »

Can't blame him tbh



Ozil better than Sanchez? Yeah on what planet is this?

Planet long term

WoollyRedHat

efb wrote: »

Plant long term

The root of all our problems.

WoollyRedHat

In a galaxy far far away.....

efb

WoollyRedHat wrote: »

The root of all our problems.

Shorterism - the problem with today! Championed by Bertie Ahern

Ken Shamrock

efb wrote: »

Shorterism - the problem with today! Championed by Bertie Ahern

You are genuinely going on the ignore list.

yipeeeee

Ozil or Sanchez??

Hmmm like I'd need time to think that one through.

jonneymendoza

Lol ozil is average at best. Where was he when we got smashed last season by all the big teams?

byrneg28

jonneymendoza wrote: »

Lol ozil is average at best. Where was he when we got smashed last season by all the big teams?

1. He is not average
2. He had nothing got to do with the big beatings
3. Too much expectation for him some how to pull all the slack of the mediocrity of the other players
4. Apart from City, you could use the same argument for Sanchez vs. big teams (Dortmund, Chelsea, United.. very absent)
5. Very reasoned and valid argument from you....

byrneg28

I encourage you all to do the same, go through the arsenal squad and pick the folllowing terms, Indisposable, Important (Squad Member), Squad Player, Disposable, Hot Prospect


No. Position Player
1 GK Wojciech Szczęsny (Important)
2 DF Mathieu Debuchy (Important)
3 DF Kieran Gibbs (Important)
4 DF Per Mertesacker (Disposable)
6 DF Laurent Koscielny (Indisposable)
7 MF Tomáš Rosický (Disposable)
8 MF Mikel Arteta (Disposable)
9 FW Lukas Podolski (Disposable)
10 MF Jack Wilshere (Important)
11 MF Mesut Özil (Indisposable)
12 FW Olivier Giroud (Important)
13 GK David Ospina (Squad)
14 FW Theo Walcott (Indisposable)
15 MF Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain (Indisposable)
16 MF Aaron Ramsey (Important)
17 FW Alexis Sánchez (Indisposable)
18 DF Nacho Monreal (Squad)
19 MF Santi Cazorla (Squad)
20 MF Mathieu Flamini (Disposable)
21 DF Calum Chambers (Hot Prospect)
22 FW Yaya Sanogo (Hot Prospect)
23 FW Danny Welbeck (Important)
24 MF Abou Diaby (Disposable)
26 GK Emiliano Martínez (Squad)
27 FW Serge Gnabry (Hot Prospect)
28 FW Joel Campbell (Squad)
35 MF Gedion Zelalem (Hot Prospect)
38 FW Chuba Akpom (Hot Prospect)
39 DF Héctor Bellerín (Hot Prospect)
42 DF Isaac Hayden (Hot Prospect)

jonneymendoza

byrneg28 wrote: »

1. He is not average
2. He had nothing got to do with the big beatings
3. Too much expectation for him some how to pull all the slack of the mediocrity of the other players
4. Apart from City, you could use the same argument for Sanchez vs. big teams (Dortmund, Chelsea, United.. very absent)
5. Very reasoned and valid argument from you....

I will reply properly once I get on my comp. Hold that thought as your reasons have too many plot holes

greendom

It's beginning to feel like the end is nigh as far as Arsene is concerned. A matter of when not it. I personally still hope he can turn it around and think if only he'd bought a central defender and a defensive midfielder in the Summer we wouldn't be having this discussion.

yipeeeee

greendom wrote: »

It's beginning to feel like the end is nigh as far as Arsene is concerned. A matter of when not it. I personally still hope he can turn it around and think if only he'd bought a central defender and a defensive midfielder in the Summer we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Why do you think the end is high?

greendom

yipeeeee wrote: »

Why do you think the end is high?

The pressure is mounting. So many dissenting voices, even in the boardroom.

Chances are it won't be till the Summer, but it may happen before if we slide to the bottom half of the table by Christmas

yipeeeee

greendom wrote: »

The pressure is mounting. So many dissenting voices, even in the boardroom.

Chances are it won't be till the Summer, but it may happen before if we slide to the bottom half of the table by Christmas

As negative as I do be I feel there is no point panicing at this stage and sacking him. A serious rethink is needed at the end of the season.

Chelsea are the only strong looking team.

What makes Sanogo a hot prospect?

jonneymendoza

byrneg28 wrote: »

1. He is not average
2. He had nothing got to do with the big beatings
3. Too much expectation for him some how to pull all the slack of the mediocrity of the other players
4. Apart from City, you could use the same argument for Sanchez vs. big teams (Dortmund, Chelsea, United.. very absent)
5. Very reasoned and valid argument from you....

1. he is average, stats and actual performance backed this up. he hasnt set the world alight at arsenal

2. Yes he has got a lot to do with the big defeats. lacklust passing and poor cover for defence is two prime examples.

3. I am not an armchair fan and i go to a lot of the big matches at the emirates. Just for comparison sakes, i went to the united game at the emirates last season and this season.

Last season Ozil was pants. lazy and held the ball far too long whilst sanchez was always trying to track back and help in defending. Always looking to get into space and in general showed more effort then lazy Ozil at the same damm fixture.

When you watch on TV, the camera followes the ball but live in the actual game u see a lot more.

Eeverytime i see ozil play he barely moves 10 yard with or without the ball. He is proper lazy and doesnt help in defending at all and loses the ball very often.

He is average at best and arsenal dont/wont miss him as he would have made little difference in the past few matches

jonneymendoza

yipeeeee wrote: »

As negative as I do be I feel there is no point panicing at this stage and sacking him. A serious rethink is needed at the end of the season.

Chelsea are the only strong looking team.

panicking? its not as if we have not seen this dross before. we have for 10 years.

time to panic.

he needs to jump ship asap.

greendom

jonneymendoza wrote: »

panicking? its not as if we have not seen this dross before. we have for 10 years.

time to panic.

he needs to jump ship asap.

I'm not buying the 10 year rubbish and each time I see it I will refute it. Based on the reduced funds available to Arsene, 8 of those 10 years were as successful as the pre Emirates period.

Keeping the club in the champions league and in the top 4 when Chelsea and City got bankrolled and the opposite happened at Arsenal deserves far more credit than it gets.

Hyzepher

greendom wrote: »

I'm not buying the 10 year rubbish and each time I see it I will refute it. Based on the reduced funds available to Arsene, 8 of those 10 years were as successful as the pre Emirates period.

Keeping the club in the champions league and in the top 4 when Chelsea and City got bankrolled and the opposite happened at Arsenal deserves far more credit than it gets.

If anything this year should be highlighting the incredible job done at Arsenal to consistently secure CL each year - whether you agree with that as a yard stick is irrelevant.

Spurs, Liverpool, Everton, Man Utd and even City this year have shown inconsistency, bad play, regression etc and some of these teams have had nothing more than on-pitch issues.

In the last while Arsenal have had cruel injuries, debt, new stadium, players leaving, no real investment, increasing fan pressure etc and yet still seem to get a decent season-long result.

I would say that all but 3 teams in the PL would die for our recent history.

Mr Blobby

jonneymendoza wrote: »

1. he is average, stats and actual performance backed this up. he hasnt set the world alight at arsenal

2. Yes he has got a lot to do with the big defeats. lacklust passing and poor cover for defence is two prime examples.

3. I am not an armchair fan and i go to a lot of the big matches at the emirates. Just for comparison sakes, i went to the united game at the emirates last season and this season.

Last season Ozil was pants. lazy and held the ball far too long whilst sanchez was always trying to track back and help in defending. Always looking to get into space and in general showed more effort then lazy Ozil at the same damm fixture.

When you watch on TV, the camera followes the ball but live in the actual game u see a lot more.

Eeverytime i see ozil play he barely moves 10 yard with or without the ball. He is proper lazy and doesnt help in defending at all and loses the ball very often.

He is average at best and arsenal dont/wont miss him as he would have made little difference in the past few matches

The fact you think Ozil is average kinda suggest you don't have a clue.
You say he has average passing going by your stats (which you didn't provide) yet my stats say otherwise.

Lets compare Ozil to Wilshere since they play a similar role. I've bolded that who has the better stats in each passing section.
Now these stats are over an average 90m match.
Ozil:

Total Forward passes - 39.50
Total Backward passes - 26.83
Total Passes - 66.67
Successful Passes - 58.67
Chances created - 2.33
Key Passes - 2.17
Pass Completion - 88%

Jack Wilshere:

Total Forward passes - 28.11
Total Backward passes - 11.33
Total Passes - 39.78
Successful Passes - 32.89
Chances created - 0.78
Key Passes - 0.67
Pass Completion - 83%

So as you can see Ozil is well ahead of Jack passing wise. Now let me compare him to Juan Mata.

Again i'll bold the areas where he is better than Ozil.

Ozil:

Total Forward passes - 39.50
Total Backward passes - 26.83
Total Passes - 66.67
Successful Passes - 58.67
Chances created - 2.33
Key Passes - 2.17
Pass Completion - 88%

Mata:

Total Forward passes - 16.22
Total Backward passes - 21.56
Total Passes - 38
Successful Passes - 34.89
Chances created - 1.11
Key Passes - 1.0
Pass Completion - 92%

Apart from pass completion he is better everywhere else. I also done this over the course of this full season and Ozil still comes out well ahead of the pack.

Basically you saying Ozil is avarage is pure crap.. And saying the stats back it up is just false. If you had put 5mins into actually checking you'd have seen that.


*awaits reply stating that since you go to games you see more than everyone else and he's still crap bla bla bla...*

Soups123

Hyzepher wrote: »

If anything this year should be highlighting the incredible job done at Arsenal to consistently secure CL each year - whether you agree with that as a yard stick is irrelevant.

Spurs, Liverpool, Everton, Man Utd and even City this year have shown inconsistency, bad play, regression etc and some of these teams have had nothing more than on-pitch issues.

In the last while Arsenal have had cruel injuries, debt, new stadium, players leaving, no real investment, increasing fan pressure etc and yet still seem to get a decent season-long result.

I would say that all but 3 teams in the PL would die for our recent history.

Incredible is way too strong a description, he did a very good job at best, he also didnt pick up enough cups along the period look at some of the ****ty teams that did we should have picked up more in that period with the players at our disposal. The way some people go on you would think we he was managing Championship Level players into the Champtions League.

On the second bolded point, that just lists out a long line of excuses that are gone now. Wenger did a very good job keeping us competitive and his willingness to support the club in the roadmap they took is a credit to him but what is the point of it all if when you get to the other side you still manage the first team like an accountant

Ken Shamrock

byrneg28 wrote: »

I encourage you all to do the same, go through the arsenal squad and pick the folllowing terms, Indisposable, Important (Squad Member), Squad Player, Disposable, Hot Prospect

For me,

No. Position Player
1 GK Wojciech Szczęsny (Squad Player)
2 DF Mathieu Debuchy (Important)
3 DF Kieran Gibbs (Important)
4 DF Per Mertesacker (Disposable)
6 DF Laurent Koscielny (Indisposable)
7 MF Tomáš Rosický (Squad Player)
8 MF Mikel Arteta (Squad Player)
9 FW Lukas Podolski (Disposable)
10 MF Jack Wilshere (Important)
11 MF Mesut Özil (Important)
12 FW Olivier Giroud (Important)
13 GK David Ospina (Squad)
14 FW Theo Walcott (Important)
15 MF Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain (Indisposable)
16 MF Aaron Ramsey (Squad Player)
17 FW Alexis Sánchez (Indisposable)
18 DF Nacho Monreal (Disposable)
19 MF Santi Cazorla (Squad)
20 MF Mathieu Flamini (Disposable)
21 DF Calum Chambers (Hot Prospect)
22 FW Yaya Sanogo (Disposable)
23 FW Danny Welbeck (Squad Player)
24 MF Abou Diaby (Disposable)
26 GK Emiliano Martínez (Disposable)
27 FW Serge Gnabry (Hot Prospect)
28 FW Joel Campbell (Hot Prospect)
35 MF Gedion Zelalem (Meh, Hot prospect means potentially fantastic)
38 FW Chuba Akpom (Meh, Hot prospect means potentially fantastic)
39 DF Héctor Bellerín (Hot Prospect)
42 DF Isaac Hayden (Meh, Hot prospect means potentially fantastic)

Ken Shamrock

greendom wrote: »

I'm not buying the 10 year rubbish and each time I see it I will refute it. Based on the reduced funds available to Arsene, 8 of those 10 years were as successful as the pre Emirates period.

Keeping the club in the champions league and in the top 4 when Chelsea and City got bankrolled and the opposite happened at Arsenal deserves far more credit than it gets.

That is just ridiculous, If you want to kid yourself then fire away. He did a good job, for a while, then he dropped off very consistently i might add. As the squad got better and funds became available our position never changed, our trophy cabinet never changed, with 1 exception.

The idea he kept Wycombe Wanderers in the top 4 is just insane, he had one of the most talented squads in europe for most of that time, he was unable to get them to produce their best and he was unable to motivate them. He was also unable to strengthen in the right areas.

We still haven't replaced Pat Vieira, or Sol Campbell and it doesn't look like we will anytime soon. You can't continue to think that we're just unlucky or disadvantaged every year. It's no coincidence that we are where we are.