"Upper" & "Lower" Streets...

WetDaddy

In my 33 years, I haven't figured out exactly what the difference is here. Is one closer to, say, the GPO (Abbey St.) or the Liffey (Mount St.(s))? Some run parallel (Leeson St.) to the river, so it's hard to tell.

I would hope there's a simple answer I just haven't figured out yet, but then again...

Riskymove

Lower is closer to the river

If parallel then lower is the one nearest the bay


btw Leeson st is not parallel to the river, it runs sw

WetDaddy

At last! Order!

That's great, thanks for the explanation. Yes, you're right about Leeson St. technically not running parallel. I was thinking of it more in a typical gridiron layout fashion, simplifying it a bit for myself.

Now, the only challenge is remembering it... Thanks again!

Lovely Bloke

it's not hard to remember. You go "down to the river"

WetDaddy

Yes, but you swim "upstream"...

I'm joking, although I do like telling people the mnemonic for stalactites and stalagmites is "Stalagmites MIGHT grow down from the ceiling, but they DON'T."

whiskeyman

WetDaddy wrote: »

I'm joking, although I do like telling people the mnemonic for stalactites and stalagmites is "Stalagmites MIGHT grow down from the ceiling, but they DON'T."

I preferred that stalagtites hold on tight so their wont fall from the ceiling!

WetDaddy

whiskeyman wrote: »

I preferred that stalagtites hold on tight so their wont fall from the ceiling!

Yeah, that was the one I learned as well (and that stalagmites "grow up with all their MITE (sic)". I just like mixing them around to confuse people. Cutting off Peter's nose to spite Paul's face.

miamee

WetDaddy wrote: »

Yes, but you swim "upstream"...

I'm joking, although I do like telling people the mnemonic for stalactites and stalagmites is "Stalagmites MIGHT grow down from the ceiling, but they DON'T."

The way I was taught was StalaGmites are on the Ground, StalaCtites are on the Ceiling. Easy peasy :pac:

Great to know about Upper and Lower too, another one here who never had it figured out

Tigerbaby

had a Geography teacher way back in the '70s tell us ;

"As the Mites grow up the Tights come down"..

never forgot it.

Ethan.Saaris

Riskymove wrote: »

Lower is closer to the river

If parallel then lower is the one nearest the bay

This is really interesting, I'll be able to orientate myself easier now.

I initially thought "upper" might be up the hill, but it's no longer the case as some streets are at the same level from one end to another.

BowWow

Tigerbaby wrote: »

had a Geography teacher way back in the '70s tell us ;

"As the Mites grow up the Tights come down"..

never forgot it.

I think we must have gone to the same school!

Hrududu

BowWow wrote: »

I think we must have gone to the same school!

And me only it was our science teacher that told us. Never forgot it

tricky D

There's a bit of an exception to this for Baggot St. Lower and Upper. Lower is closer to town, upriver and at higher elevation. Any body know why?

ProudDUB

I always thought it was in reference to a street that was close to, or bisected by a river or a canal & the main bridge over it. If the street were north of that, you were "upper" and if you were south of it, you were "lower". That would make sense for Abbey St and O'Connell Bridge over the Liffey. Does that hold too for the likes of Leeson St & Baggot St? I'm trying to picture them in my head, but it's late & I can't.

JuliusCaesar

'Down to the river' is how I remember it - but the relevant bit of the river is O'Connell Bridge/city centre. So that holds for Baggot St Lower: it's closer to the city centre than Baggot St Upper.

As for North Great Georges St and South Great Georges St, which are miles away from each other - one is on the north side, the other on the south side. I think there's a Nth and Sth Frederick St which are also geographically apart.

Qualitymark

You walk towards the Liffey when you walk down from Upper Baggot Street and down along Lower Baggot Street.
It's hidden now that we're walking along streets full of buildings, but a lot of these roads were first made when Dublin was still a hilly green place, and in their naming the fact of walking downhill to the river was remembered.

Avada

I always thought it was closest to GPO. Isn't that the method that they use for distances on road signs as well?

athtrasna

Upper and Lower Mount Street are parallel which I've always thought to be very strange

rolliepoley

Lower Mount st is closest to the liffey and as for Baggot st , Leeson st and Grandcanal st the canal splits them up into upr and lwr.

Victor

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

'Down to the river' is how I remember it - but the relevant bit of the river is O'Connell Bridge/city centre. So that holds for Baggot St Lower: it's closer to the city centre than Baggot St Upper.

Generally, 'lower' will be nearer O'Connell Bridge, not the river or the bay. The two exceptions I know of are Dorset Street and the nearby Sherrard Street.

As for North Great Georges St and South Great Georges St, which are miles away from each other - one is on the north side, the other on the south side. I think there's a Nth and Sth Frederick St which are also geographically apart.

Generally, if there is a direction in a name, it is relative to O'Connell Bridge, hence Richmond Street North, Brunswick Street North, North Great Charles Street, etc. are on the north side of the city.

Cathmandooo

Never copped this before, very interesting. Thought of Mount Street first and sure enough when looking at the map Mount Street Lower is nearer O'Connell Bridge.

Victor wrote: »

Generally, 'lower' will be nearer O'Connell Bridge, not the river or the bay. The two exceptions I know of are Dorset Street and the nearby Sherrard Street.

Any idea why Dorset Street and Sherrard Street are the wrong way around?

spurious

Cathmandooo wrote: »

Any idea why Dorset Street and Sherrard Street are the wrong way around?

They are governed by the canal I think.

Aard

I always thought that the upper/lower designation was purely based on altitude - literally whether one street was higher or lower than the other. I think this works for Dorset Street too -- Dorset Lower is on a hill down to the canal.

uch

When I did my PSV license we were told that Lower is nearer the River

Hootanany

I would have thought that the upper had higher numbers than the lower part as in lower starts a 1 upper ends at 500

Cathmandooo

Hootanany wrote: »

I would have thought that the upper had higher numbers than the lower part as in lower starts a 1 upper ends at 500

Off the top of my head any streets with upper and lower have two sets of numbers. For example 10 Lower Leeson Street is different to 10 Upper Leeson Street.

Aard

Just while we're at it, I must say I love these quirks of street naming/numbering in Ireland. Between discontinuous upper/lowers (e.g. Merrion Street), parralel (Mount St), only one of the two (Upper Ely Place), being separated by bridges (Baggot St)... and more I'm sure if I looked at a map long enough! It gives such variety to the layout of the city compared to North American or Australian streets. It may be confusing, but I think it ultimately adds to the charm of the place

Ste-

Aard wrote: »

Just while we're at it, I must say I love these quirks of street naming/numbering in Ireland. Between discontinuous upper/lowers (e.g. Merrion Street), parralel (Mount St), only one of the two (Upper Ely Place), being separated by bridges (Baggot St)... and more I'm sure if I looked at a map long enough! It gives such variety to the layout of the city compared to North American or Australian streets. It may be confusing, but I think it ultimately adds to the charm of the place

Like Father Ted and the magic road kind of way ?

Qualitymark

Aard wrote: »

Just while we're at it, I must say I love these quirks of street naming/numbering in Ireland. Between discontinuous upper/lowers (e.g. Merrion Street), parralel (Mount St), only one of the two (Upper Ely Place), being separated by bridges (Baggot St)... and more I'm sure if I looked at a map long enough! It gives such variety to the layout of the city compared to North American or Australian streets. It may be confusing, but I think it ultimately adds to the charm of the place

Not to mention the 1901 census often has street numbers in the hundreds on streets with few houses

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Dublin/Rathmines___Rathgar_East/Oakley_Road/

Victor

Qualitymark wrote: »

Not to mention the 1901 census often has street numbers in the hundreds on streets with few houses

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Dublin/Rathmines___Rathgar_East/Oakley_Road/

Oakley Road is only 400 metres long. There are about 50 houses currently (not including side roads or apartment developments), with slightly fewer houses 100 years ago: http://maps.osi.ie/publicviewer/#V1,716136,731807,7,9

So those numbers aren't house numbers, or at least they aren't only house numbers - some other number has been added.

hardCopy

Aard wrote: »

Just while we're at it, I must say I love these quirks of street naming/numbering in Ireland. Between discontinuous upper/lowers (e.g. Merrion Street), parralel (Mount St), only one of the two (Upper Ely Place), being separated by bridges (Baggot St)... and more I'm sure if I looked at a map long enough! It gives such variety to the layout of the city compared to North American or Australian streets. It may be confusing, but I think it ultimately adds to the charm of the place

I'd love to know why CamdenWicklowAungierGeorge's Street needs so many names.