New changes to the testing of vintage Cars/Trucks?

pryantcc

alastair wrote: »

But that doesn't mean it's illegal, or there's anything that would mean it shouldn't be allowed on the road. And unless all NCT staff are briefed on the complexities of what chassis/body swaps are viable/legal, it wouldn't really help identify abuses of the law.

That's a very good point Alastair. I guess the only illegal ones are the "taxed as a 1.2" brigade which is not so blatantly easy to spot

alastair

pryantcc wrote: »

I think for basic things like tyre age & condition, lighting (functionality rather than performance), structural integrity, brake balance, brake line/linkage condition, you can certainly apply a universal methodology too. It doesn't have to be really fancy, just basic safety.
It's also important to note that nobody is suggesting applying the current modern NCT test to old cars, it would be a modified version specifically for cars in this age group.

The nature of the modified test, and who is best placed to do it would be the real question then. My modern(ish) car has an unorthodox bonnet removal process - which stymied the NCT tester last time I brought it in - the bonnet was never opened, and the car passed regardless. It doesn't impart too much confidence in the quality of test that strange old cars with legacy technologies would have to endure. The universality of a test that needs to account for cars with brass carbide lanterns and no indicators to the complexity of figuring out where the linkages are for anything in a Citroen SM is bit doubtful imo.

Kenny Logins

alastair wrote: »

Good point. There's still nothing stopping the dodgy owner fixing in their own VIN plate however, as there's no cross-checking of the VIN plate with the chassis as part of the NCT test.

No.

I actually came across a request for equipment to make VIN plates this morning, by somebody in the classic car/truck business here in Ireland.

alastair

Kenny Logins wrote: »

No.

I actually came across a request for equipment to make VIN plates this morning, by somebody in the classic car/truck business here in Ireland.

Blanks are readily found on ebay etc - for whatever marque. It's no great challenge for the determined elephant-driver.

pryantcc

alastair wrote: »

The nature of the modified test, and who is best placed to do it would be the real question then. My modern(ish) car has an unorthodox bonnet removal process - which stymied the NCT tester last time I brought it in - the bonnet was never opened, and the car passed regardless. It doesn't impart too much confidence in the quality of test that strange old cars with legacy technologies would have to endure. The universality of a test that needs to account for cars with brass carbide lanterns and no indicators to the complexity of figuring out where the linkages are for anything in a Citroen SM is bit doubtful imo.

From the questionnaire they are using, it looks like pre-1960 will remain exempt so you'd be talking 1960 to 1980. They ask responders to pick an option:

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Option 1 (exempt pre-1960 vehicles),
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Option 2 (exempt pre-1980 vehicles),
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Option 3 (exempt vehicles over 40 years old)
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]or
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Option 4 (exempt vehicles over 30 years old)[/FONT]

alastair

pryantcc wrote: »

From the questionnaire they are using, it looks like pre-1960 will remain exempt so you'd be talking 1960 to 1980. They ask responders to pick an option:

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Option 1 (exempt pre-1960 vehicles),
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Option 2 (exempt pre-1980 vehicles),
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Option 3 (exempt vehicles over 40 years old)
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]or
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Option 4 (exempt vehicles over 30 years old)[/FONT]

That simplifies matters a bit - aside from the hornet's nest that is the Citroen SM.

The Big Red Fella

alastair wrote: »

Blanks are readily found on ebay etc - for whatever marque. It's no great challenge for the determined elephant-driver.

Well it is nice to have a brand new vin for your classic like i have along with the original!
we are not all crooks !!!
i dont like this thread i will never nct my classics which i built myself to the highest standard & i do know what im doing & hell will freeze over before anyone else gets to test MY cars which i know are perfect its just another cash cow for this poxy diseased government!!!

hi5

The new Cooper cobra raised white letter tyres on my Mustang will fail straight away, no E mark:(

Means Of Escape

It's never the car, it's the monkey who drives it .

draycottgirlz

alastair wrote: »

I've replied. As a comment, I referenced the noticeable lack of an issue with road traffic accidents involving classics. If the brief is to save lives, this doesn't seem to be a priority area.

There's some heaps dragged along to shows alright, but it's questionable that they've posed much risk to road users to date, and conversely, most classics are, by definition, going to be less safe than modern cars for their occupants, even if in perfect shape. It's never going to be a motoring niche that's not at odds with the RSA's mandate.

We all need to reply. This has the potential to kill the vintage scene.
Costs will only go through the roof, not to mention that cars will be killed by those NCT testers....

I say no no no....

Option 4 all the way....!!!!

Grimreaper666

hi5 wrote: »

The new Cooper cobra raised white letter tyres on my Mustang will fail straight away, no E mark:(

Just change them on the day of the test. The "E" mark thing is a load of cobblers anyway much like most of the EU crap being imposed on us.

alastair

The Big Red Fella wrote: »

Well it is nice to have a brand new vin for your classic like i have along with the original!
we are not all crooks !!!
i dont like this thread i will never nct my classics which i built myself to the highest standard & i do know what im doing & hell will freeze over before anyone else gets to test MY cars which i know are perfect its just another cash cow for this poxy diseased government!!!

Where is the revenue stream for the government? The NCT is profitable for Applus for sure, but I'm not seeing where the govt cash cow is.

Silvera

pryantcc wrote: »

I think for basic things like tyre age & condition, lighting (functionality rather than performance), structural integrity, brake balance, brake line/linkage condition, you can certainly apply a universal methodology too. It doesn't have to be really fancy, just basic safety. It's also important to note that nobody is suggesting applying the current modern NCT test to old cars, it would be a modified version specifically for cars in this age group.

I agree....as I stated before ....basic, basic, basic.... checks!

(I also believe that tractors and trailers (ALL trailers) should be NCT/CVRT checked. Many countries already have car trailer checks in place for many years).

dougie-lampkin

hi5 wrote: »

The new Cooper cobra raised white letter tyres on my Mustang will fail straight away, no E mark:(

Vehicles registered prior to 1980 are not required to have e-marked tyres

Traumadoc

The reason these cars have such low insurance is the low claims against them.

If the RSA want to introduce criteria for testing vehicles, it will have little to do with impact on road safety.

Means Of Escape

Traumadoc wrote: »

The reason these cars have such low insurance is the low claims against them.

If the RSA want to introduce criteria for testing vehicles, it will have little to do with impact on road safety.[/QUO

If there was compelling evidence that despite the low numbers of vintage cars and the mileage they cover were causing carnage on our roads I would see it as being a valid proposal
As it stands this is not the case and unless the RSA can prove otherwise it should be shot down.

Has anyone been killed driving a vintage car in a reckless manner even in the last 20 years?

jca

Means Of Escape wrote: »

Traumadoc wrote: »

The reason these cars have such low insurance is the low claims against them.

If the RSA want to introduce criteria for testing vehicles, it will have little to do with impact on road safety.[/QUO

If there was compelling evidence that despite the low numbers of vintage cars and the mileage they cover were causing carnage on our roads I would see it as being a valid proposal
As it stands this is not the case and unless the RSA can prove otherwise it should be shot down.

Has anyone been killed driving a vintage car in a reckless manner even in the last 20 years?

Maybe no one has been killed driving a vintage vehicle but I've sure seen many dodgy ones at field days etc. They certainly wouldn't pass even the most basic of NCT tests.

The Big Red Fella

Thats the place for them parked in fields at shows etc & as i have said before you wont see the good cars at shows!

whisky_galore

Means Of Escape wrote: »

Traumadoc wrote: »

Has anyone been killed driving a vintage car in a reckless manner even in the last 20 years?

Not aware of anyone in a vintage car, however there was a vintage tractor safety campaign that got to govt level following a fatality that melted into inaction.

Silvera

whisky_galore wrote: »

Means Of Escape wrote: »

Not aware of anyone in a vintage car, however there was a vintage tractor safety campaign that got to govt level following a fatality that melted into inaction.

Was that related to the 'talk' of enforcing the fitment of roll-over bars to all tractors?

Silvera

The Big Red Fella wrote: »

Thats the place for them parked in fields at shows etc & as i have said before you wont see the good cars at shows!

Bit harsh is it not?
....lots of 'good'/great cars on display at shows.

johnty56

Lots of talk on this forum from people suggesting that all classics should be tested, who obviously own post 1980 cars. I would bet that if they owned pre 1980 cars they would be screaming for the exemption to stay.

Just good old fashioned Irish begrudgery at play.

The NCT is a joke..

adunis

Mine is 1978, I have no problem with it being tested in fact I welcome it because it's a range rover,testing might get rid of all its dodgy cousins

WDB123

will they be testing tractors and trailers???

whisky_galore

Silvera wrote: »

whisky_galore wrote: »

Was that related to the 'talk' of enforcing the fitment of roll-over bars to all tractors?

At the risk of veering OT...Yes, but generally speaking it's pretty unknown for a modern tractor (post 70's-ish) to have been sold minus some sort of a safety cab. Don't think newer generations of farmers were willing to rough it and get soaked. On the other hand something like a steel wheeled 1920s relic would look pretty damn stupid with ROP and it might not be even physically possible to fit without drastic cutting and pasting. Trailers (double axled ones over certain capacity only afaik) do have to meet certain standards before being permitted to be left onto the road legally, any talk of bringing tractors incl modern ones under the testing umbrella would be fought hard by the farming organisations I dare say.

Silvera

WDB123 wrote: »

will they be testing tractors and trailers???

I'd say in the coming years we will see basic testing of tractors and trailers.
(Many countries already do so).

However, IMO, they should do some sort of testing of 16yr old tractor drivers before they start worrying about testing tractors. How it makes sense to let a 16 yr old drive (on a learner permit - without any training!) a JCB Fastrac towing a low-loader with 30 ton digger onboard defies logic!

whisky_galore

Silvera wrote: »

However, IMO, they should do some sort of testing of 16yr old tractor drivers before they start worrying about testing tractors. How it makes sense to let a 16 yr old (on a learner permit) drive - without any training - a JCB Fastrac towing a low-loader with 30 ton digger onboard defies logic!

That has crossed my mind, that something the size of a wee grey Fergie is classed on a par with a modern day monster is faintly ridiculous.

mannurse

Cringe at the thought of putting my modern car through the test. Not a hope of some ape climbing into any of my classics regardless of what they are doing.
For the person that mentioned other european countries having competent testers, showing empathy; they are bound to when you are sitting in the car for the vast majority of the test, as they do in Spain for example.

Means Of Escape

Silvera wrote: »

I'd say in the coming years we will see basic testing of tractors and trailers.
(Many countries already do so).

However, IMO, they should do some sort of testing of 16yr old tractor drivers before they start worrying about testing tractors. How it makes sense to let a 16 yr old drive (on a learner permit - without any training!) a JCB Fastrac towing a low-loader with 30 ton digger onboard defies logic!

And on a country road yapping on a phone

WDB123

Are we having a protest rally before they shaft us ???????