Dublin House Prices 2015

Michael D Not Higgins

lima wrote: »

Haha wow

It's pretty clear to me that all the 60+ people in my area are sitting pretty in luxurious houses that they bought for nothing back in the day, which are worth millions now. That's a pretty easy life.

So basically, just because women earn money now then houses prices should double and triple? It really seems idiotic. Unfortunately the people in charge did not seem to plan for the future and so Dublin has remained a city squeezed into a 'town'. Such that biddys and farts are living in inner-suburban mansions where high-rise apartments should be like they are in every other city.

How is it an easy life if they struggled through high interest rates, etc in pursuit of their house? How is it an easy life if the house is worth a million and they can't do anything with it? Sure they can take another mortgage out on the house but that's far from ideal.

It may seem idiotic to you, but it's basic economics that more money means more demand means higher prices, especially on an inelastic supply like property.

No country in the world would demolish the D6 redbricks in your area to build high rise apartments. Sure the government (and local government) made errors in their planning over the years, but that's one area they were right to leave as is.

lima

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

How is it an easy life if they struggled through high interest rates, etc in pursuit of their house? How is it an easy life if the house is worth a million and they can't do anything with it? Sure they can take another mortgage out on the house but that's far from ideal.

It may seem idiotic to you, but it's basic economics that more money means more demand means higher prices, especially on an inelastic supply like property.

No country in the world would demolish the D6 redbricks in your area to build high rise apartments. Sure the government (and local government) made errors in their planning over the years, but that's one area they were right to leave as is.

But sure didn't it all work out for them, they now own large million euro properties in a city where there are pretty much no houses. I'd definitely go through more that what they did to own such lavish property.

Michael D Not Higgins

lima wrote: »

But sure didn't it all work out for them, they now own large million euro properties in a city where there are pretty much no houses. I'd definitely go through more that what they did to own such lavish property.

Oh for the love of god stop whinging about what other people have. We all have our problems and struggles and some people have more than others and life isn't fair, blah blah blah. But just because someone has a nice house that they managed to get cheap enough 40 years ago and have cleared the mortgage on doesn't mean they don't have struggles and doesn't mean you're in any way entitled to it or similar.

You say you're willing to go through more. So do it. Work harder, earn more money, and buy a nice house that will be worth much more than you purchased it at in 30 years time.

lima

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

Oh for the love of god stop whinging about what other people have. We all have our problems and struggles and some people have more than others and life isn't fair, blah blah blah. But just because someone has a nice house that they managed to get cheap enough 40 years ago and have cleared the mortgage on doesn't mean they don't have struggles and doesn't mean you're in any way entitled to it or similar.

You say you're willing to go through more. So do it. Work harder, earn more money, and buy a nice house that will be worth much more than you purchased it at in 30 years time.

I am not whinging, it seems like you are getting stressed because this differs from your point of view.

'blah blah blah' is not constructive input.

Whether or not these people have other struggles is irrelevant.

I hold no sense of entitlement to anything.

I perhaps do go through more. An Engineering Degree is pretty hard. I emigrated on my own for 7 years to gain work experience. I worked since I was 15 to pay my way in what way I could. I have never gotten help from anyone bar pocket money and 2.5 months on the dole once. I am a potential first time buyer who is cruelly getting priced out of the market by wicked vested interests who are trying to maintain the assets of the middle class. I came back after you all 'partied' to find services reduced and taxes raised.
I am also in the process of working much harder than many of the older generation to get what I want. In fairness I do earn good money and I will earn a lot more, and I will shortly own property, but I am pretty sure I will work a lot harder to get it than Maura and Derek who just happened to buy at a time when Ireland was moving from 3rd world to 1st world.

Michael D Not Higgins

Maura and Derek had to live and work in '3rd world' Ireland to get what they have now. You have much more than they did back then. A better standard of living, a better education, better prospects in general. Don't begrudge them.

I'm in a very similar position to you. Engineering degree, have emigrated (still abroad at the moment), but I don't begrudge Ireland's previous generation for their relatively minor successes. I do blame the ones in charge during the bubble for the heavy reliance on property related tax income and overheated market. Should the system have been properly regulated and planned for, we might have had better quality, higher density housing that would have serviced the needs of people in Dublin, instead of the property developers and politicians.

by the seaside

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

How is it an easy life if they struggled through high interest rates, etc in pursuit of their house? How is it an easy life if the house is worth a million and they can't do anything with it?

They can sell the house and move to a smaller house, cashing in. They may not want to, but it is incorrect to say 'they can't do anything with it'.

The_Morrigan

by the seaside wrote: »

They can sell the house and move to a smaller house, cashing in. They may not want to, but it is incorrect to say 'they can't do anything with it'.

What is the fascination with booting people out of their family homes to smaller places? If my parents downsized there would be nowhere for us to stay for family events or Christmas etc.
We have all grown up and moved out, but there are times when we are all at home and the house is full of people, kids and dogs. That isn't going to work if they left the four bed bungalow to downsize to a 1 bed apartment.

ted1

lima wrote: »

I am not whinging, it seems like you are getting stressed because this differs from your point of view.

'blah blah blah' is not constructive input.

Whether or not these people have other struggles is irrelevant.

I hold no sense of entitlement to anything.

I perhaps do go through more. An Engineering Degree is pretty hard. I emigrated on my own for 7 years to gain work experience. I worked since I was 15 to pay my way in what way I could. I have never gotten help from anyone bar pocket money and 2.5 months on the dole once. I am a potential first time buyer who is cruelly getting priced out of the market by wicked vested interests who are trying to maintain the assets of the middle class. I came back after you all 'partied' to find services reduced and taxes raised.
I am also in the process of working much harder than many of the older generation to get what I want. In fairness I do earn good money and I will earn a lot more, and I will shortly own property, but I am pretty sure I will work a lot harder to get it than Maura and Derek who just happened to buy at a time when Ireland was moving from 3rd world to 1st world.

Your posts are coming across as whinging with alot of begrudgery. I too have an engineering degree (+ a MSc) I wont begrudge people living in their family home who have paid their dues to society worked hard and can now relax in their surroundings. The world doesn't owe you anything, why are you expecting it too?
You have yet to buy a home, for a lot of people these homes you speak of are as a result of being on the ladder and trading up. Not many would have bought one as their first home

by the seaside

The_Morrigan wrote: »

What is the fascination with booting people out of their family homes to smaller places? If my parents downsized there would be nowhere for us to stay for family events or Christmas etc.
We have all grown up and moved out, but there are times when we are all at home and the house is full of people, kids and dogs. That isn't going to work if they left the four bed bungalow to downsize to a 1 bed apartment.

I don't think correcting an obvious error that stated 'they can't do anything with it' equates to 'booting people out of their family house'. Neither is there a binary choice between a four bed bungalow and a 1 bed apartment. Or am I missing something?

The_Morrigan

by the seaside wrote: »

I don't think correcting an obvious error that stated 'they can't do anything with it' equates to 'booting people out of their family house'. Neither is there a binary choice between a four bed bungalow and a 1 bed apartment. Or am I missing something?

The attitude is that as a two person family they no longer need the 3/4 bed house that all the FTBs are seeking and they should downsize to something more suitable to them...ie not a big family home but a 1 bed.
The point I'm trying to make is that they should not have to downsize whether capable or not.
The family home is just that....just because the fledglings have flown the nest doesn't mean they don't return.

by the seaside

The_Morrigan wrote: »

The attitude is that as a two person family they no longer need the 3/4 bed house that all the FTBs are seeking and they should downsize to something more suitable to them...ie not a big family home but a 1 bed.
The point I'm trying to make is that they should not have to downsize whether capable or not.
The family home is just that....just because the fledglings have flown the nest doesn't mean they don't return.

They don't have to, but they can. The OP made out they had no choices.

But it's a shame the conversation has to be so binary: stay in their big house forever vs being booted into a 1 bed apartment. Where there is limited housing stock in places like Dublin, it does make sense to give incentives to retirees to downsize. Yes it's nice to have space at Christmas, but 95% of year these rooms are unused when there are families living in overly small accommodation or far away with big commutes. I'm sure if there was a political will, incentives could be found - waive stamp duty for retirees down sizing, refund property taxes for the last two years, think of something else until there is an effect.

The_Morrigan

by the seaside wrote: »

They don't have to, but they can. The OP made out they had no choices.

But it's a shame the conversation has to be so binary: stay in their big house forever vs being booted into a 1 bed apartment. Where there is limited housing stock in places like Dublin, it does make sense to give incentives to retirees to downsize. Yes it's nice to have space at Christmas, but 95% of year these rooms are unused when there are families living in overly small accommodation or far away with big commutes. I'm sure if there was a political will, incentives could be found - waive stamp duty for retirees down sizing, refund property taxes for the last two years, think of something else until there is an effect.

That might work if the family all lived in the same town/city. It won't work if you have kids and grandchildren who have moved across the country or world. In my situation I have a 2 bed apartment in Dublin; I head home to my parents every few weeks. My brother and his wife are in the same county as my parents, but they will stay over if a few drinks are had at a dinner. My other brother is no longer in Ireland and when he comes home he isn't going to stay in a hotel for 2-3 weeks with his wife and kid when his old room is there still.
I think some people forget this side of the big family homes that have pensioners rattling around in them. My parents generation don't give up family homes because they still want their kids and grandkids to be able to stay.

gaius c

The_Morrigan wrote: »

What is the fascination with booting people out of their family homes to smaller places? If my parents downsized there would be nowhere for us to stay for family events or Christmas etc.
We have all grown up and moved out, but there are times when we are all at home and the house is full of people, kids and dogs. That isn't going to work if they left the four bed bungalow to downsize to a 1 bed apartment.

They sure as hell won't be able to stay at their kid's place for xmas anyway.

The Spider

lima wrote: »

I am not whinging, it seems like you are getting stressed because this differs from your point of view.

'blah blah blah' is not constructive input.

Whether or not these people have other struggles is irrelevant.

I hold no sense of entitlement to anything.

I perhaps do go through more. An Engineering Degree is pretty hard. I emigrated on my own for 7 years to gain work experience. I worked since I was 15 to pay my way in what way I could. I have never gotten help from anyone bar pocket money and 2.5 months on the dole once. I am a potential first time buyer who is cruelly getting priced out of the market by wicked vested interests who are trying to maintain the assets of the middle class. I came back after you all 'partied' to find services reduced and taxes raised.
I am also in the process of working much harder than many of the older generation to get what I want. In fairness I do earn good money and I will earn a lot more, and I will shortly own property, but I am pretty sure I will work a lot harder to get it than Maura and Derek who just happened to buy at a time when Ireland was moving from 3rd world to 1st world.

Lot of nonsense, when people bought those houses Ireland was a basket case, no jobs a war in the north and a small percentage of people went to college. Why should anyone move out or sell up, just because you or anyone else id finding it difficult to buy a house in an area you feel you deserve to live.

You have options with your education, you could move to Cork or another urban center and buy your ideal house, but let me guess you'd like to be close to family etc. well tough luck buddy those houses are now beyond your reach, so you'll need to assess what you want, if you want to live in Dublin and have access to what you see as high paying jobs then you'll have to get one that pays you enough to accommodate the lifestyle you feel you deserve, otherwise buy what you can afford.

If you want a big house then move out of Dublin and get a job that may not pay the same but you'll be able to get the big house. Ironically enough that'll, put you in still a better position than the previous generation, and who knows in twenty years time the house could be worth a million too, then you'll be happy as you'd have made sacrifices for your ideal house, not as many as previous generations mind you.

The_Morrigan

gaius c wrote: »

They sure as hell won't be able to stay at their kid's place for xmas anyway.

Actually, in our case my parents would. We all have properties with at least one spare room.
But my siblings and myself wouldn't have room for the entire family.

by the seaside

The_Morrigan wrote: »

That might work if the family all lived in the same town/city. It won't work if you have kids and grandchildren who have moved across the country or world. In my situation I have a 2 bed apartment in Dublin; I head home to my parents every few weeks. My brother and his wife are in the same county as my parents, but they will stay over if a few drinks are had at a dinner. My other brother is no longer in Ireland and when he comes home he isn't going to stay in a hotel for 2-3 weeks with his wife and kid when his old room is there still.
I think some people forget this side of the big family homes that have pensioners rattling around in them. My parents generation don't give up family homes because they still want their kids and grandkids to be able to stay.

Lot's of things "don't work". Holding a big family Christmases in a small house doesn't work. Families living in cramped accommodation doesn't work. Couples putting off having kids doesn't work. Kids spending long days in child care because their parents have long commutes doesn't work.

Out of all these things that don't work, it should be manageable to use tax and tax break levers to change the balance.

lima

ted1 wrote: »

Your posts are coming across as whinging with alot of begrudgery. I too have an engineering degree (+ a MSc) I wont begrudge people living in their family home who have paid their dues to society worked hard and can now relax in their surroundings. The world doesn't owe you anything, why are you expecting it too?
You have yet to buy a home, for a lot of people these homes you speak of are as a result of being on the ladder and trading up. Not many would have bought one as their first home

I am not whinging. My point has developed to me giving my opinion that we probably work harder now for much less than what people in the 70/80's did. I'd be quite surprised if we earn such a windfall on our properties in 30/40 years time. We'll still be working past 65 and we have no idea what our pensions will be like with more older people in the future.

I am not sure what you mean by paying dues to society. What does one owe to society other than tax?

Good on you for having your BEng and Masters. I am not expecting anything from the world. Actually, I am proactive rather than reactive and as such I work hard and strive for progress. When I think of people expecting things from the world I think of those people in negative equity claiming that 'de banks took der money'. I have more than paid back the costs for my university education, and I am now paying for the muppets who 'partied' in 'de boom'.

I would get upset when large amounts of the middle class have benefited from house price rises while at the same time they lobby for debt forgiveness etc. Meanwhile young, proactive, hard workers lose opportunities to 'get on the ladder' because of them. The greedy investment property owners then see an opportunity to milk things further so they increase rent.. young ones lost even more opportunities..

ffactj

lima wrote: »

I am not whinging. My point has developed to me giving my opinion that we probably work harder now for much less than what people in the 70/80's did. I'd be quite surprised if we earn such a windfall on our properties in 30/40 years time. We'll still be working past 65 and we have no idea what our pensions will be like with more older people in the future.

I am not sure what you mean by paying dues to society. What does one owe to society other than tax?

Good on you for having your BEng and Masters. I am not expecting anything from the world. Actually, I am proactive rather than reactive and as such I work hard and strive for progress. When I think of people expecting things from the world I think of those people in negative equity claiming that 'de banks took der money'. I have more than paid back the costs for my university education, and I am now paying for the muppets who 'partied' in 'de boom'.

I would get upset when large amounts of the middle class have benefited from house price rises while at the same time they lobby for debt forgiveness etc. Meanwhile young, proactive, hard workers lose opportunities to 'get on the ladder' because of them. The greedy investment property owners then see an opportunity to milk things further so they increase rent.. young ones lost even more opportunities..

To be honest I feel sorry for you Lima. You really cant see how you are coming across, can you.

Why dont we try to help you out then.
Why dont you post how much you have to spend and we'll find a house you can afford in an area you can afford. You would be surprised how easy that is to do.

ted1

ffactj wrote: »

To be honest I feel sorry for you Lima. You really cant see how you are coming across, can you.

Why dont we try to help you out then.
Why dont you post how much you have to spend and we'll find a house you can afford in an area you can afford. You would be surprised how easy that is to do.

He'll never buy, ( in ireland) he has being on here giving out for years,

ted1

by the seaside wrote: »

They can sell the house and move to a smaller house, cashing in. They may not want to, but it is incorrect to say 'they can't do anything with it'.

Unfortunately the 700+ market isn't as buoyant as the 300+ market and for what they sell they will get very little in return. so there is little inventivr to sell

Dr Turk Turkelton

Here ya go Lima, bit of a commute but I assume this is the sort of price you want to get on the market at.
I'd say if you have a turbo diesel you can close tomorrow.

http://www.donedeal.ie/view/7151480

by the seaside

ted1 wrote: »

Unfortunately the 700+ market isn't as buoyant as the 300+ market and for what they sell they will get very little in return. so there is little inventivr to sell

Sounds like they'd get a 400k return.

ted1

by the seaside wrote: »

Sounds like they'd get a 400k return.

But selling a big 5 bed with good gardens in a very good location to get a 1 or 2 bed shoe box isn't a good return.

lima

ffactj wrote: »

To be honest I feel sorry for you Lima. You really cant see how you are coming across, can you.

Why dont we try to help you out then.
Why dont you post how much you have to spend and we'll find a house you can afford in an area you can afford. You would be surprised how easy that is to do.

You don't have to feel sorry for me, as I said it's a first world problem so I'm not in pain or anything.

I hardly need help, other than perhaps an acknowledgement that people understand the situation we are in and keep it in mind. Many people are working harder for less nowadays whilst some old people sit pretty in huge houses all over the city that will forever be out of reach. Moving to a non-built up area is generally a no because the government forgot to build infrastructure.

As for assisting in my property search, thanks but I can do that myself. My lifestyle does not align with the suburban culture so prevalent in Dublin and I am not interested in south Dublin so I am focused on some specific areas. The less you know the better to he honest.

lima

Dr Turk Turkelton wrote: »

Here ya go Lima, bit of a commute but I assume this is the sort of price you want to get on the market at.
I'd say if you have a turbo diesel you can close tomorrow.

http://www.donedeal.ie/view/7151480

:D:D

Haha naah your alright!

I'd hate to be the suckers who bought that!

Frank Lee Midere

lima wrote: »

You don't have to feel sorry for me, as I said it's a first world problem so I'm not in pain or anything.

I hardly need help, other than perhaps an acknowledgement that people understand the situation we are in and keep it in mind. Many people are working harder for less nowadays whilst some old people sit pretty in huge houses all over the city that will forever be out of reach. Moving to a non-built up area is generally a no because the government forgot to build infrastructure.

As for assisting in my property search, thanks but I can do that myself. My lifestyle does not align with the suburban culture so prevalent in Dublin and I am not interested in south Dublin so I am focused on some specific areas. The less you know the better to he honest.

Its not the older folks (although I agree they were a lucky generation). It's the recent boom time buyers who are getting their restructuring on your dime. Meanwhile you are asked to suck up the "free market" and cut your cloth to your measure.

Zamboni

I take Lima's point and don't think he is a whinge.
Perhaps a bit melodramatic sometimes..:pac:

Previously a one income family of a builder/factory worker/taxi driver could buy a typical 3 bed semi in places like Rathfarnham, Knocklyon, Glasnevin, Artane etc. in the 1980's and 1990's.
Sure interest rates were higher but they had a far higher quality of life and access to their offspring.

Nowadays you would need two professional salaries to buy the same houses.
Whilst also paying for childcare and seeing your children for an hour on the weekdays and at the weekends.

The bonus kick in the teeth to the people who didn't purchase during the "boom" is that they are now
a) paying high rents in an artificially inflated market and
b) also have the pleasure of paying taxes to keep Celtic Tiger cubs in houses that are unsustainably mortgaged.
c) if they do buy, paying higher interest rates to cover existing loss making trackers.

It is a crock of sh1t and there is no point in criticising Lima for looking behind the curtain.

The Spider

Zamboni wrote: »

I take Lima's point and don't think he is a whinge.
Perhaps a bit melodramatic sometimes..:pac:

Previously a one income family of a builder/factory worker/taxi driver could buy a typical 3 bed semi in places like Rathfarnham, Knocklyon, Glasnevin, Artane etc. in the 1980's and 1990's.
Sure interest rates were higher but they had a far higher quality of life and access to their offspring.

Nowadays you would need two professional salaries to buy the same houses.
Whilst also paying for childcare and seeing your children for an hour on the weekdays and at the weekends.

The bonus kick in the teeth to the people who didn't purchase during the "boom" is that they are now
a) paying high rents in an artificially inflated market and
b) also have the pleasure of paying taxes to keep Celtic Tiger cubs in houses that are unsustainably mortgaged.
c) if they do buy, paying higher interest rates to cover existing loss making trackers.

It is a crock of sh1t and there is no point in criticising Lima for looking behind the curtain.

Sigh! where do I even start on this, I'll give it a go. In the 80's there was a huge recession in Ireland, not many people had jobs and there was massive emigration, so yes those lucky enough to have a job could possibly have bought in Rathfarnham etc.

There were zero building jobs, the economy ground to a halt, the amount of people with a college education was miniscule, lot's of people didn't even do their leaving cert, instead leaving after the intercert to either work in a factory or try get a trade, for which there was no work.

The road network was non existant so you didn't have people coming up to Dublin as much shall we say. Ireland was an industrial country you still had jobs in factories like waterford crystal which employed the majority population in waterford at least.

There really are some silly assumptions from people who don't even seem to have a basic grasp of history in Ireland, I suggest you look at the following link to get just maybe a bare idea of what Ireland was like, when you suggest everyone was off buying mansions and only had one income.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_the_Republic_of_Ireland

Zamboni

The Spider wrote: »

you suggest everyone was off buying mansions and only had one income.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_the_Republic_of_Ireland

I wrote a reply and then deleted it because I'm not bothered wasting time with you.
You only come here to throw snide comments and remarks and use half intelligible sentences.
And you attribute statements like the one above where nothing of the like was said.
I have no time to entertain your posts.

The Spider

Zamboni wrote: »

I wrote a reply and then deleted it because I'm not bothered wasting time with you.
You only come here to throw snide comments and remarks and use half intelligible sentences.
And you attribute statements like the one above where nothing of the like was said.
I have no time to entertain your posts.

Well then stop posting nonsense about how good people had it in the 80's!:rolleyes: