Convicts who've served their time.

oceanman

Laois6556 wrote: »

So you're happy a rapist can get back to living life as normal only a few years after they committed their crime?

yes...he has served the sentence that the courts handed down!
what more do you want?

Lyger

Mrsmum wrote: »

Tbh I think we should be brutally hammering home a few real facts of life to young men and women and one brutal fact of life is that actions have consequences. So to young girls we should say yes technically you are entitled to be as drunk as you like but remember that then can result in someone else taking advantage because quite frankly they don't give a damn about you and your whole life can be ruined while you were too drunk to protect yourself. And young men need to realise that if you put yourself in a situation where to an unbiased jury you clearly are happy to have sex with a rag doll then wise up because there may be reprecussions when the rag doll wakes up. No point in boo hooing about it when you life is ruined afterwards. You may be able to convince yourself and your nearest and dearest that rape, as in stranger jumping out of the bushes, wasn't the intention but at the very least when you turn up at a hotel ready to have sex with a girl that you have never met or spoken one word to, a girl that your friend has just finished having sex with, a girl who is totally drunk and out of it, then in my book you can man up to the consequences also because if you put yourself in that he said she said situation then as many people will believe her as you.

Even if he was found not guilty, mud would stick. That's just life.

But he was found guilty. End of story.

I agree with a lot of this.
Nobody should have sex with someone who is unconscious - that's cut and dry - but it is stupid and irresponsible to get so wrecked that you black out too.

BrokenHero

Laois6556 wrote: »

This is exactly the attitude I've been talking about. Sickening. Even comparing eating food to being raped.

I didn't compare eating with being raped. Or at least, not in any way in which you are trying to suggest I did.

This woman has said she does not remember giving consent but she also does not remember eating anything that night.

I used sarcasm to make the point that just because something is not remembered, does not mean that it did not take place.

Holsten

oceanman wrote: »

yes...he has served the sentence that the courts handed down!
what more do you want?

It's pretty clear, he wants 20 years min and then a life on the dole afterwards.

osarusan

I don't have a problem with a person who has served a sentence being allowed to try and go back to work in the same field, or even the same job, as they had before (unless the job would somehow make the liklihood of reoffending almost inevitable).

I don't really see any reason to change my position on that because Evans happens to be able to work in a job that makes him well known and well paid.

Pwindedd

Cyber Ghost wrote: »

Football players are a bad role model for kids in general.

Stupid, materialistic, cheating, womanizing, etc

Agreed. It's a bubble their living in, some girls (the ones I think are NOT in their right minds) will actively chase a bloke purely because he's a footballer with a flash car and a thick wedge of cash on the hip. They'll happily be plied with drink and other substances and in exchange will put out. It's not very pleasant to think of, but it's the truth. We all know it goes on. And as long as both parties know the score and are up for it, then who am I to judge.

Then every once in a while it goes tits up for both said footballer and the girl involved. I'm not saying that's what happened here BTW. Just that every one needs to be very careful of the situations you get yourself into. Footballers are paid very large sums of money to represent and play for their club, they should be aware 24/7 of their perceived behaviour.

Do you think if I was to be convicted and serve jail time for a crime I could just turn up at my old place of work and expect to be taken back. I know my skillset is completely different (I'm a mere hutch bunny) but I'd expect to be shown the door! At the end of the day it's up to the hiring club. We'll see how it pans out no doubt.

cloud493

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Vick

In April 2007, Vick was implicated in an illegal interstate dog fighting ring that had operated for five years. A federal judge noted that he had promoted, funded, and facilitated a dog fighting ring on his property, and had engaged in hanging and drowning dogs who did not perform well. He also had failed to cooperate fully with police. In August 2007, Vick pleaded guilty to federal felony charges and served 21 months in prison, followed by two months in home confinement.[1][2][3] Hurt financially by the loss of his NFL salary and product endorsement deals, combined with previous financial mismanagement, Vick filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in July 2008.[4] Falcons owner Arthur Blank did not want Vick on his team, so the team released Vick after failing to trade him. He signed with the Philadelphia Eagles and was reinstated in Week 3 of the 2009 season.[5]

Recondite49

osarusan wrote: »

I don't have a problem with a person who has served a sentence being allowed to try and go back to work in the same field, or even the same job, as they had before (unless the job would somehow make the liklihood of reoffending almost inevitable).

I don't really see any reason to change my position on that because Evans happens to be able to work in a job that makes him well known and well paid.

A very good point osarsusan - would we be as upset about this if he cleaned the streets for a living? Would it even have appeared in the papers?

One eyed Jack

Recondite49 wrote: »

A very good point osarsusan - would we be as upset about this if he cleaned the streets for a living? Would it even have appeared in the papers?

I'm not personally upset by what anyone wants to do when they're released from prison (unless I was personally affected by it obviously. I think money will talk in this case, and clubs will weigh up what it's worth signing him against possible losses and bad PR), but as for would it have appeared in the papers if he'd worked a less high profile job? Possibly. Remember the story in the papers there a few weeks back about the ex-cons working in the locksmith shop?

No doubt too he will be constantly hounded on social media.

Piliger

BrokenHero wrote: »

In any case, I don't think for one second that Ched raped this girl. The "evidence" was a joke and before someone says 'well, he was found guilty': so was Barry George and not since that case had I got such a sense that a miscarriage of justice was taking place.

Incidentally, the man who helped free Barry George, Don Hale, also believes that Ched is innocent:

Exactly. We are living through a kangaroo court system now for accused men.

This man appears to have been found guilty on the basis of no actual evidence. And now the feminist hate campaign is trying to destroy his life and his ability to follow his profession. It is a despicable and sickening campaign that could well be compared to the very act of rape that is being claimed.

braddun

most rapist reoffend ,but if they served theier time that should be it


just give a long sentence at the start

Piliger

Mrsmum wrote: »

Tbh I think we should be brutally hammering home a few real facts of life to young men and women and one brutal fact of life is that actions have consequences. So to young girls we should say yes technically you are entitled to be as drunk as you like but remember that then can result in someone else taking advantage because quite frankly they don't give a damn about you and your whole life can be ruined while you were too drunk to protect yourself. And young men need to realise that if you put yourself in a situation where to an unbiased jury you clearly are happy to have sex with a rag doll then wise up because there may be reprecussions when the rag doll wakes up. No point in boo hooing about it when you life is ruined afterwards. You may be able to convince yourself and your nearest and dearest that rape, as in stranger jumping out of the bushes, wasn't the intention but at the very least when you turn up at a hotel ready to have sex with a girl that you have never met or spoken one word to, a girl that your friend has just finished having sex with, a girl who is totally drunk and out of it, then in my book you can man up to the consequences also because if you put yourself in that he said she said situation then as many people will believe her as you.

Even if he was found not guilty, mud would stick. That's just life.

But he was found guilty. End of story.

All well and good, but where is the evidence that she was unconscious ? And what kind of abhorrent justice system is it if it depends on being 'persuasive' ?
And this 'man up' rubbish is so deeply sexist and offensive it makes a mockery of all your arguments.
And being found guilty is clearly and self evidently not the end of the story btw.

_Brian

Gelatomela wrote: »

Fir a start people don't know that he is a rapist, there is much doubt surrounding his case. Have you actually not seen how much people despise rapists?

Actually he's a convicted rapist, he faced the justice system and he was found guilty. He's a rapist, unless the decision of the courts changes he'll remain guilty of rape forever.

Now he's a rapist that has served a sentence, but he's still a rapist.

Personally I don't feel he deserves to be back playing football, in a position where he's a potential rolemodel to impressionable young men, thats just not right.. plenty of menial factory jobs he can go look for.

He's a rapist, served time, but still a rapist, the sentence is punishment, it in no way expunges or negates the terrible crime he was found guilty of, what he has done should never be forgotten.

Piliger

_Brian wrote: »

Actually he's a convicted rapist, he faced the justice system and he was found guilty. He's a rapist, unless the decision of the courts changes he'll remain guilty of rape forever.

Now he's a rapist that has served a sentence, but he's still a rapist.

Personally I don't feel he deserves to be back playing football, in a position where he's a potential rolemodel to impressionable young men, thats just not right.. plenty of menial factory jobs he can go look for.

He's a rapist, served time, but still a rapist, the sentence is punishment, it in no way expunges or negates the terrible crime he was found guilty of, what he has done should never be forgotten.

Ah yes. No one has ever been convicted of a crime they didn't commit. I'd forgotten that powerful fact.

Sand

_Brian wrote: »

Actually he's a convicted rapist, he faced the justice system and he was found guilty. He's a rapist, unless the decision of the courts changes he'll remain guilty of rape forever.

Now he's a rapist that has served a sentence, but he's still a rapist.

Personally I don't feel he deserves to be back playing football, in a position where he's a potential rolemodel to impressionable young men, that's just not right.. plenty of menial factory jobs he can go look for.

He's a rapist, served time, but still a rapist, the sentence is punishment, it in no way expunges or negates the terrible crime he was found guilty of, what he has done should never be forgotten.

Its not really an issue of what you feel. He was convicted, though he continues to claim his innocence and is appealing the conviction. He served the sentence he was given. He is a free man, and there no legal barrier to him resuming his career on whatever terms a football club will have him. You have to accept that in the same way you advise others to accept his conviction. The circumstances of the case are not such that Evans seems like an ongoing threat to anyone or that justify an ongoing witch hunt of Evans.

Its getting to the point where I hope someone, anyone will sign him so the hysteria on media can just end and everyone moves on to the next 15 minutes of drama. He may need to go outside the UK to do so.

As for being role models - the vast majority of footballers are anything but rolemodels. Evans is more than likely going to face years of being jeered, mocked and chanted at for being a rapist by rival fans. Even if his appeal is successful and his conviction is declared a miscarriage of justice.