Olivia Mitchell "We should expand our gene pool"

kneemos

reprazant wrote: »

Half the treads in AH are about how foreigners are better looking that Irish yet a politician says something similar and you have the same people foaming at the mouth.

That's an easy one...politicians trump immigrants.

Wompa1

conorhal wrote: »

Except she's wrong, couldn't be more wrong in her libtarded eugenical understanding of genetic diversity. If you have a pool of 4 million people you have a massive pool of genetic diversity and people that fail to understand that, probably belong writing tiresome op-ed column’s for the Times because they wouldn't be left near a science or education brief.
Clearly Mitchell buys into the 19th Century Punch magazine caricature of the Irish as simian, potato munching drunks in need of a good injection of ‘superior DNA’ and the paternal guiding hand of a colonial master. It's nice to see that the Blueshirts have outgrown their fondness eugenics and facisism.
I'd love to hear her suggest that people in Guinea or Korea need a good injection of immigrant blood so they can be smarter, taller and less black or slanty eyed. Silly cow.
What next? Will she be telling sobbing parents in the departures lounge to cheer up, their kids aren't being shunted out of the country in increesing numbers, they're just adding to the genetic diversity of Canada and Australia! Though by the sounds of it Mitchell probably believes that we'll be dragging them down.

This BS from Mitchell really serves to underline what a contemptuous and traitorous political class we serve. Time to kick them out

Do you reckon the famine would have any impact? Just an educated guess from crap I've read about it. Usually entire generations and families were wiped out. If there was no food source for the family, they died. Except for those who left the country... Which you'd think would mean that many of the survivors were either directly or indirectly related.

It seems like we've got a wide variety of illnesses, many which are not spread throughout Europe or other continents at the rate that it's seen in Ireland. e.g. Hemochromatosis which is genetic has a much higher rate in Ireland per capita than the likes of the US. It's speculated that it originated in Ireland and spread as people emigrated...but then that's all just ****e that I've read. Don't know anything for sure

Wibbs

RobertKK wrote: »

I said hybrid vigour brought advantages, yet I was referred to as RobertKKK, which was strange.
Hybrid Vigour would be something like breeding a human of lets say African origin with someone of lets say Irish origin. The resultant child would gain from the genetic diversity. Genetically superior to the parents. I don't think the Nazis would like...
Science seems to go over the heads of some people.

Hybrid vigour is only in play with sub species of animals. Humans are the same species with relatively little diversity compared to many species*. In the past we did get it on with other extinct subspecies of humans, but it seems it was a double edged sword. With Neandertal blood non Africans seem to have gotten enhanced immune systems in some areas of the DNA, on the other hand such "hybrids" had diminished fertility in male offspring.

Plus if you "cross" to populations it's a coin toos as to what results you may get. Yes you could get kids with the "best of both" or you could have kids with the worst, or an average. EG An African chap might bring sickle cell anemia to his kids, which is of no benefit to someone living outside an area where malaria is endemic. His Irish girlfriend may bring a higher chance of spinabifida and so on.



* you could argue that within the species of modern humans there are some broad sub sub species in different populations with a lot of overlap. A stance I would be behind TBH. There is quite the diff between a Swede, a Pgymy and an Inuit, both in local adaptations and a good bit of genetic heritage. Still I wouldn't be so sure of hybrid vigour.

Billy86

Manach wrote: »

So a liberal minister begins to spout out nonsense about "expanding gene pools" and will likely be given a pass on this behaviour as the usual PC lobbying groups perceive she is one of theirs.

Actually the backlash from some people about what she said is pretty much textbook "political correctness". It's kind of funny to see people who condemn political correctness over and over when it is non-Irish people being discussed, or who try to use it almost as a curse word or insult over things that have nothing to do with political correctness, take a completely different stance now. :pac:

Doesn't stop what she said from being downright stupid, though. If an Irish person has kids with another Irish person, good for them! If an Irish person has kids with a non Irish person, good for them!

RobertKK

Wibbs wrote: »

Hybrid vigour is only in play with sub species of animals. Humans are the same species with relatively little diversity compared to many species*. In the past we did get it on with other extinct subspecies of humans, but it seems it was a double edged sword. With Neandertal blood non Africans seem to have gotten enhanced immune systems in some areas of the DNA, on the other hand such "hybrids" had diminished fertility in male offspring.

Plus if you "cross" to populations it's a coin toos as to what results you may get. Yes you could get kids with the "best of both" or you could have kids with the worst, or an average. EG An African chap might bring sickle cell anemia to his kids, which is of no benefit to someone living outside an area where malaria is endemic. His Irish girlfriend may bring a higher chance of spinabifida and so on.



* you could argue that within the species of modern humans there are some broad sub sub species in different populations with a lot of overlap. A stance I would be behind TBH. There is quite the diff between a Swede, a Pgymy and an Inuit, both in local adaptations and a good bit of genetic heritage. Still I wouldn't be so sure of hybrid vigour.

Good post.
But we know different races have different advantages, we can see in various athletes that there are regional genetic advantages like Ethiopian/Kenyan runners over long distances or people of West African extraction who have a genetic advantage in running short distances incredibly fast.
There is a lot of overlap in most species, and we would share a lot of similar DNA to other species, which is why we can pick up certain diseases from different mammals to our self.
I am not a geneticist to be 100% on this so I won't pretend to be one, I just know what I know in regards to other species of mammals, where it was found to be an economic advantage to cross breed within the species for hybrid vigour.

But as I stated at the start of my post, you did a good post, found it thought provoking and informative.

RDM_83 again

Billy86 wrote: »

Actually the backlash from some people about what she said is pretty much textbook "political correctness". It's kind of funny to see people who condemn political correctness over and over when it is non-Irish people being discussed, or who try to use it almost as a curse word or insult over things that have nothing to do with political correctness, take a completely different stance now. :pac:

Doesn't stop what she said from being downright stupid, though. If an Irish person has kids with another Irish person, good for them! If an Irish person has kids with a non Irish person, good for them!

Whatever about the looks thing I can see her thoughts on that, i might not agree with her I think dark hair and pale skin looks savage personally, but its not that a big issue really. (though I don't see it flying the other way around)
She references IQ though and thats a really fcuking sinister mindset, I might not agree with some of the overly Right On stuff on boards but surely how you can see equating race or ethnicity to IQ is not what we want in our members of government.

ps biology rule of 5's
50 breeding population negates major inbreeding
500 negates genetic drift

_Kaiser_

Personally speaking, I'd take an Irish girl every time myself. We have some great looking "every day" women in this country - and most of them can hold a decent conversation, don't take themselves too seriously and can have a bit of craic as well.

I've worked in several multinationals over the years and went out with girls from various places but when it comes to things like cultural nuances, language, sense of humor, interests etc the Irish girls win every time

crockholm

I Think her comments were more Clueless in attempting to compliment immigrants/non Irish ancestry than being genuinely offensive to Irish people-a bit of a "some of my best friends are black (the housemaid)" kind of statement.

I really do hope that it is brought up again when she's looking for the vote,que all the "mis-spoke" "taken out of context" horseshyte.

lanos

One eyed Jack wrote: »

Perhaps she should have a word with her party colleague Michael Noonan and ask him for his opinions on children, specifically third children, as he quite famously seems to have issues with them and all!

Michael Noonan has no problem with 3rd children. He simply removed the bonus rate of children's allowance and the result was that 3rd children are now treated the same as 1st and 2nd children. it was a simple budget cost cutting measure
Michael martin thought he was very clever saying that Michael Noonan may have been bullied by a 3rd child.
it was a mildly funny opposition point scoring opportunity but not clever enough to be repeated here

Putinovsky

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Personally speaking, I'd take an Irish girl every time myself. We have some great looking "every day" women in this country - and most of them can hold a decent conversation, don't take themselves too seriously and can have a bit of craic as well.

I've worked in several multinationals over the years and went out with girls from various places but when it comes to things like cultural nuances, language, sense of humor, interests etc the Irish girls win every time

Just can't agree with the bolded. I think Irish women are quite behind on culture nuances and interests when it comes to other nations such as mainland europe and eastern europe. Same with interests, Irish women (like Irish men) seem to revolve mainly around getting drunk whereas take a trip any day to go hiking or a nature park and you'll hear mainly Polish people out being active.

'good looking every day women' = plain janes
'dont take themselves too seriously' = sloppy or gob****es
'can have a bit of craic' = can drink like a fish

Bongalongherb

Celtic Tiger immigrants made us better-looking, says Mitchell.

Jesus H christ, I almost had a heart attack when I clicked the OP's link. And she in her own words says the above ?, yeah right, you're a fine looking woman I must say, my god, shocking picture indeed. I need a memory-wipe after that.

Nodin

Bongalongherb wrote: »

Celtic Tiger immigrants made us better-looking, says Mitchell.

Jesus H christ, I almost had a heart attack when I clicked the OP's link. And she in her own words says the above ?, yeah right, you're a fine looking woman I must say, my god, shocking picture indeed. I need a memory-wipe after that.

Its creepy the way the smile never meets the eyes, isn't it?.....like she was wearing somebody elses face as a mask....

Richard Hillman

People are really going out of their way to get offended here.

The far-left are trying to insinuate that the mere mention of gene pool is fascist (Even though a fascist would usually want to preserve their gene pool)

The right are appalled that she wants to polute the gene pool (Even though they know as an Island nation we need diversity)

Bongalongherb

That woman has serious issues coming out with a comment like that. Has she looked in the mirror lately by any chance ffs if she has any mirrors left.

Definitely a terrible and uneducated comment to make from here. Back to further education I'd send her to. Not an ounce of education in that brain of hers.

Frank Lee Midere

Richard Hillman wrote: »

People are really going out of their way to get offended here.

The far-left are trying to insinuate that the mere mention of gene pool is fascist (Even though a fascist would usually want to preserve their gene pool)

The right are appalled that she wants to polute the gene pool (Even though they know as an Island nation we need diversity)

Just asking for consistency. If she believes that the IQ pool is increased by immigration can she list in order the best candidates to come in and possibly countries whose immigration might be dysgenic. ( Or is she saying that the Irish are the stupidest people in the world?).

I doubt her IQ "realism" stops at these shores.

Frank Lee Midere

That said she's on firmer ground on mixed marriages because that seems to work. There is some indication that mixed race people are better looking.

Inspector Coptoor

The One Doctor wrote: »

I'm reminded of Inspector Chalmers in The Simpsons:

"Class after class of ugly, ugly children."

There's something hauntingly... well, not fascist, but disturbing about Mitchell's comments. But then again, she is an idiot politician. People don't become politicians to prove their intelligence. It's to make up for a lack of it. Sort of like teachers, really.

You're some bell end

Sweeping generalizations much

Frank Lee Midere

Putinovsky wrote: »

Just can't agree with the bolded. I think Irish women are quite behind on culture nuances and interests when it comes to other nations such as mainland europe and eastern europe. Same with interests, Irish women (like Irish men) seem to revolve mainly around getting drunk whereas take a trip any day to go hiking or a nature park and you'll hear mainly Polish people out being active.

'good looking every day women' = plain janes
'dont take themselves too seriously' = sloppy or gob****es
'can have a bit of craic' = can drink like a fish

Still though. Irish guys. Phwoarr.

Nodin

Frank Lee Midere wrote: »

Still though. Irish guys. Phwoarr.

Our hairy backsides, y-fronts and well rounded bellies are the envy of Europe.

Bongalongherb

Someone should get the whip out to this thing of FG. Sure, the government love the whip-system, so they should use it wisely and whip her until she grows better genes.

Who in the name of politics voted her in ?.

Albertofrog

If we did expand the gene pool then we might get semi intelligent politicians.
Who knows...

TheBeardedLady

As the product of a mixed race couple (Cavan and Dublin), I have to agree.

First Up

Frank Lee Midere wrote: »

Just asking for consistency. If she believes that the IQ pool is increased by immigration can she list in order the best candidates to come in and possibly countries whose immigration might be dysgenic. ( Or is she saying that the Irish are the stupidest people in the world?).

I doubt her IQ "realism" stops at these shores.

It isn't down to specific races. There is a reasonable argument that a gene pool is strengthened by people who are motivated and ambitious enough to leave their familiar surroundings and try to better themselves. The US is the obvious example and so are Canada and Australia.
As well as improving our stock of good looking women (and probably our soccer and rugby teams) we will be the better for the injection of people wiling to put in a shift, instead of whinging on Boards or complaining to Joe Duffy.

Laois6556

TheBeardedLady wrote: »

As the product of a mixed race couple (Cavan and Dublin), I have to agree.

Yeah that's a wise statement, well done you passed.

Bongalongherb

I must say though, this first comment below from the Irish-times sums it up quite correctly...

The latest in a line of useless idiots, who's attempts at being fashionably "unracist" actually implies racism towards a group (in this case the Irish).
Though - I understand that racism against Irish people is acceptable.

crockholm

TheBeardedLady wrote: »

As the product of a mixed race couple (Cavan and Dublin), I have to agree.

I was under the impression that those two tribes were so genetically different that offspring was impossible.

You are either The Golden Child or a parsimonious heroin addict:p

reprise

Nodin wrote: »

Our hairy backsides, y-fronts and well rounded bellies are the envy of Europe.

Seriously?

A thread crying out for your unbearable scrutiny, riddled with race references and soft eugenics, and that lazy (self referencing?) slur is all you have?

At least be man enough to explicitly agree, for once in your life.

Bongalongherb

Nodin wrote: »

Our hairy backsides, y-fronts and well rounded bellies are the envy of Europe.

No, Nodin, do you really/seriously think all Irish men have hairy arses and hairy backs ?. I'm 45 and I have no hair in these places all thanks to my ultimate genes and DNA. No hairy bastard here. So I would advise you to get the shaver out and slide it over your said hairy anomalies.

RDM_83 again

I know this is after hours but really focusing on the looks issue when she is basically saying that
1) There is a genetic link to IQ
2) Certain ethnicities and/or racial groups have higher IQ's
3) The Irish have low IQ's that need a bit of mixing to boost it

If your going to be progressive thinking at least be consistent, FFS she's a TD she has potential to actually influence things.

Otherwise the next time somebody says some sh-t like "Black people are less intelligent than whites or jews" don't bother being offended, because you know what your fine with a race based idea of intelligence, or is it that on Boards espousing Eugenic theories doesn't matter if its not a about a group that doesn't big up The Champion of the sensible forward thinking liberal poster image.

Bongalongherb

RDM_83 again wrote: »

I know this is after hours but really focusing on the looks issue when she is basically saying that
1) There is a genetic link to IQ
2) Certain ethnicities and/or racial groups have higher IQ's
3) The Irish have low IQ's that need a bit of mixing to boost it

If your going to be progressive thinking at least be consistent, FFS she's a TD she has potential to actually influence things.

Otherwise the next time somebody says some sh-t like "Black people are less intelligent than whites or jews" don't bother being offended, because you know what your fine with a race based idea of intelligence, or is it that on Boards espousing Eugenic theories doesn't matter if its not a about a group that doesn't big up The Champion of the sensible forward thinking liberal poster image.

I agree indeed.

Well if any person says/assumes/thinks that African folk are less intelligent, then they need a serious wake-up call accordingly...

The list of African-American inventors and scientists attempts to document many of the African Americans who have invented a multitude of items or made discoveries in the course of their lives. These have ranged from practical everyday devices to applications and scientific discoveries in diverse fields, including physics, biology, mathematics, plus the medical, nuclear and space sciences.

Is there actually a single person today that still holds this Neanderthal thinking regarding Africans or Jews as less intelligent. Some of them would put us all to shame.

DeadHand

Olivia Mitchell links IQ to race, implies the Irish are genetically inferior and promotes eugenics. Result? No negative effects so far.

Darren Scully makes silly, mildly negative remarks about the African community. Result? National villain, crucified in the press, loses job, is reported to the Gardai in an attempt to criminalise him for expressing an opinion.

It seems the severity of the consequences of expressing racist opinions very much depend on who is expressing the opinion and which group they are being racist toward.

First Up

She may not have expressed it as well as she might but my interpretation of what Mitchell said is that societies benefit from exposure to and influence from others. That is an indisputable fact. It has nothing to do with racism or eugenics.

woodoo

DeadHand wrote: »

Olivia Mitchell links IQ to race, implies the Irish are genetically inferior and promotes eugenics. Result? No negative effects so far.

Darren Scully makes silly, mildly negative remarks about the African community. Result? National villain, crucified in the press, loses job, is reported to the Gardai in an attempt to criminalise him for expressing an opinion.

It seems the severity of the consequences of expressing racist opinions very much depend on who is expressing the opinion and which group they are being racist toward.

Its this hypocrisy that galls me. Its so widespread too. If someone said what she said about any other race it would be career ending.

RDM_83 again

First Up wrote: »

She may not have expressed it as well as she might but my interpretation of what Mitchell said is that societies benefit from exposure to and influence from others. That is an indisputable fact. It has nothing to do with racism or eugenics.

Explain this quote then

“You can even see the better-looking and taller children now as a result of the Celtic Tiger years. I think it’s a good thing to keep our IQs up there; it’s not just about appearance.”

Those height and looks (well looks dependent on taste) are genetically driven, its clear she is putting IQ in with them

woodoo

First Up wrote: »

She may not have expressed it as well as she might but my interpretation of what Mitchell said is that societies benefit from exposure to and influence from others. That is an indisputable fact. It has nothing to do with racism or eugenics.

She clearly implied that it would make us taller, better looking and more intelligent.

Bongalongherb

As human beings will say... Beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder. Some folk might find you attractive, and some might not. It's just the way she goes, the way of the road.

Lyger

"You can even see the better-looking and taller children now" - even without the implied disparaging of the Irish gene pool, what an idiotic, airheaded thing for a politician to focus on!
I don't disagree that it's good for us to have a mix of cultures here, but she isn't just saying that - she's got a backhanded compliment thing going on.

reprise

First Up wrote: »

She may not have expressed it as well as she might but my interpretation of what Mitchell said is that societies benefit from exposure to and influence from others. That is an indisputable fact. It has nothing to do with racism or eugenics.

It is an indisputable fact that this "benefit" also has serious drawbacks that are neither universally enjoyed nor evenly spread.

diddley

Olivia, may be, perhaps, like myself, a Christian, and as such our gene pool derives from Adam agus Eve.

/thread

Nodin

reprise wrote: »

Seriously?

A thread crying out for your unbearable scrutiny, riddled with race references and soft eugenics, and that lazy (self referencing?) slur is all you have?

At least be man enough to explicitly agree, for once in your life.

Are you upset over something?

Bongalongherb

First Up wrote: »

She may not have expressed it as well as she might but my interpretation of what Mitchell said is that societies benefit from exposure to and influence from others. That is an indisputable fact. It has nothing to do with racism or eugenics.

Well she should not be in office if she doesn't know how to communicate to the public in a professional manner. Her education wreaks of poorness. Do we really need another idiot in control of this country ?. IMO, no, we don't. She's just another idiot we could do without IMO.

Nodin

Bongalongherb wrote: »

No, Nodin, do you really/seriously think all Irish men have hairy arses and hairy backs ?. I'm 45 and I have no hair in these places all thanks to my ultimate genes and DNA. No hairy bastard here. So I would advise you to get the shaver out and slide it over your said hairy anomalies.

You Sir, have dehaired yourself in pursuit of foreign fashions. Go, go in shame.

V Eight

kneemos wrote: »

We need more supermodels,or women,as the east Europeans call them.

so true

bb1234567

This is such BS. I could count the amount of mixed race children I know on the fingers of one hand. Most immigrants who come here come with their immigrant wife or husband and together have children who arent ethnically irish. Many of these children ,probably the majority, will marry other men and women of same race or ethnicity. 99% of of irish people mary other irish people.

Its not like the celtic tiger suddenly made mixed race marriages a common thing in ireland
Immigration has such a minimal impact on our white irish gene pool. Im actually getting pissed off just thinking about how retarded some of the politicans in our country are

Bongalongherb

Nodin wrote: »

You Sir, have dehaired yourself in pursuit of foreign fashions. Go, go in shame.

I do have a downside to this non-hairyness bodily scenario... My nick-name is Beard, and as you should realise, the majority of hair accumulates on my face like grizzly adams, so it does take a lot of work to release my facade of hairyness with a good shave daily.

It's like my DNA was messed with and forwarded all my bodily hair to my chin.

reprise

Nodin wrote: »

Are you upset over something?

lol

This from the boards self anointed queen of outrage?

Has someone taken over your account?

Theres wacism everywhere..............

Nodin

Bongalongherb wrote: »

I do have a downside to this non-hairyness bodily scenario... My nick-name is Beard, and as you should realise, the majority of hair accumulates on my face like grizzly adams, so it does take a lot of work to release my facade of hairyness with a good shave daily.

It's like my DNA was messed with and forwarded all my bodily hair to my chin.

My apologies, I didn't mean to mock your condition. Don't worry, every day science brings us closer to a cure for ass baldness.

reprise

Nodin wrote: »

My apologies, I didn't mean to mock your condition. Don't worry, every day science brings us closer to a cure for ass baldness.

What breeding solution have you in mind?

Bongalongherb

reprise wrote: »

What breeding solution have you in mind?

Maybe these ? ye never know.

Frank Lee Midere

First Up wrote: »

It isn't down to specific races. There is a reasonable argument that a gene pool is strengthened by people who are motivated and ambitious enough to leave their familiar surroundings and try to better themselves. The US is the obvious example and so are Canada and Australia.
As well as improving our stock of good looking women (and probably our soccer and rugby teams) we will be the better for the injection of people wiling to put in a shift, instead of whinging on Boards or complaining to Joe Duffy.

That wouldn't help long term IQ though because of regression to the mean.