NBA Regular Season 14/15

For Forks Sake

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Durant was on the Sonics team then.

Yeargh, brainfart. See that, scored 23.

padraig_f

For Forks Sake wrote: »

Nope, only drafted in 2007.

Here's the box score, Melo and Iverson.

http://espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?id=280316007

Melo, Iverson AND JR Smith, wow.

Got a laugh out of JR Smith last night, saying he didn't have to fit in to the Cavs and just had to be himself. Also the fact that he was expecting to do better in Cleveland because there was less to do at night.

Bulls playing pretty crap lately, have now lost to the Wizards, Hawks and Cavs in the last few weeks, 3 of their main rivals in the East.

Mozgov looks a good addition to the Cavs, had 15 reboiunds I think last night, defended Pau well, and scored a few points as well.

Kevin Love still looks like a role player. I knew him more by reputation this season, as I hadn't watched the Wolves much. But from what I've seen of him on the Cavs, he looks like a hugely overrated player, considering the hype about his free-agency.

Paully D

padraig_f wrote: »

Bulls playing pretty crap lately, have now lost to the Wizards, Hawks and Cavs in the last few weeks, 3 of their main rivals in the East.

I'm officially worried.

The offense has been steadily declining (I saw these statistics on Twitter) - October: 47.8%, November: 45.4%, December: 44.8%, January: 42.5% which was my main worry due to the poor defensive displays relative to other seasons under Thibs, could we keep those offensive numbers up, and the players are voicing concern now too about effort, with Rose calling it "****ing irritating". It's not like him to speak like that, so it's obviously very frustrating and boiling over.

Strange situation earlier too. Last night the players were told after the game that they had practice today, however, pre-game they thought they had today off and would meet back on Wednesday. Practice was slated to go ahead, but with about 5 minutes to go it was cancelled. So it appears either Thibs relented of his own accord, or the players' voices didn't give him a choice.

Chris Sheridan, who many may remember broke the LeBron to Cleveland story during the summer, reports that Thibs "may" have lost the locker room:

http://www.sheridanhoops.com/2015/01/20/sheridan-thibodeau-on-hot-seat-as-bulls-crumbling-internally/

I told you yesterday about mutterings I have heard around the league that Chicago Bulls coach Tom Thibodeau has lost his locker room. The last night, Derrick Rose poured jet fuel on the fire with some of the strongest comments he has made as a professional, including “we are not on the same page.” Rose rarely if ever uses expletives, but he used them Monday night after the Bulls got crushed by the Cavs 108-94.

A source close to the Bulls tells SheridanHoops that eating the remaining money (roughly $11 million) and years (two after this season) on Thibodeau’s contract will not be a concern to management or ownership if they decide to fire him.

The feeling among some players in the locker room is that Thibodeau is simply too hardcore, too much of an oddball personality, and runs his best players into the ground both in practices and games.

hibodeau has had the support of ownership, grudgingly at times, because he led the Bulls to the playoffs each of the past two seasons despite the absence of Derrick Rose both years. There is no questioning his basketball acumen or dedication to his craft. But a head coach cannot impose his own gym rat mentality on a roster of players loaded with easygoing guys. from free spirit Joakim Noah to wily veteran Pau Gasol to smarter-than-you-may-realize Derrick Rose. Even Jimmy Butler, who is playing for his max contract, has seen his production drop from 21.7 ppg in November and December to 17.0 (on .403 shooting) in January.

Here is a little historical background on Thibodeau, who has coached under one of the most hardcore guys out there, Jeff Van Gundy, and one of the smoothest and most player-friendly, Doc Rivers.

Van Gundy was an us vs. them guy, a trait he inherited from his one-time mentor, Pat Riley. “Us vs. them” was a very closed society in the Van Gundy years when he coached the Knicks, with the coach often telling the team that the only people who mattered in an organization were the 15 guys in the locker room, along with the coaching staff. Management, the media, opposing teams — they were all lumped together as “them.”

So in a case like this one, if Thibodeau has lost his locker room, he should not expect a ton of support from management. People close to the organization have told me that relations between Thibodeau and the front office have improved in the two years since assistant coach Ron Adams was let go against Thibodeau’s wishes, but I have heard enough anecdotes from people close to the team to realize that Thibodeau still views Bulls management with a jaundiced eye. And some have told me that team president John Paxson remains lukewarm at best regarding Thibs.

Just my opinion, but Thibodeau should be emulating Rivers more than he is emulating Van Gundy.

So you can be damn sure that Thibodeau’s job will be on the line as the Bulls, losers of four of their last five, begin a brutal stretch that includes games against the Spurs, Mavericks, Warriors and Suns before the end of January. The pre-All Star break schedule concludes with a home game against the Cavaliers — but it should be noted that Chicago does not exactly enjoy a home court advantage. They are 12-10 at home and 15-6 on the road.

NufcNavan

Thibs seems to be making the same mistake as previous years by grinding his starters into the ground. Of course the likes of Butler's production was going to drop with the heavy minutes he was playing.

padraig_f

Paully D wrote: »

Chris Sheridan, who many may remember broke the LeBron to Cleveland story during the summer, reports that Thibs "may" have lost the locker room:

http://www.sheridanhoops.com/2015/01/20/sheridan-thibodeau-on-hot-seat-as-bulls-crumbling-internally/

I saw that yesterday, and my initial reaction was:



A few weeks ago they were among the favourites for the East, and now this guy's saying it wouldn't be a problem to get rid of Thibs....

A source close to the Bulls tells SheridanHoops that eating the remaining money (roughly $11 million) and years (two after this season) on Thibodeau’s contract will not be a concern to management or ownership if they decide to fire him.

I think there's a bit of both substance and hype. There is legitimate concern there because I've never seen the effort/energy level of players this low under Thibs for a sustained period of time. They've had flat nights before like every team, but nearly always bounced back a game or two later.

But right now, they've probably only had one good performance in the last 3-4 weeks (against the Rockets).

Having said that, I see a lot of speculation in the article, like:

But a head coach cannot impose his own gym rat mentality on a roster of players loaded with easygoing guys. from free spirit Joakim Noah to wily veteran Pau Gasol

This suggests Noah isn't a comitted or intense player, but no-one wants to win or work harder than Noah, so I think there's some loose talk there.


I'm not particularly worried, Thibs is a good guy, and there are a lot of good characters on the team. When you have that, you work things out. They'll get Dunleavy and Noah back into the starting lineup, and things will improve.

It does call into question a bit if Thibs is going to be there long-term, if his coaching style has a certain shelf-life. But I think they'll get it together for this season at least.

Paully D

I'd agree with you on the Sheridan piece, Padraig. Lots of conjecture in it. This tweet has also eased my worries regarding performance a bit, though the question becomes will the Bulls ever have their first choice starting lineup over a consistent period before it becomes too late? I'd love to see a statistic on how many games each side has played their first choice lineup over the last say 3-4 seasons? The Bulls would have to rank bottom even accounting for Rose's injury.

@KCJHoop: Bulls have only had regular lineup of Rose, Butler, Dunleavy, Noah, Gasol 15 times in 43 games. They're 12-3.

stuchyg

Paully D wrote: »

I'd agree with you on the Sheridan piece, Padraig. Lots of conjecture in it. This tweet has also eased my worries regarding performance a bit, though the question becomes will the Bulls ever have their first choice starting lineup over a consistent period before it becomes too late? I'd love to see a statistic on how many games each side has played their first choice lineup over the last say 3-4 seasons? The Bulls would have to rank bottom even accounting for Rose's injury.

@KCJHoop: Bulls have only had regular lineup of Rose, Butler, Dunleavy, Noah, Gasol 15 times in 43 games. They're 12-3.

Saw the same tweet myself courtesy of taco trey.

ButtersSuki

Kyle Korver with a dunk :eek::rolleyes:;):D last night

ButtersSuki

I know he gets some grief (some justified, some not) here and elsewhere but last night Brandon Jennings became the 3rd player since 1985 to record 20+ points & 20+ assists in 35 MP or less (Magic in '85, Stockton in '89). :eek:

In fairness to him, he's playing well this year under SVG, and Detroit have really turned things around since getting rid of Josh Smith. If he can continue to cut down on the crazy shot selection and continue to improve his passing game, he could become a serious threat.

all star starting teams announced

THE EAST

LeBron James
Carmelo Anthony
Pau Gasol
John Wall
kyle lowry


THE WEST

Blake Griffin
Marc Gasol
Anthony Davis
Stephen Curry,
Kobe Bryant

padraig_f

Joey Blue Rodent wrote: »

all star starting teams announced

THE EAST

LeBron James
Carmelo Anthony
Pau Gasol
John Wall
kyle lowry


THE WEST

Blake Griffin
Marc Gasol
Anthony Davis
Stephen Curry,
Kobe Bryant

Yay for Pau, did I read that's his first time starting?

Carmelo/Kobe...think you should almost be precluded from the all-star game if your team is X games under .500 (never gonna happen though).

The rest looks fine, pretty cool for the Gasol family, having two brothers both starters in an all-star game.

Mongo

Joey Blue Rodent wrote: »

all star starting teams announced

THE EAST

LeBron James
Carmelo Anthony
Pau Gasol
John Wall
kyle lowry


THE WEST

Blake Griffin
Marc Gasol
Anthony Davis
Stephen Curry,
Kobe Bryant

Harden instead of Kobe IMO. Really cool that Steph topped the pool ahead of LeBron too!

padraig_f

padraig_f wrote: »

Yay for Pau, did I read that's his first time starting?

Carmelo/Kobe...think you should almost be precluded from the all-star game if your team is X games under .500 (never gonna happen though).

The rest looks fine, pretty cool for the Gasol family, having two brothers both starters in an all-star game.

its in nyc so melo is "hosting" he was always going to be there.

i really hope korver makes the bench he's having an insane year

bmcc10

Great watching Rose in this form.

scottmcb04

Aldridge out for 6-8 weeks... this could be a massive blow to the blazers who are already down RoLo and freeland... pretty short on frontcourt players. the west is so competitive that they could easily go from 2nd to 6th in that time!

also, listening to BS report this week, they've had the most games against teams under.500 so they have some really tough games coming up!!!

trying to get time to watch some games now!!!

GoldFour4

Ridiculous that Kobe is an all star starter and James Harden will have to come off the bench. Harden is a legit MVP candidate this year. Very good that Kyle Lowry is getting the start though!

Mongo

Kobe injured his rotator cuff though so might miss out which would push The Beard into the starting 5. I guess as long as Kobe is playing he will be an All Star starter!

NufcNavan

Kobe shouldn't be anywhere near the starting line up, but God almighty nobody bores me as much as James Harden. A super player, but the Houston Rockets are as dull as any team to watch. Watching Harden shoot free throws all night and Dwight Howard and his robotic game. Ugh.

padraig_f

Well that was encouraging. You hear the phrase 'statement game', and sometimes it's an overused phrase. Derrick Rose came out after the Cavs game with a vocal statement about how the Bulls weren't playing hard enough. And he followed it up last night with an even stronger statement on the court.....going 100 miles-an-hour, being aggressive, driving to the teeth of the defense. His statement was: I'm 100% behind my coach, and it was a statement to the to the fans, the media, and other players on his team. If anyone questioned that the players had checked out on the coach, Rose was saying emphatically that he hadn't, and it set the tone for the rest of the team. It was great leadership, I loved it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KR11hl7jAvI

As for the game, I noticed the Spurs record hasn't been quite as good this season, and to be honest the team that played last night wasn't in the championship form of last year. I wasn't watching the Spurs closely enough to say exactly what was wrong (they had the main 4 guys all starting). The commentators mentioned Tony Parker hasn't been in great form lately, and he did look a bit below-par.

Didn't matter though, the Spurs are never an easy team to beat the way they're coached, and this game was all about attitude for the Bulls. When the game was close in the first half I thought 'win or lose, this is a great performance'. That they won the game was the icing on the cake.

NufcNavan

NufcNavan wrote: »

Kobe shouldn't be anywhere near the starting line up, but God almighty nobody bores me as much as James Harden. A super player, but the Houston Rockets are as dull as any team to watch. Watching Harden shoot free throws all night and Dwight Howard and his robotic game. Ugh.

your right but at the end of the day he's a legit mvp candidate at the moment its a joke that he's not in there

kobe talking about his torn rotator cuff "this is what happens when i pass to much"

D2D

Kobe is seeing a second doctor on Monday but he'll probably be ruled out for the rest of the season

buyer95

D2D wrote: »

Kobe is seeing a second doctor on Monday but he'll probably be ruled out for the rest of the season

It doesn't make any sense for him to keep playing this season. I'm pretty sure he's had this exact injury before and that he has played through it, but there is really no point in him coming back this season.

NufcNavan

Lakers are paying Nash and Kobe a ton of money to sit lol.

NufcNavan

NufcNavan wrote: »

Lakers are paying Nash and Kobe a ton of money to sit lol.

i think there quite happy to be taking to be honest

WHIP IT!

I presume I'm the only insomniac up watching Kings/Warriors... but Kyle Thompson just went insane... He out scored the Kings 37-21 ON HIS OWN in the third quarter!!

Watching b'ball since early 90s, never seen anything like this. Think he was 13/13, they were going in from everywhere.

Game was tight when I turned it on, maybe 3 points in it... Warriors now lead by 30+

ButtersSuki

WHIP IT! wrote: »

I presume I'm the only insomniac up watching Kings/Warriors... but Kyle Thompson just went insane... He out scored the Kings 37-21 ON HIS OWN in the third quarter!!

Watching b'ball since early 90s, never seen anything like this. Think he was 13/13, they were going in from everywhere.

Game was tight when I turned it on, maybe 3 points in it... Warriors now lead by 30+

well there's something you don't see every day! Not to spoil it but I think in years to come he may regret coming out of the game with 9+ Mins to play. He'd likely have broken 60 and maybe gotten close to 70. We'll never know now I guess.

WHIP IT!

ButtersSuki wrote: »

well there's something you don't see every day! Not to spoil it but I think in years to come he may regret coming out of the game with 9+ Mins to play. He'd likely have broken 60 and maybe gotten close to 70. We'll never know now I guess.

That's exactly what I thought to be honest... The game was tied at 60 four minutes into the 3rd... well, just watch this for the rest of the story...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wxjsz92v53M

and people thought they where crazy for not trading him for love

edit: just watched the vid one or two of those are hilarious theres one in the corner in particular that he just chucks up and you can see it on his face afterwords

how many points did he finish the game on?

mixery

52 points in 33 minutes, 11-15 from 3.

everyone loves a guy that can get hot. i'm waiting to see how they do in the play-offs though, i have my doubts about this team.

mixery

mixery wrote: »

52 points in 33 minutes, 11-15 from 3.

everyone loves a guy that can get hot. i'm waiting to see how they do in the play-offs though, i have my doubts about this team.

i think boguts health is the key to them winning playoff series

WHIP IT!

mixery wrote: »

52 points in 33 minutes, 11-15 from 3.

everyone loves a guy that can get hot. i'm waiting to see how they do in the play-offs though, i have my doubts about this team.

Same. I love watching them but teams that live and die by the jumpshot generally fall short of the big one...

ButtersSuki

mixery wrote: »

52 points in 33 minutes, 11-15 from 3.

everyone loves a guy that can get hot. i'm waiting to see how they do in the play-offs though, i have my doubts about this team.

They were my tip to win it all this year (check start of season posts if you need proof!) with the caveat they stay injury free. Injuries are the key, losing Bogut and Lee variously is what cost them in the last 2 playoffs. They are clearly the best 1-2 guard combo in the league but it's the bigs health that will determine how far they go.

They've now made home court a fortress (like the Boston teams of the 80s) and that's crucial as they'll likely be the 1 seed in the West - again barring injury. They've performed very well in the play offs the last 2 years even with the injuries they had and an awful coach. They're far more than a jump shot team, you're focusing on the spectacular parts of play and not the bread and butter. They play really hard D (check their numbers and ranking) and they really push the transition.

What's differebt this year? The coaching is better and I have to admit to being surprised by how good Kerr has been. Curry and Thompson are a year older and wiser, and critically Thompson's game has evolves to where he now attacks the basket off the dribble far more than he used to - which has the added benefit of opening the floor out wide for him and Curry (and the others). They now have 2 guys who are a lock for 20points a game and that adjust defences more than you think.


They're legit, make no mistake about it.

padraig_f

WHIP IT! wrote: »

That's exactly what I thought to be honest... The game was tied at 60 four minutes into the 3rd... well, just watch this for the rest of the story...

That was cool, I like how the commentators start getting excited when he has about 15, and he goes on to get 37.

NufcNavan

Insane shooting from Klay. Well done to him.

On a slightly related note, it looks like the decision to bring in Ty Corbin has gone badly for the Kings. Who would have guessed it eh.

padraig_f

NufcNavan wrote: »

On a slightly related note, it looks like the decision to bring in Ty Corbin has gone badly for the Kings. Who would have guessed it eh.

No-one ever saw that coming.

have to feel cousins is regretting signing that extension about now

D2D

That was just incredible from Klay last night, he just couldn't miss in the 3rd

Paully D

Heat @ Bulls (6pm) and Thunder @ Cavs (8:30pm) the early games today and live on BT.

Bulls are 9 point favourites over the Heat and Cavs are 3 point favourites over the Thunder.

Paully D

So, it appears Chad Ford has been retroactively editing his mock draft boards to make them appear more accurate and has been caught in the act. :pac:

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/2tk9xa/chad_ford_changes_his_draft_boards_years_after/

http://deadspin.com/espns-chad-ford-has-been-retroactively-editing-draft-bo-1681631642/1681658049/+bubbaprog?utm_campaign=socialflow_deadspin_twitter&utm_source=deadspin_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

GoldFour4

Paully D wrote: »

So, it appears Chad Ford has been retroactively editing his mock draft boards to make them appear more accurate and has been caught in the act. :pac:

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/2tk9xa/chad_ford_changes_his_draft_boards_years_after/

http://deadspin.com/espns-chad-ford-has-been-retroactively-editing-draft-bo-1681631642/1681658049/+bubbaprog?utm_campaign=socialflow_deadspin_twitter&utm_source=deadspin_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

Yeah I saw that on reddit earlier, fairly ridiculous and petty from him tbh!!

Very few people would actually care enough to go back and look at where Ford ranked them. Must have been mainly for his own confidence. We all know none of that they very rarely get in 75% right. Glad that ESPN have removed his edits.

Paully D

I see Hassan Whiteside has turned into Anthony Davis for this game! :eek:

NufcNavan

Paully D wrote: »

I see Hassan Whiteside has turned into Anthony Davis for this game! :eek:

Swatting everything that moves.

GoldFour4

Jimmy Butler only got 2mins rest in the first 3qtrs...

Paully D

malistheman wrote: »

Jimmy Butler only got 2mins rest in the first 3qtrs...

He has been absolutely shocking tonight, but in fairness he's not alone. Big 4th quarter needed here. Would be typical of the Bulls this year to go to SA and Dallas and win and then lose at home to a less than .500 team. :rolleyes:

NufcNavan

Thibs running Butler into the ground. As improved as he's been he wasn't going to sustain his early season numbers. Paul George had a similar drop last year too.

What about Whiteside though. A triple double in 24 minutes. The Heat may have really lucked into a gem with Whiteside. And they smartly signed him to a two year deal, so they'll have him next year at the minimum salary.

Paully D

Man, I hate losing to the Heat. :mad:

D2D

Very impressed with Whiteside, he had an incredible game. Really brings an extra edge the Heat needed

D2D

Cavs lead 57-49 at the half!

D2D

Real fun game in Cleveland, Cavs lead 83-78 after 3Q.