NBA Regular Season 14/15

D2D

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Watching the sixers Knicks game. Good God almighty.

That good eh?

Cavs/Pacers for me, they're 2-0 on us this season so we need a win. Also, a win for us would secure our playoff place

Itssoeasy

NufcNavan wrote: »

Why on earth would you do that to yourself.

Well it's one of two games on at the time.

Itssoeasy

D2D wrote: »

That good eh?

Cavs/Pacers for me, they're 2-0 on us this season so we need a win. Also, a win for us would secure our playoff place

Magical. The last two sixers possessions have barely hit the front of the rim.

D2D

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Magical. The last two sixers possessions have barely hit the front of the rim.

I will be shocked if either team gets near 100 tonight looking at the stat line/starters #Tank

Itssoeasy

D2D wrote: »

I will be shocked if either team gets near 100 tonight looking at the stat line/starters #Tank

And listening to the knicks feed its obvious the lads wouldn't be there if they weren't being paid to be there.

Itssoeasy

I wouldve previously put my team the Celtics into the same league as the Knicks and 76ers but we have been on a nice little role as of late.

Itssoeasy

51-41 to the Knicks at the half. One of the other teams playing tonight has 30 points at it's only in the 1st quarter.

Itssoeasy

Alright let's go celtics. Let's keep it going.

mixery

Bulls playing perfect team bball right now, it's a pleasure to watch them. And that's without Rose and Butler!

Itssoeasy

The Knicks only scored 81 points in 48 minutes of pro Ball. I'm not a Knicks fan but this season has been a cluster**** for this historic and once proud franchise. Maybe that fan and his letter were right about the owner James Dolan.

buyer95

nerd69 wrote: »

i think we all did lebron is lebron but okc looked like the next shaq/kobe type team it could end up falling apart on them now.

iv heard it said that part of the injury issue was the club rushing them back from previous injuries i find that hard to believe however i think the players themselves where dying to get back what do ye think

I don't find that hard to believe at all. In the playoffs last year Ibaka was ruled out for the season, sat the first 2 games of the conference finals and then returned to play out the series. Within a few months Ibaka would have to have knee surgery on the knee.

ButtersSuki

I'm not being wise after the event, I did say it at the time that OKC should not have traded Harden (check my posts at the time for verification of this of required). Their argument at the time was that they didn't want to pay the luxury tax. Anyone remember how much they would have pay Harden the year they let him go? $5.8m - yes, that was the figure.

So, for less than $6m and whatever they'd have been on the line for luxury tax wise, they broke up the best young team in pro sports. Do you think anyone would have questioned them or Presti's wisdom of they paid Harden and the tax, and won even just one Championship? No. It was a bad decision then, and looks plain stupid now.

The other issue was around giving Harden a max. Though he didn't have a great Finals in 2012, he was the best 6th man in the league that year, was on the Olympic team, was very young and had IMO at least significantly more upside than Ibaka - again I posted on this at the time. Harden was clearly a far more skillful player, and had a significantly better all around game than Ibaka, who, although has shown some gradual improvement over the years, was never ever going to be a 20 and 10 guy (which is what you need at this level if you're ditching a guy with Harden's production). They SHOULD have found a way to make it work financially. Again, you win Championships and no-one asks questions on tax!

And I believe it will cost them more in the long term too. If OKC don't win it all in the next year or two, then you can imagine one or both of the main two getting fed up and either demanding a trade and/or waiting for free agency to walk. That team is either going to break up internally or be broken up by 2017 if they don't win it all. Had they managed to keep Harden & Ibaka we'd likely be looking at a legacy.

buyer95

ButtersSuki wrote: »

I'm not being wise after the event, I did say it at the time that OKC should not have traded Harden (check my posts at the time for verification of this of required). Their argument at the time was that they didn't want to pay the luxury tax. Anyone remember how much they would have pay Harden the year they let him go? $5.8m - yes, that was the figure.

So, for less than $6m and whatever they'd have been on the line for luxury tax wise, they broke up the best young team in pro sports. Do you think anyone would have questioned them or Presti's wisdom of they paid Harden and the tax, and won even just one Championship? No. It was a bad decision then, and looks plain stupid now.

The other issue was around giving Harden a max. Though he didn't have a great Finals in 2012, he was the best 6th man in the league that year, was on the Olympic team, was very young and had IMO at least significantly more upside than Ibaka - again I posted on this at the time. Harden was clearly a far more skillful player, and had a significantly better all around game than Ibaka, who, although has shown some gradual improvement over the years, was never ever going to be a 20 and 10 guy (which is what you need at this level if you're ditching a guy with Harden's production). They SHOULD have found a way to make it work financially. Again, you win Championships and no-one asks questions on tax!

And I believe it will cost them more in the long term too. If OKC don't win it all in the next year or two, then you can imagine one or both of the main two getting fed up and either demanding a trade and/or waiting for free agency to walk. That team is either going to break up internally or be broken up by 2017 if they don't win it all. Had they managed to keep Harden & Ibaka we'd likely be looking at a legacy.

I also posted on the trade on here at the time, saying I thought it was a great move by Daryl Morey. I decided to go back and look at what the consensus on here at the time was. Here's the thread on us discussing the trade. http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=81461735
Pizzaman, WhipIt, MadCon, NufcNavan and Ade all voiced their support for the trade Don't worry guys, if we were to go back through all my posts on here I'm sure I got a lot of stuff wrong also! Butters, padraig both didn't like the trade from OKC'S point of view, I said that I thought people on here were underatting how good Harden was and that it was a great move by Houston. I did also say that it could work out well from the Thunders point of view however:pac:

Looking back on it now, it would have to go down as one of the worst trades in the history of the league. The Thunder were on the cusp of having one of the top teams in the league for years, and traded it away for a year of Kevin Martin, Jeremy Lamb and a first rounder... OKC could have 3 of probably the top 7 or 8 players in the league on the same team right now. To be fair, they have been cursed by injuries ever since, and it is now increasingly likely that this group will never win a title. Durant leaving in Free Agency in 2016 is very much on the table in my opinion.

D2D

Steve Nash announces his retirement - http://www.theplayerstribune.com/steve-nash-retirement/

buyer95

Steve Nash has announced his retirement via Twitter. What a career he had, shame his last seasons were blighted by injury. I guess that's always a possibility when you play into your 40s as a guard though. Feels like a bit of an anticlimax, but the guy changed the game.

ButtersSuki

D2D wrote: »

Steve Nash announces his retirement - http://www.theplayerstribune.com/steve-nash-retirement/

Sad really. At his peak was absolutely amazing, sad to see it end with him basically sitting on his backside for 2 years whilst collecting a cheque.

ChicagoJoe

mixery wrote: »

Bulls playing perfect team bball right now, it's a pleasure to watch them. And that's without Rose and Butler!

Didn't do us much good in the end having a 19-point third quarter lead only to get run over in the fourth quarter to the Detroit Pistons. Still Gibson continued to show the energy of a month to recover with aggressive and forceful play in the post, a hopeful sign with Butler and Rose due back from long stays out with injuries.

LuckyGent88

And yet another triple double for Westbrook!!
Not the greatest points haul but a rake of assists.

Paully D

I haven't seen anywhere near enough basketball this season to make a judgment from my own perception, but Westbrook is available at 4/1 for the MVP. Is that price big considering all I seem to hear about/read about these days is how well Westbrook is playing?

http://www.oddschecker.com/basketball/nba/nba-championship/regular-season-mvp

TheGoldenAges

Paully D wrote: »

I haven't seen anywhere near enough basketball this season to make a judgment from my own perception, but Westbrook is available at 4/1 for the MVP. Is that price big considering all I seem to hear about/read about these days is how well Westbrook is playing?

http://www.oddschecker.com/basketball/nba/nba-championship/regular-season-mvp

There's no real standout candidate so it's not bad, if the Warriors get to 67/68 wins I think Curry will get it.
Hardens in the mix too with a good season so far.

padraig_f

Paully D wrote: »

I haven't seen anywhere near enough basketball this season to make a judgment from my own perception, but Westbrook is available at 4/1 for the MVP. Is that price big considering all I seem to hear about/read about these days is how well Westbrook is playing?

http://www.oddschecker.com/basketball/nba/nba-championship/regular-season-mvp

Need to remember it's voted on the media, and while everyone likes Curry, I don't think Russell Westbrook is as well-liked (and the same a bit for Harden). I'm not saying Curry wouldn't deserve it if he won, but in a close race, it is a factor.

Pretty interesting article last week on Grantland about Durant & Westbrook's odd relationship with the media:

Distant Thunder: What Did Oklahoma City’s Media Do to Piss Off Russell Westbrook and Kevin Durant?

The media can stick together about things like this (e.g. the widespread condemnation of Marshawn Lynch for his stonewalling).

For me, I never bet on things that will be voted on anyway.

ButtersSuki

Paully D wrote: »

I haven't seen anywhere near enough basketball this season to make a judgment from my own perception, but Westbrook is available at 4/1 for the MVP. Is that price big considering all I seem to hear about/read about these days is how well Westbrook is playing?

http://www.oddschecker.com/basketball/nba/nba-championship/regular-season-mvp

A few reasons why he won't be MVP;
1. As alluded to, he's not hugely liked by the press
2. He had missed too many games - he was injured at the start of the season remember?
3. The current outrageous form he's in has come too late in the season to make people change their minds on their vote
4. Curry in particular has had a better season all round. Harden too
5. The MVP almost always goes to the best player on the best team in the league (team with most wins that season) OR at worst top 3/4 teams depending on his stats. OKC may not make the play offs, ergo he basically has NO chance
6. I may be wrong but I don't think anyone has ever been MVP when their team didn't make the play offs. I'd be shocked beyond belief if someone had
7. Despite his tripdoub run, he's still perceived as a gunner and NOT a team player. Gunners do not win MVP
8. He's still the no. 2 on that team. OKC is Durant's team. It's almost inpossible for a no. 2 guy to win MVP regardless of what he does over a season

I actually had more reasons in my head but I'm too tired to remember them, may edit later (lol).

One thing this run and his season have done is likely change some people's (media) perception of him, which can only be a good thing for him long term.

Lt J.R. Bell

Sad really.anyone watch Durant's documentary of his recent summer. Two summers ago him and Love went to watch the US try outs and had committed themselves for last summers world championship

Then last summer Love pulled out due to his on going trade, George Paul nearly ended his career and kg,being knackered,pulled out of the US team in order to prepare for this season. He feared getting injured

Irony is, he has been injured for most of this season anyway

Look at the documentary, instead of resting for the three months, he's constantly training and travelling to basket ball camps promoting his "brand"

What is it with American sports. They are always expected to "work hard" and don't just rest? No one ever follow Dirks attitude of quality over quantity?

GoldFour4

This was floating around reddit this morning, super casual.

http://gfycat.com/FittingLoathsomeDeer

padraig_f

Pulled together some stats...

[B]Player      GP   MPG     Points   PPG     Assists   APG    Ast/Tov   RPG   TS%    WS     WS/48   USG     VORP   PER
[/B]Westbrook   55   34.0    1513     27.5      478     8.7      1.98    7.3   53.7   9.1     .233    38%     6.4   29.5
Harden      68   36.7    1831     26.9      474     7.0      1.72    5.8   60.1   13.4    .258    31.1%   6.5   26.3
Curry       67   32.9    1561     23.3      528     7.9      2.55    4.3   62.3   12.9    .280    28.8%   6.3   27.4

Don't think it makes it conclusive. Curry is the most efficient (highest TS%, highest Ast/TOV). But he also has the lowest usage....lowest minutes (probably because of a lot of Golden State blowouts), and lowest usage-percentage...28.8% to Westbrook's 38%.

Higher usage will lead to lower efficiency. So you can argue that either way, Westbrook is putting his team on his back more, but at the expense of some efficiency.

Harden has the most win-shares (WS), a function of him playing most minutes, and playing all 68 games (though Curry has a higher WS/48, efficiency again). But you can argue a case for Harden there. He's kind of a combination of the two, in terms of volume and relative efficiency.

Box-score stats tend to measure offense more than defense. From what I've seen, I'd say Westbrook is the best defensive player of the 3, and it shows up in his rebounds....7.3, to Harden's 5.8 and Curry's 4.3.


Ultimately, I think it's close enough that the 67/68 wins, and the likability factor will give it to Curry. If I had to vote, I might go for Westbrook. For defense, and I have a soft spot for the 'putting the team on your back' thing, even if it costs you some efficiency.

Lt J.R. Bell

buyer95 wrote: »

Steve Nash has announced his retirement via Twitter. What a career he had, shame his last seasons were blighted by injury. I guess that's always a possibility when you play into your 40s as a guard though. Feels like a bit of an anticlimax, but the guy changed the game.

Shame it was blighted by Kobe

GoldFour4

Simmons has a new Monday NBA podcast called "Bill Don't Lie". It's a separate podcast from the BS report so you'll have to subscribe to it again if you want to hear Simmons and Lowe talk about ball etc.

Lt J.R. Bell

malistheman wrote: »

Simmons has a new Monday NBA podcast called "Bill Don't Lie". It's a separate podcast from the BS report so you'll have to subscribe to it again if you want to hear Simmons and Lowe talk about ball etc.

I like Bill but doesn't he have enough shows on one sport? He has got the BS Report and Grantland (with Jalen Rose and fella)

What will be different about this.

I sound like I am complaining, I am not, really

No doubt a gizilon times better than Stephen A Smith and that other turd

GoldFour4

Lt J.R. Bell wrote: »

I like Bill but doesn't he have enough shows on one sport? He has got the BS Report and Grantland (with Jalen Rose and fella)

What will be different about this.

I sound like I am complaining, I am not, really

No doubt a gizilon times better than Stephen A Smith and that other turd

Yeah I thought the new show name was a bit unnecessary. I think they're going to try keep his basketball stuff on this new show and the BS report will be kept for the NFL and MLB and the different pop culture stuff he does.

padraig_f

Didn't understand the need for a rebrand either, but think it means there'll be one every Monday from here til the end of the playoffs, which will be cool.

Thought the one he did with Ryen Russillo last week was very good, lot of gossipy stuff about Cleveland, about all not being well despite their improved form of late. Apparently Lebron is still not really communicating with David Blatt.