No M50 public transport alternative?

cgcsb

There is some serious thought going into multiple tolls along the m50 as a demand management measure, which would be great if there was some alternative. I would say the majority of peak hour users, especially between tallaght and blanch, are not going suburb to city centre, rather they are travelling between suburbs. For them there is no, or very little public transport alternatives. My question is, what else are they supposed to do? There is no credible bus service between blanch and tallaght. Sure metro west would be great but until then driving is the only option. With no bus alternative, multi tolling isn't going to encourage a switch to pt, rather it'll just force cars onto smaller roads to avoid those rolls.

timetogo

They're supposed to pay the tolls

I'm in the same boat. I go from Swords -> Sandyford every day. What a pain in the hole it's gotten to be over the last couple of months and it's only going to get worse.

For me I'm actively trying to get a job in the city centre or closer to Swords. If you're travelling from a suburb to the city centre then Dublin is fairly well served. Many other routes are car only. If there was a decent park & ride for the M50 I'd be all over it.

I would suggest a peak / off peak system for the current toll. E.g. before 7AM it could be 50c off. After 8PM another 50c off. That might stagger some traffic which could ease off peak flow.

I think the multiple tolls will have to be done though. At it's current levels the M50 is just about usable for a daily commute. If it increases by a couple of percent it's going to be back to gridlock.

thomasj

Sadly the closest you have is 239 blanchardstown to Liffey valley and the 76 liffey valley to tallaght, you'd bre better off getting bus and luas!

A major upgrade of the 76A was planned as part of network direct but following protests by ballyfermot residents the route was more or less culled!

cgcsb

timetogo wrote: »

They're supposed to pay the tolls

I'm in the same boat. I go from Swords -> Sandyford every day. What a pain in the hole it's gotten to be over the last couple of months and it's only going to get worse.

For me I'm actively trying to get a job in the city centre or closer to Swords. If you're travelling from a suburb to the city centre then Dublin is fairly well served. Many other routes are car only. If there was a decent park & ride for the M50 I'd be all over it.

I would suggest a peak / off peak system for the current toll. E.g. before 7AM it could be 50c off. After 8PM another 50c off. That might stagger some traffic which could ease off peak flow.

I think the multiple tolls will have to be done though. At it's current levels the M50 is just about usable for a daily commute. If it increases by a couple of percent it's going to be back to gridlock.

In fairness for your commute you have the express 142 bus and green line luas available to you. Many other suburb-suburb journeys are substantially more difficult by public transport.

cgcsb

thomasj wrote: »

Sadly the closest you have is 239 blanchardstown to Liffey valley and the 76 liffey valley to tallaght, you'd bre better off getting bus and luas!

A major upgrade of the 76A was planned as part of network direct but following protests by ballyfermot residents the route was more or less culled!

I wasn't aware of that. Why were there protests? The blanch to tallaght section of the m50 is the busiest, surely it justifies at least one bus route

corktina

Interesting idea. Presumably an express service from (say) Red Cow LUAS to the Airport might get used

AlekSmart

corktina wrote: »

Interesting idea. Presumably an express service from (say) Red Cow LUAS to the Airport might get used

The fragmented nature of Transport Planning in the Greater Dublin Area has been the common thread running through it for decades.

Some posters here may remember the Circle Line proposals which were energetically promoted by a (now retired) Busdriver from Conyngham Road.

Quite an amount of the proposals actually make sense,however,these suggestions usually fall as they do not emenate from the "Right Type" of proposer....;)

There is still quite a volume of stuff out there,but,be warned,you'll have to trawl through quite a bit of reading....:)

http://dublinbus.org/
http://dublinbus.org/id49.html

Yggr of Asgard

corktina wrote: »

Interesting idea. Presumably an express service from (say) Red Cow LUAS to the Airport might get used

That sort of exists, it's operated by Dublin Coach which goes every hour and costs 5€ per ride.

It goes from the Red Cow Luas Stop via the M50, exits at Ballymun goes via the old airport road to Dublin Airport.

Pete_Cavan

Is there any plan to extend the R121 south to link with either junction 2 or 3 on the N4?

No doubt it would be expensive, between the bridge and avoiding the golf courses in the area. It would be a very useful link if it was feasible. Obviously measures would have to be taken to prevent over use by traffic avoiding the M50 and bus lanes would have to be provided. It would be a good project to fund from multi tolls on the M50.

StreetLight

cgcsb wrote: »

I wasn't aware of that. Why were there protests? The blanch to tallaght section of the m50 is the busiest, surely it justifies at least one bus route

There were protests because it involved removing the 76 from Ballyfermot altogether and running it directly over to Blanch from Liffey Valley.

To compensate, there was a plan to continue the 79 route through Clondalkin on to Tallaght, but Ballyfermot residents were having none of it.

cgcsb

Surely the NTA could insist on it anyway. There generally isn't any public consultation on route changes so, why should this case be any different.

thomasj

cgcsb wrote: »

Surely the NTA could insist on it anyway. There generally isn't any public consultation on route changes so, why should this case be any different.

It was brought in as part of network direct so all major areas affected by network direct has consultation periods. I think it was at the ntas behest that the consultation stage had to happen.

Carawaystick

cgcsb wrote: »

In fairness for your commute you have the express 142 bus and green line luas available to you. Many other suburb-suburb journeys are substantially more difficult by public transport.

The 142 serves Swords, like Ryanair serve cities, far away from the centre. The stops on Dublin bus' map are all east of the r132, and there's only 4 busses a day anyway.

LXFlyer

The reason that the services were not expanded is simply that there was no cash to do so.

That's ultimately why the improved orbital services were canned. There were plans for an all day 76a from Blanchardstown to Tallaght via the M50 and the R113, the 166 from Liffey Valley to Tallaght via the Outer Orbital route (R136) and Citywest, and for the 75 to be split into two routes from Tallaght to Dun Laoghaire.

All of those would need extra buses and there simply wasn't (and probably still isn't) the money to do them. The focus was on maintaining the existing network.

There was an additional issue of the people in Ballyfermot objecting strongly to losing the service to Clondalkin and Tallaght (it was planned to divert all 76 services from Liffey Valley to Blanchardstown rather than Ballyfermot), and that also impacted on the decision to retain the 76 routing as was.

Personally I'd like to see a couple of peak time routes introduced along the western corridor:

76a from Tallaght Square to Blanchardstown SC via the R113, M50 from Liffey Valley, and Ballycoolin business parks in the morning (say from 06:30 every 20 minutes to 08:30), returning in the evening (16:00 to 19:00),

76b from Ongar or Littlepace via Clonsilla down the M50 to Liffey Valley and then on to Tallaght/Citywest via the R113 and N81/82 in the morning peaks, returning in the evening at the same times..

Conway635

There was a service which ran hourly:

Tallaght-Clondalkin-Ballyfermot-Westlink-Ballymun-Airport.

It was operated by Dualway as route 2411 and lasted a couple of years before folding due to lack of use.

The four-digit routenumber was unusual - they explained it by saying the buses went from Dublin 24 to Dublin 11 !

C635

Idbatterim

I'm in the same boat. I go from Swords -> Sandyford every day.

There were plans to build an easterbypass, that have been shelved...

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055516991&page=3

Alas as we have found out, why bother investing in infrastructure, far more votes to be bought in throwing money into peoples back pockets every few years...

cgcsb

Carawaystick wrote: »

The 142 serves Swords, like Ryanair serve cities, far away from the centre. The stops on Dublin bus' map are all east of the r132, and there's only 4 busses a day anyway.

yes 4 buses a day during peak hours which is when you commute, no? there is also the 41 X and Swords express services, so you do in fact have public transport options, you just chose to drive instead. For the busiest section of the M50, Tallaght-Blanch there is no public transport options which is my point regarding multi tolling.

cgcsb

Idbatterim wrote: »

There were plans to build an easterbypass, that have been shelved...

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055516991&page=3

Alas as we have found out, why bother investing in infrastructure, far more votes to be bought in throwing money into peoples back pockets every few years...

the eastern bypass was a bit of a celtic tiger excess. It's not happening. Even with DARTu, MetroN and integrated ticketing there'd be ample other essential items to spend the dosh on, a comprehensive network of park and rides integrated into leap for example.

omicron

Multi-point tolling will only be effective if it tries to change the times of peoples commutes rather than force them off the M50 onto smaller roads e.g. only toll 7-9am and 4-7pm or something around those times. If even 10% of people currently travelling between 7 and 9 am went before 7 or after 9 it would make an enormous difference.