Next Gen game prices

Big Knox

Ok so I'm not sure if this has been discussed in detail as of yet but are consoles completely pushing away PC gamers? I got my PS4 when destiny came out but since then I haven't bought a single game for it. I simply can't justify paying €70 for a game when I can get it for half the price or less on PC. Surely it's also pushing people away from consoles and to try PC gaming more and more!

Shadows or Mordor, Alien Isolation, The Evil Within and now Lords of the Fallen are all games I would have liked to play and get some use from my PS4 but the disparity of digital prices is ridiculous and it's making the divide between PC and console gaming bigger than ever.

A big factor in the lower prices on the PC is digital keys which can be sold through 3rd party vendors. Would this help for consoles possibly? In an age where digital downloading is now a massive portion of the market (if not the largest) surely this would be a logical step for console games so why is this not a thing?

Also let's not turn this into a PC versus console thing. This is clearly a problem and consoles will always have their place in gaming so leave the masterrace jokes aside please!

Myrddin

I can see the physical pricing coming down for new gen stuff already. The digital pricing model is ridiculous though, for something you can't sell on or trade in there should be a small initial price. Also the manufacturing process is eliminated when buying digitally, but that is never reflected in the price, & often enough, it can be more expensive to buy digitally than physically.

Generic Dreadhead

Donkey Kong Country was £50 at release

Retr0gamer

This happened last gen as well. Prices go up at the start because there's a small install base so you are selling to less people and you have to cover licensing costs unlike on PC. They will come down as the user base grows. If you take inflation into account games are still cheaper than in 2005-2006 when they were selling for the same price. Just buy online and have a bit of patience if you want your games cheaper. You don't need a game on release day.

Genghiz Cohen

Retr0gamer wrote: »

You don't need a game on release day.

+1

You don't need a game that doesn't have any real world reviews/lets plays.
You don't need a game with a day-1 patch and the servers melting.
You don't need game breaking bugs that won't be patched for a week.

Stop paying outrageous prices and people will soon stop asking for them.

Nody

Myrddin wrote: »

I can see the physical pricing coming down for new gen stuff already. The digital pricing model is ridiculous though, for something you can't sell on or trade in there should be a small initial price. Also the manufacturing process is eliminated when buying digitally, but that is never reflected in the price, & often enough, it can be more expensive to buy digitally than physically.

Is not the whole point that the digital versions sold on the stores "have" to be MRRP priced to stop the stores from refusing to stock the same game (at a slightly lower price to be appealing vs. the full price digital price)?

So the digital store is not really there for you to buy the games; it's simply there to make the physical copies look cheap and make the retailers happy. I also think this is why Steam is normally so expensive (i.e. 49.99 for a game two years old) and sales make such a big difference (as they can "break" the need to be at retail price due to being a sale).

Myrddin

Nody wrote: »

Is not the whole point that the digital versions sold on the stores "have" to be MRRP priced to stop the stores from refusing to stock the same game (at a slightly lower price to be appealing vs. the full price digital price)?

So the digital store is not really there for you to buy the games; it's simply there to make the physical copies look cheap and make the retailers happy. I also think this is why Steam is normally so expensive (i.e. 49.99 for a game two years old) and sales make such a big difference (as they can "break" the need to be at retail price due to being a sale).

Yeah perhaps so. I think though if you want to buy digitally, you should benefit from the reduced costings (manufacturing, shipping, can't sell/trade later on etc). If you choose to buy physically (which I do), then you should pay the expected price. I'm sure that's an extremely simplistic take on it however.

gizmo

Big Knox wrote: »

A big factor in the lower prices on the PC is digital keys which can be sold through 3rd party vendors. Would this help for consoles possibly? In an age where digital downloading is now a massive portion of the market (if not the largest) surely this would be a logical step for console games so why is this not a thing?

The availability of cheaper keys from developing countries shouldn't be used as an indication of anything. They're an abnormality brought on by regional pricing in an online system with no region locks. In my, I assume unpopular opinion, the widespread adoption of them in developed countries will lead to either one of two things, either publishers start region locking keys and stores or they drive the prices up worldwide leading to a whole load of gamers in those developing countries being totally unable to enjoy games.

Whether people care about this, especially in light of the value offered by games at their current general price with respect to inflation and continually rising development costs, is another issue entirely.

Myrddin wrote: »

Yeah perhaps so. I think though if you want to buy digitally, you should benefit from the reduced costings (manufacturing, shipping, can't sell/trade later on etc). If you choose to buy physically (which I do), then you should pay the expected price. I'm sure that's an extremely simplistic take on it however.

Given the small percentage of the retail price that goes towards manufacturing and distribution, one could argue the savings made could be offset by the convenience offered by the digital stores. What those stores, and by extension publishers, should do though is, rather than keeping their higher prices for prolonged periods of time, allow them to drop organically after release. Some of them do, however. For example, in terms of launch titles, Need For Speed: Rivals is down to $29.99 on the XBox One whereas Dead Rising 3 from Capcom and all of the MGS games are still $49.99/$59.99.

As has been pointed out already though, there's the rather unknown variable of where the push to keep digital prices higher is coming from, is it at the platform level with those companies worried retailers will suffer causing hardware units to fall or is it at a publisher level with said companies afraid of retailers refusing to stock their games? One way or another, if they want to see digital sales really grow on the next-gen consoles, something is definitely going to have to change.

johnny_ultimate

I'd put forward that console games have never been cheaper. Unless you desperately want the game from a bricks and mortar or digital store on release day, there is no reason whatsoever to pay €70 for a game.

Head online and you can easily save 15-20 euro on new releases. If you're willing to wait a few extra days for delivery from the likes of VG Plus, you'll be saving even more money. Since PS4 and X-One games are region free, we can easily take advantage of the cheaper prices available elsewhere, both for physical and digital releases, and seemingly with the approval or at least tolerance of Sony and Microsoft.

Discounts have never been deeper and quicker. I was looking for a copy of Alien Isolation on PS4 yesterday out of curiosity, and it can easily be gotten for around €40 - and that's only a couple of weeks after launch. It will almost definitely cheaper again come late November - December. Digital sales, on the other hand, (not to mention services like PS Plus and Games with Gold) mean anyone can build up a vast catalogue of games at huge discounts - maybe not quite as ridiculous as Steam sales, but honestly not far off at all. Patience is all that is needed, and it's a rare case where one has to wait any more than a couple of weeks for the discounts to start in earnest. If you can wait a few months, you'll be paying a fraction of the initial asking price.

Yes, PC gaming in general is quite a bit cheaper (although I'd also put forward that a lot of those key sites mentioned in the OP have some very suspect methods for keeping their prices so low - new release prices are typically relatively high on most 'legitimate' platforms, although obviously still cheaper than a console title). But I also think there's no good reason to settle for the high prices set by Gamestop for new releases when there are so many alternatives. I do agree that the official digital stores should be cheaper for brand new releases, but for the time being I can happily express my disapproval by not buying them.

super_furry

In real terms they've never been cheaper. It's weird but videogames seem to have avoided inflation entirely. I remember paying £70 punts for Super Nintendo games.

COYVB

Games cost more on newer systems because they sell less due to smaller user base. The street price comes down with adoption rate increases. Based on inflation, new major titles on new systems are actually cheap now compared to their price points historically

wandatowell

Myrddin wrote: »

Yeah perhaps so. I think though if you want to buy digitally, you should benefit from the reduced costings (manufacturing, shipping, can't sell/trade later on etc). If you choose to buy physically (which I do), then you should pay the expected price. I'm sure that's an extremely simplistic take on it however.

I think you have it spot on. But I also think there would be a major issue if Xbox Live/PSN started to undercut the Gamestops of this world. It would be a very aggressive move on the very companies they need to sell their product.

Hope Im explaining my point clearly. Finished a 12hr shift at 8.

wandatowell

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

although I'd also put forward that a lot of those key sites mentioned in the OP have some very suspect methods for keeping their prices so low

Can I ask Johnny what methods the Key sites use?

cloud493

Tis true, games go down in price very fast. Look at watchdogs, thats only 4 months old, less half the price it was at launch, and thats on the high street :P

recyclops

i have had an xbox one now for over half a year and never once have i paid more than 25 for a game, game sharing and american marketplace have made the games more accessible for me, so i am the complete opposite in comparison to the point the OP made.

much to my gf annoyance i am buying more games than ever

recyclops

i have had an xbox one now for over half a year and never once have i paid more than 25 for a game, game sharing and american marketplace have made the games more accessible for me, so i am the complete opposite in comparison to the point the OP made.

much to my gf annoyance i am buying more games than ever

johnny_ultimate

wandatowell wrote: »

Can I ask Johnny what methods the Key sites use?

As mentioned by gizmo, a lot of them sell keys from countries where prices are cheaper (Eastern Europe, for example). In some cases, the buyer has to use regional trickery like VPNs to actually play the games on Steam, and their account could be at risk of being banned as result.

Then there are some extreme cases: http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2014-06-30-rebellion-revokes-unlicensed-or-stolen-sniper-elite-3-steam-keys

Again, some key sites are legitimate or at least reputable. But I think the whole area is something of a wild west, and as gizmo pointed out something is likely to give eventually.

FutureGuy

I paid £72 for Street Fighter 2 Turbo for the SNES. I didn't baulk at it.

Now I have a massive issue for paying 70 euro for an XBOX ONE game :-D

Myrddin

wandatowell wrote: »

I think you have it spot on. But I also think there would be a major issue if Xbox Live/PSN started to undercut the Gamestops of this world. It would be a very aggressive move on the very companies they need to sell their product.

Hope Im explaining my point clearly. Finished a 12hr shift at 8.

That seems to be the problem alright. Reducing the price digitally, will affect physical sales. The two end products are different though, on one hand you've a file & a license on a hdd...on the other hand, you've a physical product, a box, a disc, artwork, the choice to sell on or trade in etc.

richymcdermott

Pc game prices are not that great either , all the cheap games are usually 4-5 years old , 50 quid for a online game still on steam is just stupid when you had cliff blenzinski making a claim years ago that if games were digital only they be cheaper , its simply not the case.

Watch dogs is 35 new after few months I expect other games will drop after christmas aswell

Retr0gamer

super_furry wrote: »

In real terms they've never been cheaper. It's weird but videogames seem to have avoided inflation entirely. I remember paying £70 punts for Super Nintendo games.

ROM chips at the time were ridiculously expensive which is why console prices before optical media were so expensive. Once they went to optical media which was dirt cheap to produce prices plummeted. In the mid 90's you had PC games at 25-30 pounds new and PS1 releases at 40 pounds. It was a huge selling point for the playstation at the time compared to SNES and N64 prices, late SNES games had a huge premium due to demanding high ROM space to compete technically.

I say bring back games on tape. A new mastertronic budget title for £3.99, yes please!

Retr0gamer

richymcdermott wrote: »

Pc game prices are not that great either , all the cheap games are usually 4-5 years old , 50 quid for a online game still on steam is just stupid when you had cliff blenzinski making a claim years ago that if games were digital only they be cheaper , its simply not the case.

Watch dogs is 35 new after few months I expect other games will drop after christmas aswell

If you are stupid enough to get a new game off steam then you deserve to pay a premium. Boxed copies or from a legit key site is significantly cheaper.

cloud493

I'm reasonably sure I (well my mum) paid £85 British pounds for Pokemon stadium including that transfer pak. So.... yeah its cheaper.

Grumpypants

wandatowell wrote: »

Can I ask Johnny what methods the Key sites use?

There are many key selling sites that are totally legit. They buy in bulk direct from the dev, publisher or distributor so they can pass on the savings that way. They can sell much cheaper than Steam because they only have a fraction of the cost that steam has.

Steam for example needs huge server banks that can allow users to download massive amounts of expensive data. All the security that goes with keeping user data, payment details and handling huge amounts of codes and money. And a ton of people to keep it all working, they all need to be paid and they all need to work in a building. It is not "almost free" to sell digital content as people seem to imagine.

The next tier starts getting murky they buy from different regions. Look at the PC bargain alerts thread and see how often a Brazilian site gets mentioned. Not illegal but dubious enough and could put your account at risk.

The bottom tier then are the really dodgy sites that steal credit cards buy a load of codes and sell them on. They hack accounts and sell the full account, but if you think you can buy a week old game on an account for $2 and it is legit then you deserve to get ripped off.

Stylesclash07

Apart from the last of us remastered and Destiny which i bought The digital version i havent payed "full price" for a game for my ps4 yet i have waited for sales. Nothing has that sale now feeling for me yet. Just yesterday i got battlefield 4 and premium for less than 45. I feel if you look around and wait a little bit you can get great game for less than half the price it was released at

richymcdermott

I do not mind paying 50 for a game but 70 you are having a laugh , especially now that half the game is locked away on online subscriptions , dlc and pre order bonuses and season passes , better to wait now more than ever

Big Knox

I wasn't aware console prices tend to drop off so much as the consoles become more popular (Haven't owned a console since the N64) but it obviously makes sense. Digital prices are still far too high however, they should be discounted not marked up!

The flipside is I can see changes being made in the likes of steam as mentioned, especially with the new trend of websites selling "keys" so cheap but actually trading the game from an account directly into your library with no actual key being used.

I used to be big into getting everything on release day but I just can't justify it any more. I haven't picked up any of the four games I mentioned in the OP yet and I'll probably wait for a steam sale to do so.

gizmo

Big Knox wrote: »

I wasn't aware console prices tend to drop off so much as the consoles become more popular (Haven't owned a console since the N64) but it obviously makes sense. Digital prices are still far too high however, they should be discounted not marked up!

They're not marked up though, that's their actual recommended retail price. It's the retailers themselves that apply discounts on physical copies based on bulk purchases, stock levels over time, ability to trade in etc...

Randall Floyd

richymcdermott wrote: »

I do not mind paying 50 for a game but 70 you are having a laugh , especially now that half the game is locked away on online subscriptions , dlc and pre order bonuses and season passes , better to wait now more than ever

Pre-order bonuses and day one dlc actively put me off buying games at release, as soon as I hear publishers use phrases like "the content available at launch" I rule out a day one purchase.

C14N

In response to OP: yes, the prices of new console games are off-putting to me as a PC gamer. PC games have gotten so cheap (and more importantly, aren't locked to a current piece of hardware) that I have a very hard time buying almost anything on consoles unless its exclusive. Even the Wii U, the cheapest of the 3, charges much more for games than what I'd usually pay. These days, it would be rare for me to pay over €10 for anything. €20-30 would be for something new that I really want and €40+ would be only for very special occasions (like upcoming Smash Bros). Paying €60 seems unfathomable at this point.

I don't know exactly how PC gaming does it or why Valve let others sell keys for their service so much cheaper than their own RRPs. These days I'm really just coasting on hugely discounted special offers for the most part. I can only imagine the reason people pay more is because they aren't really aware of this way yet. I really can't tell if this is sustainable through or if it's just a temporary thing to enjoy while it lasts. Seems to me that if games continue being so cheap on PC all the time, it will pull in more console players, but it may be that those console players who were paying €60+ are the ones who were propping up the publishers enough that they weren't that concerned about the PC gaming market and let it run wild with discounts.

I have heard that in the fashion industry, they make most of their money on sales and from outlet shops. They just need the expensive high-street shops in order to keep the demand high so that when people see it cheap they snap it up without hesitation. They basically just inflate the price to give the illusion of value because if the price is low from the get-go, people won't want it. I'm wondering if maybe this is how PC gaming is working right now. That maybe the Steam €50 RRP isn't actually making them a lot of money and they really intend to make most of the profit when they drop it to €25 a few months later.

Captain Chaos

Don't know what people are complaining about. Prices of next gen games have already dropped to last gen prices. All new releases for the PS4 and X1 are now €50-€55 delivered. Stop buying in Gamestop and paying silly money for games, shop around. If you want to get suckered inot paying more for Day 1 and Limited Editions with DLC than that's another issue. Stop buying it and developers will stop doing it.