The breaks even out in the long run

Bahanaman

How many double run days do you have each week NE? What's your opinion on their effectiveness? I'm just wondering because during the last six weeks of my training for Waterford last year I did all my runs early in the morning before work and most evenings I was tempted to head out again.

Netwerk Errer

Bahanaman wrote: »

How many double run days do you have each week NE? What's your opinion on their effectiveness? I'm just wondering because during the last six weeks of my training for Waterford last year I did all my runs early in the morning before work and most evenings I was tempted to head out again.

Depends really, I'm not one for strict planning outside of my workout days and long runs and even they go out the window sometimes. I prefer to let my body tell me what I can do. I was getting in 2-3 a week before Christmas during base-building but I really slacked off since then. Most people would look at my mileage now and say what the hell is he doing doubles for? but I'm looking at incorporating them now to build a foundation for down the road.

Are they effective? that debate will go on forever. Personally, I find them effective especially after after a workout the day before. I usually double up the day after a workout with a recovery and easy/steady run and I feel that recovery run helps me massively before I go into the main run of the day. If I'm doing an easy-easy/steady double day, I'm getting more miles in and lessening my chance of injury which a big thing for me. I have found them brilliant so far but I'm still a newb to them. I'm a lot fresher and getting more miles and better quality in than I would in singles right now.

There was actually a thread on letsrun lately about this. They were talking about about a 2.20 marathon runner who only done something like 4-5 mile runs but he would do them multiple times per day, I'll try dig it out and post it up when I get a chance.

There was a study done as well which shows that the number of runs in the last 4-6 weeks of marathon training was a greater predictor of marathon day performance than mileage run in that same period. I'll post that up too if I can find it for anyone who is interested.

Anyway, How's the training going? Any race planned for the long overdue sub-3?

Bahanaman

Tipping away NE! Did the Enniscorthy 10k the other day and found it a struggle. I'm a good bit away from where I'd like to be but it's early in the year. A few of us in the club are going to do Frankfurt next October and as of now that looks like the next attempt at the sub 3! The problem will be structuring the year up to then. Waterford is an option too because it's so close to me but to be honest I'm still a bit pished off over the cock ups down there with the distance in the last two years. I know I should probably get over it but last year especially was a big let down with all the effort that went into it! I'm doing a bit of cross country for the first time this winter and I might even have a go at the odd track race this year too. All new experiences! Bit of craic! I'd be hoping to get a lot more races in this year overall.

Netwerk Errer

Thur 12th Feb- 6m inc. 5x800@ 5k pace w/1.30 rec, 2x400m hard w/2min rec.

Wasn't going to do another run after this morning but I got a call from one of the lads at lunch asking if I wanted to head back to the track for a session tonight. In a moment of stupidity, I said shur why not. Quick power nap in the evening to shake off the cobwebs and headed back to the track for 8 after the C25k were finished, a whole 200+ of them training on the track at once.

Reps:
1. 2:53
2. 2:57
3. 2:58(only 1 minute rec, brain freeze)
4. 2:58
5. 2:58
2min rec
6. 1:20
7. 1:18

Whether the 800 pace is my actual 5k pace is arguable right now but I felt pretty comfortable with it bar the hiccup on the first rep and short recovery between 3-4. Pretty happy

Netwerk Errer

Bahanaman wrote: »

Tipping away NE! Did the Enniscorthy 10k the other day and found it a struggle. I'm a good bit away from where I'd like to be but it's early in the year. A few of us in the club are going to do Frankfurt next October and as of now that looks like the next attempt at the sub 3! The problem will be structuring the year up to then. Waterford is an option too because it's so close to me but to be honest I'm still a bit pished off over the cock ups down there with the distance in the last two years. I know I should probably get over it but last year especially was a big let down with all the effort that went into it! I'm doing a bit of cross country for the first time this winter and I might even have a go at the odd track race this year too. All new experiences! Bit of craic! I'd be hoping to get a lot more races in this year overall.

Good stuff! The 6.5 mile might be a good option in Waterford, as good a shot as anywhere to run a 10k PB!:D

Netwerk Errer

Fri 13th Feb- 4m rec (9:26)

Woke up fairly groggy this morning, probably 50/50 from the awful sleep the night before and yesterday's antics. Tipped away with a recovery run today and I was stiff as a plank heading out the door. Felt alright after the run, a little tired in the quads so tomorrow's just going to be another easy shakeout in prep for Sunday.

Netwerk Errer

Sat 14th Feb- 4m shakeout w/ 6x50m accels

Feeling good. Some nice pop in my stride which is a good sign after a pretty good week in terms of some very good quality among decent quantity. Going well.

Dubgal72

What's the race tomorrow NE? Good luck anyway (alarm.....:D )

Netwerk Errer

Dubgal72 wrote: »

What's the race tomorrow NE? Good luck anyway (alarm.....:D )

First goal race of the year, a big un, County roads 4 mile. We're missing most of our best seniors so I'm going to have pull my weight for senior and novice. No pressure!:eek:

I've half the town on alert to wake me up if the alarm doesn't.

tang1

Best of luck NE, hope it goes well for you.

JohnDozer

Best of luck! In with a shot of a team medal?

Netwerk Errer

Ooooooh, I don't know really. It's going to be tight whether I can make the top 4 in senior or novice. We only have one guy running who can't run novice so my odds are only a little smaller at making both teams. In senior, it's going to extremely difficult to beat the old enemy Limerick AC and Dooneen especially with a relatively weak team. The same with novice but I can't see us finishing outside the medals in either so it will be just a question of whether we can place higher and whether or not I can make the team to get a medal which will be touch and go.

I'm just going to go out and do whaat I can for the team and see what happens even if that means blowing up spectacularly in the end, I have to put myself in a scoring position early on to try and make a difference and hold on as best I can.

JohnDozer

Hard to see Limerick AC being knocked out of 1st place alright. I remember looking at previous results and its quite competitive. Pity ye haven't a full selection! Hope to be part of it next year, all going well.

Anyway, sounds like team competition brings out the best in you. Bring it on!

Netwerk Errer

25:45 today. Grand, there's some positives to be taken from it. Went out really hard in the last scoring position and sacrificed myself, Not really too bothered about that as I done what I had to. Report to come later or tomorrow, I'm bollixed!

Dubgal72

We'll done, sounds like a real race! Looking forward to the report.

Netwerk Errer

County 4 mile- 25:45

Felt pretty confident all morning going into the race but it was always going to be a case of how everyone else was running which would determine my approach at the start. Pulled up at registration at 11, about an hour and a half before the men's race so I would be there for the Women's start at 12. The start was a mile away from registration so the lads and I jogged down and back to wave the girls off. Felt unusually perky on the warm-up so the confidence was peaking.

With the two races being only a half hour away from each other, we didn't get to see the girls come in. Tipped back down to the start 15 minutes before the gun went off and got a few drills and stretches in. The wind was picking up at this stage but to be honest, that didn't matter as we all had to deal with and this wasn't going to be a time trial although I still entertained thoughts of breaking my now ancient 4 mile PB of 24:50 from 2013.

The Race

Mile 1
Everyone set off at a ridiculous pace and I had a good look around to see where everyone was. Spotted 2 of the lads from the club and tacked onto them and a group of about 15. The first mile was by far the most difficult in my opinion, constantly climbing into a strong headwind for the first 1000m or so. At 6,2, people seem to like to take shelter behind me and I wasn't going to give them that advantage so for the first 500m, I was swerving wildly back and forth across the road to try and shake them off until it was only me and two of my clubmates. A look at the garmin here showed up a shocking 5:47 pace through a half mile. The focus then turned to keeping us running as a team and I took up the job of breaking the wind. 5:58

Mile 2-

The course took a turn here and flattened out, The headwind was now a crosswind and we took up position in the gutter for protection. One of the lads made his move here and pushed on, I was now just outside scoring position but could still be a difference maker as 5th man in novice if it came down to ties. My other teamate was starting to slow off the pace and I tried my best to pull him along but he just said to me "head down, push it on". I was starting to feel the burn here too but I had no choice but to hammer as best as I could until my legs fell off given the position I was in. 6:24

Mile 3

The legs were buckling starting off the 3rd mile when another clubmate came up alongside me and started to pull away fairly quickly, now as sixth man, the goal had changed again to just not letting any rival club runner pass me as I was trundling along, my legs were shot. Ended the 3rd mile without anyone else passing me. 6:42

Mile 4

Two more clubmates passed me early into this mile and I took that petrified look over my shoulder to see a rival club runner in the corner of my eye 30m behind. Usually, I'd back myself in this position but the legs were quaking and I had to put all my energy into keeping the arms pumping. There was a slight pull for 400m which turned into a steep 100m climb. I knew if I could get up to the top, I wasn't going to be taken on the downhill run into the finish line. Got up there with the help of some of the girls who had came back out the course to offer some badly needed encouragement. Picked it up a little from here and got to the line without anyone passing me and done the NE flop™. The guy must have blown a cylinder coming over the hill as 2 more of the lads had passed him and he was a good bit behind.6:41

Senior team finished 2nd and novice 3rd I think.


There was some positives in there today that bode well for my last race of my heavy schedule of late next week in Adare.

I managed to maintain a 6:40 pace for the second half when in excruciating pain. That mightn't sound great but with the pace of the opening mile today, that's encouraging. The pace won't be near that fast in Adare next week for the first mile. I also got some solid midweek training in this week so with a fully fledged taper, I will be fresh on the start line for the first time in a long time as my races of late have been trained through. Mentally, I feel like I'm coming around which is probably 90% of the battle for me. Last year, I was in the best shape of my life but couldn't put it together with a stubborn performance. My willingness to take pain is starting to come back to what it was like in 2013 when I feel it was my biggest strength. Plus, I have a few plans in the pipeline to take my training to the next level after Adare. Time to pull the finger out.

RayCun

do you not think the swerving was counter-productive, hurting you more than breaking the wind was helping the others?
(you could always try the 'over the shoulder snot rocket' to dislodge hangers on )

Dubgal72

Great report and fantastic team running, you sound like a real team player....but I have to agree with Ray. You could have added up to 100m on by swerving. Years and years ago, I remember a female athlete (Grete Waitz maybe) and her coach tell how they analysed the course beforehand and planned the shortest route possible. I doubt very much you'd give all the other athletes a 100m head start?! (Or continue 100m after everyone finished )

Dubgal72

Ps love Ray's eeeoouuwww advice

annapr

Well done, NE, I love reading all these XC reports... those races sound mad!

hillsiderunner

Well done, especially on getting away from that last challenger.

I take it the asthma is under control now!

Netwerk Errer

RayCun wrote: »

do you not think the swerving was counter-productive, hurting you more than breaking the wind was helping the others?
(you could always try the 'over the shoulder snot rocket' to dislodge hangers on )

Haha, never thought of that Ray. Cheers!

Bloody cars were at it too!:mad: It'd take a good case of the manflu to make them ease back.

http://scontent-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/t31.0-8/10928838_10152628863500264_821630126535644823_o.jpg?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9

But yeah, you probably right. I only kept doing it until they stopped following me. They were doing the same thing behind me.

annapr

Netwerk Errer wrote: »

Haha, never thought of that Ray. Cheers!

Bloody cars were at it too!:mad: It'd take a good case of the manflu to make them ease back.

http://scontent-ams.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/t31.0-8/10928838_10152628863500264_821630126535644823_o.jpg?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9

so it wasn't XC then... my mistake!

Netwerk Errer

Dubgal72 wrote: »

Great report and fantastic team running, you sound like a real team player....but I have to agree with Ray. You could have added up to 100m on by swerving. Years and years ago, I remember a female athlete (Grete Waitz maybe) and her coach tell how they analysed the course beforehand and planned the shortest route possible. I doubt very much you'd give all the other athletes a 100m head start?! (Or continue 100m after everyone finished )

Thanks DG! I'd like to think I was running sub-4 pace if I was going in a straight line though!:D

Netwerk Errer

annapr wrote: »

Well done, NE, I love reading all these XC reports... those races sound mad!

Thanks Anna! No it wasn't XC. Club roads but the tactics are still the same idea. Tough stuff!

Netwerk Errer

hillsiderunner wrote: »

Well done, especially on getting away from that last challenger.

I take it the asthma is under control now!

Thanks hillside! Yeah, the weather's getting better so it's not really an issue. Still need to get an inhaler and not leave it on the backburner.

RayCun

I hate to see cars on the road during a race, they couldn't get road closures for a county championship?

Netwerk Errer

RayCun wrote: »

I hate to see cars on the road during a race, they couldn't get road closures for a county championship?

Pretty sure there was full road closures. Probably just a car that pulled out of a house along the route. To be fair, the race was well organised. I wasn't too happy at the time though as you can see.

RayCun

ah yes, if they can't figure out how to apply an L plate correctly they'd have trouble with concepts like, "people running a race on the road means you shouldn't drive there at the same time"

annapr

RayCun wrote: »

ah yes, if they can't figure out how to apply an L plate correctly they'd have trouble with concepts like, "people running a race on the road means you shouldn't drive there at the same time"

A car pulled out from a side road into the DCM crowd near the top of the hill in Milltown... I couldn't believe it at the time, this was in the 4:40 zone so everyone was wrecked and it was just luck that none of the shufflers runners stumbled under the car! Grrr motorists! :mad: