Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014 - Mod Warning in OP, 10/12

amiable

Lord Trollington wrote: »

We need a World Class Stiker and a World class DM and I genuinely believe a lot of our problems would be solved. We have already stopped leaking goals.

With Sturridge back and another top stiker along with him along with a top class mobile DM i believe that would solve a lot of our problems.

We need a GK too

5starpool

brevity wrote: »

Is Opr allowed to post anymore? I know he was banned for a while, is he up for parole?

Always enjoyed his posts...

brevity

Nope, persona non grata, and topic non grata also.

Bit windy out there today.

LuckyLloyd

brevity wrote: »

Is Opr allowed to post anymore? I know he was banned for a while, is he up for parole?

Always enjoyed his posts...

brevity

Nope.

brevity

Shame.

mosstin

I hate reading today about Gerrard's heroics last night. Superb free kick but I thought he was incredibly wasteful in possession. I suppose that makes me a hater now though.

Knex*

He'd be absolutely raging after last night, but he was always quite constructive and informative in his posts. Didn't always agree with him, but I did enjoy the detail and length he would go to.

He was the cause of a lot of interesting discussions around here, and in hindsight, he actually often compelled me to post seriously to engage in these discussions, often enough.

Its rare enough for me to do so these days!

LuckyLloyd

mosstin wrote: »

I hate reading today about Gerrard's heroics last night. Superb free kick but I thought he was incredibly wasteful in possession. I suppose that makes me a hater now though.

Correct, it does.

mosstin

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Correct, it does.

Right. And how exactly does it? Just so that I know.

Connavar

Iused2likebusts wrote: »

Carrick top 50 players in the world come on. He can barely get in the England squad. Top 50 in the world is a serious standard probably only 15 premier league players at most at that standard with Chelsea and city having the majority of them.

Never said he was a top 50, I said he wasn't far off those players that were listed, whom I do think are in or around top 50.
And I don't take what is happening in the england squad as a sign of the players talents

Strongbow10

mosstin wrote: »

I hate reading today about Gerrard's heroics last night. Superb free kick but I thought he was incredibly wasteful in possession. I suppose that makes me a hater now though.

Itv's analysis was fairly sickening last night post game. Apparently this kind of predicament really isn't fair on him and he deserves a lot better in the twilight of his career.

And if you thinks that's just hyperbole watch the last 5-10 mins back which more or less gushed about fantastic Stevie, and how he deserves a premier league medal aswell.

Knex*

Strongbow10 wrote: »

Itv's analysis was fairly sickening last night post game. Apparently this kind of predicament really isn't fair on him and he deserves a lot better in the twilight of his career.

And if you thinks that's just hyperbole watch the last 5-10 mins back which more or less gushed about fantastic Stevie, and how he deserves a premier league medal aswell.

Steven Gerrard is one of the greatest players to ever play for this club, and it wouldn't be too ridiculous to go as far as saying that he IS the greatest player to have ever played for us.

The man is a living legend, and we will thoroughly miss him when he is gone. We are already nostalgic for a younger version of him, and we'll be worse off again when he does hang up his boots.

I do feel like the team and his situation needs to be managed better, but I wouldn't think its too ridiculous to say he deserves better. The man pretty much kept us relevant for years almost single handily, and last year it finally looked like the Club was giving back. The right players were around him meaning we didn't have to look at him to carry the team any more.

This season has been back to normality for Steven Gerrard though, and he can no longer be expected to carry this team at 34, in all honesty.

Strongbow10

Knex. wrote: »

Steven Gerrard is one of the greatest players to ever play for this club, and it wouldn't be too ridiculous to go as far as saying that he IS the greatest player to have ever played for us.

The man is a living legend, and we will thoroughly miss him when he is gone. We are already nostalgic for a younger version of him, and we'll be worse off again when he does hang up his boots.

What has any of that got to do with current performance?

Carragher played on for 2-3 seasons beyond his sell by date, the fact Gerrard is still a regular let alone a key player is a key indicator of why Liverpool are where they are at. Nostalgic sentimentality merchants.

Chucky the tree

Knex. wrote: »

Steven Gerrard is one of the greatest players to ever play for this club, and it wouldn't be too ridiculous to go as far as saying that he IS the greatest player to have ever played for us.

The man is a living legend, and we will thoroughly miss him when he is gone. We are already nostalgic for a younger version of him, and we'll be worse off again when he does hang up his boots.

I do feel like the team and his situation needs to be managed better, but I wouldn't think its too ridiculous to say he deserves better. The man pretty much kept us relevant for years almost single handily, and last year it finally looked like the Club was giving back. This season has been back to normality for Steven Gerrard though.

We'll miss the old Gerrard when he hangs up his boots. Counting down the seconds with eager anticipation for the current one to do it tbh.

mosstin

Knex. wrote: »

Steven Gerrard is one of the greatest players to ever play for this club, and it wouldn't be too ridiculous to go as far as saying that he IS the greatest player to have ever played for us.

The man is a living legend, and we will thoroughly miss him when he is gone. We are already nostalgic for a younger version of him, and we'll be worse off again when he does hang up his boots.

I do feel like the team and his situation needs to be managed better, but I wouldn't think its too ridiculous to say he deserves better. The man pretty much kept us relevant for years almost single handily, and last year it finally looked like the Club was giving back. This season has been back to normality for Steven Gerrard though.

There's hardly a Liverpool fan alive who isn't aware of the fact that he's one of the greatest ever players for us. What bugs me is that automatically precludes him from any criticism whatsoever. In fact he's been scapegoated for several performances this season in which I thought he did pretty well. Last night though - gave the ball away so often.

joe123

Gerrards biggest asset last season was his long range balls that kick started our counters. He had Sterling, Suarez and Sturridge to pick from.

This year he has only Sterling who is being marked out of it. Lambert is nowhere near good enough to be playing for us and likewise Borini. You take your two best players out of a team and you will struggle.

Rodgers biggest failing this year has been the Summer Transfers. Nothing short of ****e.

I still don't understand however, how fans can be so quick to turn on a manager that gave us a season like last year. People attributing it to Suarez are basically stating "who needs a manager".

Its no suprise to see the likes of Alan complaining or LL but they have been at it for years so why bother even discussing topics with them? Can't remember which one it was but one of them came out at the end of last year and said Rodgers looks like the real deal. Now its all negative and most likely want him sacked.

Turtyturd

With the pining for Benitez and fan wankery over Gerrard a time machine is the only solution to our current predicament which will be acceptable for some.

Knex*

mosstin wrote: »

There's hardly a Liverpool fan alive who isn't aware of the fact that he's one of the greatest ever players for us. What bugs me is that automatically precludes him from any criticism whatsoever. In fact he's been scapegoated for several performances this season in which I thought he did pretty well. Last night though - gave the ball away so often.

Gerrard has been getting criticism from many for a few years now. Its peaked this year, and that coincidences with his performances, but our biggest issue is that we still don't have an adequate replacement for him.

When its a big game and we need to win, he has to start tbh.

Bandana boy

Last year Brod found a formula that played to the strengths of the team ,it had us really motoring ,difficult to play against and entertaining to watch.
At times when that did not work ,if teams had set up to counter it ,he changed it up and we managed most of the time to get a result.
He never addressed the defieciencies in Defence ,but we were ok with that as long as the goals kept going in.

I refuse to believe that this was all a fluke ,but as this season goes on and his inability to get the team playing continues ,it is hard to come up with another explanation.

Results will go your way and go against you over time ,there is little you can do to counter things like Evertons wonder goal in the last minute ,Chelsea getting stronger.

The only thing you can control is your own performance levels.
Results might go against you and those around you invest heavier and get stronger than you, so I do not like hard targets like top two top three to judge a Managers as a success or failure .
You can though set your team up in a coherant manner and have the players fired up and giving it there all. You can entertain and leave it all on the pitch every game.Something we have failed for 10 games in a row to do . These facts are not to do with injurys or transfer policy's but basics of managment.

Chucky the tree

Knex. wrote: »

Gerrard has been getting criticism from many for a few years now. Its peaked this year, and that coincidences with his performances, but our biggest issue is that we still don't have an adequate replacement for him.

When its a big game and we need to win, he has to start tbh.

Never know, if we allowed other players take free-kicks they might score too every so often.

6am7f9zxrsjvnb

Bandana boy wrote: »

Last year Brod found a formula that played to the strengths of the team ,it had us really motoring ,difficult to play against and entertaining to watch.
At times when that did not work ,if teams had set up to counter it ,he changed it up and we managed most of the time to get a result.
He never addressed the defieciencies in Defence ,but we were ok with that as long as the goals kept going in.

I refuse to believe that this was all a fluke ,but as this season goes on and his inability to get the team playing continues ,it is hard to come up with another explanation.

Results will go your way and go against you over time ,there is little you can do to counter things like Evertons wonder goal in the last minute ,Chelsea getting stronger.

The only thing you can control is your own performance levels.
Results might go against you and those around you invest heavier and get stronger than you, so I do not like hard targets like top two top three to judge a Managers as a success or failure .
You can though set your team up in a coherant manner and have the players fired up and giving it there all. You can entertain and leave it all on the pitch every game.Something we have failed for 10 games in a row to do . These facts are not to do with injurys or transfer policy's but basics of managment.

It wasn't a fluke - it was Suarez and Sturridge.

Knex*

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Never know, if we allowed other players take free-kicks they might score too every so often.

Admittedly, I missed the game last night due to work so I don't know how he played, but as poor as he has been this season, would you honestly prefer to bench him this weekend?

Agent Coulson

So are we going to do a Spain on it against Utd and play no striker.

Will he play Lambert again who probably doesn't have 90 mintues in him.

Knex*

This Borini shit is getting out of hand. I know he's not great, but at least he performs the necessary functions of the striker role that we need in order to get back towards playing how we did last season.

He has decent speed, he works the channels, he's aggressive without the ball, and he'll stretch the defence and open up more space for the likes of Sterling. Also, he gives the likes of Coutinho, Gerrard and Henderson an outlet for a quick through pass, etc.

Keeping him at home, I don't fucking get it.

Strongbow10

joe123 wrote: »

Gerrards biggest asset last season was his long range balls that kick started our counters. He had Sterling, Suarez and Sturridge to pick from.

This year he has only Sterling who is being marked out of it. Lambert is nowhere near good enough to be playing for us and likewise Borini. You take your two best players out of a team and you will struggle.

Rodgers biggest failing this year has been the Summer Transfers. Nothing short of ****e.

I still don't understand however, how fans can be so quick to turn on a manager that gave us a season like last year. People attributing it to Suarez are basically stating "who needs a manager".

Its no suprise to see the likes of Alan complaining or LL but they have been at it for years so why bother even discussing topics with them? Can't remember which one it was but one of them came out at the end of last year and said Rodgers looks like the real deal. Now its all negative and most likely want him sacked.

You live and die by your signings. Last night saw us play a defining game in our season and the manager left some big money signings sitting on their backsides from the first whistle.

This is simply shameful, when a club like Liverpool shells out €25 million on a player you better be damn sure he will feature in games like this. If you deem him good enough, there's no excuse not to go with him from the start. If you don't then what the hell was he brought in for?

I also worry that Rodgers is starting to change his tune going by popular consensus. It took calls from Jamie Carragher and numerous band wagon jumpers calling for Gerrard to be operating further forward before Rodgers made that change.

And it wasn't independent thought, he was moulded by populist thinking there. To me, the man is incapable of managing a squad, decision making in terms of choosing different teams depending on the opposition is beyond him. We won many games heavily,last season which was no mean feat but we did it with a team that virtually picked itself.

Let's not forget, the random occasions he tinkered with selection last season, it backfired. Playing 4 centre halves as a back four at home was one occasion resulting in defeat.

The "resting" of Raheem Sterling only to get bashed by the media? This,has resulted in him flogging the lad to the point he has played every game since where he'll more than likely be running on empty by February/March. Where's the consistency in though? Does he want to rest him or not?

Contrast that with his persistence in playing our captain (who is a legend, I feel I must acknowledge the obvious before I'm qualified to be critical) week in week out despite the fact he is incapable of playing the holding role in midfield.

Rodgers positive thinking approach of telling everyone they are fantastic, is rendered redundant when the sh*t hits the fan and he needs to rattle a few cages and provoke a response. And our defence is still shakey as f*ck despite a couple of clean sheets so I'd be very sceptical about the mans ability to organise a defence in the EPL let alone at the highest level of Champions League football.

The cynic in me says the guy knows he is done and has deliberately held back most of the summer signings (Can, Markovic, Lallana mostly) so that when he is sacked he'll claim they were not his men, in order to save face for the next job application.

Lovren, Manquillo, Moreno, Can, Lallana and Markovic could very well flourish under a different regime they are all a lot better than they have showed with us so far.

Chucky the tree

Knex. wrote: »

Admittedly, I missed the game last night due to work so I don't know how he played, but as poor as he has been this season, would you honestly prefer to bench him this weekend?

Yes. The thought of him playing this weekend really frightens me. United will press us high and if Gerrard plays in the CAM role we'll have little outlet again. Lambert playing him top simply compunds this problem. This Sunday really could be a massacare if United get their tactics right. Supposedly they've looked quite poor despite the results though so that's a help.

Turtyturd

Knex. wrote: »

Gerrard has been getting criticism from many for a few years now. Its peaked this year, and that coincidences with his performances, but our biggest issue is that we still don't have an adequate replacement for him.

When its a big game and we need to win, he has to start tbh.

It's hard to tell if you have a replacement for him when he plays almost every minute of every game. And he isn't doing that on the back of his performances and I doubt it's based on what he's doing in training.

Agent Coulson

Not playing two strikers.

Only in recent games playing a DM.

Playing Henderson on the LW when he is a box to box CM.

Having no in game tactics.

Why he has blacklisted players includng most of the summer signings.

These are the question Brendan Rodgers needs to answer or find the answers for in the coming weeks or he will loss his job.

Knex*

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Yes. The thought of him playing this weekend really frightens me. United will press us high and if Gerrard plays in the CAM role we'll have little outlet again. Lambert playing him top simply compunds this problem. This Sunday really could be a massacare if United get their tactics right. Supposedly they've looked quite poor despite the results though so that's a help.

Turtyturd wrote: »

It's hard to tell if you have a replacement for him when he plays almost every minute of every game. And he isn't doing that on the back of his performances and I doubt it's based on what he's doing in training.

Fair enough. I haven't been able to watch every game in its entirety this season (small blessings, eh?), like I would normally, so maybe the breaking point has been reached.

Definitely agree that Gerrard CAM and Lambert up top is just an absolute disaster, and far too easy for teams to game plan against.

SlickRic

Rodgers is an issue right now, but the transfer policy is the big, big, big problem.

until that is sorted, it's difficult to see how another manager will have us exactly where we want to be.

you might get a manager who improves us slightly, but there will always be a ceiling unless we can buy the top-tier players we need.

we missed an enormous opportunity this summer. it could be the period of time in the club's history that in the future we look back with real sombre regret. if we'd capitalised properly and paid what we needed to pay for the players we needed to acquire, who knows where we'd be. instead of a host of "could be" signings, imagine if we'd put all the money into 2 established world class players?

we can't keep going with this policy of exclusively looking to "the future". At some point we have to pay what's needed to acquire the "now".

Suarez was an exception. he was bought when everyone knew he could be world class, and we were the ones who were willing to take a punt on him. flawed geniuses like him don't always turn out the way he did. look at Balotelli currently. Suarez was a catalyst for the team playing well, not seen since Gerrard and Torres formed that ridiculous partnership a few years ago.

i don't know when we'll get another Suarez using the policy FSG are currently using. and if they won't do that, whoever the manager is will struggle hugely to get Liverpool consistently to the top table. the presence of United, Chelsea, Arsenal and City will be an impossible nut to crack given their respective resources.

Suarez and Sturridge assisted or scored 72 goals from the 100 scored last season.

Take them out and you have what you see now - a team that can't score and leaks goals.

Gbear

Knex. wrote: »

The man pretty much kept us relevant for years almost single handily, and last year it finally looked like the Club was giving back. The right players were around him meaning we didn't have to look at him to carry the team any more.

He really did have terrible luck to have a large chunk of his peak years stolen from him when the club went into meltdown.

He certainly deserved better than that.

Iused2likebusts

Connavar wrote: »

Never said he was a top 50, I said he wasn't far off those players that were listed, whom I do think are in or around top 50.
And I don't take what is happening in the england squad as a sign of the players talents

He isnt anywhere near that level though. Maybe he was that one really good season he had 2 years ago. Think a bit more about what top 50 entails and he isn't in the discussion. From utd adm and ddg the only certainties based on form over the last 18 months or so.

bennyineire

rarnes1 wrote: »

Suarez and Sturridge assisted or scored 72 goals from the 100 scored last season.

Take them out and you have what you see now - a team that can't score and leaks goals.

You know I never thought of that and I believe this might be the first time someone has made this point

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

rarnes1 wrote: »

Suarez and Sturridge assisted or scored 72 goals from the 100 scored last season.

Take them out and you have what you see now - a team that can't score and leaks goals.

Well, yes, but we'd only be playing with 9 men...:pac:

rob316

rarnes1 wrote: »

Suarez and Sturridge assisted or scored 72 goals from the 100 scored last season.

Take them out and you have what you see now - a team that can't score and leaks goals.

Well yes that is obvious for any fan to see. The issue is we had a ton of money and didn't replace that. Depending on Sturridge was idiotic as we all know he's a sick note.

The frustrating thing about all this is we saw what Spurs did and did the exact same thing! You cannot replace World Class stars with International level squad players. Penny pinching on wages and poor scouting has cost us any progress or stability from last season.

Strongbow10

SlickRic wrote: »

Rodgers is an issue right now, but the transfer policy is the big, big, big problem.

until that is sorted, it's difficult to see how another manager will have us exactly where we want to be.

you might get a manager who improves us slightly, but there will always be a ceiling unless we can buy the top-tier players we need.

we missed an enormous opportunity this summer. it could be the period of time in the club's history that in the future we look back with real sombre regret. if we'd capitalised properly and paid what we needed to pay for the players we needed to acquire, who knows where we'd be. instead of a host of "could be" signings, imagine if we'd put all the money into 2 established world class players?

we can't keep going with this policy of exclusively looking to "the future". At some point we have to pay what's needed to acquire the "now".

Suarez was an exception. he was bought when everyone knew he could be world class, and we were the ones who were willing to take a punt on him. flawed geniuses like him don't always turn out the way he did. look at Balotelli currently. Suarez was a catalyst for the team playing well, not seen since Gerrard and Torres formed that ridiculous partnership a few years ago.

i don't know when we'll get another Suarez using the policy FSG are currently using. and if they won't do that, whoever the manager is will struggle hugely to get Liverpool consistently to the top table. the presence of United, Chelsea, Arsenal and City will be an impossible nut to crack given their respective resources.

For too long we have been mourning "lost opportunities" in the transfer window.

It was the same when Kenny and Comolli spent a small fortune.

The club always like the potential based quantity over the couple of proven quality signings. It's obviously some judgement call and is seen as mitigating financial risk that 1 out of 6 May recoup the total outlay. Which historically has seen us have large turnover of players.

But we go around in circles. It's how you become a selling club, and the world star you luck out on usually ends up frustrated by our lack of GENUINE ambition from upstairs. Who still like to seduce supporters with guff about us being the best club in the world.

In reality, we are the 5th biggest club in England right now, that's where we are at.

bennyineire

bennyineire wrote: »

You know I never thought of that and I believe this might be the first time someone has made this point

And ironically your post adds nothing.

Just a pity nobody told the committee during the summer eh

e.r

After watching 90% of our matches this season, we seem to be playing football by numbers.

Each player is drilled to only do xy or z with the ball.

But last nite with 25 minutes to go that went out the window and we saw more raw fluid football.

Hopefully Rodgers can pick up on that and try to get some sort of run going!!

e.r

e.r wrote: »

After watching 90% of our matches this season, we seem to be playing football by numbers.

Each player is drilled to only do xy or z with the ball.

But last nite with 25 minutes to go that went out the window and we saw more raw fluid football.

Hopefully Rodgers can pick up on that and try to get some sort of run going!!

The best way to beat us is press our defenders and midfielders hard. Basel did it brilliantly last night right from the 1st whistle

Bandana boy

rarnes1 wrote: »

Suarez and Sturridge assisted or scored 72 goals from the 100 scored last season.

Take them out and you have what you see now - a team that can't score and leaks goals.

If the issue was we were well set up and playing like the result mattered but results were going against us becasue we lost our main chance converters .Then I would sit here and blame the transfer performance and be confident that when Daniel returned in the New year we would see things turn a corner ,I would be sending FSG letters saying invest in the striker we need and we will hit top 4 and win the league next year.

But i feel the problems are far deeper than missing a good player.

mav79

We were always going to struggle to score even close to what we did last season, but losing Suarez and having Sturridge injured is only one of the many problems with the team. Last night I can't remember one time where the back four held a flat line when on the back foot. Lovren and Skrtel kept looking at each other but never moved to support each other, and the fullbacks were usually missing.

Will I Amnt

e.r wrote: »

But last nite with 25 minutes to go that went out the window and we saw more raw fluid football.

Hopefully Rodgers can pick up on that and try to get some sort of run going!!

I wouldn't read too much into that. Basel were trying to see out the game, became defensive and invited the pressure on themselves. You see it all the time. It was very like the City v United game, United with 10 men finished the game with City hanging on when they really should have just kept playing the way they were.

Super-Rush

Fair play to the Basel fans last night. Sang from start to finish. Nice touch with the JFT96 banner at half time. Pity about the result and performance and most importantly the selections made by the manager. I want to get behind him but he's entered Benitez mode with his selections.

Dayum

I'll never understand how Rodgers, a guy that's paid stupid amounts of money for his football knowledge, has chosen a player that has had problems at every single club he's been at over the likes of Remy, Bony and Benteke. He could have signed all three strikers for 35million and still have more than half of the Suarez money to play around with nevermind the Champions League cash and sponsorship funding...

It boggles the mind....

Mr Alan

What's going to be very interesting is Sturridge when he gets back. I fear he won't be near the same level of player he was when he had Suarez beside him, spotting runs, executing passes, creating space, taking the focus of defences.

The expectation heaped onto
Sturridge by fans, the manager & players at the club is going to be absolutely monumental.

amiable

Dayum wrote: »

I'll never understand how Rodgers, a guy that's paid stupids amounts of money for his football knowledge, has chosen a player that has had problems at every single club he's been at over the likes of Remy, Bony and Benteke. He could have signed all three strikers for 35million and still have more than half of the Suarez money to play around with nevermind the Champions League cash and sponsorship funding...

It boggles the mind....

The only name on that list open to him/committee in the summer was Bony. The Remy deal was pulled for some reason and plenty of us have heard the rumours why. Can you imagine the sh1tstorm if Benteke was signed while injured?
Liverpool should have offered massive money for Alexis Sanchez. No idea if they did but knowing FSG I doubt they did

amiable

Mr Alan wrote: »

What's going to be very interesting is Sturridge when he gets back. I fear he won't be near the same level of player he was when he had Suarez beside him, spotting runs, executing passes, creating space, taking the focus of defences.

The expectation heaped onto
Sturridge by fans, the manager & players at the club is going to be absolutely monumental.

Sturridge is getting better every week he is out. If he misses the whole season he'll be better than Suarez

Knex*

Mr Alan wrote: »

The expectation heaped onto Sturridge by fans, the manager & players at the club is going to be absolutely monumental.

He'll never have experienced anything like it before, that's for sure.

Gbear

SlickRic wrote: »

Rodgers is an issue right now, but the transfer policy is the big, big, big problem.

That really doesn't follow from our position.

We're not where we are because the players we bought aren't good enough. We're where we are because of mismanaging the squad of players we have available and a failure to fill a key role after overestimating our main threat's ability to stay fit. Rodgers' ability to use his squad properly is an ongoing concern and if he can't improve then he'll get the can but one mistake in the transfer market isn't evidence of systemic failures.

Our players are better than the players of all the other teams in the league with the exception of what you'd predict would be the top 4.
Southampton, Swansea, West Ham and all that - they're not top quality and all the good players at us, Arsenal and Utd aren't crap all of a sudden just because of the way the table looks after less than half of the season.

Rodgers has bungled the team selection at times this season and we've failed to find another player who can play up front effectively but that doesn't invalidate the entire strategy or consign the entire squad we've assembled to the bin.

marklazarcovic

i just watched the highlights from last year ,fcuk the haters it was such a rollercoaster,such quality attacking football ,cheered me right up